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Quoted: Since when does a US soldier get a rifle that is 1/9 non chrome lined? They don't, the Remington military version has 1/7. Not skimping on quality my ass. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Since when does a US soldier get a rifle that is 1/9 non chrome lined? They don't, the Remington military version has 1/7. Not skimping on quality my ass. http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/1452/bushmaster1.png |
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Looks like they're planning for the early adopters (primarily civilian operators) to rush out and buy at the inflated price, giving them quick payback on their development costs. By the time the military comes around and says "hey we're interested," they can drop their drawers and offer them up in qty for 1/2 the MSRP or less. "Hey Uncle Sam, civilians are buying these up at twice the price, look how good a deal you're getting..."
I don't think I want to be a pawn in this game. Could be a good opportunity for a dark-horse candidate to come in and take advantage of the obvious market void. Perhaps the RRA PPS rifle or something from DPMS will emerge to capitalize on some of the angst that's building. Could even see a SCAR price drop, at least that's how competition is supposed to work. |
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Thinking about it more they could certaily take lessons from Mr. Mark LaRue. When the OBR came out(which is done on a much smaller scale and all R&D in house as far as I know) he offered it at a discounted price(to what it is now) and on top of that he threw in all kinds of swag including a OBR rifle scope mount. All while offering a cutting edge Grade A Top Tier rifle.
He managed all that along with contributing to this site like no other along with countless charitable causes. Take a few notes Bushmaster. |
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The price is stupid. A vastly superior rifle can be had for the amount of money they're asking for the enhanced version.
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Watch as this clueless rep from Shrubmaster tries to justify their insane pricing on these rifles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgbOuMgoh8E Keep It Yup.. basically he said "we could have kept it shitty bushmaster quality for a real good price but we decided to actually make a good rifle so we feel the price is necessary" Wow, they sure are proud of that rifle. I'm glad they'll get to keep most of them since they like them so much. I feel like kicking a baby... |
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Watch as this clueless rep from Shrubmaster tries to justify their insane pricing on these rifles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgbOuMgoh8E Keep It Yup.. basically he said "we could have kept it shitty bushmaster quality for a real good price but we decided to actually make a good rifle so we feel the price is necessary" Wow, they sure are proud of that rifle. I'm glad they'll get to keep most of them since they like them so much. I feel like kicking a baby... Or slapping some hippies from Maine. |
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Looks like they're planning for the early adopters (primarily civilian operators) to rush out and buy at the inflated price, giving them quick payback on their development costs. By the time the military comes around and says "hey we're interested," they can drop their drawers and offer them up in qty for 1/2 the MSRP or less. "Hey Uncle Sam, civilians are buying these up at twice the price, look how good a deal you're getting..." I don't think I want to be a pawn in this game. Could be a good opportunity for a dark-horse candidate to come in and take advantage of the obvious market void. Perhaps the RRA PPS rifle or something from DPMS will emerge to capitalize on some of the angst that's building. Could even see a SCAR price drop, at least that's how competition is supposed to work. The thing is...I doubt the .Mil will be interested. What does it offer the military that the m4 doesn't...ulltmately? Given the factor that we are going to stay with the 5.56mm round. |
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Looks like they're planning for the early adopters (primarily civilian operators) to rush out and buy at the inflated price, giving them quick payback on their development costs. By the time the military comes around and says "hey we're interested," they can drop their drawers and offer them up in qty for 1/2 the MSRP or less. "Hey Uncle Sam, civilians are buying these up at twice the price, look how good a deal you're getting..." I don't think I want to be a pawn in this game. Could be a good opportunity for a dark-horse candidate to come in and take advantage of the obvious market void. Perhaps the RRA PPS rifle or something from DPMS will emerge to capitalize on some of the angst that's building. Could even see a SCAR price drop, at least that's how competition is supposed to work. The thing is...I doubt the .Mil will be interested. What does it offer the military that the m4 doesn't...ulltmately? Given the factor that we are going to stay with the 5.56mm round. True. And I remember reading somewhere that Remington is working on a Magnesium or other metal type lower for .Mil. |
