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Posted: 1/18/2021 5:19:24 PM EDT
So my wife bought a golden retriever that I doubt has hunting lines.  But I wanted to get him "evaluated" to see if he is worth field training.   So I need some advice.

Can anyone help?
Link Posted: 1/18/2021 8:15:36 PM EDT
[#1]
see if you can get to sight point. a wing on a fishing pole works well. toss the wing out and see he locks up when you give the wing a twitch. most everything can be learned if you have the patience and time and birds for exposure(the most important, IMO). lacking any of the above you can try and throw money at him with a trainer. really depends on what your expectations are.
Link Posted: 1/19/2021 2:33:07 PM EDT
[#2]
Where are you located? I can get you wings. Something that can't be taught is instinct and prey drive. I've seen dogs from non hunting lines be absolutely awesome hunters.

If you're able to get your hand on some pigeons, that would be even better.

Link Posted: 1/19/2021 6:39:17 PM EDT
[#3]
this is the trainer you seek.

http://www.bridgetcarlsen.com/index.html
Link Posted: 1/21/2021 10:05:03 AM EDT
[#4]
A Golden should be flushing, not pointing.  Buy some quail (cotournix are usually cheapest) and see if the dog will chase birds.  Tease the dog a little with the bird and make it fun to go after birds.  Build prey drive.  Praise it when it shows interest if you need to, but if the dog has good prey drive just keep your mouth shut - the dog gets it's own reward from chasing prey.  If you can get the dog really excited about birds you are most of the way home.  

Work on retrieving at home with a dummy away from birds at first.  Use a hallway if you have to to make the dog bring the dummy back to you.

Put some birds out in the field for the dog to find, and when the dog is really worked up start firing a cap gun when the dog chases a bird up, and work up from there (cap gun, starter pistol, etc.).

A bold flushing dog with good prey drive darn near the only thing you have to do is take it in a field where there are some birds and start killing birds over it and it will start hunting.  Your job is to keep the dog under control and in range with obedience training.  If the dog doesn't have strong hunting instincts you are going to have to build that up, move a LOT slower, and make sure you don't scare the dog or hurt it's confidence.


Link Posted: 1/21/2021 10:11:45 PM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
A Golden should be flushing, not pointing.  Buy some quail (cotournix are usually cheapest) and see if the dog will chase birds.  Tease the dog a little with the bird and make it fun to go after birds.  Build prey drive.  Praise it when it shows interest if you need to, but if the dog has good prey drive just keep your mouth shut - the dog gets it's own reward from chasing prey.  If you can get the dog really excited about birds you are most of the way home.  

Work on retrieving at home with a dummy away from birds at first.  Use a hallway if you have to to make the dog bring the dummy back to you.

Put some birds out in the field for the dog to find, and when the dog is really worked up start firing a cap gun when the dog chases a bird up, and work up from there (cap gun, starter pistol, etc.).

A bold flushing dog with good prey drive darn near the only thing you have to do is take it in a field where there are some birds and start killing birds over it and it will start hunting.  Your job is to keep the dog under control and in range with obedience training.  If the dog doesn't have strong hunting instincts you are going to have to build that up, move a LOT slower, and make sure you don't scare the dog or hurt it's confidence.


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Solid advice. Especially the bold.

Link Posted: 1/22/2021 10:02:14 AM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:

Solid advice. Especially the bold.

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View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
A Golden should be flushing, not pointing.  Buy some quail (cotournix are usually cheapest) and see if the dog will chase birds.  Tease the dog a little with the bird and make it fun to go after birds.  Build prey drive.  Praise it when it shows interest if you need to, but if the dog has good prey drive just keep your mouth shut - the dog gets it's own reward from chasing prey.  If you can get the dog really excited about birds you are most of the way home.  

Work on retrieving at home with a dummy away from birds at first.  Use a hallway if you have to to make the dog bring the dummy back to you.

Put some birds out in the field for the dog to find, and when the dog is really worked up start firing a cap gun when the dog chases a bird up, and work up from there (cap gun, starter pistol, etc.).

A bold flushing dog with good prey drive darn near the only thing you have to do is take it in a field where there are some birds and start killing birds over it and it will start hunting.  Your job is to keep the dog under control and in range with obedience training.  If the dog doesn't have strong hunting instincts you are going to have to build that up, move a LOT slower, and make sure you don't scare the dog or hurt it's confidence.



Solid advice. Especially the bold.



Screen name checks out.
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 10:48:11 AM EDT
[#7]
Near Aurora.
Link Posted: 1/23/2021 11:09:14 AM EDT
[#8]
Honestly,  I'm trying to not dump tons of money into a dog that, in the end will not be a solid field dog.  This was advice from my wife's family who has been raising and hunting bird dogs before I was alive.   And I don't want to be "that guy" who shows up to the field and everyone makes a point to hunt as far from me as possible because the dog will never be to par.  I had a friend like that and every time we went hunting it was not that fun because his dog never got it.

