User Panel
[#1]
Quoted:
Ok guys, here it is, at end of day Friday, and they just flipped the switch. 3-18x50 HUD DMR is in stock View Quote I was really hoping to hold out for the Athena, but this is tempting me now. Could you calculate how the drops would work compared to a Grendel with a 123gr pill with a .510 G1 moving at an average of 2575 fps? (20") also same but with the average speed of 2480 fps? (16") If it would work for the ranging/drops on either of these 2, a may pull the trigger now Thanks |
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[#3]
Quoted:
Dang it! I was really hoping to hold out for the Athena, but this is tempting me now. Could you calculate how the drops would work compared to a Grendel with a 123gr pill with a .510 G1 moving at an average of 2575 fps? (20") also same but with the average speed of 2480 fps? (16") If it would work for the ranging/drops on either of these 2, a may pull the trigger now Thanks View Quote With the HUD DMR .308 what you're dealing with is that the .308 flies flatter than 6.5 Grendel. So you start out having to compensate high, and wind up hitting low at long range anyway, with a sweet spot in the middle. Here we have a pretty significant initial offset of zeroing 1.5" high at 100, and you'll be mostly good to 600 yards that way, but by 700 yards the Grendel is hitting significantly low. The HUD DMR 5.56 does a bit better, at least at close range, because it flies flatter. Again with significant initial offset, in this case zeroing at just 33 yards (I set the target at 100 so you can see that it's pretty high at 100). Here we are almost dead on out to 600, significantly closer than the .308 reticle, and you're still pretty good at 700. It's not until you are at 800 yards that you really start hitting significantly low. That's a pretty dang decent setup, and if you want to try it out, we just put the 3-18x50 up on preorder this morning. Oh yeah, they are coming soon people. If I were in your shoes I would put in for the HUD DMR 5.56 and play with offsets once you have your actual build and ammo chronographed. |
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[#4]
Thank you. I dig the fast reticle, but trying to remember, or referring to notes takes the whole 'aim and shoot' factor out of that reticle.
I guess I'll just learn more patience in waiting for the Athena for using with my ballistic calc app |
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[#5]
Yuuuuuuup. If you're gonna have a chart taped to your stock anyway, might as well just crunch your own numbers for MIL or MOA.
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[#6]
Quoted:
...we just put the 3-18x50 up on preorder this morning. Oh yeah, they are coming soon people. View Quote |
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[#7]
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[#8]
I just saw at the bottom of the ACSS e-mail that the Apollo 6.5CM scopes are available for pre-order.
https://www.primaryarms.com/pa-3-18x50mm-illuminated-ffp-rifle-scope-with-apollo-hude-6-5cm-reticle |
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[#9]
Mike, what torque do you recommend to use when mounting these? I couldn't find any info about it in your manual. Mine will be in a LaRue LT-204. They suggest 30 in/lb on the bottom screws, then 30 on the top screws. Mark has said 24 on the top should be okay. This is going on a 5.56 AR.
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[#10]
Torque spec is really more dependent on the mount than on the optic tube itself. I would always go with the mount manufacturer's recommendation, and use some blue thread locker for cheap insurance.
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[#11]
Just got a shipping notification on the 3-18 Apollo 6.5! Looks like Christmas came early.
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[#12]
Quoted:
Just got a shipping notification on the 3-18 Apollo 6.5! Looks like Christmas came early. View Quote |
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[#13]
Quoted: How would you like some detailed load data we tested while we were waiting for them to come into stock? View Quote Very interesting info on the 90gr .224 Valkyrie load, too. I happen to have a Valk as well, just haven't ponied up a whole lot for the 90gr pills, yet. This scope will be going in a Larue QD mount, so I might have to swap it over to the .224 at some point next spring and give it a try. |
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[#14]
Just took delivery of a 3-18x55 DMR 5.56. It looks great on my home built AR15 with Warne one piece mount and seems to be of very high quality. Can't wait to get this out to the range.