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Looks like they're planning for the early adopters (primarily civilian operators) to rush out and buy at the inflated price, giving them quick payback on their development costs. By the time the military comes around and says "hey we're interested," they can drop their drawers and offer them up in qty for 1/2 the MSRP or less. "Hey Uncle Sam, civilians are buying these up at twice the price, look how good a deal you're getting..." I don't think I want to be a pawn in this game. Could be a good opportunity for a dark-horse candidate to come in and take advantage of the obvious market void. Perhaps the RRA PPS rifle or something from DPMS will emerge to capitalize on some of the angst that's building. Could even see a SCAR price drop, at least that's how competition is supposed to work. The thing is...I doubt the .Mil will be interested. What does it offer the military that the m4 doesn't...ulltmately? Given the factor that we are going to stay with the 5.56mm round. Exactly. Another also ran. No fault of the manufacturer though. The US military has historically clung to small arms way past their prime. That said however the M-16 family was way ahead of the curve design wise and remains competitive today. As to the rumored price of the ACR? Laughable. |
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Watch as this clueless rep from Shrubmaster tries to justify their insane pricing on these rifles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgbOuMgoh8E Keep It Yup.. basically he said "we could have kept it shitty bushmaster quality for a real good price but we decided to actually make a good rifle so we feel the price is necessary" Wow, they sure are proud of that rifle. I'm glad they'll get to keep most of them since they like them so much. I feel like kicking a baby... Or slapping some hippies from Maine Colorado. Fixed it. ^ |
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Watch as this clueless rep from Shrubmaster tries to justify their insane pricing on these rifles: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgbOuMgoh8E Keep It Yup.. basically he said "we could have kept it shitty bushmaster quality for a real good price but we decided to actually make a good rifle so we feel the price is necessary" Wow, they sure are proud of that rifle. I'm glad they'll get to keep most of them since they like them so much. I feel like kicking a baby... Or slapping some hippies from Maine Colorado. Fixed it. ^ Yeah. Magpul designed a kick ass rifle and called it the Masada because they have a rebel image and were inspired by the 'defiance' in the story of the Masada siege... then they sold the design to the Romans? It makes my head spin just to try to wrap my mind around that. |
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Guys did that rep say $2700 for the basic model? Are they nuts? I mean no way this thing is SCAR material. At least the SCAR looks the part of a richies gun. The ACR not so much. I'm calling rape city here!
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It's funny how the rep commented that they didn't want to strip out the Remington Defense model just to get it to the civilian market but yet it's a pound heavier and has a 1:9 non-chrome lined barrel.
Bush/Remmy get the gold mine, we get the shaft. I'm glad they feel good about the rifle because they're gonna have to pat each other on the back for a long time in those board meetings when they break out those sales figures. What an epic fail. |
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Guys did that rep say $2700 for the basic model? Are they nuts? I mean no way this thing is SCAR material. At least the SCAR looks the part of a richies gun. The ACR not so much. I'm calling rape city here! Yes. That's what he said. And it's $3,000 for the enhanced version with the folding stock and rail... |
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It's funny how the rep commented that they didn't want to strip out the Remington Defense model just to get it to the civilian market but yet it's a pound heavier and has a 1:9 non-chrome lined barrel. Bush/Remmy get the gold mine, we get the shaft. I'm glad they feel good about the rifle because they're gonna have to pat each other on the back for a long time in those board meetings when they break out those sales figures. What an epic fail. This is the deal breaker for me... When I think about what I have in my Noveske, they have to give me a Remington barrel and the rails for around $2200-$2400. Unit then, fuck off. |
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I was really excited about the ACR. But I can't justify 3k for it, $1500 maybe, but not double that. That bushmaster rep said the price is so high because they used all quality parts to set a new bar for military grade... but adding up the parts in my head I cannot come even close to $3,000. Furthermore, if they were really going for the next big weapon system, how on earth do they think that will ever happen at this price point? The thinking doesn't match reality. Also, if Magpul was working side by side with them, how on earth did they let the price double? Magpul fucked up just as much as Remmy and Bushmaster.
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I think Stretch415 is absolutely right, the proper way to do this release would be cheaper in the beginning and more expensive as the rifle gains ground. I agree with the mil forecast as I dont think they will give up the AR anytime soon especially when there are so many upgrades and parts for it. No doubt they would get the ACR for much cheaper than 3K but I dont think the mil cares about quick bbl changes or folding stocks, while civvies do.
