User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 10/2/2014 8:38:36 PM EDT
[#1]
Teir 1 & 2 were the real killers. up to 80%
3 & 4 only up to 60% 5 & 6, 50% no incentives to stay longer And most NYS jobs upstate require you to do 25 years or more. Those city guys are 20 and out. And as a former city deweller, upstate is past westchester co. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/2/2014 8:38:54 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: As far as paying pensions for 40 years. Life expectancy of LE is much lower then other occupations. I hear death notices in pre shift briefings all the time, guy retired 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 10, 15, 20 years ago. In the 15 years I have, only once have I heard of someone with more then 30 years in retirement. Old wive's tale
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/2/2014 8:40:23 PM EDT
[#3]
Then why do I hear death notice's of guys who retired only 5 years ago.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 10/2/2014 8:50:47 PM EDT
[#4]
"Mortality is another topic
of research in police retirement. An extensive study of more than 2,000 officers in Buffalo, New York, found that the age-mortality rate for officers was, on average, 12 years lower than their civilian counterparts; health issues, such as cancer and heart disease, increased as officers drew closer to retirement; and the average life expectancy after retiring was 5.05 years less than that of people in other occupations. 30 This research also revealed that officer suicides were three times higher and appeared to occur more often just before retirement, a possible indicator of the stress of retirement at a time period when maladaptive factors can form." from page 5 http://leb.fbi.gov/2009-pdfs/leb-october-2009 |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 12:08:28 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
As far as paying pensions for 40 years. Life expectancy of LE is much lower then other occupations. Quote HistoryQuoted:
As far as paying pensions for 40 years. Life expectancy of LE is much lower then other occupations. That's been disproven by the people who write the pension checks. In 2008, the California Public Employees' Retirement System, or CalPERS, which manages the country's largest public pension fund, released a report called "Preparing for Tomorrow" that concluded the average public safety officer retires at 55, about four years earlier than the average worker.
The organization's research, which was conducted in 2004, showed that police officers who retire at age 55 live, on average, to be 81 — the same age as the typical government worker. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 1:14:59 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Really hmm.. well than whats happening in Calf than Bankruptcy Judge in California Challenges Sanctity of Pensions Nothing is really protected. No different then 2nd amendment is just look at the pistol license and the unsafe act. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Taxpayers ARE responsible to the extent that the State Constitution guarantees pensions. So yes, they MUST be paid no matter what. AND, that is cast in stone. It is guaranteed by both the State and US Constitutions. Really? That is news to me,,,the US Constitution guarantees pensions? Those wiley founding fathers, covered all bases.... As I posted above, the State Constitution names the pension relationship "contractual". The Contracts Clause of the US Constitution forbids a State from "impairing" a contract. So yes, the NYS public sector pensions have US Constitutional protection. Really hmm.. well than whats happening in Calf than Bankruptcy Judge in California Challenges Sanctity of Pensions Nothing is really protected. No different then 2nd amendment is just look at the pistol license and the unsafe act. This is completely off topic, as it deals with the State's ability to collect from the City, NOT whether the individual pensions are guaranteed (which they are under NYS law and Constitution). This link is meaningless to NYS retirees. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 1:15:31 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Per my earlier post this is basically the kind of ruling that might save the taxpayers from unlimited liability. I did not know about this case and thought Detroit pretty much quashed any ruling on pension modifications. As for NYS pensions being 100%+ funded, ask who is reporting that. Is the it the state reporting that or an independent outside auditing firm using standard accounting principles? It has to be the state because outside firms have pointed out the flaws in the state's accounting practices for years. The two biggest flaw in the state's calculations versus how private pensions are accounted for is the state uses aggressive returns that do not really exist (7.6% or close) and they use "today's dollars" as the number instead of looking forward 20 years to the value of the dollar and the additional liabilities that will hit as private companies are required to do. It is bad accounting but legal for governments to do. If a private company conducted its pension and business audits like the government, a lot of people would be going to jail for financial fraud. