Current Hike Info Bulletin:

Next Hike

Saturday, March 20, 2021, 0800: Calico Mountains [Completed]; San Diego County Hike April/May TBD

Hike completed.  See AAR on Page 4.

I'm planning on an April or May hike to the south, date TBD, either in Dulzura or in a location near the Salton Sea suggested to me by HDLS.  The goal is also to use a location that permits open bearing of arms.  Potential for shooting as well.



Original Post:

So a while back I looked at one of the Virginia Battle Buddy threads showing what they did on their hikes, and thought that it was cool and wished we had something like that out here.  I recently saw the thread calling for this to be spread to other States, and thought that since no one else had gotten around to it, it'd be cool to try to organize something like this out here, especially now that I'm almost recovered from my surgery and hospital stay and should be able to engage in strenuous activity again soon.

Ideally, I'd like us to be able to hike somewhere in unincorporated areas where open carry is generally legal (at very least when fire restrictions are not in effect), so we can carry our long guns on our hikes.  It'd be nice to have options besides just the desert.  To this end, I posted in Calguns to try to solicit info and I am also doing research to see if I can find National Forest or other public land outside of the desert where there are trails sufficient for this purpose (greater than six miles of trails without having to make more than one loop or backtrack more than once, the more the merrier, and possibly areas where hiking can be done off-trail with sufficient amount of land for this).  It'd be nice to also find such land in areas fairly centralized within SoCal, so as to make it easier for those living in the extremities of the region.  If we can incorporate some camping, shooting, and land nav activities into hikes all the better.

If anyone here knows of such areas we can use, whether or not they are interested, please let me know.  If anyone knows of good areas in the desert, too, with variable terrain and other things to make it more interesting than just trekking across flat desert, I'd like to know as well.  I do know of one area in the desert, where I usually go shooting, where we can probably do something like this (I'll have to take a look at the topo maps I have), and where we can shoot out to over 500m if we wanted to do so.  It has fire pits and flat areas suitable for camping, too.  It's near Calico and Ft. Irwin.

Of course, if necessary, or as may be needed from time to time, we can also hike without firearms in other places (there's a trailhead leading to sufficient amounts of trails just mere blocks from my house), but I'd like to emphasize hikes where we carry.

I'm pretty sure that all of Los Angeles County is out for hikes involving carrying, but I could be wrong (perhaps there's some way to do it in some areas if all involved have hunting licenses and tags).

Since the challenges include passing the Navy PFT and CMP/NRA service rifle type shooting, we might also be able to get together to specifically engage in those activities, maybe find a match some of us could go to in order to participate, etc.  To this end, I could only find one CMP-sanctioned match near Castaic, and another I think in Ojai, but it may be limited to American service rifles (I'll have to look into that).  I didn't find any NRA service-rifle matches, but maybe there's something.  If you guys know of anything, especially matches that include the foreign service rifle categories, please let me know.  Attending Appleseeds might also be a good thing (and at Piru I think they use the KD range and not just .22s at 25M).

Anyhow, I'd like to gauge interest and see how many of you guys would like to get together and do something like this.  Seems like it could be a good time, a good way to improve fitness and get used to carrying a rifle and gear (or maintain all of that for those already in good shape or used to such activities), network, train, etc.  

So, is anyone willing to help build and participate in a SoCal Battle Buddies chapter?


ETA: Links to the Battle Buddies threads in GD:

ABB Guidelines

A Call To All American Battle Buddies (Challenge)

American Battle Buddies Warfighter Challenge

How far south do you want to go? There is a huge open space (Otay Open Space Preserve) near Engineer Springs, with South Bay Rod and Gun Club near for KD ranges.  I know shooting is done here: 32°37'04.3"N 116°47'02.1"W . I believe it to be legal because during dry season signs go up saying no shooting.  There is a graded road so any car can get there. Lots of trails and such in the area, camping is also done there. I imagine being seen would be rare, probably Border Patrol if anything.  Not too much flat space for more than 1/2 mile at most.

Another area that is shooting is 32°35'21.1"N 116°54'02.4"W.  again, very hilly.

