Missouri and 80% lowers - Page 1

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Missouri and 80% lowers

Posted: 11/12/2018 12:03:48 AM EDT

I know that they aren't illegal here so my question pertains to carrying a completed one without a serial number on it. Thinking about building a second Polymer80 "glock" to carry in a backpack everyday in my car but I am not sure how a finished 80% setup would be looked at in case law enforcement gets involved (for basically any reason). My experience thus far with police and firearms have been positive and they haven't so much as looked at me cross but in the event I need to use it for its intended purpose, would I be better off sending the frame out to be engraved or is that really not a big deal? Same goes for home defense if I were to use it there..

Posted: 11/12/2018 1:14:41 AM EDT

[#1]

I’m really fond of my “80%” based weapons, fortunately I don’t have to concern myself with that issue.

My primary handgun is the FN FiveseveN 5.7x28, my BUG is the Rohrbaugh R9S Stealth 9mm. Neither of which is available in an “80%” frame.

My .02, It SHOULDN’T matter but if it winds up in a shooting I think they would definitely try and make an issue out of it.

Posted: 11/12/2018 7:51:09 PM EDT

[#2]

That was kind of my thought as well. I am thinking I might look into having a number engraved on it just so I don't cause an issue where one doesn't need to be. Plus I don't care about the whole ghost gun garbage anyway. I like them because it fixes every issue I have with glocks lol.

Posted: 11/12/2018 9:09:31 PM EDT

[#3]

I prefer “80%” Lowers because of the clean, unmarked look....

Posted: 11/12/2018 9:15:03 PM EDT

[#4]

This is just a pistol so there's no rollmark and you couldn't normally see the serial number area anyway. One of these days I will work myself up to machining a lower out like that..

Posted: 11/21/2018 8:46:25 AM EDT

[#5]

If you get stopped for whatever reason, and the officer gets his hands on your gun and wants to run the serial, I'm betting it's going to wind up getting confiscated and you may even face charges/arrest. It could be expensive legally.

Posted: 11/21/2018 3:36:40 PM EDT

[#6]

Quote History

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If you get stopped for whatever reason, and the officer gets his hands on your gun and wants to run the serial, I'm betting it's going to wind up getting confiscated and you may even face charges/arrest. It could be expensive legally.

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I’m pretty sure that legally it wouldn’t get expensive. It wouldn’t take very long for an Officer to figure out that they aren’t illegal. Hell I’d hate to try and remember how many times I googled something on a car stop to check the legality. Plus, on any Dept that’s halfway decent sized, there will be some Officers familiar with “80%” Guns or “Ghost Guns”.

Posted: 11/22/2018 8:32:37 AM EDT

[#7]

Quote History

Quoted:
I’m pretty sure that legally it wouldn’t get expensive. It wouldn’t take very long for an Officer to figure out that they aren’t illegal. Hell I’d hate to try and remember how many times I googled something on a car stop to check the legality. Plus, on any Dept that’s halfway decent sized, there will be some Officers familiar with “80%” Guns or “Ghost Guns”.

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Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
If you get stopped for whatever reason, and the officer gets his hands on your gun and wants to run the serial, I'm betting it's going to wind up getting confiscated and you may even face charges/arrest. It could be expensive legally.

I’m pretty sure that legally it wouldn’t get expensive. It wouldn’t take very long for an Officer to figure out that they aren’t illegal. Hell I’d hate to try and remember how many times I googled something on a car stop to check the legality. Plus, on any Dept that’s halfway decent sized, there will be some Officers familiar with “80%” Guns or “Ghost Guns”.

I've never had an officer look at my guns during a traffic stop.

Posted: 11/22/2018 7:05:46 PM EDT

[#8]

A much bigger concern on “80%” firearms

LINK

Posted: 11/23/2018 2:01:16 PM EDT

[#9]

"...the following shall be considered banned hazardous products under section 8 of such Act (15 U.S.C. 2057):

(1) A firearm receiver casting or firearm receiver blank or unfinished handgun frame that—

(A) at the point of sale does not meet the definition of a firearm in section 921(a) of title 18, United States Code; and

(B) after purchase by a consumer, can be completed by the consumer to the point at which such casting or blank functions as a firearm frame or receiver for a semiautomatic assault weapon or machinegun or the frame of a handgun."
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Seems to me pretty much any random chunk of metal meets that definition. What constitutes a "blank" is probably a pretty wide legal gray area.

Posted: 11/26/2018 8:39:47 PM EDT

[#10]

I guess as a followup to this, I ended up selling the 80% frame and bought a serialized one for about the same price after FFL fee. Plus as a bonus I don't have to do anything but assemble it once it's here. Definitely won't be the last of my 80% builds though.

Posted: 11/27/2018 2:11:29 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:

I'm pretty sure that legally it wouldn't get expensive. It wouldn't take very long for an Officer to figure out that they aren't illegal. Hell I'd hate to try and remember how many times I googled something on a car stop to check the legality. Plus, on any Dept that's halfway decent sized, there will be some Officers familiar with "80%" Guns or "Ghost Guns".