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Really hmm.. well than whats happening in Calf than Bankruptcy Judge in California Challenges Sanctity of Pensions Nothing is really protected. No different then 2nd amendment is just look at the pistol license and the unsafe act. Per my earlier post this is basically the kind of ruling that might save the taxpayers from unlimited liability. I did not know about this case and thought Detroit pretty much quashed any ruling on pension modifications. As for NYS pensions being 100%+ funded, ask who is reporting that. Is the it the state reporting that or an independent outside auditing firm using standard accounting principles? It has to be the state because outside firms have pointed out the flaws in the state's accounting practices for years. The two biggest flaw in the state's calculations versus how private pensions are accounted for is the state uses aggressive returns that do not really exist (7.6% or close) and they use "today's dollars" as the number instead of looking forward 20 years to the value of the dollar and the additional liabilities that will hit as private companies are required to do. It is bad accounting but legal for governments to do. If a private company conducted its pension and business audits like the government, a lot of people would be going to jail for financial fraud. Last year the return was 14% |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 5:44:17 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Actually that's not true. It's better to do 20 and out as your pension percentage stops accruing at 20 years. no more 20+ years and the percentage goes up with 5 & 6. The idea was to have more turnover to get top pay guys out faster, and to keep new employees on the payroll at low wages. That theory only works for agencies that have a fairly prolonged step program to get to your top pay When I started 26 years ago there were something like 12 steps. Now you have a training rate, a hire rate and a working rate Within a couple of years of being hired you're making the same rate as anyone else other than the rookies |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 8:13:13 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That theory only works for agencies that have a fairly prolonged step program to get to your top pay When I started 26 years ago there were something like 12 steps. Now you have a training rate, a hire rate and a working rate Within a couple of years of being hired you're making the same rate as anyone else other than the rookies Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Actually that's not true. It's better to do 20 and out as your pension percentage stops accruing at 20 years. no more 20+ years and the percentage goes up with 5 & 6. The idea was to have more turnover to get top pay guys out faster, and to keep new employees on the payroll at low wages. That theory only works for agencies that have a fairly prolonged step program to get to your top pay When I started 26 years ago there were something like 12 steps. Now you have a training rate, a hire rate and a working rate Within a couple of years of being hired you're making the same rate as anyone else other than the rookies Suffolk County PD is 12 years to top step for new hires now and I don't see any guys leaving that gig. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 8:58:47 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Actually that's not true. It's better to do 20 and out as your pension percentage stops accruing at 20 years. no more 20+ years and the percentage goes up with 5 & 6. The idea was to have more turnover to get top pay guys out faster, and to keep new employees on the payroll at low wages. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: With Tier 5 and 6 there is no more 20 and out. Actually that's not true. It's better to do 20 and out as your pension percentage stops accruing at 20 years. no more 20+ years and the percentage goes up with 5 & 6. The idea was to have more turnover to get top pay guys out faster, and to keep new employees on the payroll at low wages. With <20 years of service: 1.66% of FAS times years of credited service With 20 years or more of service: 35% of FAS for 20 years of service plus 2% of FAS for years of service > 20 |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 10:33:11 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not according to this: http://www.osc.state.ny.us/retire/employers/tier-6/ers_comparison.php With <20 years of service: 1.66% of FAS times years of credited service With 20 years or more of service: 35% of FAS for 20 years of service plus 2% of FAS for years of service > 20 Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
With Tier 5 and 6 there is no more 20 and out. Actually that's not true. It's better to do 20 and out as your pension percentage stops accruing at 20 years. no more 20+ years and the percentage goes up with 5 & 6. The idea was to have more turnover to get top pay guys out faster, and to keep new employees on the payroll at low wages. Not according to this: http://www.osc.state.ny.us/retire/employers/tier-6/ers_comparison.php With <20 years of service: 1.66% of FAS times years of credited service With 20 years or more of service: 35% of FAS for 20 years of service plus 2% of FAS for years of service > 20 For Police its 50% at 20......1.66% per year after that, maxed out at 32 years = 70%.......Our pension is about average compared to the nation.......Some states are a little better, some are a little worse. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 10:34:51 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Suffolk County PD is 12 years to top step for new hires now and I don't see any guys leaving that gig. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Actually that's not true. It's better to do 20 and out as your pension percentage stops accruing at 20 years. no more 20+ years and the percentage goes up with 5 & 6. The idea was to have more turnover to get top pay guys out faster, and to keep new employees on the payroll at low wages. That theory only works for agencies that have a fairly prolonged step program to get to your top pay When I started 26 years ago there were something like 12 steps. Now you have a training rate, a hire rate and a working rate Within a couple of years of being hired you're making the same rate as anyone else other than the rookies Suffolk County PD is 12 years to top step for new hires now and I don't see any guys leaving that gig. I can't wait to leave........and I won't be getting $100,000/yr pension |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/3/2014 1:44:25 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
