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Posted: 7/6/2019 5:54:09 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge: We normally combine laying worker colonies with a queen right colony using the “newspaper combine” method. I have also shaken them out before. One thing that I experimented with last year was adding frames of brood (open and capped) and using queen cells in cell protectors. This seemed to work very well. I may have a similar situation with a third hive. I'm not sure if it's queenright, but had queen cells last Friday. When I checked on Wednesday, one of the cells was chewed open from the side, indicating a queen was eliminating the unhatched queens. If u don't see brood or eggs in a couple of weeks, I may just combine it with a strong hive since we're running out of time and it's weak. I did add a couple frames and brood just in case. |
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Posted: 7/6/2019 6:02:28 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge:
We normally combine laying worker colonies with a queen right colony using the “newspaper combine” method. I have also shaken them out before. One thing that I experimented with last year was adding frames of brood (open and capped) and using queen cells in cell protectors. This seemed to work very well. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge:
Originally Posted By rcav8r: You probably know this, but the theory is that if eggs are being laid, the hive thinks it's queenright. Get rid of the laying workers (can be more than one), and in theory they think they are queenless again. There were a couple of hours between dumping and introducing new queens, I'm not clear if that helps clear any pheromones that might be present. so dumped the hives in other parts of the yard. The workers just crawl around for a day or 2, while the gatherers head back to the hive. I had a frame of brood/larva from other hives added to each hive also. I will check on the queens this afternoon and see whats up. I did not remove the cork over candy just in case. |
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Posted: 7/6/2019 8:45:32 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rcav8r: You probably know this, but the theory is that if eggs are being laid, the hive thinks it's queenright. Get rid of the laying workers (can be more than one), and in theory they think they are queenless again. There were a couple of hours between dumping and introducing new queens, I'm not clear if that helps clear any pheromones that might be present. so dumped the hives in other parts of the yard. The workers just crawl around for a day or 2, while the gatherers head back to the hive. I had a frame of brood/larva from other hives added to each hive also. I will check on the queens this afternoon and see whats up. I did not remove the cork over candy just in case. 
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Posted: 7/6/2019 10:51:18 PM EDT
[#4]
I removed the corks this morning. Will find out Friday if everything is copatic.
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Posted: 7/6/2019 11:18:05 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge: We normally combine laying worker colonies with a queen right colony using the “newspaper combine” method. I have also shaken them out before. One thing that I experimented with last year was adding frames of brood (open and capped) and using queen cells in cell protectors. This seemed to work very well. The laying worker hives I've had have all been small and depleted by the time I figured it out, so there weren't many workers to shake off the frames. |
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Posted: 7/6/2019 11:18:49 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rcav8r:
I removed the corks this morning. Will find out Friday if everything is copatic. |
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Posted: 7/10/2019 9:56:25 PM EDT
[#7]
Can you guys tell me how it’s looking? To my untrained and inexperienced eye, it looks like it’s going pretty well so far.
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Posted: 7/10/2019 10:49:29 PM EDT
[#8]
looks good!
Add another box and frames if you haven't already. from what little I can see of the rest of the hive, they're all getting full? |
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Posted: 7/10/2019 11:41:02 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fttam:
Can you guys tell me how it’s looking? To my untrained and inexperienced eye, it looks like it’s going pretty well so far. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/287916/8106BBB5-ADEF-4A18-B4F9-6BECCF26F9D8-1011574.jpg Agree with adding more space. ALWAYS add a box before YOU think you need to add a box. Cleaning out a little burr comb is not a thing. Having your hive swarm cuz they think they have no space? Yeah, that's a thing. 
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Posted: 7/11/2019 3:00:33 PM EDT
[#10]
Thanks guys, I appreciate the feedback.
Both bottom brood boxes are full (they finally started drawing the outside frames) and I saw plenty of eggs and larvae. I tossed a honey super on a few weeks ago. |
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Posted: 7/11/2019 9:34:23 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Kitties-with-Sigs]
[#11]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fttam:
Thanks guys, I appreciate the feedback. Both bottom brood boxes are full (they finally started drawing the outside frames) and I saw plenty of eggs and larvae. I tossed a honey super on a few weeks ago. That's just as important as more room for honey. If they feel like they cannot expand because there is no place for her to lay eggs and thus enlarge the colony, they might get of a mind to swarm. You don't want that.
