What zero range would you set for that terrain? I'm thinking of a 300 yard zero. Running the ballistics, it looks like that will keep it within 7 inches above and below out to 450 yards. I can't imagine taking a shot that far. If I bring the zero back to 250 yards, that keeps it within 4 inches to 350 yards.

Anyone have experience with the 9.3 on Elk? Or would you go with a different caliber for that area?

I'd keep the shorter zero, too easy to forget to compensate for the deviation.  The 9.3 should be fine for elk but I don't believe it's intended for longer ranges.  With exceptions, elk shots are more often around 200 yards and some of the well known hunters wouldn't take a shot over 300.

I set my elk rifle up for maximizing point blank range.  Somewhere around 3.5" high at 100 yards gives me about a 300 yard range.  Just over a 200 yard zero, maybe 225 yds.  Define your 'kill zone" size, say a  8" circle, set up your scope so that when holding dead center your bullet trajectory never climbs higher than 4" high, your range is out to where bullet trajectory falls below 4".  

If you're in western montana timber 200 yd shots are hard to come by.  I have not killed a lot of elk, but the last 3 were under 75 yards. If you get an eastern Montana tag, then you'll get longer shots.

Thanks. That's about what I was thinking. I played around with the ballistics caliber to find where 4-5" was the most it ever rose above the sight line.

I'm going to suggest a 200 yard zero...  Under NO circumstance would I use a 300 yard zero with a 9.3. Here is why....

My rationale is somewhat "off topic" but very very relevant.  I'm not especially well versed in the 9.3.  However, I am fairly familiar with the 350 Rem Mag.  My load was a 225 grain .358" Nosler Partition at a muzzle velocity of about 2650 fps...  This is a load that is somewhat similar to the 9.3, in that its a big, fat, chunky bullet (the 9.3 is .366") at very modest speeds.  If you are using the original 286 grainers, your MV is likely on the order of less than 2400 fps....

Here is the problem:  Hitting the target is only half the equation.  Bullet performance once its ON the target matters.  With my old 350 and the lighter, faster, slimmer 225 partitions, I had a self-imposed limit of 300 yards MAXIMUM.  I could hit farther.  However, at 300 yards my bullets were dropping down into the 2000-2100 fps range.  At these speeds the bullets would expand sufficiently, however any less velocity would NOT guarantee expansion. In other words, hitting at game animal at 325 or 350 yards meant little to no expansion since impact speeds would be insufficient...And this was with my slimmer, more areodynamic 225's at 2650.  Your 9.3 throws  fatter slower 286's at 2350...

I did take a cow moose at a laser ranged 292 yards.  It worked.  I got expansion.  However, it wasn't the "hammer of Thor" sort or terminal impact that I had come to expect at shorter ranges and higher impact speeds.  I remain convinced that my 300 yard limit was a good idea

Pulling some velocity info from Federal Premium and running a quick ballistics check, Federal's Swift A frame load is plodding along at about 1750 fps at 300 yards.  The Woodleigh load is only moving 1509 fps!!! Remember, this is at 300 yards.   I am not especially well versed with either of these bullets, but Swift's website shows a fired 308" caliber AFrame at impact speed of 1850.  It not expanded worth a damn and pretty much just a glorified flattened nose.  Drop that to 1750 and you likely have a non-expanding bullet that acts like a FMJ....  The woodleigh would be worse...    And this is AT your intended 300 yard zero...  Starting punching holes in elk at 325, 350 yards, and you can expect even slower impact speeds, and I would expect total failure to expand.  None.  Zero. Zip.

I made well be totally missing something in regards to 9.3.  Its possible that bullets designed for this specific cartridge are intentionally "softer" and may expand to lower impact speeds.  This is where my ignorance begins to show.  However, the considering very comparable medium bores like  350 Rem Mag, .35 Whelen and 338-06, I pay very very VERY close attention to impact speeds and try to carefully match a bullet to those impact velocities.  Typically, the issue is not hitting the target.  The issue is getting the bullet to open up and actually expand when it does hit the target.

.35 and .366 bullets, big chunky things with the ballistic coefficients of a bulldozer, started at pedestrian muzzle velocities of 2400, 2500, 2600 fps are, for the most part, effective only to about 300 yards.  If your bullets fail to expand at 325, 350 and farther, why bother zeroing for that range?  Use a 200 yard zero.  If your elk is any where from muzzle to 250 yards, aim pretty much dead on and squeeze.  If you think its 250-300 yards, aim high on the shoulder and squeeze the trigger.  The bullet drops right into the breadbasket.  If your elk is 325 yards out,  get closer or watch it walk away. .  It's just beyond the effective capability of the tool you're selected...

It's possible to get some longer range performance.  It boils down to finding a very specific bullet that will open at lower impact speeds.  In my case, the favored Nosler partitions are decent down to about 2000 (Nosler says more like 1900, but like a little safety margin). if I instead use a Nosler Ballistic Tip, those are far softer and will open decently down to 1800 or so.  I can rely on them to open better than the Partitions at 300, 325, 350. However,  these aren t going to work nearly as well when my elk (moose in my case) is 40 yards out...  Its a trade off...

.366" bullets are a real oddity, pretty much loaded only for the 9.3x62 (and the longer rimmed 74). Its possible bullet makers intentionally  design these 'softer" than normal for better expansion at lower impact speeds.  I simply don't know the cartridge the well.  However, I would STRONGLY urge some careful research.  If the typical 9.3 load using a swift aframe, nobler partition, etc acts anything like a .338, or .358 version of the same bullet, your 9.3 Mauser is a 300 yard gun.  Period.  You can hit target farther than that but bullets simply may well totally fail to expand...

