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Posted: 4/22/2018 1:03:52 PM EDT
[#1]
Crap...here it comes.
Washington State libtard voters never met any anti-gun ballots they didn't love. First ban any further sales, then force registration, then confiscation. Same old tiresome story. Better get your 80% lowers and Polymer80 frames done while you can. |
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Posted: 4/22/2018 1:33:40 PM EDT
[#2]
We knew something was coming. To be honest I was expecting something on par with Oregon's initiative. Is my understanding correct that these six different propositions will require six different initiatives on the ballot and six different signature drives?
Policy Overview Raise the minimum purchase age to 21 for all semi-automatic weapons. In Washington, it is currently easier to buy an assault weapon than it is to purchase a handgun because assault weapons are treated the same as hunting rifles. This must change. Create an Enhanced Background Check at the time of purchase including: 1.) A local law enforcement check identical to the one we currently require for handguns. 2.) Requiring the purchaser show that they have completed a safety training course within the last five years that includes basic safety and safe storage rules, safe handling, and an overview of state and federal firearms laws. Dangerous Access Prevention. Holds gun owners responsible if a child or other prohibited person accesses and uses an unsafely stored firearm to harm themselves or another person. Ensure continued eligibility to possess or purchase an assault weapon. Requires the Washington Department of Licensing (DOL) and the appropriate law enforcement agencies to work together to develop a process to ensure that purchasers continue to be eligible to possess a firearm. Requireinformed consent at the point of purchase about the inherent risks associated with the presence of a firearm in the home. Requires the notification at the point of sale that owning a firearm increases one’s risk for injury, death by suicide, domestic violence and homicide. Establish a waiting period up to 10 days for the purchase of an assault weapon. |
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Posted: 4/22/2018 2:56:01 PM EDT
[#3]
I’m sure they will let them roll it all into one initiative, the government let’s the lefties bend the rules all the time.
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Posted: 4/23/2018 12:55:57 AM EDT
[#4]
Our shitty courts will say "it's just one subject, firearms" and let it go. But I also think we should use the angle that state preemption completely prevents any initiative on firearms. The "people" are not the same thing as the "state". A recent court case threw out an initiative to ban safe injection sites, with the judge ruling that the initiative would infringe on the power of the KingCo Board of Health, which had been given preemption status in that area.
https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/health/initiative-to-ban-safe-injection-sites-in-king-county-knocked-down-by-judge/ |
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Posted: 4/23/2018 12:57:55 AM EDT
[#5]
Scollins, I was going to mention that. I remember earlier you posting that. But, just like the 6 Initiative rolled into one thing, they will probably look the other way on it.
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Posted: 4/23/2018 12:36:20 PM EDT
[#6]
"They" will only look the other way, and get away with this IF we do not file lawsuits.
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Posted: 4/23/2018 1:18:34 PM EDT
[#7]
It's going to be a long, hot Summer.
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Posted: 4/23/2018 5:01:33 PM EDT
[#8]
Yes, it is.
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Posted: 4/23/2018 5:11:34 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"They" will only look the other way, and get away with this IF we do not file lawsuits. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 10:03:31 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
We knew something was coming. To be honest I was expecting something on par with Oregon's initiative. Is my understanding correct that these six different propositions will require six different initiatives on the ballot and six different signature drives? Policy Overview Raise the minimum purchase age to 21 for all semi-automatic weapons. In Washington, it is currently easier to buy an assault weapon than it is to purchase a handgun because assault weapons are treated the same as hunting rifles. This must change. Create an Enhanced Background Check at the time of purchase including: 1.) A local law enforcement check identical to the one we currently require for handguns. 2.) Requiring the purchaser show that they have completed a safety training course within the last five years that includes basic safety and safe storage rules, safe handling, and an overview of state and federal firearms laws. Dangerous Access Prevention. Holds gun owners responsible if a child or other prohibited person accesses and uses an unsafely stored firearm to harm themselves or another person. Ensure continued eligibility to possess or purchase an assault weapon. Requires the Washington Department of Licensing (DOL) and the appropriate law enforcement agencies to work together to develop a process to ensure that purchasers continue to be eligible to possess a firearm. Requireinformed consent at the point of purchase about the inherent risks associated with the presence of a firearm in the home. Requires the notification at the point of sale that owning a firearm increases one’s risk for injury, death by suicide, domestic violence and homicide. This is bullshit Establish a waiting period up to 10 days for the purchase of an assault weapon. I would like to know what sort of storage rules. I think secured in a locked house, or car is reasonable. However, if there are children in the home, I think a security cabinet, or a safe is a good idea. I would like to know the definition of "unsafely stored". I can handle waiting 10 days. This is way better than the shit proposed down in Oregon. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 10:07:13 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I can handle waiting 10 days. Incrementalism is their strategy. Not One Inch! |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 10:11:41 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This seems mostly reasonable. I know I was responsible enough to own weapons at 18, but a lot of kids were not. It seems as though kids are getting worse, not better. I would like to know what sort of storage rules. I think secured in a locked house, or car is reasonable. However, if there are children in the home, I think a security cabinet, or a safe is a good idea. I would like to know the definition of "unsafely stored". I can handle waiting 10 days. This is way better than the shit proposed down in Oregon. Your revised post is even more troubling. "mostly reasonable" is not. You may choose how you exercise your civil rights, you DO NOT get to choose for others. The Heller decision centered around so called "safe storage" - so that should be a non-starter. As you point out you were responsible, as was I, as are most. The Age of Majority in the country is 18. All Civil Rights convey as a single package at 18. If you/they want to discuss changing the Age of Majority, that is a different conversation. And one I may support. But as long as we agree as a society that you are an adult at age 18, then I do not support piecemeal doling out of civil rights. I suggest you reflect on what is really going on. And I invite you to come down to Olympia with the rest of us during the hearings to see the orange scarved fascist agenda in action for yourself. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 10:12:03 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you support this, you're part of the problem and naïve to their final goal. Incrementalism is their strategy. Not One Inch! Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I can handle waiting 10 days. Incrementalism is their strategy. Not One Inch! |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 10:14:11 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In 10 years let me know how that "not one inch" thing worked out for you.... |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 11:06:24 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
In 10 years let me know how that "not one inch" thing worked out for you.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I can handle waiting 10 days. Incrementalism is their strategy. Not One Inch! I downloaded the Word version of this thing. There's a whole bunch of crap in it. There's no way this will satisfy the "single issue" clause. Oh, and by their definition, your M1 Garand is now an assault weapon. So is a Browning BAR. Remington 750 Woodsmaster, yeah, assault rifle. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 11:29:43 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This seems mostly reasonable. I know I was responsible enough to own weapons at 18, but a lot of kids were not. It seems as though kids are getting worse, not better. I would like to know what sort of storage rules. I think secured in a locked house, or car is reasonable. However, if there are children in the home, I think a security cabinet, or a safe is a good idea. I would like to know the definition of "unsafely stored". I can handle waiting 10 days. This is way better than the shit proposed down in Oregon. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 12:34:20 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This seems mostly reasonable. I know I was responsible enough to own weapons at 18, but a lot of kids were not. It seems as though kids are getting worse, not better. I would like to know what sort of storage rules. I think secured in a locked house, or car is reasonable. However, if there are children in the home, I think a security cabinet, or a safe is a good idea. I would like to know the definition of "unsafely stored". I can handle waiting 10 days. This is way better than the shit proposed down in Oregon. Fuk that noise, thinking like you are is the reason many of us older guys have been saying "Watch out for the divide and conquer" situation for over 40 years now. This is no more acceptable than the Oregon BS that is going on and everybody in every state needs to be standing behind those under fire and letting the assholes know the country stands against these attempts to do this crap! |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 2:37:21 PM EDT
[#18]
People who are 18 years old are classified as adults in every regard. They stand trial as adults, they can serve in the military, they can vote, they buy homes, have families and careers. How anybody can be happy with the removal of constitutionally guaranteed rights for these people is beyond me. Lots of twenty year olds and beyond do dumb things as well, how would you feel about them making the age an arbitrary 35? This is creating a situation where nearly all of the young adults are being punished for the actions of a tiny few and that isn't right by any standard.
What needs to happen is that if a person commits an unwarranted violent action with a firearm and is found guilty in court of law then they need to receive the stiffest of penalties. These kinds of human beings need to be removed from society, period. How does making life hard for law abiding citizens help anything? It's crazy logic and we shouldn't stand for it. As ever, the left tries as hard as they can to remove the actual criminal from the conversation and focus on the tool used instead. It's mental illness. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 5:16:41 PM EDT
[#19]
This is just the first step as said above, just slowly roll into it, more "palatable" this way.
Death by a 1000 paper cuts is what comes to mind. 3 of the initiatives do not make sense to me, like as if 3 of them are just lip service that could be "dropped" to make it look like they are "giving some". The whole DOL/Sherriff thing is just laying the groundwork for a registration program down the road, my opinion. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 5:18:54 PM EDT
[#20]
Attach an amendment to the 21 thing. 21 to drink, smoke, buy a gun, well, you are not mature enough to vote. That would sink that right there.