@cuttingedge do you have advice? |
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Posted: 7/11/2019 10:14:12 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs:
Is there room in the bottom boxes for the queen to lay? That's just as important as more room for honey. If they feel like they cannot expand because there is no place for her to lay eggs and thus enlarge the colony, they might get of a mind to swarm. You don't want that.
@cuttingedge do you have advice? Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs:
Originally Posted By fttam:
Thanks guys, I appreciate the feedback. Both bottom brood boxes are full (they finally started drawing the outside frames) and I saw plenty of eggs and larvae. I tossed a honey super on a few weeks ago. That's just as important as more room for honey. If they feel like they cannot expand because there is no place for her to lay eggs and thus enlarge the colony, they might get of a mind to swarm. You don't want that.
@cuttingedge do you have advice? Remember that bees don’t see foundation as room for expansion. |
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Posted: 7/11/2019 10:29:12 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Kitties-with-Sigs]
[#13]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge: That depends a lot on your management style and what type of bees you have. We run a lot of single brood chamber hives and if you are on top of your game, you can keep them from swarming and produce a lot of honey from a colony that only has 10 brood frames. Some of that is genetics but you have to be in your hives on a strict schedule. I do agree that adding room before it’s needed is key. Remember that bees don’t see foundation as room for expansion. ), will you elaborate on the management points that are necessary to keep the hive from swarming in the ways you are suggesting?
Immediate questions, even without thinking on it, are: ~What do you do when the brood box is full? How do you keep them feeling like the queen has room to lay? ~Do you feel that a beekeeper could successfully do this with a package queen from generic "European Honeybee" stock? ~What does "on top of your game" mean in this scenario?  
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Posted: 7/12/2019 8:25:54 AM EDT
[Last Edit: cuttingedge]
[#14]
Immediate questions, even without thinking on it, are:
~What do you do when the brood box is full? How do you keep them feeling like the queen has room to lay? We count frames of bees and add room in the form of supers before it’s necessary. This allows them to store incoming nectar in the supers which opens up the brood nest. ~Do you feel that a beekeeper could successfully do this with a package queen from generic "European Honeybee" stock? Possibly but some of them can be on the swarmy side. Part of our selection criteria for Breeding is to select for bees that have a lower tendency to swarm and make good use of the available space given. They don’t store too much nectar or honey in the brood box which gives the queen more room to lay. ~What does "on top of your game" mean in this scenario? Being an active Beekeeper and not a Bee Haver. We go through our colonies on a 7-10 day schedule, find and cage our queens and shake down every frame to make sure that ALL queen cups/ cells are removed. Since our colonies are managed in singles (below a queen excluder) all of the issues that happen will be in that one box which makes working our hives much easier. I have a few friends in Ontario that also manage singles this way and one of them has a great video explaining why it works and how a queen cannot out lay 10 frames. Check that out here  Why Managing Bee Hives as Single Brood Chambers Works Here are some of my production hives that are managed as singles. One of them got its 5th super yesterday. If our flow continues, they will get one or two more before we extract. 
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Posted: 7/12/2019 11:21:28 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge:
Immediate questions, even without thinking on it, are: ~What do you do when the brood box is full? How do you keep them feeling like the queen has room to lay? We count frames of bees and add room in the form of supers before it’s necessary. This allows them to store incoming nectar in the supers which opens up the brood best. ~Do you feel that a beekeeper could successfully do this with a package queen from generic "European Honeybee" stock? Possibly but some of them can be on the swarmy side. Part of our selection criteria for Breeding is to select for bees that have a lower tendency to swarm and make good use of the available space given. They don’t store too much nectar or honey in the brood box which gives the queen more room to lay. ~What does "on top of your game" mean in this scenario? Being an active Beekeeper and not a Bee Haver. We go through our colonies on a 7-10 day schedule, find and cage our queens and shake down every frame to make sure that ALL queen cups/ cells are removed. Since our colonies are managed in singles (below a queen excluder) all of the issues that happen will be in that one box which makes working our hives much easier. I have a few friends in Ontario that also manage singles this way and one of them has a great video explaining why it works and how a queen cannot out lay 10 frames. Check that out here  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjyNcyVvbEIHere are some of my production hives that are managed as singles. One of them got its 5th super yesterday. If our flow continues, they will get one or two more before we extract. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/294057/8A727AB0-06D9-42F5-8171-7197D4843D0F-1012902.jpg I followed him before I got started, and I was interested in managing a single brood chamber but I chickened out when some more experienced beeks that I know talked me out of it. Next year I have been planning on expanding to a second hive, and I’ve been thinking about running it as a single and comparing it to my current double brood setup. |
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Posted: 7/12/2019 12:43:35 PM EDT
[#16]
Welp, of the 2 backyard hives I requeened with mated queens, it looks like the long lang either killed her off, or she decided to leave. Absolutely no sign of eggs or brood except for the frame I added from another hive. I guess they were NOT OK with her. No laying workers either, at least. At this point, I think I will just paper combine them with the the other hive, which did accept their queen, and is laying.
