greetings gents, wanting to add a portable coleman stove to my camping/survival gear, and coming across craigslist i've found both the 1 lb propane version and the older external reservoir versions which i assume is the white gas version. most of them are in the $50 range so its kinda the same money wise, but for you more experienced guys, which version would you go with and why. i can understand ease and simplicity of the propane one but refilling the cylinders is the proverbial downside, or i'm assuming with the pump up one all you have to do is keep it supplied with the camping fuel, but leaking of fuel / pump upkeep might be the downfall ? this would be my first one so i'm limited on knowledge

I like the pump up white gas version. Even have one for sale on the EE.

I have about 6 different types of stoves the liquid fuel models I just find cool and iconic.

I have a Coleman dual duel fuel and modded it to run in diesel, kerosene and Jet fuel so now it’s a 5 fuel stove.

I have a wide variety of stoves in white gas and butane and wood.  My favorite is the Svea 123 - liquid fuel with no pumping.  However, the Jetboil is the one I usually take on backpacking trips.  It's lightweight and boils water super fast.

If I were buying a single stove for SHTF, I would get a multi fuel model.  I have an older MSR Expedition (I think) with an external bottle and jets to swap and burn anything from white gas to jet fuel.

White gas will ruin rice crispy treats and Mtn House.  Be sure your bottle is sealed.  I was hiking in Philmont with a scout troop and the designated bottle carrier didn't get the lid on properly.  He was also carrying supper.  We noticed the Mtn Hse Mexican dish had an odd spiciness, but it wasn't until we got to the rice crispy treats that we realized the problem.  I belched that shit all night, but nobody died.  Another plus for canister stoves.

Buy the liquid fuel version and you can easily convert it to run propane too.

https://www.stansport.com/propane-converter-185

Your standard white gas Coleman suitcase stoves will last several generations so long as they are not stored with gasoline in the tank. White gas is fine.

I have several, and the only one that had a failure was rust due to improper storage. My newest is 1970s vintage.

They can be had for $5-$20 on Craigslist or Facebook.

I'm a big multi-fuel kind of person, especially if I'm car camping or camping at elevation.

I like the compressed gas stoves when light and easy is something I'm after and I'm not at 10k+ feet.

It really just depends on what is most important to you.  Compressed gas is easier.  Liquid fuel is more versatile.

I have both kinds, I prefer the propanes.

This is the right answer.  In this way, you have both.  I am a collector and use one several times a week.  If I’m deep frying or searing I’ll use gasoline (yes, the automotive fuel).  If I’m heating, boiling I’ll use propane if I’m feeling particularly lazy.

For all practical long term purposes, go propane.

The main reason? You can store propane safely for years and it won't break down and go sour. All gasoline products will, and require treatment for long term storage. That storage of containers for gasoline needs to be outside the roofline of your home, not on a shelf in the garage. A solid locked up outbuilding where if it catches fire, your house won't burn down.

Propane isn't any less flammable in that regard, but the valves and containers are a lot more robust and take a much bigger beating. We recycled propane canisters, right? Nobody recycles gasoline containers. They are light weight and often the metal ones quickly rust. They get tossed when empty and not even recycled. Propane for the win there.

It's a better system, too - propane lantern, cookstove, heater, you have it all, you have it when the power goes out, too. You have light and heat and warmth and you can use some of them indoors, too, as long as you are aware and responsible. Gas? No way in hell. Propane burns clean and the catalytic heaters are considered safe enough to keep inside a dwelling. A liquid fueled heater like a kerosene stove is too - they stink, refueling is supposed to be done outdoors, it's a mess when you spill it, etc.

We converted our white gas Coleman as soon as it became known we could, and a few years back bought an even newer two burner which is really great to cook on. Bigger, too, leaving you some room to use kitchen pots and skillets rather than special expensive teeny weeny cookware. Cooking for four isn't a one meal backpacking experience. If you have a Coleman, you are at family level sustenance. Can openers and a cooler filled with frozen goods and fresh eggs with bacon cooking.