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[#16]
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[#18]
Yup, that's pretty hot. Mind if we share the pic on Instagram or Facebook? I don't know that we will, but if you say yes I'll show it to the guy who can make it happen if he wants to.
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[#19]
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[#20]
Mike
Can you give us a break down for the BDC (223/308) reticle for both 22lr And 17 hmr. Just curious if I could make it work for either cartridge |
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[#21]
@stre-tch
Sounds like fun to tinker with, but I doubt it's gonna match up super well, but I'll see if I can figure out some initial offset. Might we wiser to wait for one of the grid reticles, ATHENA or HERA, and run your own numbers. Got a certain barrel length or velocity you want to work with as a starter? Maybe a favorite kind of ammo? |
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[#22]
Mike-
Will R-grid, Athena, and Hera all release at the same time? Any updates on the ETA? Just payed for a new Tikka T3x, and I think this scope with the R-grid will be perfect for it. EDIT: Just read in another thread that reticles will release one at a time. Can you reveal what order they will be released in? |
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[#23]
Quoted:
Mike- Will R-grid, Athena, and Hera all release at the same time? Any updates on the ETA? Just payed for a new Tikka T3x, and I think this scope with the R-grid will be perfect for it. EDIT: Just read in another thread that reticles will release one at a time. Can you reveal what order they will be released in? View Quote Tikka T3 is an tremendous and quite underrated rifle, in my book. I encountered them occasionally when gunsmithing in Colorado, hunters out there appreciated their light weight and accuracy. |
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[#24]
Has it been printed what bullet weight and average velocity was used to calculate the BDC?
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[#25]
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[#26]
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[#27]
Quoted:
My apologies. The .308 ACSS HUD DMR. I would be shooting a 168 SMK with a 0.462BC moving about 2600fps. View Quote It so happens that I have my Rem 700 virtually set up in Strelok Pro and my load is a 168 grain SMK at 2650. So hey, what can I say, you have excellent taste sir. So I brought it up and changed my velocity to 2700 fps. Here's bullet drop: 500 yards = 58.77 in, 11.22 MOA, 3.3 MRAD 700 yards = 148.10 in, 20.20 MOA, 5.9 MRAD 900 yards = 302.32 in, 32.08 MOA, 9.3 MRAD and the round has gone subsonic Then I changed velocity to 2600 fps, here's the drop: 500 yards = 64.44 in, 12.31 MOA, 3.6 MRAD so + 5.7 inches low compared to 2700 fps 700 yards = 162.28 in, 16.85 MOA, 4.9 MRAD +14.2 inches low 900 yards = 332.07 in, 35.23 MOA, 10.2 MRAD +29.8 inches low Up to 500 yards there isn't enough difference to matter that much, I mean if you're shooting groups tight enough to notice a repeatable 3 inch difference at 400 yards than I need to take a class from you. Past 500 yards things start to diverge more. If you're planning on reaching out that far with HUD DMR, and you certainly can, there are two methods. First you can download StrelokPro which is worth it's weight in gold and calculate an initial offset to compensate for the added drop at distance. If you sight in half an inch high or something like that at 100 yards, then the BDC will line up better with the trajectory as distance increases. Secondly, you can use that as just a base line, then go out and actually reach out to those longer distances and count some clicks to fine tune your impact there. If you can fine tune the reticle to hit for your exact rifle and load at 800 yards, for example, you aren't hurting yourself AT ALL when it comes to 300, 400, 500 yard shooting. In fact you are likely to be MORE accurate at those closer ranges when you really have the reticle dialed in at the longer ranges. I hope this helps. |
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[#28]
@PA_Mike thanks for your reply. I actually ran across Strelok last night while doing research and found that if I zero at 200 yards then it puts my POI within .1 to .2 tenths of a mil out to about 700 yards. Honestly anything further than five or six hundred I would just dial for so that puts me well within the ball park. Thanks for your help. I think this will be the most useable scope I have ever owned .