Ideally more centralized, but the more options in the broader SoCal area, the better.  I was told Los Padres NF is completely out of the question now.

Of course, we actually need people to want to do this.

Subscribed.

The Otay location seems to be a county/regional park.  Still trying to find firearms rules, but most such parks around the State completely ban firearms (not all, though).  The BLM land out there seems to be okay from what I could tell.  There's also a wilderness area; not sure about the rules there.  But if it is GTG for carrying firearms, seems like it could be a good place, even if some of us have to drive a ways (as many would for the desert, too, anyways).  That close to the border, it might actually be a good idea to carry firearms regardless of what activity someone's doing.

I’m in.

Think it’s going to be hard to find somewhere close we can hike and open carry, but I’m down for some remote camping, shooting, and training and local hikes, meeting up to shoot at a range, etc.

I know a few places in the desert we can set up to shoot with room for individual fire and maneuver, buddy teams, and even fire team size.

Up near Ft Irwin, another near 29 palms, and out near ocotillo wells.  Can also camp at or right near those locations too.

I have 4-5 reactive steel targets from MOA and also several wooden stands that break down and are easily transportable.  I can easily make more stands or pass the design info to others.  They’re good for holding cardboard silhouettes or even just squares of cardboard and staple various types of paper targets on them.

This is an okay place to discuss generalities, but we need some type of more private comms for detailed discussion/ planning.

Maybe a discord or signal channel?

Also, our local (Oceanside) indoor range, Iron Sights, does steel challenge on Thursday nights.  I think they also do some type of organized shooting on Sundays too.

Pala range also hosts shooting competitions.

Camp Pendleton has steel out to 600 meters and a pistol range for weekend recreational shooting, but I’ll have to see what the rules are for bringing others aboard base to shoot.

If you look at 32°35'29.4"N 116°54'51.2"W you will see it's right next to a juvenile prison, down the road from an adult prison. people shoot there all the time. That is the west end of the place i mentioned already.  Sherrif dept shooting range between the prisons.  no way it isnt legal to do it there with as much as it's done. people would get busted instantly.

I think it's legal also due to the signs that go up and come down, saying no shooting due to fire hazard. no other signs.  I'll try to find someone to ask about it and get something official, county sheriff and BP.

I'd be interested in joining the fat lazy out of shape group, but I am way down in Otay Mesa.

If we have to go out of the way to go somewhere where we can do our hikes (and possibly other activities) and still carry, so be it, but if there's something more convenient all the better.

I think civilians need to pass a background check to go shoot on Pendleton (not sure what the criteria are for that) and I think also may need to be a member of the club that uses the Pendleton range (I know they offer daily memberships just so people can participate in their matches on base who aren't regular members, otherwise it would be prohibited).

Pala I think is open on certain days to the public for shooting.  IIRC, they have steel out to 800m.

The place I shoot off of the road to Ft. Irwin would be good for some of this stuff.  Enough room to shoot out to 5-600m (my buddy says he did 800 yards, but that might be a stretch there).  Good land for camping.  There should be dirt roads and trails sufficient for hikes of sufficient length, and there are exploratory mines and stuff like that around there that can be kind of neat to check out.  The valley I use for shooting should be large enough for shooting activities involving teams or maneuvering, or other movement, or for setting up targets oriented for shooting in multiple directions.  Not too far down dirt roads, but despite that, it usually isn't too populated.  During the week pretty likely to be the only ones there.  Weekends may vary (and folks on bikes and quads can be an issue for shooting sometimes if there are folks around).  Holidays are pretty packed, though.  Every once in a while a large group may go on a non-holiday weekend (like a club I'm part of that uses the site once or twice a year, or a Boy Scout troop or two).

These are a couple of pictures I took shooting at two 500m targets I set up to practice for the Big Igloo (shortly before I got appendicitis).  Far targets are 500m, the closer one is 200m.  I'm shooting diagonally across the valley, from a spot on top of a ridge to the hills across.





