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Posted: 2/1/2021 12:28:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/5/2021 10:05:35 PM EDT by twodeucetrey]
As the thread title says, there will be a public hearing (via Zoom) regarding House Bill 1238, which amends RCW 9A.84.010 to add:

"(b)Openly carries or displays a deadly weapon in a manner that would lead a reasonable person to feel threatened."

The current RCW reads:

"Criminal mischief.
(1) A person is guilty of the crime of criminal mischief if, acting with three or more other persons, he or she knowingly and unlawfully uses or threatens to use force, or in any way participates in the use of such force, against any other person or against property.
(2)(a) Except as provided in (b) of this subsection, the crime of criminal mischief is a gross misdemeanor.
(b) The crime of criminal mischief is a class C felony if the actor is armed with a deadly weapon."

IMO, adding:  "Openly carries or displays a deadly weapon in a manner that would lead a reasonable person to feel threatened" may sound good at first blush, however I think it is ripe for abuse.

NOTE:  This does not appear to be a companion to SSB 5038.  HB 1238 does not appear to have a companion bill in the Senate.  That does not mean that it is a "nothing-burger".  The "ledge" has until 15 February to file bills in either house, so a companion could still get filed.  The more we push back NOW the less likely that is to happen.

ETA:  wa.leg.gov HB 1238 Information page

You Can Sign In Here

Instructions on how to get signed in:

At the top, you will see three buttons. Click on the House button.
At the top of that page, you will see a drop down box that says “Committee” and another that says “Meetings”. Choose Civil Rights & Judiciary as the Committee and 2/02/2021 10:00 am for meetings.

You need to choose the bill you wish to sign in for. Choose HB 1238 Including the open carry or display of weapons within the offense of criminal mischief.

As soon as you click the bill number, there are three choices – submit written testimony, testify live, or you can just sign in as supporting or opposing. There is also a link where you can see the list of people who signed in. We’d like this list to go on forever. This is a great way to show our numbers. You know the anti-2A people will organize to support. If you oppose this bill, you need to out-organize them!

Click on which you would like to do. If you do not wish to testify, but you want your voice heard, please click on this button and choose either pro, con, or other from the drop-down box.

Now here is the part that does bug some people. You have to enter your name, address, etc. This is not for some registry out there – this is to make sure you live in WA State. Think about it. If you live anywhere in the world, you have access to this site with a click of a button. Only WA State citizens can weigh in, so they have to confirm that you live here. Also, they need to know where in WA you live, so the legislators in that district get an idea of the feelings about those bills in their districts. You had to sign in when you went in person, as well. I know people don’t like to give out their personal info, but at some point – we need to make a stand. We have to. The other side is highly organized and will make it look like the majority supports this bill. We have to prove them wrong. It is public records, but so is every email you send to the Senate. Please make a stand on this. We have no other options.


Some talking points:

   This bill reduces the ability of a peaceful demonstrator to defend him or herself against an overzealous police officer, counter demonstrator, or other attacker.

   You could be charged with a felony because someone “felt threatened.” This is going to be a police officer’s nightmare–how are they to determine such a subjective claim?

   How close does someone have to be to feel threatened by someone carrying a visible firearm? 10 feet? 20? 50, 1000?

   Carrying a firearm or weapon with intent to intimidate is already illegal in Washington per RCW 9.41.270

   Aiming any firearm at another human is already illegal under RCW 9.41.230.

   What purpose does it serve to make something extra illegal?

   Or worse, this law is extremely ripe for abuse. it could be used to weaponize feelings to roll up groups any individual doesn’t like: Blacks, Asians, Latinos, LGBTQ; all they have to do is stand nearby and call the police.

   Because communities of color are over-policed anyway, it stands to reason that this bill will dis-proportionally harm them.

Attachment Attached File


Link Posted: 2/1/2021 12:57:37 AM EDT
Done.