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[#30]
Quoted:
@stre-tch Sounds like fun to tinker with, but I doubt it's gonna match up super well, but I'll see if I can figure out some initial offset. Might we wiser to wait for one of the grid reticles, ATHENA or HERA, and run your own numbers. Got a certain barrel length or velocity you want to work with as a starter? Maybe a favorite kind of ammo? View Quote Going to have to look at the other reticles too. |
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[#31]
Has anyone compared the glass on these to something similar price wise?? I am having trouble deciding between this and the Athlon Midas Tac 4-16-44. Both are same price. Any opinions?
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[#32]
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[#34]
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[#35]
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[#36]
I will most likely wait for the Athena reticle, but I had a question that I don't think has been asked yet. Do these have any sort of zero stop? How is the tracking with them?
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[#37]
Quoted:
I will most likely wait for the Athena reticle, but I had a question that I don't think has been asked yet. Do these have any sort of zero stop? How is the tracking with them? View Quote We are seeing about a 3% deviation over the course of 10 mils. V/R |
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[#38]
@PA_Mike
Any plans for an ARC-2 model? I've been using an ARC-2 4-14x44 to wack ground squirrels with but want something with better light, clarity and a little more magnification for those 200+ yard shots. |
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[#40]
Quoted:
@PA_Mike Any plans for an ARC-2 model? I've been using an ARC-2 4-14x44 to wack ground squirrels with but want something with better light, clarity and a little more magnification for those 200+ yard shots. View Quote We do however have the BPR hera in moa in development with the 3-18. |
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[#41]
The Her\ra MOA Grid will be ready soon for your MOA guys. Arc 2 will probably happen but not in the works as of yet.
Edit to add: Looks like Nick and I were posting at the same time. TO clarify. Hera development is done, prototypes approved and production is scheduled. |
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[#42]
@Marsh1
Have any of your reviewers done some comparisons of these scopes vs the competition? I figured I would be seeing a ton more reviews based on features and price but I really haven’t seen much. With all the reticles you have there should be something for everyone |
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[#43]
Quoted:
@Marsh1 Have any of your reviewers done some comparisons of these scopes vs the competition? I figured I would be seeing a ton more reviews based on features and price but I really haven’t seen much. With all the reticles you have there should be something for everyone View Quote |
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[#44]
Primary Arms Silver Series 3-18x50mm FFP Rifle Scope - Illuminated Athena BPR MIL Reticle
Silver series BPR Athena's in 3-18 are back in! Guys the feedback has been great...get em while you can. |
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[#45]
FWIW, I'm running the 6.5 CM one on my PSA 6.5 Creedmoor; and discuss some its features and nuances in my gun-log thread on that rifle. Basically the entire concept is a cost-effective Creedmoor PRS style action gun and optics. So to me, a decent Silver Line scope from PA (who have a pretty good rep on scopes) combined with a decent PSA creedmoor rifle, is an optimization experiment on costs and performance; which is going pretty decent.