Travelling further north on the ridge (maybe 50m or so) and shooting straight across the valley, this is the view.  It's probably not much more than 250m from the crest of the ridge to the bottom of the slope of the hills straight across.  Target was at 100m, IIRC.  The place where I had the 500m targets on the aforementioned trip is out of frame to the right.



Regarding comms, what are discord and signal, and do they require special apps?

If we can get away with it, that's good enough for me, although it's always good to be sure.  I had thought the spot was the east end of the area in question.

If we can't find good centralized areas, I think it might be good to alternate between more northern and more southern areas within the SoCal region.  Out of the four of us interested so far, two of us live near the San Bernardino/LA County border area around the San Gabriel Mountain foothills, and two live down in San Diego County or thereabouts.

@bigstick61

I can sponsor people on base.

I’m just not sure if they allow me to take anyone but family members to the recreational range. Or the rules for them bringing weapons.  I will call them or drive out there tomorrow and find out.

This is a completely different range and area then the competitions that Santa Margarita gun club does, which get cancelled a lot from what I’ve seen.

If there is a limit to how many people you can get in (seems reasonable) I also have an ID

One thing I've been trying to find are NRA and CMP-sanctioned service rifle matches (since that's part of the Battle Buddies challenge).  Not a whole lot of options there that I've found so far, and I'm not sure any of the CMP ones allow foreign service rifles (whether in the CMP vintage or modern categories), which would exclude someone like me.  I'm not sure if the NRA service rifle match rules permit foreign rifles in some matches like the CMP does, although so far of the few service rifle matches I've found, all have been CMP and not NRA.  The Rancho Santa Margarita club does CMP EIC ones, which allow a wide variety of rifles, but only give EIC points for U.S. service rifles; the other rifles combined are scored in a separate category, too.  On practiscore, no one had signed up for the second category, only the U.S. service rifle one.

Burbank Rifle and Revolver Club does a CMP match regularly at their range near Castaic, but it's not clear to me if it's only U.S. service rifles, or any.  I'll have to e-mail their match director, as their site with match info hasn't been updated since 2017 and doesn't show this year's matches or the guidelines for them.

ETA: Found some info the BRRC posted on Calguns about this match and modern and vintage foreign military rifles are eligible and not just U.S.-issue ones.

Awesome, read OP's posts in the GD thread a few-ish days ago:

https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/A-Call-to-all-American-Battle-Buddies-ABB-Updated-Challenge-in-OP-/5-2271929/?page=1

Right on SoCal...

OP updated with links.  I'm gonna do a post in Calguns and see if I can draw any positive attention and people there. While I know a lot of those guys aren't the types for this sort of thing, to say the least, that place gets way more traffic from Californian gun owners than the hometown forum here.

Edit: Wrong venue.

Heck, if it gets even a couple of takers, it's worth it.  Can't hurt to try.  I think I'll post in GD sometime tonight or tomorrow and see if I can get more attention from our SoCal members there.

Pending determination of a location for the first hike, does anyone have any ideas for a date for the first meeting/hike?  I'll be in Arizona from February 7th to February 17th, maybe a bit longer, but any other timeframe within February works for me.  My job mostly has me work weekends more than week days, but I'm not obligated to take a work call, so I'm flexible there, and my calls are usually for night shifts, anyways.  Week or weekend can potentially be made to work for me.

I'm in San Diego County if anyone wants to hit me up.

I used to shoot there. come across illegals occasionally. makes it interesting. very hilly there, being as its a mountain. I'm too fat to hike in that area. but its local for me so thats a bonus.

ETA Also in San Diego area.

If people regularly shoot there without issues with the cops, sounds like it's basically GTG to me.  Since the majority expressing interest so far are in SD County, I think it could be a good place to do the first hike.

Are there any trail maps available for the area?

I’d be in but I’m all the way up in Simi Valley and I’m not a big fan of driving I have long commute to work everyday so I usually avoid driving on my time off. I’d be in if you guys come up this way sometime.

Ideally, I'd like to go back and forth so that it's not always the same people having to drive far.  I'm in the East San Gabriel Valley area myself.