"Mortality is another topic of research in police retirement. An extensive study of more than 2,000 officers in Buffalo, New York, found that the age-mortality rate for officers was, on average, 12 years lower than their civilian counterparts; health issues, such as cancer and heart disease, increased as officers drew closer to retirement; and the average life expectancy after retiring was 5.05 years less than that of people in other occupations. 30 This research also revealed that officer suicides were three times higher and appeared to occur more often just before retirement, a possible indicator of the stress of retirement at a time period when maladaptive factors can form." from page 5 http://leb.fbi.gov/2009-pdfs/leb-october-2009 1) Doughnuts are a factor. If they are glazed or cream filled can shorten your life expectancy. 2) Who would want to get out of the car in sub-zero temperatures and die. 3) You may have to dig your car out to get to work in Buffalo ,but then again I'm sure the DPW will take care of that. 4) Your doing detail at a Buffalo game in January and keel over in the sub-zero temperature from drinking too much alcohol to stay warm. 5) Your totally over weight and are a ticking time bomb 6) Your predisposed to heart disease and its just a matter of time. 7) We are all going to die sometime. 8) Remember it's always the beginning of the end. 9) Admit to nothing deny everything and die with the lie can be very stressful and lead to a sudden cardio infraction So this is life |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/4/2014 7:43:57 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's your choice....nobody is twisting your arm to take a test. Just don't begrudge someone who did. It is the same old song and dance...when the economy is in the tank the civil servants get attacked for their pension. A pension that some worked 25, 30 or more years for. It has now become commonplace for pension numbers to be in the news. Why don't they post how much the senior editor or the owner of the "rag" makes? They don't want you to know that. No one complains when the fat financial cats pull down millions upon millions of dollars as some Wall Street CEOs have during good financial times. Money that is made off of the backs of their investors, which could be any or all of us. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Sorry not really looking to spend twenty years standing next to a metal detector. That's your choice....nobody is twisting your arm to take a test. Just don't begrudge someone who did. It is the same old song and dance...when the economy is in the tank the civil servants get attacked for their pension. A pension that some worked 25, 30 or more years for. It has now become commonplace for pension numbers to be in the news. Why don't they post how much the senior editor or the owner of the "rag" makes? They don't want you to know that. No one complains when the fat financial cats pull down millions upon millions of dollars as some Wall Street CEOs have during good financial times. Money that is made off of the backs of their investors, which could be any or all of us. Take a test... I'm not sure where you are. ... but that's got nothing to do with who gets hired. The "rule of 3s" makes absolutely sure it's all about who you know. Burning through 100s and 90s to get to the chiefs buddy's son in the 85s ... it's laughable. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/4/2014 10:01:33 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Take a test... I'm not sure where you are. ... but that's got nothing to do with who gets hired. The "rule of 3s" makes absolutely sure it's all about who you know. Burning through 100s and 90s to get to the chiefs buddy's son in the 85s ... it's laughable. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Sorry not really looking to spend twenty years standing next to a metal detector. That's your choice....nobody is twisting your arm to take a test. Just don't begrudge someone who did. It is the same old song and dance...when the economy is in the tank the civil servants get attacked for their pension. A pension that some worked 25, 30 or more years for. It has now become commonplace for pension numbers to be in the news. Why don't they post how much the senior editor or the owner of the "rag" makes? They don't want you to know that. No one complains when the fat financial cats pull down millions upon millions of dollars as some Wall Street CEOs have during good financial times. Money that is made off of the backs of their investors, which could be any or all of us. Take a test... I'm not sure where you are. ... but that's got nothing to do with who gets hired. The "rule of 3s" makes absolutely sure it's all about who you know. Burning through 100s and 90s to get to the chiefs buddy's son in the 85s ... it's laughable. The one in three rule does exist, but in large departments it is almost never used for entry level jobs, except to weed out someone who "qualifies" on paper but clearly does not belong there. It is used much more for promotions. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/4/2014 11:32:56 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Take a test... I'm not sure where you are. ... but that's got nothing to do with who gets hired. The "rule of 3s" makes absolutely sure it's all about who you know. Burning through 100s and 90s to get to the chiefs buddy's son in the 85s ... it's laughable. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Sorry not really looking to spend twenty years standing next to a metal detector. That's your choice....nobody is twisting your arm to take a test. Just don't begrudge someone who did. It is the same old song and dance...when the economy is in the tank the civil servants get attacked for their pension. A pension that some worked 25, 30 or more years for. It has now become commonplace for pension numbers to be in the news. Why don't they post how much the senior editor or the owner of the "rag" makes? They don't want you to know that. No one complains when the fat financial cats pull down millions upon millions of dollars as some Wall Street CEOs have during good financial times. Money that is made off of the backs of their investors, which could be any or all of us. Take a test... I'm not sure where you are. ... but that's got nothing to do with who gets hired. The "rule of 3s" makes absolutely sure it's all about who you know. Burning through 100s and 90s to get to the chiefs buddy's son in the 85s ... it's laughable. I didn't know jack squat........I wasn't related to anyone, wasn't buddies with anyone,........my family is not in politics whatsoever........I took the test, got a 95 and got hired........who would have thought.
........On that note: I have seen "Politics" and "Games" played to "reach" certain people.......no doubt it does happen, but at least LE is civil service and it does cut most of the political BS out of the hiring process.......now you want to talk politics.......look at your local Highway Depts.......you don't get hired in one of them without donating or sucking up to the right people. Yet amazingly nobody really ever bitches about them. Our PD is grossly understaffed and OT is out of control.......we haven't settled a contract in 4 years, and they are threatening layoffs.......which will only create more OT. This is a double edged sword, it saves money upfront, but kills the taxpayer on the backend with increased pension costs. Our Highway Dept is "untouchable" because it is 100% patronage jobs.......they are overstaffed. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/4/2014 11:38:00 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I didn't know jack squat........I wasn't related to anyone, wasn't buddies with anyone,........my family is not in politics whatsoever........I took the test, got a 95 and got hired........who would have thought. I took the PD test when I was 16 and scored 100. Got hired 4 years later. Who would've thought. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/5/2014 10:12:51 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I didn't know jack squat........I wasn't related to anyone, wasn't buddies with anyone,........my family is not in politics whatsoever........I took the test, got a 95 and got hired........who would have thought.
........On that note: I have seen "Politics" and "Games" played to "reach" certain people.......no doubt it does happen, but at least LE is civil service and it does cut most of the political BS out of the hiring process.......now you want to talk politics.......look at your local Highway Depts.......you don't get hired in one of them without donating or sucking up to the right people. Yet amazingly nobody really ever bitches about them. Our PD is grossly understaffed and OT is out of control.......we haven't settled a contract in 4 years, and they are threatening layoffs.......which will only create more OT. This is a double edged sword, it saves money upfront, but kills the taxpayer on the backend with increased pension costs. Our Highway Dept is "untouchable" because it is 100% patronage jobs.......they are overstaffed. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Sorry not really looking to spend twenty years standing next to a metal detector. That's your choice....nobody is twisting your arm to take a test. Just don't begrudge someone who did. It is the same old song and dance...when the economy is in the tank the civil servants get attacked for their pension. A pension that some worked 25, 30 or more years for. It has now become commonplace for pension numbers to be in the news. Why don't they post how much the senior editor or the owner of the "rag" makes? They don't want you to know that. No one complains when the fat financial cats pull down millions upon millions of dollars as some Wall Street CEOs have during good financial times. Money that is made off of the backs of their investors, which could be any or all of us. Take a test... I'm not sure where you are. ... but that's got nothing to do with who gets hired. The "rule of 3s" makes absolutely sure it's all about who you know. Burning through 100s and 90s to get to the chiefs buddy's son in the 85s ... it's laughable. I didn't know jack squat........I wasn't related to anyone, wasn't buddies with anyone,........my family is not in politics whatsoever........I took the test, got a 95 and got hired........who would have thought.