Gee....I wonder why they're not giving much public notice on these bills
Link Posted: 2/1/2021 3:09:58 AM EDT
Done,.........
Link Posted: 2/1/2021 10:51:59 AM EDT
Done
Link Posted: 2/1/2021 11:42:14 AM EDT
Done. The OC bill is definitely ripe for abuse of law. And “Criminal Mischief” certainly wasn’t getting enforced during last year’s riots, looting and destruction...but you can sure as shit bet 3 + conservative, right-leaning people who are (truly) peacefully protesting will get the book thrown at them.
Link Posted: 2/1/2021 7:41:45 PM EDT
Signed in and left my comments on the bill.
Link Posted: 2/1/2021 8:34:48 PM EDT
Thanks everyone for taking action!!
Link Posted: 2/5/2021 10:01:55 PM EDT
Hello WAHTF!!!

Work has been keeping me busy so I haven't been around much the last few days.  I wanted to post what I feel is "good news" regarding HB 1283 (Open Carry Ban):

Today was the House Civil Rights & Judiciary Committee's Executive Session where 1238 was to be voted on ("do pass" or "do not pass" to the House Rules Committee for a potential spot on the floor calendar).

Well, the committee punted.  Yep, they "took no action" on the bill and kicked the can down the road to 10 Feb.  So, HB 1238 is still in "limbo" until next Wednesday.

Between you, me and the fence post:  I think our emails, testimonies, calls, etc. are giving many law makers some cold feet regarding gun control legislation.

LET'S KEEP IT THAT WAY!!!

Keep those calls, emails and easy links rolling!!  Keep urging your friends, family, anybody and everybody that you know is even slightly pro-gun to get involved!

Here is the bill information page for HB 1283  You can follow this link to the green "comment on this bill" button towards the upper right.  You don't even have to write much.  Just write: "Please oppose HB 1283" and your voice will be counted and HEARD!!!

NO ACTION IS TOO SMALL!!
Link Posted: 2/6/2021 12:30:07 AM EDT
we commented
Link Posted: 2/6/2021 4:58:44 PM EDT
This is awesome! If this is correct, I feel like our only “vote” that actually amounts to something is via laying into these bills like we have.
Link Posted: 2/6/2021 8:26:54 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By PACorps:
This is awesome! If this is correct, I feel like our only “vote” that actually amounts to something is via laying into these bills like we have.
View Quote


I can understand the feeling that voting "doesn't matter" any more, but I think it is damn important that we continue to participate in the process because the threat of losing an election is what can possibly motivate some of these politicians into voting "no" on an anti-gun bill or using some other form of legislative maneuvering to prevent a bill from moving forward.  

Much of the voting process is handled at the county level by the county auditor's office.  The county auditor is an elected position.  While the potential for fraud will always exist, I think it can be mitigated by us staying engaged, educated and aware as citizens and participants.

And yes - all of you out there clicking, commenting, sharing, encouraging (goading) your friends and family to do the same - is being felt this session even with the COVID b.s. put in place!!

KEEP IT UP!!!
Link Posted: 2/7/2021 1:39:32 AM EDT
twodeucetrey, I own you a drink or three.

All of us on the WAHTF do
Link Posted: 2/7/2021 1:04:37 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By PACorps:
twodeucetrey, I own you a drink or three.

All of us on the WAHTF do
View Quote

Aye. We do.
Link Posted: 2/7/2021 11:26:10 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Getnlwr:

Aye. We do.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Getnlwr:
Originally Posted By PACorps:
twodeucetrey, I own you a drink or three.

All of us on the WAHTF do

Aye. We do.


I sincerely appreciate the sentiment!  I would like to thank all of you folks in WAHTF-land who are taking action - regardless of what it is!  As has been posted in a few other threads, our opponents were not expecting such a large push-back from the law-abiding pro-gun community during this "unique" legislative session.  However ALL OF YOU literally caught them off guard and put them on their heels!!!

But we cannot rest.  We MUST NOT REST!!!  STAY ENGAGED AND DON'T LOSE HOPE!!!

Our fight is hard, but it is not unwinnable!!!  During the 2020 legislative session, we faced TWICE as many anti-gun bills as we are facing this session and we prevented the "mag-ban" and AWB along with a slew of others.  