If your bullets "dont work" at ranges over 300, why use the 300 yard zero????

(I did check noslers 250 accubond load.  This is a smidgen lighter and a tad faster (at 2550) than most of the other loads, which are 286 grs. and slower. and the accubond is a bit softer than many others.  Its possible you MIGHT get a bit better expansion at 300 or 325 with this one specific load.  Nosler says these should moving at 2048 fps at 300 yards, which is again pretty much the lowest end of this bullet's operating window. Interestingly enough, while Nosler shows data for 400, 500, 600 yards with other cartridges, it only shows a ballistic table for the 9.3 out to 300 yards..  That probably means something)


I'd use the 200 yard zero, call it good, and simply know that 300 yards is the absolute long range limit of my 9.3x62.   Hope this helps...

That does help, thank you. Very interesting perspective.

Since .366 is basically only loaded in the x62 and x57, I ASSumed bullets would be optimized for those velocities. I'll have to look into expansion velocity limits further. Thanks.

It seems that the Hornady 286 grain is claimed to expand down to 1800 fps.

I'll throw one other slight consideration at you....

Any of the cartridges I mentioned (the 350, 35 Whelen, and the 9.3) really loose a LOT of steam once they hit 300 yards....  Once the bullet has crossed that third football field, it is typically down into the 1900-2100 fps range for most of the bullets we can use in those cases.  This is pretty damned pedestrian...  The issue of range starts to become a problem that demands a very precise answer....  

I'm not a huge long range shooting aficionado...  I'm an eastern hunter, and my opportunities to shoot at extended range are limited.  My skills are limited.  However, go to one of the online ammo calculators like Federal Premium, select a 9.3 load, and compare it to something like a 300 Win Mag loaded with a 180 Accubond.  Then look carefully at the 300 and 400 yard point of impacts and in particular, the wind drift figures... Sometimes a visual representation is a good thing...  Two things become apparent...

1) If you use a laser range finder, its all good.  You get an exact number.  However, if you are estimating range (That big rock was lasered at 300, the bull is just beyond it, lets call it 300 yards...) and your actual range is more like 350, bad stuff happens...  With the faster 300, your bullet drop is likely about 4" lower than you had planned.  Same mistake with the 9.3 and its now off intended target by something closer to a foot...

2) Wind....  Is that left to right cross wind blowing 10 mph?  or is it closer to 15?  I know that isn't my strong suit.  At 300 yards the 300 Win mag has been pushed 5 or 6 inches.  At the same range the 9.3 is off target double that...  If I make a mistake on wind estimating with the 9.3, any mistake has HUGE effects at longer range.

Don't get me wrong:  I absolutely LOVE big medium bores.  I'm a HUGE .35 caliber fan.  These big ol chunky bullets just smack the shit out of things.  However, they go awfully slow at anything beyond 300 yards...   And as those speeds drop dramatically, the whole long range shooting skill set is exponentially harder.   A little error in judgement with a speedy cartridge like a 300 Mag or my 280 Ackley Improved isn't a huge deal.  However, the very same mistake made with my medium bore has DOUBLE the unintended consequence at the same range.  Smacking gongs at 300 and 400 with that 280 AI, or my 6.5 Creedmore isn't all that hard.  I even do it regularly with my little 5.56.  Experience has taught me its harder to do consistently with my medium bores...  Something about "wrong tool for the job" and all that....

Please, I'm not trying to piss on your idea.   You asked for input, and this is a very honest attempt to help.  Given the ballistic limitations of the big 9.3, I'd use the 200 yard zero.  If its at 100 yards I just "know" bullet impact is going to be 3" or so high and adjust my aim accordingly.  Looks about 200?  aim and squeeze.  Closer to 300?  High on the shoulder and let it drop in.  at 300 or farther?  Damn, shoulda brought the 280 AI.....

Honestly hope this helps...

Fro

If you can, try to find what that expansion actually looks like...

Look at these Swift Aframes...  Same bullet, different impact speeds



2500, 2600, 2700 fps and these are absolute hammers...  Look hard at 1850....  yeah its "expanded".  But that little riveted flattened nose is simply going to push a small hole thru and keep on going...

Virtually all bullet makers will give you a design impact speed 'window':  Starts expanding at xxxx, use all the way to YYYY.    Unfortunately the lower end of that window is often a bit 'optimistic".  again, yes, there is "expansion".  Look at the 1850 impact speed on the Swift Aframe pic.  It's expanded.  I personally dont think it is expanded very well.  If Nosler says a Partition expands well down to 1800 (and they do), then I use 1900 or 2000 as my own lower limit.    


This second pic is Nosler's photo of the Partition.  In my experience, its a decent lower velocity bullet.  However, I haven't got a similar pic of Hornady's Interlock.  And I'd MUCH prefer to see this image in either .358" or .366" if at all possible.    the bullet makers usually 'tweak" medium bore bullets a bit, and they act differently than their .277, .284, and .308 siblings...

Snoop around some..  See if you can find someone who has done testing in a big 358 or 366 cal and find pics of the bullets and corresponding impact speeds.  I suspect it may prove really enlightening....

Yes, that's great information. Maybe I should just go with a 300.