I did combine one of my weak hives at the other site today too. I'm 1 for 4 for getting splits to raise their own queen, and even that took a couple of attempts. Maybe part of it due to being a funky year for hives. Lots of folks around here have reported queen/hive issues this spring, possibly due to the frequent rain and cool weather. Also decided to remove the excluder from my 2 good hives, and added another super for good measure, to get them moving. Even though they had drawn comb in the existing super, they just weren't doing much. |
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Posted: 7/12/2019 8:51:11 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge:
Immediate questions, even without thinking on it, are: ~What do you do when the brood box is full? How do you keep them feeling like the queen has room to lay? We count frames of bees and add room in the form of supers before it’s necessary. This allows them to store incoming nectar in the supers which opens up the brood nest. ~Do you feel that a beekeeper could successfully do this with a package queen from generic "European Honeybee" stock? Possibly but some of them can be on the swarmy side. Part of our selection criteria for Breeding is to select for bees that have a lower tendency to swarm and make good use of the available space given. They don’t store too much nectar or honey in the brood box which gives the queen more room to lay. ~What does "on top of your game" mean in this scenario? Being an active Beekeeper and not a Bee Haver. We go through our colonies on a 7-10 day schedule, find and cage our queens and shake down every frame to make sure that ALL queen cups/ cells are removed. Since our colonies are managed in singles (below a queen excluder) all of the issues that happen will be in that one box which makes working our hives much easier. I have a few friends in Ontario that also manage singles this way and one of them has a great video explaining why it works and how a queen cannot out lay 10 frames. Check that out here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjyNcyVvbEIHere are some of my production hives that are managed as singles. One of them got its 5th super yesterday. If our flow continues, they will get one or two more before we extract. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/294057/8A727AB0-06D9-42F5-8171-7197D4843D0F-1012902.jpg Michael Bush was espousing single brood chamber when I first got into beekeeping, but I was scared to try it as a brand new beekeeper, since I figured if something went wrong, I'd have nobody nearby who could diagnose without immediately defaulting to "they need more space." Very interested in this guy's channel. Hit subscribe just now. Very personable and good at explaining. |
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Posted: 7/12/2019 8:52:24 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rcav8r:
Welp, of the 2 backyard hives I requeened with mated queens, it looks like the long lang either killed her off, or she decided to leave. Absolutely no sign of eggs or brood except for the frame I added from another hive. I guess they were NOT OK with her. No laying workers either, at least. At this point, I think I will just paper combine them with the the other hive, which did accept their queen, and is laying. I did combine one of my weak hives at the other site today too. I'm 1 for 4 for getting splits to raise their own queen, and even that took a couple of attempts. Maybe part of it due to being a funky year for hives. Lots of folks around here have reported queen/hive issues this spring, possibly due to the frequent rain and cool weather. Also decided to remove the excluder from my 2 good hives, and added another super for good measure, to get them moving. Even though they had drawn comb in the existing super, they just weren't doing much. |
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Posted: 7/12/2019 11:02:00 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: I watched part of it and will finish later, but I like the philosophy so far. Michael Bush was espousing single brood chamber when I first got into beekeeping, but I was scared to try it as a brand new beekeeper, since I figured if something went wrong, I'd have nobody nearby who could diagnose without immediately defaulting to "they need more space." Very interested in this guy's channel. Hit subscribe just now. Very personable and good at explaining. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 11:38:29 AM EDT
[Last Edit: cuttingedge]
[#20]
I’m sure that I have posted this YouTube channel before but they have a bunch of new videos out this season.
If I had to recommend one channel for learning the ins and outs of beekeeping, this would be it... Here |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:40:37 PM EDT
[#21]
So a question.......