https://www.ar15.com/forums/precision-rifles/PSA-6-5-Creedmoor-PA10-PA65-Lazy-s-Log/4-9020/ On this scope, overall, it's not perfect; and has some nuances, but it's a lot of scope for $500. My biggest wish is that they did the reticle just a touch different; and put one of their large quick aquisition rings around the center on their Apollo reticle, because at 3X it goes so fine with the FFP it pretty much can't be used. The point of going 3X and parallax that goes down to 10 yards, is to be able to quick acquire and shoot stuff close, yet as is, the reticle doesn't really support that. My Burris is the same way, the trade off with FFP is that at low power, the reticles just get really darned fine; it's not a unique PA issue. I suspect in low light with the illumination though, it'll work out pretty good then. At higher power, once you get above 6 or so, the reticle is large and clear enough to work pretty good. Glass clarity is good, but if your head isn't centered right, it can double/fuzz out on you some. That's not necessarily a terrible thing, since consistency of head-position is important anyway. Biggest surprise is that it's pretty fragile to torque from the front ring. I had something UNDER 20 in-lb on my front ring (I don't recall what was used originally, but that's what was on the torque wrench to unscrew); yet even that was still enough to squeeze the scope enough to bind up the parallax adjustment dial. It's not so fragile that such damaged it, and loosening that up, and the dial spins easy now. But man, that's not a lot of torque, so kind of weird. All in all, I considered sending it back for a refund while trying to figure out why parallax was giving me fits. now that it's working again - I finally realized that for $500; I'm not going to find anything even close. If I had to buy it again, I suppose I would; particularly for pairing up with a cost-effective rifle concept. I suppose the only thing I might have done different is run with the lighter mount, as the PA Deluxe mount is a little chunkier than it has to be. But to the scope itself... yea, I'd buy it again. |
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[#46]
Quoted:
FWIW, I'm running the 6.5 CM one on my PSA 6.5 Creedmoor; and discuss some its features and nuances in my gun-log thread on that rifle. Basically the entire concept is a cost-effective Creedmoor PRS style action gun and optics. So to me, a decent Silver Line scope from PA (who have a pretty good rep on scopes) combined with a decent PSA creedmoor rifle, is an optimization experiment on costs and performance; which is going pretty decent. https://www.ar15.com/forums/precision-rifles/PSA-6-5-Creedmoor-PA10-PA65-Lazy-s-Log/4-9020/ On this scope, overall, it's not perfect; and has some nuances, but it's a lot of scope for $500. My biggest wish is that they did the reticle just a touch different; and put one of their large quick aquisition rings around the center on their Apollo reticle, because at 3X it goes so fine with the FFP it pretty much can't be used. The point of going 3X and parallax that goes down to 10 yards, is to be able to quick acquire and shoot stuff close, yet as is, the reticle doesn't really support that. My Burris is the same way, the trade off with FFP is that at low power, the reticles just get really darned fine; it's not a unique PA issue. I suspect in low light with the illumination though, it'll work out pretty good then. At higher power, once you get above 6 or so, the reticle is large and clear enough to work pretty good. Glass clarity is good, but if your head isn't centered right, it can double/fuzz out on you some. That's not necessarily a terrible thing, since consistency of head-position is important anyway. Biggest surprise is that it's pretty fragile to torque from the front ring. I had something UNDER 20 in-lb on my front ring (I don't recall what was used originally, but that's what was on the torque wrench to unscrew); yet even that was still enough to squeeze the scope enough to bind up the parallax adjustment dial. It's not so fragile that such damaged it, and loosening that up, and the dial spins easy now. But man, that's not a lot of torque, so kind of weird. All in all, I considered sending it back for a refund while trying to figure out why parallax was giving me fits. now that it's working again - I finally realized that for $500; I'm not going to find anything even close. If I had to buy it again, I suppose I would; particularly for pairing up with a cost-effective rifle concept. I suppose the only thing I might have done different is run with the lighter mount, as the PA Deluxe mount is a little chunkier than it has to be. But to the scope itself... yea, I'd buy it again. View Quote |
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[#47]
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[#48]
Silver Series 3-18's are here!!
Primary Arms Silver Series 3-18x50mm FFP Rifle Scope - Illuminated Hera BPR MOA Reticle We are filling all the pre orders and now shipping the Silver 3-18. |
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[#49]
Gents, on the 3-18 Apollo 6.5 CM version; could you please indicate what the actual MIL's the graduations are on the elevation? e.g., how many Mils is it from 0 to 300 yards, how many mils up is that 400 yard marking, etc? I'm using a spectrum of different ammo, and found that it worked very well out to 600 yards, but after that - differences in ammo started to show up. I will say, FWIW, the friend I was with was so impressed with the scope, he immediately went to your website and bout one just like it, so hey - that's not bad!
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[#50]
Bump on the above. Would be handy to know the actual MIL's used for the BDC ticks on this scope, for the Apollo 6.5 Reticle.
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