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Posted: 5/30/2020 1:22:40 PM EDT
My son lives in L.A.(Downtown)He is an upstanding citizen an engineer by occupation.No criminal record etc.When he visits me in Arizona can I give him a semi auto handgun as a gift for him to take back to Californa.Not to carry but home defense.The gun would be a S&W Shield 45acp.Would he or I be breaking any Californa Laws.
Link Posted: 5/30/2020 3:58:14 PM EDT
[#1]
Link Posted: 5/30/2020 6:58:58 PM EDT
[#2]
Quoted:  Personally, I would give it to him and tell him to keep his mouth shut about it.
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IMO, this is worse than just a parental mistake, it's actually illegal.  What happens if he needs to use it and does so?

Give him some cash which he is bound to use for an in-State purchase.

If he feels his life is in immediate danger due to the rioting, exit the area.  A hotel is cheaper than medical bills.

Link Posted: 5/30/2020 11:45:57 PM EDT
[#3]

I think dad isn't properly explaining that son brought the gun with him when he moved to CA, then left it at dad's last time he visited
Link Posted: 5/31/2020 12:27:47 AM EDT
[#4]
Since this is a father - son transfer, it qualifies for an intrafamilial transfer.  No roster restrictions and should be fine as long as it isn't an "assault weapon" with a Shield, seems unlikely.  Because it is a transfer across state lines, federal law requires use of an FFL.  Find a competent ffl with reasonable fees, etc.  Look it up on the net, there are DoJ and Calguns articles, etc., which go into more detail.  

Possible problems?  "Pandemic" related processing delays have been occurring beyond the usual periods.  And I'd expect ffls, etc., are stupid swamped right now.  In the past during these riot conditions, I believe some cities may have shut down (or tried to) firearms sales, which is a different issue.  Nor am I familiar with current "lending" provisions under state or federal laws.  there's a lot to be said for checking things yourself at reliable sources beyond just internet forums.
Link Posted: 5/31/2020 12:57:48 AM EDT
[#5]
You drove to CA and handed it to him as a gift correct? If so he needs only fill out this form https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/forms/oplaw.pdf and pay $19. No threaded barrels and no mags over 10 rounds unless he got them during freedom week. The handgun roster does not apply in this case.
Link Posted: 5/31/2020 2:04:16 AM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
You drove to CA and handed it to him as a gift correct? If so he needs only fill out this form https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/forms/oplaw.pdf and pay $19. No threaded barrels and no mags over 10 rounds unless he got them during freedom week. The handgun roster does not apply in this case.
View Quote


So, with that form there is no need to use an FFL under the circumstances you describe?

My fear is trying to do the right thing and inadvertently screwing up resulting in DOJ knocking at the door.

(I’m not the OP, but a friend of mine has an out of state daughter that wants to give him a gift.  He ask me to ask for him)
Link Posted: 5/31/2020 4:23:07 AM EDT
[#7]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I think dad isn't properly explaining that son brought the gun with him when he moved to CA, then left it at dad's last time he visited
View Quote

 
Which of course means it will show up in the state records if it gets run because it was registered when he bought it here, or when he brought it here.   Or not.  Not the right chance to take.

Then again, these being extraordinary times, I would likely risk it for myself.  Assuming I won't make myself an object of interest,  Sounds worse and worse.  

this is something that a Father Son discussion on arrival in CA or before coming here should have covered.  When the riot starts it's to late to get a legal gun here.

But if he isn't scarfed up out after curfew with merchandise that has no receipt, he probably doesn't have to worry, he's very likely to get a ticket and or just released.  maybe,

I'd risk it it, but tell him he will be taking some big chances and not to take any other chances.  As usual you mileage may vary.  And it is better to be judges by 12 than carried by 6, etc etc
Link Posted: 5/31/2020 1:17:37 PM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


So, with that form there is no need to use an FFL under the circumstances you describe?

My fear is trying to do the right thing and inadvertently screwing up resulting in DOJ knocking at the door.

(I’m not the OP, but a friend of mine has an out of state daughter that wants to give him a gift.  He ask me to ask for him)
View Quote



Federal law requires interstate transfers go through an ffl and that that transfer be in accordance with state requirements.  Ca handgun sales through dealers have been recorded/reported since 1924.  "Private" sales ended in 1991.  (Sales would include gifts, transfers, etc. but reporting has been required.  The DoJ site describes the intrafamilial process, etc.) It's been a requirement for self-imported (new residents) to report/register handguns since 1998.  So, they theoretically have the information required to see that a new "swimmer" (not originally sold here, not reported or otherwise in the system here) has popped into the system when reported using the intrafamilial reporting.