A few weeks ago I tossed a medium super on top of my hive (double brood chamber). During last week’s hive inspection I found that the medium was about 50% drawn with nectar. The brood chambers beneath it looked great (I posted a typical frame a few posts up) and all seemed well. I did a hive inspection this afternoon and I was surprised that the medium is about 90% drawn with nectar, and they are beginning to cap honey. The box weighs a ton. The brood boxes look great. The question is this: is there harvestable honey? I’ve heard plenty of times that a new hive shouldn’t be harvested in the first year, and I’m totally fine with leaving them be. But I was curious if there would be enough honey to have even a small harvest of a few frames? The goldenrod is coming in strong, and they seem to be extra busy foraging. Any input is appreciated 
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Posted: 7/16/2019 11:37:02 PM EDT
[#22]
Put another super under the one they are finishing. As you saw, they can draw and fill pretty fast.
Leaving a super for the winter is really for weaker hives, IMHO. Although my first year hives died (from the polar vortex) this past winter, they had more than enough stores to get them through the winter. In fact, now that I think about it, maybe the slow start this spring was too much honey for the new packages (had more than enough filled frames to start new packages and splits)? Interesting thought... Anyway, I would leave it on until they're something like 95% capped to make sure you don't have too much nectar in anything you harvest. This would be a good time to look into buying a refractometer. |
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Posted: 7/17/2019 4:38:24 AM EDT
[Last Edit: cuttingedge]
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fttam:
So a question....... A few weeks ago I tossed a medium super on top of my hive (double brood chamber). During last week’s hive inspection I found that the medium was about 50% drawn with nectar. The brood chambers beneath it looked great (I posted a typical frame a few posts up) and all seemed well. I did a hive inspection this afternoon and I was surprised that the medium is about 90% drawn with nectar, and they are beginning to cap honey. The box weighs a ton. The brood boxes look great. The question is this: is there harvestable honey? I’ve heard plenty of times that a new hive shouldn’t be harvested in the first year, and I’m totally fine with leaving them be. But I was curious if there would be enough honey to have even a small harvest of a few frames? The goldenrod is coming in strong, and they seem to be extra busy foraging. Any input is appreciated Speaking of supers, if they have one 90% full, I would definitely add another. Depending on your preference, you can add it above or below the existing super. This will give them some much needed room and keep the brood nest from being overly congested. If you are using a top entrance, I also advise that you turn it around to have it facing the back of the hive. This helps for two reasons: 1. It provides a little cross ventilation which helps dry your honey a little faster. 2. It prevents the bees from storing as much pollen in the supers. Hopefully this helps... |
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Posted: 7/18/2019 1:54:13 PM EDT
[#24]
Raining too hard today to check the hives (then it's going to get too hot), but I did tilt up the top brood box in the yard to see how they're going with the paper combine. I was astonished to see they had completely removed the paper inside the box. I was expecting a bunch of holes or something, but it's completely gone except for whats sticking outside the box.
I just hope they were nicer to the queen there than their own. |
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Posted: 7/19/2019 11:04:05 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rcav8r:
Raining too hard today to check the hives (then it's going to get too hot), but I did tilt up the top brood box in the yard to see how they're going with the paper combine. I was astonished to see they had completely removed the paper inside the box. I was expecting a bunch of holes or something, but it's completely gone except for whats sticking outside the box. I just hope they were nicer to the queen there than their own. This is real-life suspense.
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Posted: 7/20/2019 4:23:52 AM EDT
[#26]
You may have to wail til monday.
Between a surgery that requires no heavy lifting for awhile (recruiting son for that), and the hot weather this weekend, will just have to wait. >might< get a chance to look at the backyard hive before that. |
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Posted: 7/21/2019 10:01:08 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge: In my opinion, you could harvest anything in the supers. They don’t need more than the two brood boxes for winter. Once you remove the super(s) I would start “hefting” your hives in early September and feed 2:1 (heavy) syrup as necessary to get them up to optimal weight. I believe that they winter better on syrup than honey. This is especially true in the Northeast where we have high ash content fall honeys (Aster, Goldenrod, etc.) Speaking of supers, if they have one 90% full, I would definitely add another. Depending on your preference, you can add it above or below the existing super. This will give them some much needed room and keep the brood nest from being overly congested. If you are using a top entrance, I also advise that you turn it around to have it facing the back of the hive. This helps for two reasons: 1. It provides a little cross ventilation which helps dry your honey a little faster. 2. It prevents the bees from storing as much pollen in the supers. Hopefully this helps... 