Sounds like Pomona area I grew up around there my usual gun store is up there All state police equipment.

Not too far from Pomona.  Fortunately, not in Pomona (although there are some decent areas of Pomona up north near La Verne and Claremont).

I'm also near Pomona and am watching this thread with interest.

I was thinking that Walnut Creek or Bonelli/Puddingstone could be good areas for unarmed hikes more easily accessible for the folks up closer to LA.  Enough miles of trails there for our purposes.  I thought about Azusa Canyon, but I'm not sure we could maintain the pace on some of those trails.  Going around the backside on Angeles Crest Hwy (it'd be nice if they could ever fix West Fork) and hiking up to the top of Mt. Islip or, on this side, Mt. Wilson might also be good options for this part of the region.

There may also be areas in the San Bernardino National Forest where we could hike armed.

I've read some of the material at the linked threads and my thinking on this is very clear.  I'm not interested.

What I'm not really sure about is why anyone is.  What's the point?

I'm honestly not surprised by your comments so far based on previous posts.  If you don't see the point of networking and organization among gun owners, camaraderie, encouragement to improve shooting skills and physical fitness in practical contexts, and improving or acquiring other practical skills, or of instilling the martial spirit that should be present among all male citizens (even our Founding Fathers said as much), then I don't know what to tell you.  If you think this sort of thing requires a "sanity check" (does this sound insane to you or something), well, even tougher to figure out what to say.  You're just not going to get it, I guess.  All of those things are positive and good for the individual, for gun owners generally, and even for the citizenry at large.

If you are so disinterested, why did you bother posting this in multiple threads on the topic?

Join a club.  Go to the range and shoot with your friends.  That's what builds camaraderie, friendship, skills, networking.

Why drive for hours to shoot?

Why drive for hours to go for a hike?  Physical fitness is only achieved with daily consistency, not once a week or once a month.

"Martial spirit",... join a local dojo.

"Sanity check" is a phrase that means to check to see if something makes sense.  In this case, to me, it does not.

YMMV

I think this is much more in keeping with my assessment of this suggestion.

Go to the range and spend some quality time shooting.  Meeting and chat with others.

This place is too big and traffic is too fucked up to waste your life idling in the parking lot,... err,... I mean on the freeway.

We need to have enough people to break it up into more local organizations, but I was thinking something similar as well in that regard.  But first, something has to get off of the ground.

Do you think you might be able to go on hike later in the year, supposing this thing gets going?

Ranges suck...

Yeah, I almost never patronize them.  Haven't for years now.  Ranges are often too short, have to wait too long to change targets and can't have a bunch set up at once to avoid having to reset them right away, costs a lot for what you get (and some places charge hourly what you might pay in a day at another range), the good ones require expensive memberships with long wait lists, generally can't do tactical shooting or draw from a holster at them (aside from the membership-only or group-reservation type places), and more.  Crowds and dummies, too.  Finding a good place on public land is much better.

However, NRA and CMP matches are done at ranges, so those who want to do the challenges will have to go to one at some point, if just for that.

So what do you guys think of the 29th of February at the Otay location near Engineer Springs suggested by @maggiethecat for the first hike?  Suggested weight either the probationary 25lbs dry or the 35 lbs standard in the pack plus rifle.  Some ammo in LBE suggested as well.  We'll try to do at least 6 miles.  Maybe some shooting after if there's a good place to set up for that with actual targets (steel or paper).  I still need to get more info about the area, but I think that gives enough time to get things figured out, see what routes we can do, etc.  Those with local knowledge, please, chime in.

If enough folks can't or don't want to go to that area that live further north in SoCal, but we have enough folks who do want to do the above hike, we can have a secondary one either on the 23rd or March 1st, 25 or 45 lb packs, dry weight suggested, no weapons or LBE (handgun with CCW might be okay, though), at Walnut Creek in San Dimas.  At least 3 miles, but I think we could probably get 6 out of it.  No major grades outside of the area near the trailhead.  Need to be careful at some of the places where the creek needs to be forded, but that's about it.  Should be able to keep up a decent pace even without being in peak shape.