Dang, I'm typing this at 7 in the morning and now I'm hungry. If I hadn't had that for the last three days on a mini vacation at the motel breakfast bar I'd be going back for the other half of a waffle. There's that, too - show me a waffle maker for a backpacker white gas stove.

Nope, propane owns the market and for good reason. Yes, you can fill the 1 pounders, or, you could just buy them by the case - which is a good prepper idea for a week's long power outage. If I lived in hurricane country I'd have two or three flats and more than a few tanks to cover an emergency.

You'd see us with the lights on in a neighborhood abandoned by the unprepared McSuburbanite's who left for a crowded Motel 6 50 miles away. In point of fact, we have been the only ones left in the neighborhood when there is no power. No power for them.

We had power. Propane rules.

BTW, if you have a propane grille, you already made the decision, don't bother rethinking it. Who runs a white gas grille on the deck?

Propane lil easier to deal with. But i have coleman fuel stove but also have propane conversion

Attached File

I like the white gas version for camping. I dislike buying the cylinders and find them bulkier than a couple of the MSR fuel bottles.

I like that the white gas version performs better in extreme cold and altitude when I adventure to the mountains too.

I have both Coleman white gas lantern and cook stove.

I also have Jetboil.

Me too. I have both DF lanterns and single burner stoves and also propane and during 84 hours without power after Irma, I just grabbed the propane versions.

They’re just easier to employ and less messy.

Chris

This.  If you actually need to use it, propane is much easier to deal with.  I use a smaller bulk tank, a 2.5 gallon, with adapters and a tee to run a camp grill, lantern, and stove top at the same time.

We do the same. I got a 11 lb propane tank for use when camping with the camper and added  a T fitting. We can run two propane appliances at once. Usually the stove and the small portable grill.

Much prefer the big tank over a bunch of small ones. We now just keep a couple 1 lb propane bottles in the camping gear as backup.  I've refilled 1lb bottles in the past but now use the bigger bottle and refill it from the house 500 gallon tank.

As others have said,cheap used Coleman fuel stove.
Buy however many gal Coleman fuel you want.
Go buy the propane adapter.
Buy however many propane bottles you want.

I use the propane for convenience Coleman fuel is the backup.

White gas>propane

This post pretty well nails it. If you want SHTF, the multi fuel MSR models are tough to beat. I suppose some other things could work just as well but if you want to be sure you got a solid stove the first time, go MSR.

And, the Svea 123 is just old school cool. One of my professors would bring one out in college. Pretty much the original backpacking and climbing stove. They're awesome.

I have adapters for my white gas and multifuel coleman type stoves so they run propane just fine.  The adapters were cheap and work great.  The dedicated propane stoves are smaller/lighter, but I have multifuel backpack stoves if I am really worried about size/weight.

I have both but prefer propane.

It’s not something you have to worry about in FL, but propane performs poorly in cold temps (around 0F or lower.) Propane forklifts run like shit for a few minutes until the coolant going through the vaporizer warms up enough to start adding some heat (liquid withdrawal systems.) Vapor withdrawal systems aren’t any better, propane vaporizes at -42F but the vapor pressure is pretty low up to 0F or so. Propane also has a lower energy density than just about any other petroleum fuel, meaning it takes more fuel to produce a given amount of heat.

White gas keeps forever without any treatment. I’ve used stuff that had been sitting in the can for 15 years and it worked just as well as new stuff. White gas is far superior in cold weather, it’d have to be so cold that fire can’t exist not to be able to light a white gas stove. White gas is more work, between filling the tank, pressurizing, lighting, preheating, more pressurizing, etc, but it’s more versatile. Plus you can use other fuels, even dirty stuff like diesel or heating oil. You’ll just have to clean the burners and generator more often.

As cheaply as Coleman stoves like the 413 can be found, get one of each.