Also thanks to @rcav8r |
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Posted: 7/21/2019 2:26:04 PM EDT
[#28]
Merged backyard hive not doing well. No sign of queen, a few capped brood, a couple of capped queen cell that may or may not be viable. I don't know if they swarmed, or the assholes from the other hive killed her off. They'll sink or swim with what they have.
Other 3 hives are doing well. The 2 big hives are filling in the supers now, so might have something to harvest this year. Maybe keep it up for goldenrod? Other merged hive is ok. They're just building for themselves this year. Might be candidate for the medium full of sugar water honey I have. |
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Posted: 7/22/2019 12:07:12 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rcav8r:
Merged backyard hive not doing well. No sign of queen, a few capped brood, a couple of capped queen cell that may or may not be viable. I don't know if they swarmed, or the assholes from the other hive killed her off. They'll sink or swim with what they have. Other 3 hives are doing well. The 2 big hives are filling in the supers now, so might have something to harvest this year. Maybe keep it up for goldenrod? Other merged hive is ok. They're just building for themselves this year. Might be candidate for the medium full of sugar water honey I have. I'm sorry about the merged hive. I've had ZERO luck with newspaper combines. Other people do great with them. |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 7/22/2019 11:53:38 AM EDT
[#30]
A question for the more experienced beekeepers.............
I am located in Central Texas and started with 2 nucs last year. They wintered well and due to an unusually warm winter and wet spring, both hives got off to a great start in early spring. Great to the point of swarming but that is what bees do,right? The strongest hive swarmed successively 3X. Bad news is the original hives de-populated. Good news is I captured 3 swarms and now have 5 strong hives. Due to the swarming, I did not get any honey production in the supers until June. Greed (and inexperience?) delayed the hive robbing until just this past week. I wanted as much honey as I could get. I ended up with 5 gals of amber colored slightly thin honey with a very pronounced taste. Some taste testers are finding the flavor unpleasant and most note a pronounced lingering after-taste. My AAR is I waited too long to harvest the honey. Last rain here was June 30; I harvested on July 20. The lack of rain during July is not unusual here. Once it quit raining the garden and pretty much everything else dried up. The predominant blooming plants right now are broomweed and bitterweed. My thoughts are I should have harvested mid June and not been so greedy. Opinions and observations? |
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Posted: 7/22/2019 5:58:04 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Kitties-with-Sigs]
[#31]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By STX45:
A question for the more experienced beekeepers............. I am located in Central Texas and started with 2 nucs last year. They wintered well and due to an unusually warm winter and wet spring, both hives got off to a great start in early spring. Great to the point of swarming but that is what bees do,right? The strongest hive swarmed successively 3X. Bad news is the original hives de-populated. Good news is I captured 3 swarms and now have 5 strong hives. Due to the swarming, I did not get any honey production in the supers until June. Greed (and inexperience?) delayed the hive robbing until just this past week. I wanted as much honey as I could get. I ended up with 5 gals of amber colored slightly thin honey with a very pronounced taste. Some taste testers are finding the flavor unpleasant and most note a pronounced lingering after-taste. My AAR is I waited too long to harvest the honey. Last rain here was June 30; I harvested on July 20. The lack of rain during July is not unusual here. Once it quit raining the garden and pretty much everything else dried up. The predominant blooming plants right now are broomweed and bitterweed. My thoughts are I should have harvested mid June and not been so greedy. Opinions and observations? 1-As far as swarming----the idea is to manage the hives so that they do NOT swarm, which means giving them more space earlier, which means you have to pay attention and be on top of it, of course, which is the downfall of many hobby beekeepers, cuz we're all busy people. 2-Did you allow your "now-weak" original colonies to make their own queens? Or did you requeen after the swarms? Current thought is that it's nearly always better to requeen, so you know exactly what your hive should turn out to be once the new queen gets going. Some other members, Dux and @cuttingedge can advise you better on this, as they have more experience than I do with requeening hives, and what genetics can do for you. 3-You may already be aware that you have to leave enough honey for your bees to survive the winter, but if not, this is important. So you need to harvest at the right time for you, then allow them to rebuild enough stores to survive. 4-What were the bees bringing in BEFORE the dry season started? Did you check or taste the honey at that time, to know whether it had the same taste? 5-If you haven't gotten involved with a local bee club or beekeeping association, that is my best advice..because what I would do here in Kentucky (with way more annual rainfall than you get, normally I'm guessing) is a different thing/timeline than what you would do in your climate/region. Your local beekeepers can guide you as to timing and other subtleties of beekeeping in your region. The fees are usually dirt cheap, and the education is profoundly valuable. I cannot overstate the need to have a local support group if one is available within driving distance. This may not help with your question, so others will hopefully chime in, but either way...welcome to your first harvest. I'm interested in what you find out. @Joemama74 is a Texas beekeeper. Maybe he is online and can offer advice. |
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Posted: 7/22/2019 11:48:50 PM EDT
[#32]
I’m in Dallas, so it’s only been 2 weeks without rain, but there were some scattered showers today. Wildflowers are still out, but the thought is they dried up as a nectar source when we hit 100 degrees.
