I'm not talking about free -> paid - - - that was a while ago and doesn't bug me.

Before today, my last transfers were one fee for (a reasonable number of items) from a single FFL/Mfg. I went in today to pick up some transfers and was unpleasantly surprised when the guy tells me it's now one transfer fee per item.

I didn't notice this change on their transfer request page when I pre-paid the transfer, and I'm curious when it was implemented.

not an edit -> I'm not grumpy that they charge for their services. I'm grumpy that the process I was expecting no longer exists, and the guy I worked with seemed to have no idea it was ever any different.

Bill, we made the change to charge per item approximately 3-4 years ago.  I don't believe any of our current staff was working then so yes, to them it's always been per item.  I don't recall exactly the verbiage we've used on the website over the years, but I believe it used to just say "per transfer" which was slightly ambiguous and now says per firearm.

I was historically one of the biggest proponents for doing free transfers.  Part of me would still like to do free transfers.  But after our last ATF audit and the ATF's continuing push to revoke FFLs for what would have previously been considered minor paperwork errors, even I am in the camp of charging for transfers.  After our last audit, we had to add additional resources to insure compliance with regulations on both receiving into the A&D boundbook and transferring out on 4473s.  We are now spending an additional $1k-2k per month than we were before just to insure we keep our FFL.  I know some people (not saying you) think that transfers have zero cost but in reality we spend a lot of time tracking down FFLs from senders, determining the proper firearm info for a one off gun with no markings that none of us have ever seen before, dealing with issues when the buyer doesn't want the gun because it doesn't match the gunbroker description or has a scratch on it, calling/emailing the person who doesn't come to pick up their gun for months (we have a couple of transfer guns we've had for 2+ years now that pretty soon we'll just sell), dealing with bad publicity because someone blows us up for not letting them know their gun was ready when their voicemail is full and we sent them multiple emails they didn't read, keeping the 4473s *forever*, etc.

Now, we are certainly open to the idea of changing how we charge and going to where we charge $X for the first firearm and $Y for each additional firearm.  We'll have to discuss that internally and consider things like if the guns come from the same or different FFLs.  We can also discuss internally trying to find a way to offer limited free transfers for loyal customers, perhaps using a 'free transfer' card we give out or one reduced cost/free transfer per month or quarter.

Now, if you were still teaching classes at the store you'd get the employee free transfer hook up!  ;-P  Hit me up if you're still teaching anything and we'll put you to work.

That is a well explained post and I understand your positions. The buy one, get the 2nd at "reduced off" does make some sense at first look.
Thanks

Thanks Matthew. That's a lot longer than I expected you'd say.

It's hard to overestimate the annoyance value of working with the general public, so I completely understand that part. I've also been hearing stories of audit findings based on something as little as mis-spelling the name of a state. It makes the triple checking I've seen at several shops understandable. As for the fee structure, I'm not here to hassle you or claim superior knowledge over someone who's living the business, so I'll refrain from trying to tell you 'how things would be if I were president'.

My UT cert expired while things were socially dicey. I'm considering getting it back. With the number of states going Constitutional Carry, do you think it would still have enough value to draw people in? I'm going to be gone till mid next week, but we can pick this topic up then if there's value in it for you.

Have a good weekend!

I'm happy to pay so you can continue the transfers and make money from them.   The worst thing for us would be FFL's stop doing transfers.  

Matthew, could Truprep help us ship firearms to FFL's or help with sales on GunBroker?     I got some guns that I'm looking for an easy way to sell.

Unfortunately since attacks on the second amendment haven't been as successful as they would like, they are now going after manufacturers and retailers like us (TruPrep).  I sincerely doubt we make anything right now on transfers even with our fee considering the amount of time and resources we spend trying to make sure that there are no issues.  Even a minor oversight by an employee that you don't catch could be grounds for them to take an FFL under the new administration's zero-tolerance rules.  Hearings are backed up over a year for pursuing revocations due to the increased load under the new rules.  Many FFLs are surrendering their licenses rather than go through the expensive revocation hearing process.  This time last year, revocations were up 500%  It's expensive and a huge time suck right now.  If not purely for the fact that I know they are actively trying to shut down gun stores through this process, I personally wouldn't even want to deal with the headaches.  It definitely isn't a money making proposition right now.

Regarding shipping guns, I don't see it as something we can really justify doing right now.  We would take on the additional liability of shipping the gun itself as well as the legal liabilities with the ATF.  If Fedex lost one gun we have an angry buyer and seller and then would be expected to replace it.  If we priced it at what we would need to do to cover our exposure, everyone would complain that we are an "evil gun store just trying to profit" so right now we find its best to just avoid it.  We do offer consignments and purchase used guns through our store though if you are looking to sell something locally.

Joey

you have guns waiting to be picked up for over 2 years! what!?!?!?

that's insane.

I'll be happy to transfer those out of your position to mine

From a consumer perspective, I recognize that you have a cost involved in doing transfers, and I expect to pay for the service.

The biggest impact to me is I used to drive past 38 dealers to get to Cherokee or truprep. Now I just have them shipped to the pawn shop around the corner who has average prices but good service.

It’s a difficult balance. I certainly wouldn’t want to manage the paperwork load you guys have.

One idea that might strike a balance is provide a coupon for the transfer fee against a $200 purchase or something like that.

Same for me. A company that has to deal with the whims of the general public, especially the gunbroker crowd, deserves to be compensated.

Good to see you in here Joey......

When you finally gonna get your ass out to a 2gun match?  

https://www.ar15.com/forums/Hometown/Redwolf-2-Gun-Challenge-at-Angry-Emu-5-21-2023/35-668301/

On shipping guns from NON-ffl to an ffl for gunsmith work on a long gun, I looked at the UPS and FedEx sites and both say something along the lines of "you must ship through and FFL or be an FFL with an agreement with us". I always thought an individual could ship to an FFL without the individual having to use an FFL. Has that recently changed? I saw some sites listing this from August 2022. Now I am confused and want to send my rifle out today lol Does anyone know if this is now the case?

Sorry for hi-jack, but seems relevant to the last paragraph from Joey

I just looked at the USCCA's website on reciprocity, and the only two states I can find that they show as having reciprocity with UT but not with GA are Nebraska and Washington.  My understanding is Nebraska just passed permitless carry last month so I assume it's down to just Washington.  The population of Georgia residents who need to carry in Washington is probably pretty small.

My thinking is parallel to yours.
I may still do it, as more options are MOAR BETTR!
Getting the NRA instructor cert back will be the annoying part.

I'll reach out again if I get it back. I may just decide to do the classes as freebies. (PSA's Arm The Population theme is a little contagious)

The LAW is still the same.  UPS and FEDEX adopted their own new policies.