At this juncture,  I just need help taking my dog out once to chase birds with another dog and wise owner that can control the hunt and provide feedback on our prospects.
Link Posted: 1/25/2021 3:15:52 PM EDT
[#9]
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Quoted:
Near Aurora.
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Bridget Carlsen is in Yorkville. she has trained several Master Hunter bird dogs and will give you a honest evaluation. there are show line dogs and there are working line dogs. she knows the nitty gritty like the back of her hand. most dog trainers give free evaluations. give her a call and see what she has to say. she is a total sweetheart! if you go in for a evaluation bring the dogs papers with so she can have a look. you have a highly skilled  nationally known trainer who has competed on both sides of the pond not far from your front door,  take a few minutes to see what she has to say.

http://www.bridgetcarlsen.com/source/brags.html
Link Posted: 2/9/2021 10:19:48 AM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:
A Golden should be flushing, not pointing.  Buy some quail (cotournix are usually cheapest) and see if the dog will chase birds.  Tease the dog a little with the bird and make it fun to go after birds.  Build prey drive.  
View Quote


When I was a kid my dad convinced a local gas station to let us trap pigeons.  I would go up on the roof of the gas stations and set a live trap. Then I'd go get it the next day and use the pigeons to train the dog, just spin 'em and plant 'em and have the dog find them.  Then shoot a blank gun when they flushed.
Link Posted: 2/15/2021 11:47:45 PM EDT
[#11]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


When I was a kid my dad convinced a local gas station to let us trap pigeons.  I would go up on the roof of the gas stations and set a live trap. Then I'd go get it the next day and use the pigeons to train the dog, just spin 'em and plant 'em and have the dog find them.  Then shoot a blank gun when they flushed.
View Quote


Our OP here could make himself a “pigeon pole”.

Buy a 10 foot piece of 1” PVC pipe.

Drill a hole in one end to accept an eye bolt and hex nut.

Go find a field with some knee high weeds.

Pound a piece of rebar or a concrete form  stake into the ground.

Tie some string (aka mason’s twine.... braided??? ).... maybe about 20 or 30 feet of it.... to the eye bolt.

Slip the other end of PVC pipe over the stake.

Very gingerly tie the other end of the string/twine to a live pigeon’s feet.

The past few times I did it, I used a separate piece of string  maybe a foot long.... and basically tied the pigeon’s feet together  with a separate loop in the middle.

Then I tied the main string to that loop.

Then very carefully  set the pigeon in the weeds.

Get your pup out.... and with at least a leash on his collar lead him into the field so he is down wind of the pigeon .

Then kinda just casually walk him back and forth leading up to the pigeon to see if he picks up on the scent.

Get him to hold still on his “point”....aka whoa!

If you had a buddy with you have him walk towards the pigeon and if necessary kick it up to get it to flush.

Your pup might  try to run after the bird.

That’s a good sign.

You can kinda let it, but don’t let him get its mouth on the bird just yet.

See?  When the pigeon gets to the end of the string, the PVC pipe has enough flex to it that it acts like a shock absorber and the bird just kinda floats/flitters to the ground.

Oh... yeah... before you start handling the pigeon to tie the string on, if the pup is in a crate or kennel, hold the bird up to its nose to let him get a good whiff of it.

Its eyes should get real big like it just took a hit of crack or heroin.

The hunt club where I usually go to has pheasants, quail, and chukar... plus a pigeon coop.  The hunt club owner has one of those old fashioned mesh baskets/fish strainers that he gives me the pigeons in.  

Some people will wear those el cheapo brown jersey gloves to keep their scent off a bird.

As far as introducing a gun or noise to the dog, you have to be real careful.

The worst thing you could do is make a dog gun shy.  I want make every experience or interaction your dig has to be very positive.

I have done few things in the past before.  I would go to a local range’s trap league night and gradually walk my pup closer and closer to the firing line.

I have also taken an over/under with me to the patterning board.

Leave the dog in the truck close enough to still watch me... but with the windows up.

Cut a shell apart and dump out the wad, the pellets, and the gunpowder.  Then hold up the shotgun pointed towards the patterning board while looking at the dog, squeeze the trigger and watch the dog’s response.

Slightly lower the windows.

Cut a shell apart.

Rinse.

Repeat.

Move on to low recoil shells.

Rinse.

Repeat.

Move onto regular shells.

Rinse.

Repeat.

Move onto super handicap shells.

Rinse.

Repeat.

Then let the dog out of the truck but still on a leash.

Bring the dog up close to firing line.

And start all over with a cut up shell that just has a primer.

Rinse.

Repeat.

There are other methods to desensitize your dog to noise.

Some people will beat on pots and pans as their dogs are eating.

Or play loud music while they are feeding.

If you  go to YouTube, you can do a search for things like “force fetching”  or “steady to wing”, you will get sucked into a rabbit hole of different gundog training videos....see you in a couple of days.


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