Looks like it’s gonna cool off a few days, so who knows. It’s not a typical year. I haven’t seen any snow on the prairie (flowers). I’m hearing honey harvest have been good. I got tired of wearing my Bee suit and wading in 6 inches of water to check my hives, so I haven’t done much. I just took my 50 gallon sprayer out of the back of my John Deere gator, so hopefully I’ll get out there this week, pull some frames, and get my hives moved up 50 yards to where the ground stays dry year round. Where are you in Central Texas? My cousin is in Stephenville, he could probably give you more insight. He also keeps bees at my grandmothers farm in West. There is also a Central Texas Beekeepers, Republic of Texas Beekeepers, Texas Beekeepers, Texas A&M Apriculture pages on Facebook. Great info there, they could probably hook you up with a local club. If you haven’t figured it out, every beekeeper has a different opinion and think their way is the right way. Don’t get too caught up in that. Just think of them more as livestock or cattle and you’ll do fine. |
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Posted: 7/25/2019 11:32:20 AM EDT
[#33]
So I took the advice here and tossed a second d honey super on last night during my bike inspection, but I ran into something that I didn’t expect.......
The honey super is about 90% capped honey now. Looks beautiful, and I’m amazed at how fast they drew it out and capped it. When I pried off the super and queen excluder and got into the top brood box, I was totally surprised to find that the entire top brood box was now honey. Total honey. No brood. Honey. So I pried it off to get into the bottom brood box and the moment that I did all hell broke loose (my work phone started ringing off the hook and that’s when I noticed that my pool filter tarted spraying water ten feet into the air when a hose broke). Damn! I looked in quick and saw capped brood in the bottom box, but I only pulled a couple frames and had to close it all up quick. I tossed the second honey super on (underneath the existing honey super) and wrapped it up for the night. I know that I need to get back in and find the queen and look for eggs, but I’m leaving town tonight for a long weekend. Should I be worried? 
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Posted: 7/25/2019 3:27:41 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By fttam:
So I took the advice here and tossed a second d honey super on last night during my bike inspection, but I ran into something that I didn’t expect....... The honey super is about 90% capped honey now. Looks beautiful, and I’m amazed at how fast they drew it out and capped it. When I pried off the super and queen excluder and got into the top brood box, I was totally surprised to find that the entire top brood box was now honey. Total honey. No brood. Honey. So I pried it off to get into the bottom brood box and the moment that I did all hell broke loose (my work phone started ringing off the hook and that’s when I noticed that my pool filter tarted spraying water ten feet into the air when a hose broke). Damn! I looked in quick and saw capped brood in the bottom box, but I only pulled a couple frames and had to close it all up quick. I tossed the second honey super on (underneath the existing honey super) and wrapped it up for the night. I know that I need to get back in and find the queen and look for eggs, but I’m leaving town tonight for a long weekend. Should I be worried? https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/287916/0509FEB2-A4F6-4F94-A0B9-074380DE81A9-1029692.jpg That should hold them for the weekend, but don't be surprised if you think you might need another super. They can move pretty fast sometimes. |
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Posted: 7/25/2019 11:47:36 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rcav8r: You don't need to find the queen, you just need to find larva or eggs. Putting another super on was a good move. That should hold them for the weekend, but don't be surprised if you think you might need another super. They can move pretty fast sometimes. Good move putting it below the full one. Excellent. |
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Posted: 7/26/2019 12:17:30 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Kitties-with-Sigs: Agreed. Come back Monday prepared to put on another super. Good move putting it below the full one. Excellent. |