That being said I cant bring myself to hate Magpul. They had a great idea and they tried to bring it to market, and THEY DID but unfortunately the company (CEREBUS) realized a greedy potential to make more cash instead of move rifles by the boatload. Hell they could have easily still sold it for abit elevated over the MSRP. However I dont blame Magpul. I dont think they have control of what its offered for. If they did I think Dr. Drake would be on here smacking bitches for complaining about the product. Its bad business to tell the consumer oh sorry company x boned you on the price when they are your business partner. Lets be realistic and see how this plays out. |
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This one post that started back on 5-23-09 has had these results-Pages-55! Posts-1369! Read-97747!
Amazing to say the least! Seems all for nothing now! |
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This one post that started back on 5-23-09 has had these results-Pages-55! Posts-1369! Read-97747! Amazing to say the least! Seems all for nothing now! It sure was..... |
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Very impressive, but it may just get deleted like one of the threads in the bushmaster section. Easier to delete then to answer for this mess.
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Very impressive, but it may just get deleted like one of the threads in the bushmaster section. Easier to delete then to answer for this mess. MAGPUL has DELETED some of my responces in the past on this forum. Best thing is to post it elsewhere where they can't. |
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Quoted: Meh, if it gets deleted, it gets deleted. Who cares, .05% of the people in this thread are actually going to be buying an ACR when they come out. Might as well delete this thread and put it to bed eh? or maybe charge a $2685 admission to read it and $3061 to read AND post. Quoted: Very impressive, but it may just get deleted like one of the threads in the bushmaster section. Easier to delete then to answer for this mess. MAGPUL has DELETED some of my responces in the past on this forum. Best thing is to post it elsewhere where they can't. |
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I expect all threads concerning the ACR in both the Magpul and the Bushmaster sections to be gone as soon as next week!
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Quoted: I expect all threads concerning the ACR in both the Magpul and the Bushmaster sections to be gone as soon as next week! Well in that case IBTL!! Pg. 56 are mine! |
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I expect all threads concerning the ACR in both the Magpul and the Bushmaster sections to be gone as soon as next week! They may be gone, but ceratinly NOT forgotten. |
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I expect all threads concerning the ACR in both the Magpul and the Bushmaster sections to be gone as soon as next week! They may be gone, but ceratinly NOT forgotten. Kind of like my dreams of owning an ACR... |
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I expect all threads concerning the ACR in both the Magpul and the Bushmaster sections to be gone as soon as next week! They may be gone, but ceratinly NOT forgotten. Kind of like my dreams of owning an ACR... Never give up on your dreams, they will come true |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I expect all threads concerning the ACR in both the Magpul and the Bushmaster sections to be gone as soon as next week! They may be gone, but ceratinly NOT forgotten. Kind of like my dreams of owning an ACR... Never give up on your dreams, they will come true You have to talk to crickets and wish at stars though. |
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And even if you're dreams come true it's still an overweight shrubmaster aimed at a market that allegedly has more money than brains.
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Well, after all of our mudslinging threads, I wonder if it will become a new magpul policy that their employees not respond to any threads on ARFCOM. Couldn't blame them if they did. We may have screwed ourselves.
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Well, after all of our mudslinging threads, I wonder if it will become a new magpul policy that their employees not respond to any threads on ARFCOM. Couldn't blame them if they did. We may have screwed ourselves. Magpul, dont' turn into HK! |
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Well, after all of our mudslinging threads, I wonder if it will become a new magpul policy that their employees not respond to any threads on ARFCOM. Couldn't blame them if they did. We may have screwed ourselves. There are many companies that have threads here on ARFCOM and on other forums that are well respected and interact on a regular basis. Whatever has happened with the ACR, it has completely left much of their intended customer base with some hard feelings. It was over-hyped and severely under-delivered. And what has been said by Bushmaster has been pretty much unapologetic and possibly somewhat offensive. I'm a huge fan of Magpul products and will continue to be. But as someone has posted earlier they are probably forced to remain "mum" contractually regardless. Bushmaster really screwed the pooch on this one. I could really care less if they ever respond to threads around here or anywhere else. They have aptly demonstrated how they feel about there customers. Cottage industries like Magpul, Spikes, BCM, LaRue and others will continue to be go-to companies because they care about their customer service and don't try and sell a line of BS above anything else. Tho I do think Magpul has suffered a blow on this deal and probably wishes they had done things differently. Just my opinion, as worthless as it may be. |
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Remington will be building both full- and semi-auto ACRs, right? Just out of curiosity, what's the determining factor whether an ACR receiver is a machine gun or not? The ACR uses an AR trigger group, but the auto sear pin would be on the unserialized lower, which being unserialized would mean that the lower wouldn't be able to be the sole difference between a machine gun and rifle. I'm assuming the auto sear is in the same place as on an AR. So do the lowers on an ACR machine gun attach differently than on an ACR rifle (ala a pushpin vs shelf on an HK 9x series rifle) or is there some other difference?