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Posted: 4/25/2018 6:24:34 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Attach an amendment to the 21 thing. 21 to drink, smoke, buy a gun, well, you are not mature enough to vote. That would sink that right there. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 7:17:49 PM EDT
[#22]
If you raise the age to 21 everything should be 21, No military service, no law enforcement, no voting, no paying taxes, and no signing up for selective service.
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Posted: 4/25/2018 7:38:30 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you raise the age to 21 everything should be 21, No military service, no law enforcement, no voting, no paying taxes, and no signing up for selective service. |
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Posted: 4/25/2018 10:58:36 PM EDT
[#24]
https://www.sos.wa.gov/_assets/elections/initiatives/420201831446pm_364.docx
Any semi auto rifle. Rimfire or centerfire doesn’t matter. Scroll all the way to the bottom to see the definition. |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 1:54:46 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If you raise the age to 21 everything should be 21, No military service, no law enforcement, no voting, no paying taxes, and no signing up for selective service. |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 2:21:12 AM EDT
[#26]
Who the fuck is this Squigy guy?
No more giving up rights. This is when we need to continue taking them back to our side. Fight this on every level. The right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. It's that fucking simple. |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 1:04:07 PM EDT
[#27]
Have we seen the Initiative numbers?
edit: spelling |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 1:49:34 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Who the fuck is this Squigy guy? No more giving up rights. This is when we need to continue taking them back to our side. Fight this on every level. The right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. It's that fucking simple. |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 7:47:24 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This seems mostly reasonable. I know I was responsible enough to own weapons at 18, but a lot of kids were not. It seems as though kids are getting worse, not better. I would like to know what sort of storage rules. I think secured in a locked house, or car is reasonable. However, if there are children in the home, I think a security cabinet, or a safe is a good idea. I would like to know the definition of "unsafely stored". I can handle waiting 10 days. This is way better than the shit proposed down in Oregon. |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 8:37:43 PM EDT
[#30]
This would require a registry, would it not? Not just keeping records of sales.
NEW SECTION. Sec. 15. A new section is added to chapter 9.41 RCW to read as follows: (1) Within twelve months of the effective date of this act, the department of licensing shall, in conjunction with the Washington State Patrol and other state and local law enforcement agencies as necessary, develop a cost-effective and efficient process to: (a) verify, on an annual or more frequent basis, that persons who acquired pistols or semiautomatic assault rifles pursuant to this chapter remain eligible to possess a firearm under state and federal law; and (b) if such persons are determined to be ineligible for any reason, to (i) notify and provide the relevant information to the chief of police or the sheriff of the jurisdiction in which the purchaser resides and (ii) take steps to ensure such persons are not illegally in possession of firearms. |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 9:08:43 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"mostly reasonable" is not. (snip) The Age of Majority in the country is 18. All Civil Rights convey as a single package at 18. If the initiative passes, we'll have to see how it shakes out in court. This initiative and those like it are being floated in places where it seems likely to have a fairly predictable chance of passing. In this state, it has a good chance of being upheld by the state courts, and it will be an interesting SC case. |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 9:14:59 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I downloaded the Word version of this thing. There's a whole bunch of crap in it. There's no way this will satisfy the "single issue" clause. I hate politics. Almost as much as I hate liver. |
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Posted: 4/26/2018 10:28:15 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are all rights unlimited? Scalia said "no" regarding the Second Amendment in Heller v DC, and other rights have restrictions that have survived challenges. If the initiative passes, we'll have to see how it shakes out in court. This initiative and those like it are being floated in places where it seems likely to have a fairly predictable chance of passing. In this state, it has a good chance of being upheld by the state courts, and it will be an interesting SC case. Yes. |
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Posted: 4/27/2018 12:37:58 AM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Age discrimination limiting civil rights to adults. Protected Class |
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Posted: 4/27/2018 12:43:21 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In what way(s) are 18-21 year old people legislated into a protected class? Cannot discriminate against a non-protected class of people in the US. Protected Class Your philosophy is indicative of the problem. What other rights are restricted to adults? |
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Posted: 4/27/2018 2:16:32 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Civil Rights for me but not for Ye. Your philosophy is indicative of the problem. What other rights are restricted to adults? |
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Posted: 4/27/2018 3:56:50 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are all rights unlimited? Scalia said "no" regarding the Second Amendment in Heller v DC, and other rights have restrictions that have survived challenges. If the initiative passes, we'll have to see how it shakes out in court. This initiative and those like it are being floated in places where it seems likely to have a fairly predictable chance of passing. In this state, it has a good chance of being upheld by the state courts, and it will be an interesting SC case. |
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Posted: 4/27/2018 7:04:37 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So you are saying that they are going for "GIMME" states to set precedence and case law, for future actions in other "difficult" states? |
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Posted: 4/27/2018 7:08:17 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Civil Rights for me but not for Ye. Your philosophy is indicative of the problem. What other rights are restricted to adults? I guess I walked into the kindergarten Constitution class ("It's what I say it is, not what it really is."). Can anyone tell me where the big kids are hanging out? |
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Posted: 4/27/2018 11:37:37 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My"philosophy"? Laws and case law is mere "philosophy" in this game? I guess I walked into the kindergarten Constitution class ("It's what I say it is, not what it really is."). Can anyone tell me where the big kids are hanging out? That is a troubling philosophy. Your post above smacks of the Jews who helped the Nazis load the other Jews on the train cars just so they could survive for a few more days. Laws - 18 years old is the age of majority. Period. |
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Posted: 4/27/2018 11:47:52 PM EDT
[#41]
Sounds like you got yourself a strong case.