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Posted: 7/26/2019 12:33:25 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Grendelsbane: Why? I can't quote those. So I'm going to list the "old, nonscientific" beekeeper reasons. There are a couple of those "old, nonscientific reasons" , I think. First...most beekeepers (not all, but most) still use only the bottom main entrance as the entrance to their hive. That means the bees have to go through two brood boxes (assuming a two-deep chamber) and then trek all the way across a honey super to get to the place where they can put the nectar. *pant pant...I'm tired just thinking about it.* That's a lot of unnecessary work. (Which is a good reason to use a second hive entrance) Second.. I think this is more about noticing how bees *think* about their space. The fuller it gets, the more likely bees are to start thinking they don't have any room. That MIGHT cause them to start thinking they need to swarm and go find another place to be. The brood box is where a lot of activity will ALWAYS be, and where hopefully the queen is spending her time. Placing a box above it will seem like, "wow, look at all that space we've got!" And it will still allow the bees to take care of (cap any open cells, protect it from predators, consider that box of honey as a bonus for staying in this hive, etc) the full honey super on the top. If that super had, say, empty frames on the outside, the beekeeper could move those to the middle, and let the bees fill those frames, while still feeling like they had lots of space. Okay other people can probably say this better than I can. Experience of my own, and years of hearing the experience of older (some master) beekeepers, has told me that the open space below the full space is a good thing. They are more likely to notice it in the way that assimilates it into the hive mind, and they are more likely to feel like they've got extra room, if it is not way up there above a lot of full supers. Okay does that make any sense? |
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Posted: 7/26/2019 1:11:41 AM EDT
[#38]
I think it does make sense, thanks.
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Posted: 7/26/2019 9:31:13 AM EDT
[#39]
Reality check.
A local beekeeper told me that the queen knows what kind of egg to lay according to the size of the cell she's led to. If it's a "regular" sized cell she lays a worker; if it's a larger cell, she lays an unfertilized drone cell. I've told this to several people. Is it true or was he FOS? |
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Posted: 7/26/2019 11:00:36 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FrankSymptoms:
Reality check. A local beekeeper told me that the queen knows what kind of egg to lay according to the size of the cell she's led to. If it's a "regular" sized cell she lays a worker; if it's a larger cell, she lays an unfertilized drone cell. I've told this to several people. Is it true or was he FOS? |
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Posted: 7/26/2019 11:43:04 AM EDT
[#41]
The queen does know.
check out "green drone comb". Plastic frames with LARGE plastic cell foundation. Intentionally made green to make it stand out from other frames (for the beekeeper). The queen will will intentionally lay drones on this stuff because of the large cells. The idea of the drone comb is pest management. Mites have a preference for drones, since they take the longest to emerge at 26 days, gives them more time to reproduce. Once the frame is full of drones, or every 2 weeks, whichever comes first, you take that frame out and chuck it in the freezer, putting another drone frame in that box in either the 3rd or 8th slot, alternating between the 2 spots. When it's time to switch them out again, you take the frozen frame, scratch the caps so the bees clean them out, and switch them. You don't really need the drones (queen will try to mate with other drones for genetic diversity), and the queen will lay drones in other spots anyways. But to get back to your question, the cell size does matter. The queen CAN lay drones in smaller cells, but she'll put them in larger over if she can. |
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Posted: 7/26/2019 11:55:35 AM EDT
[#42]
Ah- unfertilized (haploid) eggs make drones, but fertilized eggs make workers (or new queens). The queen has to know to lay drones in drone comb. I have learned something new today!
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Posted: 7/26/2019 11:51:56 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Kitties-with-Sigs]
[#43]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FrankSymptoms:
Reality check. A local beekeeper told me that the queen knows what kind of egg to lay according to the size of the cell she's led to. If it's a "regular" sized cell she lays a worker; if it's a larger cell, she lays an unfertilized drone cell. I've told this to several people. Is it true or was he FOS? |
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Posted: 7/26/2019 11:56:01 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Grendelsbane: I thought the egg was the same, but the cell configuration tells the workers how to raise it. In that instance...a queen cell...it does. |
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Posted: 7/27/2019 7:20:11 AM EDT
[#45]
For a.plot twist, the bees can decide to raise a queen on their own. As long as it's a egg 1-3 days old, they can transform it into a queen cell and feed of royal jelly. This where emergency queen cells come in. The queen is missing,.or they feel she's underperforming, etc.