You can solve that issue by going with larger propane tanks.  The small 1 lb tanks can and will freeze up even in the summer if the withdrawal rate is high enough.  Go with the 11 lb tank or a 20 lb tank and you'll be able to run the stove down to well below 0*.

I just used my white gas 1972 stove for the first time in years this weekend.

God it was awesome.

Id go with white gas. I have a propane cylinder mod, but it doesn't work right.

so i lucked out on craigslist today, ended up with a 70s model 425E dual burner and a 200E lantern for $30 total, they were originally bought by the father of the guy i bought them from, but he said dad moved out of the family house 19 years ago and didnt take them with him, so he said son could sell them. they were a bit dusty but cleaned up nice with dish soap and toothbrush. Even had fuel in both of them, got the stove to fire up one burner, but couldnt get the other one to light, so probably just a lube/clean of the plate at the end. ill probably sell the lantern to recoup money and keep the stove for free

Does the left side valve open freely? Are you taking a match to the left side burner when trying to light it?

Note that the left side burner won't burn as hot as the right side.  There are videos on yourtube that show how to take them apart and clean them.  You might consider holding onto the lantern if you camp.  They'll burn for hours on a tank and the yellowish light and hissing noise is iconic, classic camping.

I have both... propane is handy at lower altitudes, but liquid gas is far superior in the mountains - IMO

Effects of temperature and altitudes of your Coleman® propane or liquid fuel stove
Published 04/20/2010 01:13 PM   |    Updated 09/26/2014 04:27 PM
What effects do temperature and altitude have on the performance of my stove?
Coleman® liquid-fueled stoves generally (below 32° F/ 0°C), will need air pumped into the tank more often and, when started, will burn with a yellow flame for a longer time if the temperatures are below 32°F/ 0°C.

These effects are related to both the stove and fuel being colder. At low temperatures, it will take longer for the generator to heat to the point where the fuel will vaporize efficiently and the burners settle to a blue flame.

The performance of Coleman® Propane Stoves will not be affected by temperatures above 0° F / -18°C. As the temperature drops below 0° F, there will be a gradual reduction of maximum heat output down to -20°F / -29°C where the stove may fail to function.

Altitudes above 10,000 ft will have an effect on both propane and liquid fuel stoves. Because of lower air pressure and decreased oxygen at these altitudes, you will experience more yellow flame and less heat output. The stoves will not operate as efficiently.

http://coleman.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/82/~/effects-of-temperature-and-altitudes-of-your-coleman%C2%AE-propane-or-liquid-fuel

Disregarding tempurature, propane will actually work better at higher altitudes.
The problem the Coleman article points out for both propane and liquid fuel stoves, is that the fuel/oxygen ratio changes with altitude, and with a fixed burner orifice, the stoves will burn richer as you go higher/
You would need to have a variable sized orifice in the stove to match the exact altitude.
This used to be a real problem with carburetor engines in cars.

You can buy fire gel/fire ribbon/fire paste to put in the burners of Coleman stoves under the generator to help warm it up for faster vaporization of the fuel.  It used to be in the owner's manual but I can't say as I've looked at a new version.  My personal experience with propane, despite what that article says, is that it will work below freezing but performance does drop off.  I've never used one above 12600ft (Humphrey's Peak in AZ) so can't comment on altitudes above that.  Adding a reflective panel or blanket around the cylinder helps and you need to get it off the ground, especially if there's snow.  A simple piece of closed cell foam will work.  It's a good idea under liquid fuel stoves like the single burners where the tank contacts the ground as well.  You can buy various mixtures of the propane/butane cartridges for different temperatures if needed.

My buddies and I use Coleman stoves when camping in Tioga County, PA at an elevation of ~2400 feet. What we've found:

• In warm weather propane is a lot easier to use. It's basically like using a gas range at home except there's no automatic igniter.
• Below freezing, white gas performs better. It can be a PITA to pump the tank and potentially messier due to spills but it's a lot more energy dense and performs better below freezing.
• Having a liquid fuel stove with a propane conversion gives you the best of both worlds. Choose the fuel that meets your needs at a particular time and place.