So let me end by saying again:  THANK ALL OF YOU WAHTF MEMBERS FOR ALL THAT YOU HAVE DONE AND WILL CONTINUE TO DO!!!
Link Posted: 2/17/2021 11:55:59 PM EDT
I saw that on February 10th a "1st Substitute Bill" was substituted, and the majority said "do pass".  What is a substitute bill, and what does this mean, that it passes out of committee and goes in front of the whole House?  Also said referred to Rules for review on the 12th.
Link Posted: 2/18/2021 11:42:15 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By armstrong001:
I saw that on February 10th a "1st Substitute Bill" was substituted, and the majority said "do pass".  What is a substitute bill, and what does this mean, that it passes out of committee and goes in front of the whole House?  Also said referred to Rules for review on the 12th.
View Quote


Excellent questions and thank you for asking!  And thank you for putting forth the effort to stay engaged and keep tabs on this bill!

The substitute bill added additional language to the original bill.  The Original bill stated “deadly weapon” but did not define what a “deadly weapon” is/was.  The Substitute bill defines “deadly weapon” (too broadly,IMO) as pretty much anything AND adds loss of CPL if convicted.  

Because SHB 1283 lacks a companion bill in the Senate, how likely is it to move all the way forward into law?  That is a little more difficult to answer.  Sadly, due to COVID, I don’t have face-to-face access to our lobbyist like I had in sessions past.  It’s not as easy for me to inquire about non-work related issues via electronic comms.  I will see if I can ascertain that info through some of my other contacts.

Basically, every time a bill is amended (substituted), it must go back through the Rules committee before being assigned a date for a floor vote.  This is one tool that can be used to our favor as if enough of the politicians feel the pressure from us, they can keep a bill like this in “purgatory” and never have to actually vote on it.  

REMEMBER:  When a bill gets a formal vote, that voting record is public information!  Thus, a congress-critter is on record “for life” as to having either supported or opposed a particular piece of legislation.  So, sometimes the best way of NOT going on record is to not bring the bill up for a vote!

THIS is why every voice matters and no action is too small!
Link Posted: 2/18/2021 6:42:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 2/18/2021 6:44:01 PM EDT by 2T2_Crash]
Basically got told to eat a dick by Bronoske’s aid


”Good afternoon,

Thank you for writing to the office of Representative Dan Bronoske to express your concerns for House Bill 1283. Representative Bronoske appreciates hearing from you on this matter.

House Bill 1283 seeks to prioritize public safety by prohibiting open carry or display or weapons when with three or more people who have the intent to harm others. The bill's seeks to balance safety measures, while not infringing on rights of law abiding firearm owners. I would also like to acknowledge the new substitute bill has bipartisan support. We hope you will continue to voice your opinion on these, or any other pieces of legislation which are important to you.

If you are interested in following this, or any other bill, we encourage you to visit http://app.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/ to sign up for email notifications.

Representative Bronoske thanks you for taking time to share your views. Please do not hesitate to contact our office whenever you have a matter of interest or concern.

Best regards,

Megan Bartol
[email protected]
Office of Representative Dan Bronoske
28th Legislative District”
Link Posted: 2/18/2021 10:52:17 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By 2T2_Crash:
Basically got told to eat a dick by Bronoske’s aid


”Good afternoon,

Thank you for writing to the office of Representative Dan Bronoske to express your concerns for House Bill 1283. Representative Bronoske appreciates hearing from you on this matter.

House Bill 1283 seeks to prioritize public safety by prohibiting open carry or display or weapons when with three or more people who have the intent to harm others. The bill's seeks to balance safety measures, while not infringing on rights of law abiding firearm owners. I would also like to acknowledge the new substitute bill has bipartisan support. We hope you will continue to voice your opinion on these, or any other pieces of legislation which are important to you.

If you are interested in following this, or any other bill, we encourage you to visit http://app.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/ to sign up for email notifications.

Representative Bronoske thanks you for taking time to share your views. Please do not hesitate to contact our office whenever you have a matter of interest or concern.

Best regards,

Megan Bartol
[email protected]
Office of Representative Dan Bronoske
28th Legislative District”
View Quote


While it may not be the answer we want, your opposition to SHB 1283 does get recorded on a spreadsheet.

Thanks for taking action!
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