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Ehhh, as you know, it depends on the officer and situation. I've had to fight bullshit charges more than once, and it was expensive EVERY time. If you get charged for what the officer thinks is a zip gun or obliterated serial number (simply because you never put a serial on it), it will probably be expensive. As long as you have a competent lawyer like K.J., you'll win, but you'll wind up paying $$$$. If you're a middle aged white man who can clearly explain to the officer why there is no serial on it and why you can legally own it, AND if you have a clean record, AND if you're being questioned about it pursuant to some minor traffic violation, you've got a 99% chance of coming out ok and leaving the scene with your 80%/ghost gun. So that means probably everybody reading this thread is fine. If you're a 23yo black man in Riverside MO though, regardless of how clean your record is and why you were stopped, your gun is probably going to be confiscated and you're probably going to be charged with defacing the serial number.

Quoted:

I've never had an officer look at my guns during a traffic stop.

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Soon after 9/11, KCPD was searching EVERY car that parked in short term parking at MCI. They asked me to pop my trunk, found my Glock 21, and confiscated it simply because I couldn't provide proof of ownership on the spot. Took me 6 months to get it back.

Because of my lines of work, and because I drive exotic cars (no relation between the two), I have frequent traffic stop interactions with LEO all over MO and KS. 30 years ago, LEO (on the east coast) would run the serials EVERY time. 10 years ago, they'd run the serials about half the time (ie. whenever they felt the need to remove the guns from me or my vehicle which was invariably "for their safety"). So far this year, no LEO has cared about any of my guns. Note that I always inform the officer that I'm carrying, tell him/her where the guns are, and offer my CCW permit. KSHP stopped me earlier this year and asked if I was a sheriff when he looked at my Jackson County CCW permit issued by Mike Sharpe.

Posted: 11/27/2018 5:33:54 AM EDT

[#12]

I can tell you first hand some very backwards shit was/is? taught at the KCPD academy when it comes to firearms owners. I do think the younger generation of Officers, instructors and looser gun laws have changed things a lot in the last 10 years.

Namely, and most importantly, was the death of the permit to acquire handguns.

Posted: 11/27/2018 10:46:33 AM EDT

[#13]

Quote History

Quoted:

Soon after 9/11, KCPD was searching EVERY car that parked in short term parking at MCI. They asked me to pop my trunk, found my Glock 21, and confiscated it simply because I couldn't provide proof of ownership on the spot. Took me 6 months to get it back.

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I think you are referring to Burns Security, because I had to pick a friend up every three weeks at KCI I had SEVERAL run ins with them. At the time a good friend of mine was in charge of KCI Airport Division Police unit,

I pull in to short term parking (the first time I encountered them)

The Rent-A-Cop walks up and states “I have to search your vehicle”

I ask him “On what grounds?”

He states “911”

I ask him “Where’s your Warrant?”

He states “I don’t need a Warrant for Private Property!”

I then inform him that “Since when did the KCI Airport that belongs to the City of Kansas City, MO and was paid for by the Public become “Private Property”?”

I then tell him “I think you better get your Supervisor out here NOW!”

Well his boss shows up and goes through the same shit.

I inform his boss I’m calling Richard the head of the KCI Police unit, he then states “You can’t reach him, he’s off today”

Well, then I guess I’ll just have to call him at home then wont I.

I call Richard and he tells me he’s warned Airport management that they are violating the hell out of people’s rights and the $8.00 an hour, untrained idiots doing their 20 second “search” is worthless.

So I go ahead and let the the knuckle dragger do his “search”

Fast forward a few months, my oldest son and I are at Pideon Hill blasting away with a few of the Machine Guns, my son looks at his watch and says “Aren’t you supposed to pick Mike up?”

SHIT!

Throw everything in the back of the Suburban and head to the Airport.

Of course, Burns Security is there keeping the World safe from the bad ass terrorists.

They walk up and say, we have to search your vehicle!

I put on my best grin and say........SURE!

He opens the back doors and there are several automatic weapons, hundreds of rounds of ammo, and a bunch of loaded magazines.

His jaw drops.....

And i then inform him, “Yep, they’re Registered Machine Guns.”

He doesn’t have a clue what the fuck to do and finally because vehicles are stacking up motions me on.

I send my son in to meet my friend.

Yep, keeping the World safe.

My wife everytime she was with me would say “PLEASE, don’t screw with Security AGAIN!”

But of course, I HAD to.

Posted: 11/27/2018 3:44:32 PM EDT

[#14]

Quote History

Quoted:

I think you are referring to Burns Security, because I had to pick a friend up every three weeks at KCI I had SEVERAL run ins with them. At the time a good friend of mine was in charge of KCI Airport Division Police unit,

I pull in to short term parking (the first time I encountered them)

[...]

My wife everytime she was with me would say "PLEASE, don't screw with Security AGAIN!"

But of course, I HAD to.

View Quote

Holy shit! Crazy experiences, and hilarious, and pathetic.

I know that KCPD was there at some point, but it may have been Burns who stopped me first, and then called KCPD for backup when I started raising hell about the gun confiscation. When I called airport security later about my Glock, they claimed they didn't know anything about a gun and didn't know where it might be. It magically turned up when I told them I was going to report it as stolen to the BATFE.

Posted: 12/2/2018 7:10:59 PM EDT

[#15]

Reading these stories makes me glad I decided to pony up for a serialized one. Not that I expect something to happen but I certainly don't want to add any unneeded drama. Now if I could just get the damn frame in my possession life would be good.