 You ought get your ass to the Supreme Court and tell them they got this shit all wrong. I'm sure they'll clear out all the time you need.
Or shut the fuck up about how you think you know me. It's not my "philosophy", it comes from the US Constitution as interpreted by the only body charged with interpreting it. Prove them wrong, not me. I got the same power here you do: less than dick. Even the Originalist Scalia hung in there with current Federal firearms restrictions. (Heller v DC) I cite my sources. You babble on about how you think it should be. Pass the Bar. Get appointed to the SC if you're so damn good with your shithouse lawyering. Or stick to what you're doing here and all the influence it gets you. It's fuckin funny. |
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Posted: 4/28/2018 12:28:57 AM EDT
[#42]
Yup,
This is the way to get things done, just throw daggers at each other...
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Posted: 4/28/2018 4:10:03 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sounds like you got yourself a strong case. You ought get your ass to the Supreme Court and tell them they got this shit all wrong. I'm sure they'll clear out all the time you need.
Or shut the fuck up about how you think you know me. It's not my "philosophy", it comes from the US Constitution as interpreted by the only body charged with interpreting it. Prove them wrong, not me. I got the same power here you do: less than dick. Even the Originalist Scalia hung in there with current Federal firearms restrictions. (Heller v DC) I cite my sources. You babble on about how you think it should be. Pass the Bar. Get appointed to the SC if you're so damn good with your shithouse lawyering. Or stick to what you're doing here and all the influence it gets you. It's fuckin funny. |
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Posted: 4/28/2018 9:56:46 AM EDT
[#44]
Should we be pulling a counter initiative together?
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Posted: 4/28/2018 1:35:47 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Should we be pulling a counter initiative together? |
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Posted: 4/28/2018 2:00:14 PM EDT
[#46]
OK, Initiative 1621, but how does that counter or help us against this initiative?
Is there any reason to file a counter initiative, or is it better to fight this one in the courts? I would think that the best way to fight this is with a counter propaganda campaign letting people know the true definitions of this initiative. Is there a local group who are organized and making a plan of action? I wanna volunteer to that effort? That is one of the ways I-594 got approved, a lot of the sheeple didn't understand what they were voting for. This new initiative has a lot of cryptic language that tries to make it look nothing like what it really is. |
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Posted: 4/28/2018 5:14:55 PM EDT
[#47]
ITT we discover squiggy is a leftist troll.
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Posted: 4/28/2018 7:01:05 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
ITT we discover squiggy is a leftist troll. |
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Posted: 4/28/2018 7:47:46 PM EDT
[#49]
It feels like you're under the impression this is all they want and, after these get passed, they'll stop. That couldn't be further from the truth, just ask them. They're very open about their end goal being to disarm American citizens. They won't stop pushing until they get this either. If you agree with them or go along with them at any point on their long-term confiscation goals then it's only making it easier for them. Every step of their process needs complete resistance and made to be as difficult as possible for them. It's confusing to try and understand how anybody who supports the 2nd Amendment could be saying the things you are.
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Posted: 4/28/2018 7:55:26 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No sir. I am not left. I am not right. I am a fucking American. We are all in this together. I am not part of the DSA. (Divided States of America) I am part of the USA. I understand that everyone did not grow up like I did. I understand that the majority of the state that I live in does not own guns. If a couple laws inconvenience me, but allow me to continue to live my way of life, I am not against them. So called assault weapons bans I am 100% against. Feel free to not agree with me. I don't need to be surrounded by people that all fall in line with my way of thinking. However, if you get butt hurt like a couple fellas in this thread, just because my beliefs don't fall in line with yours. I recommend you go talk to a shrink. 
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