Undoubtedly for political purposes, they've recently made a BFD about backtracking ammunition  purchase attempts by prohibited persons.  Should they see an upswing in intrafamilial transfers with the handguns not in the system, will they do something?  Especially if off roster, perhaps, given current climate and litigation?

Incidentally, if a giftee isn't already in the system, ammunition purchases can  be messed up/delayed.  

Do I expect there are a lot of "loans" and the like going on? Absolutely.  Will the full range of legal hoops be known and observed?  I have some questions in my mind about the political ramifications of jacking up a "nice guy" for seeking to protect him/her/they self during these current riot conditions but have no doubt that unless the political climate changes a lot in California that the inadvertent/intentional failure to fully  meet all the requirements might be used against you.
Link Posted: 5/31/2020 3:14:33 PM EDT
[#9]
Useful thread, thanks.

My situation:

I am Oregon resident.
My daughter graduated high school in Oregon in 2015.
I gave her a Ruger LCP as a graduation gift. Six round mag.
The 4473 was in my name. It is legal in Oregon for me to give it to her without additional paperwork.

In 2015, she went off to college in Cali.
She lived in dorm for 4 years, no gun, not allowed in dorm.
For those 4 years, she was an Oregon resident with an Oregon DL, living as a college student in Cali.

Today, she is a master's student at the same college in Cali.
She lives off campus (private home).
She is a now a fulltime Cali resident with a Cali DL.

She is visiting us in OR right now.

She drives back to Cali soon.

Our plan - she takes her pistol with her when she drives back to Cali next week.

I looked at the BoF form 4454A linked by NorCalRT (thanks).

Is that the form she needs to file?

In Section B, I'm not sure if i should put June of 2015 or June of 2020 as the "Date Acquired"?
The gun was a gift to her in June 2015, so she acquired it back then.
But the gun has never left Oregon or been transported into Cali until next week.

Thoughts?
Link Posted: 5/31/2020 5:00:08 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Useful thread, thanks.

My situation:

I am Oregon resident.
My daughter graduated high school in Oregon in 2015.
I gave her a Ruger LCP as a graduation gift. Six round mag.
The 4473 was in my name. It is legal in Oregon for me to give it to her without additional paperwork.

In 2015, she went off to college in Cali.
She lived in dorm for 4 years, no gun, not allowed in dorm.
For those 4 years, she was an Oregon resident with an Oregon DL, living as a college student in Cali.

Today, she is a master's student at the same college in Cali.
She lives off campus (private home).
She is a now a fulltime Cali resident with a Cali DL.

She is visiting us in OR right now.

She drives back to Cali soon.

Our plan - she takes her pistol with her when she drives back to Cali next week.

I looked at the BoF form 4454A linked by NorCalRT (thanks).

Is that the form she needs to file?

In Section B, I'm not sure if i should put June of 2015 or June of 2020 as the "Date Acquired"?
The gun was a gift to her in June 2015, so she acquired it back then.
But the gun has never left Oregon or been transported into Cali until next week.

Thoughts?
View Quote


Look at this form.  Seems that if you legally gave her the gun in Oregon before she moved to California and 1) brought the gun in to the state, 2) and became a resident, then file the form within 60 days.  I think it’s pretty straight forward if the time frame is correct.

When I moved I brought my guns in and filed those forms for the guns.  I made sure they were configured legally, but some were off roster handguns and I had no problems.  In fact I have a Glock 43 (non roster) gun I brought in, registered within 60 days, listed on my CCW.

ETA:  The bottom of page 2 instructions gives the criteria and Penal Code.  Maybe it will clear up your question.  I’m just telling you what I did and how I interpreted it.  DOJ makes up their own rules.
Link Posted: 5/31/2020 6:26:49 PM EDT
[#11]
That was helpful, thanks!
Link Posted: 6/11/2020 7:49:44 AM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Being that you live in another state, you'll have to use an FFL and the pistol will have to be on the roster, if it's not on the roster of approved pistols, then he can't have it.
View Quote


Roster does not apply to intra-familial transfers.
Link Posted: 6/11/2020 3:05:53 PM EDT
[#13]
Link Posted: 6/12/2020 2:30:44 AM EDT
[#14]
Link Posted: 6/12/2020 3:05:57 AM EDT
[#15]
That's the big "No cop buddies" exception.  The intra-familial transfer provisions allow for it.  Grandparent-parent-child can transfer an off roster handgun.  Federal law does require transfer interstate via ffl.  The recipient can't be a prohibited person and the firearm must be legal to possess.  After that, it's possible to private party transfer, the roster not applying to PPTs
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