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Posted: 7/27/2019 3:00:39 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By rcav8r:
For a.plot twist, the bees can decide to raise a queen on their own. As long as it's a egg 1-3 days old, they can transform it into a queen cell and feed of royal jelly. This where emergency queen cells come in. The queen is missing,.or they feel she's underperforming, etc. Not that the bees care if I understand them!
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Posted: 7/27/2019 7:55:18 PM EDT
[Last Edit: cuttingedge]
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Grendelsbane:
I find the complexity of bee behavior fascinating. I knew about emergency queen cells, as that is why walk-away splits work, but I’m still wrapping my head around a queen intentionally laying in a queen cell. It only makes sense to me for pre- swarm prep. Not that the bees care if I understand them! Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Grendelsbane:
Originally Posted By rcav8r:
For a.plot twist, the bees can decide to raise a queen on their own. As long as it's a egg 1-3 days old, they can transform it into a queen cell and feed of royal jelly. This where emergency queen cells come in. The queen is missing,.or they feel she's underperforming, etc. Not that the bees care if I understand them! Larvae between the ages of 1-3 days old are bipotent meaning that they can either become workers or queens depending on their diet of Royal Jelly. When a colony makes a new queen under emergency conditions, they very often choose the oldest larvae (2-3 days old) to start the process because they are in a hurry to make a replacement. This older larvae is not fed royal jelly for the duration of its pupal stage. Even if they choose to make a second option out of younger larvae, the oldest larvae will always hatch out first and kill its sister(s) leaving the colony with an inferior queen. This is why I am a strong advocate of requeening your colonies either with a cell or mated queen from a reputable source. Queen breeders produce cells under ideal conditions which equals better developed queens that will almost always outperform those developed under supersedure conditions. This is a great opportunity to improve the genetics in your colonies. Something else to consider is the dilution of your genetics in concurrent generations as well as loss of trait/ behavior stability. |
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Posted: 7/29/2019 11:16:33 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Grendelsbane: I find the complexity of bee behavior fascinating. I knew about emergency queen cells, as that is why walk-away splits work, but I’m still wrapping my head around a queen intentionally laying in a queen cell. It only makes sense to me for pre- swarm prep. Not that the bees care if I understand them! The queen does not decide. Not really. Her attendants tell her where to lay an egg. If they tell her to lay an egg in the queen cup, she must. Then they build it out into a queen cell if they need to do so. The life of a queen bee might seem charmed, looking on from a distance. But when you really understand her life, it's not so great. Kind of like, "honey, you could grow up to be President!" Smart honey child says, "no thanks, that job sux." |
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Posted: 7/29/2019 11:23:47 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By cuttingedge: Supersedure queens are not developed under ideal conditions. They are considered inferior and are often times superseded again shortly after they start laying. Larvae between the ages of 1-3 days old are bipotent meaning that they can either become workers or queens depending on their diet of Royal Jelly. When a colony makes a new queen under emergency conditions, they very often choose the oldest larvae (2-3 days old) to start the process because they are in a hurry to make a replacement. This older larvae is not fed royal jelly for the duration of its pupal stage. Even if they choose to make a second option out of younger larvae, the oldest larvae will always hatch out first and kill its sister(s) leaving the colony with an inferior queen. This is why I am a strong advocate of requeening your colonies either with a cell or mated queen from a reputable source. Queen breeders produce cells under ideal conditions which equals better developed queens that will almost always outperform those developed under supersedure conditions. This is a great opportunity to improve the genetics in your colonies. Something else to consider is the dilution of your genetics in concurrent generations as well as loss of trait/ behavior stability. |
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FL, USA
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Posted: 7/31/2019 2:03:00 PM EDT
[#50]
Somehow just discovered this thread today...ashamed of myself.
But, I have been wondering, how many of y'all (us?) have an observation hive going somewhere? (Not talking about a glass box with bees in it, I mean an actual growing colony, managed and observed throughout the seasons.) I currently have 2, a 2 medium frame that sits on my kitchen windowsill, and another 4 medium frame in the living room. I will get some pics soon. I recommend it wholeheartedly, as I have been able to observe so many thing I either never heard of, heard of but otherwise never saw, proved things wrong that I was sure of, or proved things true I had heard were false. |
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