So, in the tradition of Arcom, get both.

I've sprayed raw fuel on the burner of a suitcase stove from the generator. Light it and turn the knob when the fuel is almost out.

That works too and it's what I usually do since I ran out of paste years ago and never bothered to replace it.  

That's the reason to go with larger than 1 lb tanks. The 1 lb tanks freeze up quickly vs the larger thermal mass of the larger tank. Of course you can't backpack a 11 or 20 lb tank.

I think it's possible we have people in this thread talking about different size stoves. Some, like me, are talking about car/truck/camper stoves and some are talking about backpacking stoves. I'd give different recommendations depending on what someone is wanting to do with the stove.

If I was going to be backpacking at high elevations in cold weather, I'd recommend a liquid fuel stove. More energy dense fuel and works better at elevation especially in the cold. I have a now discontinued Coleman Peak One stove that I take on  ATV trips.

We generally go camper camping in spring, summer, and fall. We occasionally camp when the temps dip below freezing and with the 11lb tank we have no issues with the stove not running at max capacity. We even have a three burner stove we use and on the large tank we can run all three burners at max without a problem. When it's cold out we'll freeze up the 1 lb bottles when running 2 or 3 burners.

I have and use both.  Both have pluses and minuses.  I probably use white gas more often just to keep the fuel rotated (although it has a very long shelf life).

Propane is certainly easier in warmer weather.  I only use 20# propane tanks and haven't bothered with smaller tanks in years.  A 20# tank will run a stove or lantern for a very long time.   The distribution tees that attach to the tank are handy.   I've seen hoses and regulators go bad.

As said above, white gas is better in the cold.  Pump cups and cap gaskets are the only parts I've replaced on the white gas stoves and lanterns.  They sometimes require disassembly and cleaning.   It sucks when you're in the woods and spill white gas on your skin or clothes.

Pick one or both!!

Although I do have a white gas stove and lantern that I inherited, the high cost and limited availability of white gas turns me off.

Not factoring in the gasoline generator;
-My heating preps are centered around kerosene with propane as a backup.
-My cooking preps are centered around propane with white gas or wood as a backup.
-My lighting preps are heavily divided between propane, kerosene, white gas, battery and candles.

As much as Coleman stoves have been around for ever, for a propane stove I prefer the Camp Chef Everest stove.

The Camp Chef Everest stove has 2 20,000 BTU burners compared to the 8,000-10,000 burners on the Colemans.



https://www.campchef.com/two-burner-stove-everest.html

My GF bought that for me at Christmas and while I’ve yet to cook anything on it, it really throws some BTUs.

$99 at Dicks, 25% off coupon, free shipping and $5 for tax.  $80 out the door and it has no plaguing problems with ‘simmer.’

Chris

Lanterns do convert to kero easily enough. Factory or not they all involve filling a tiny cup with alcohol at the bottom of the generator and lighting that for a preheat. I'm not interested in the hassle myself fwiw

Good stove but get a bigger tank with a hose. If you pull that many BTUs out of the 1lb tank it'll freeze up really fast especially in cooler weather.

I might, but it’s not a huge concern for my intended usage.

Chris

If OP is intent on a Coleman stove--as in small suitcase size-- then get the Dual Fuel model PLUS the aftermarket propane convertor.  The converter is originally set up for use with relatively expensive 1# propane bottles.  No expert, but if connecting much larger propane sources, an in-line regulator might be necessary.

ETA:  Any used liquid-fuel stove must be approached with the view that some maintenance must be done, and perhaps some parts replacement.  It is not uncommon for the pumps to need replacement, and the fuel tank should be visually inspected with a good light to see if rust has started internally.  If so, then the tank should be replaced, if it is still available.  If not (and this may be true of some older models), there are ways to neutralize the rust and coat the inside of the tank with a solution intended for that exact purpose.  Motor cycle shops may be able to provide more info on this procedure/and the solution(s) required.