If both take place, obviously anyone is welcome to do both if they want to do so.

I'm in, but frankly I'm so far behind the fitness curve, I'll be water only and sucking wind at mile 2 in the hills.

That's cool.  We all gotta start (or get back on the horse) somewhere.  We need at least one more and we've got enough for an official hike.  Do you know if there are trail maps of the area?  I want to try and plan this out and make sure we stay in a firearms-friendly area.

Go for your hike in the morning, then rent a range for the afternoon ($100) at Angeles Shooting Range.

Alternatively, make it a two day affair.  Day one is a hike.  Day two you rent a range at Angeles, do some training then shoot a match ($200).

I do not know of any maps of the area. I just look at the bing aerial shots to see trails.  keeping in mind that doesn't show elevation change at all.  I'll get over there today and see if I can find any info on any of the signs.

I rode out this morning. it is BLM land.  In the popular shooting spots you can get about 250 yards. More if you get creative.
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Nice.  I'll look that up now that I have a name and see what maps I can find so I can plan something out.

Another update is that we have three for the San Dimas hike and it's just a matter of determining the better date (March 1st or February 23rd).  The others interested are Calgunners (one of whom I've met before).  If anyone here is interested and has a date preference, please post.  For the 1st, which is a Sunday, I'd prefer if we'd start in the early afternoon, as I get out of mass between 1145 and 1215 in Ontario (it's the only Latin mass of the day at my church, so I try not to miss it).  That would still give enough time to finish the hike before the sun begins to set.  The 23rd is a Saturday.

a closer and much easier to reach shooting spot is at 32.654724, -116.807078  Still the same BLM land
Park on the side of the road, and set up right there.  I guess hiking could jump off from there also.

Does the BLM land extend southwards from that point?

Also, the LA-area hike is scheduled for Saturday, February 23, tentatively meeting at 1000, at Walnut Creek in San Dimas.  Meeting point will be the parking lot at the trailhead on San Dimas Ave.  Parking is also available on the street to the north of the lot, on the southbound side.  Nearest Fwy. exit is Via Verde off of the 57.  From either exit, make a right onto Via Verde.  Make a right onto San Dimas Ave.  Proceed past the first signal light and you will see the parking lot on your left-hand side.

No open-carrying of firearms for this hike.  For those wanting to do the challenge/ratings, 25 lb. pack dry, or 45 lbs., to count towards provisional or higher ratings, respectively.  For those who do not, bring what you want, or nothing at all, although I'd recommend water, at least.

I'll be measuring out a course somewhere between 3-6 miles in the next week or so, and doing it out in-person to check it out.

So far I have myself and two Calgunners interested.  If anyone here is interested, please let me know.  The more the merrier.

Being seen is often in Otay. Lots of off road vehicles and target shooters.

I grew up in the area, and shoot there often. In fact, I was shooting there this last weekend with my younger son.

South Bay Rod and Gun has those. I'm pretty sure you could shoot a foreign service rifle but you would be in the match rifle class for scoring.

There are a lot of potential trails there. I would suggest driving a bit farther in where more cars could be parked, out past the gun range.

Also best to stay away from local houses, some of them are liberals who would freak out if they saw multiple armed hikers. There is a local effort to shut down shooting in the area, local government tried to end it but didn't get the feds onboard with that (so far). Also, shooting is shut down in dry weather.

I always see either shooters or offroaders when I'm out there. In that area I haven't seen BLM rangers. Sometimes see Border Patrol. Haven't seen illegals in awhile.

yes. mostly south and west, a little north.
everything south and west or the yellow line, which is a road, and between the red lines

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That's the Pink Gate. Lots of people park there when shooting is allowed. The BLM land extends to the other location he mentioned.

Personally I wouldn't want to leave my car there.

not like it'd be there a long time.  but yeah, even parking at the lot right at SBRGC is better in my opinion. From there it's 2 miles to the other spot i mentioned.

You mean the lot below SBRGC I assume? Even if the trail starts farther up we could carpool form there for those with sedans.