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I forsee a Gen 2 ACR release in 2010 after Bushmaster takes their foot out of their mouth with a 1:7 barrel.
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Well, after all of our mudslinging threads, I wonder if it will become a new magpul policy that their employees not respond to any threads on ARFCOM. Couldn't blame them if they did. We may have screwed ourselves. There are many companies that have threads here on ARFCOM and on other forums that are well respected and interact on a regular basis. Whatever has happened with the ACR, it has completely left much of their intended customer base with some hard feelings. It was over-hyped and severely under-delivered. And what has been said by Bushmaster has been pretty much unapologetic and possibly somewhat offensive. I'm a huge fan of Magpul products and will continue to be. But as someone has posted earlier they are probably forced to remain "mum" contractually regardless. Bushmaster really screwed the pooch on this one. I could really care less if they ever respond to threads around here or anywhere else. They have aptly demonstrated how they feel about there customers. Cottage industries like Magpul, Spikes, BCM, LaRue and others will continue to be go-to companies because they care about their customer service and don't try and sell a line of BS above anything else. Tho I do think Magpul has suffered a blow on this deal and probably wishes they had done things differently. Just my opinion, as worthless as it may be. THIS |
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The silver lining with the ACR is going to be that it will be available, due to the price a lot of people on this forum and others will no longer be buying one. The main concern I had was one would be on a waiting list for "forever plus a day" if the ACR came out at $1500.00 (MSRP).
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Looks like the line will be short for the paying customer. And rifles should be readily available. I'll also be looking forward to hearing some unbiased range reports. Anything less than glowing will be just one more death nell.
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This is like killing a kids dream of owning a very cool toy.... I've been lurking on the forums and this is the worst news ever..... though consumers could still have a say at it.... don't patronize the product and eventually it will become cheaper due to low demand...
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This is like killing a kids dream of owning a very cool toy.... I've been lurking on the forums and this is the worst news ever..... though consumers could still have a say at it.... don't patronize the product and eventually it will become cheaper due to low demand... Welcome to the Forum!! |
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I apologize if this has already been addressed,
To any retailers: How has the announced prices affected pre-orders? Have a lot of people canceled? Just curious. |
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I apologize if this has already been addressed, To any retailers: How has the announced prices affected pre-orders? Have a lot of people canceled? Just curious. Who's taking preorders? |
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I apologize if this has already been addressed, To any retailers: How has the announced prices affected pre-orders? Have a lot of people canceled? Just curious. Who's taking preorders? Not sure off the top of my head but, there were definitely a few retailers that were. |
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I ALMOST pre ordered with DSG,hoping that the $2700 was false on the basis of what Magpul said about that not being the price they'd been told. Glad I didn't go through with it.
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I ALMOST pre ordered with DSG,hoping that the $2700 was false on the basis of what Magpul said about that not being the price they'd been told. Glad I didn't go through with it. +1 I almost put in for it too but just as I was going to the MSRPs came out and I Xed out of the window |
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I ALMOST pre ordered with DSG,hoping that the $2700 was false on the basis of what Magpul said about that not being the price they'd been told. Glad I didn't go through with it. +1 I almost put in for it too but just as I was going to the MSRPs came out and I Xed out of the window Me too... |
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I would happily pay $3000 for an ACR if it comes with the fixed, folding/collapsible, and prs stock the gen4 rail, long and short MOE style handguards 18 inch 1/9 twist barrel in 6.5 Grendel. All in A-TACS camo.
Oh yeah 1400th reply! |
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