The $20 yard sale "find" is no bargain.  if it needs a new fuel tank and pump-- although it is always a wise idea to have a new pump on-hand.  A quick look shows that brand-new fuel tanks (with new pump) go for about $40 from Coleman.  Whether or not they have a replacement fuel tank for a particular stove is an open question.

Some tips for removing internal fuel tank rust: https://classiccampstoves.com/threads/tip-for-removing-rust-from-coleman-stove-tank.12497/

The sealer, to be used after-de-rusting, is here: https://www.amazon.com/POR-15-49216-U-S-Standard-Sealer/dp/B00B3HXCZ4/ref=sr_1_12_sspa?hvadid=77996657599383&hvbmt=bb&hvdev=c&hvqmt=b&keywords=fuel+tank+repair+kit&qid=1576335181&sr=8-12-spons&psc=1&spLa=ZW5jcnlwdGVkUXVhbGlmaWVyPUEzT0xCSEo4VktLWjJXJmVuY3J5cHRlZElkPUEwNzA1MTcxMk9YRUNIMVJHT0lEWCZlbmNyeXB0ZWRBZElkPUEwMjY4MTUzMktESkoyQzBVSUNOJndpZGdldE5hbWU9c3BfbXRmJmFjdGlvbj1jbGlja1JlZGlyZWN0JmRvTm90TG9nQ2xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==

Shouldn't need a regulator on the tank.  The regulator is on the propane line just before the stove.  You do need the correct hose to connect the hose to the same point that you would connect the 1lb tank.  Just like a Mr. Heater Buddy heater....you won't need a regulator on the tank like you have on a propane grill....just need the right hose.

Here is the hose you need.



You can also get this splitter and run two appliances

Please expound on these mods....

jd1

Same here, propane stoves are More reliable in my experiences.  I do use a Coleman liquid fuel lantern, but my 425 stove sits on the shelf since I bought a basic Coleman propane stove.

I have both as well as butane stove. Comparing all 3 during the summer/warmer months i tend to use the butane just for ease. The other 2 whatever im in the mood for. But in reality its best to get all. They arent expensive just make sure to purchase cast iron as well

I don't think any reasonable person can dispute the claim that the Coleman propane stove is the easiest to use.  But this being a Survival Forum, then I suggest getting the Multi-Fuel stove, the Propane adaptor, and making a point of using all of them to the point you are entirely familiar with them.  And get some adaptors and hoses to hook up your Propane-powered stove to larger propane tanks, instead of the usual 1lb bottles.

I think it makes sense, in a Survival Forum context, to have one's stove able to run on as many different fuels as possible, and having the requisite equipment needed to do so.

All the equipment in the world will be of scant use if you don't practice with it.  So, practice, and best yet, practice in the dark, and wind, and rain.  That's when you will probably need it.

Depends on the stove.

502s, 533s, and other single burners can burn kerosene stock but it is kind of a sooty hassle. Kero, diesel, and Jet-A are all similar.

Suitcase stoves do not run well on kero.

Stoves do exist that can be properly converted but you would need to change jets for diesel/alcohol/gas.

Dual Fuel. Super convenient. Attached File

Currently, only have the propane version.

We use it often with 1lbers and occasionally used the 20lb with hose just to make sure it worked.

The adapters to refill your 1lb containers is handy.

In the future looking to get a white gas version strictly for versatility.

KILLERtj

The real answer is none of that Coleman shit.  Coleman blows.

For a super versatile and lightweight option, try an alcohol stove.  Burns anything from bottles of yellow HEET you can get from Autozone to Everclear from the liquor store to Denatured Alcohol from Lowes.  The one I'm posting below can use wood or solid fuel too...

Evernew titanium multi-fuel stove

I have a couple Coleman Dual Fuel stoves as well.

What did you do to mod them to run the heavier fuels?