........On that note: I have seen "Politics" and "Games" played to "reach" certain people.......no doubt it does happen, but at least LE is civil service and it does cut most of the political BS out of the hiring process.......now you want to talk politics.......look at your local Highway Depts.......you don't get hired in one of them without donating or sucking up to the right people. Yet amazingly nobody really ever bitches about them. Our PD is grossly understaffed and OT is out of control.......we haven't settled a contract in 4 years, and they are threatening layoffs.......which will only create more OT. This is a double edged sword, it saves money upfront, but kills the taxpayer on the backend with increased pension costs. Our Highway Dept is "untouchable" because it is 100% patronage jobs.......they are overstaffed. Admittedly there is a problem with the system which is unsustainable and equally unfair. Bernie Madoff has nothing on this pension system . Its just to large to fail UmUmUm. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2014 12:45:51 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Even on Long Island the pensions are NOT $100k for the average retiree. Only for high ranking Officers, Judges, High ranking school officials. And the NYS Constitution calls pensions a "contractual relationship", granting them protection under the US Constitution Contracts Clause. As well, there is NO legal basis for a State to go bankrupt. So stop worrying about haircuts and take the test if you are jealous. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The bright side for the taxpayers, and the downside for the pensioners, is that eventually gravity and the courts are going to address this nonsense and then everyone is going to learn the new meaning of the word "haircut". $100K+ pensions are practically the norm on Long Island now and is unsustainable. The billions in tax dollars being spent on a retired workforce that produces nothing just cannot go on indefinitely. Either we will reach the point where they are literally confiscating people's entire paychecks and property to keep up with the payments or the pensions will have to be recalculated at pennies to the dollar. Many states including New York have constitutional provisions protecting pensions but the U.S. Constitution does not and there has not yet been a Federal Bankruptcy Court ruling on whether or not pensions obligation can be discharged through Federal bankruptcy. It was looking like Detroit would be the test case but, as has been the case in all municipal bankruptcy cases to date, the parties have made concessions and settlements in order to avoid what would probably be a precedent setting decision that pensions CAN be discharged through bankruptcy. The municipal employees and unions do not want such a decision so are making small concessions and agreements in order to prevent such a decision from being possible. However, it will definitely reach a point where someone does not agree to a settlement and the courts will have to rule. Then maybe we can get our fiscal houses in order, roll out 401K type savings plans to employees and make everyone responsible for his/her retirement savings. Even on Long Island the pensions are NOT $100k for the average retiree. Only for high ranking Officers, Judges, High ranking school officials. And the NYS Constitution calls pensions a "contractual relationship", granting them protection under the US Constitution Contracts Clause. As well, there is NO legal basis for a State to go bankrupt. So stop worrying about haircuts and take the test if you are jealous. I don't think that is fair. I am not "jealous" of state workers, and my taking the test isn't going to solve anything. Is it ok if I do not like the set up, because in reality I do not believe the tax payer is REALLY represented in those "negotiations"? I'm not going to fault anyone for taking a job to feed his family, but do not piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. I would not feel right taking money from NY taxpayers, as a public servant, and getting a pension when the regular tax payer does not get one. It has nothing to do with jealousy. Governmental Agencies should have no need to pay former employees years down the road, contribute to 401k that year, and be done. That is the biggest reason pensions take up a whopping 27% of the federal budget. |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2014 2:07:53 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I don't think that is fair. I am not "jealous" of state workers, and my taking the test isn't going to solve anything. Is it ok if I do not like the set up, because in reality I do not believe the tax payer is REALLY represented in those "negotiations"? I'm not going to fault anyone for taking a job to feed his family, but do not piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. I would not feel right taking money from NY taxpayers, as a public servant, and getting a pension when the regular tax payer does not get one. It has nothing to do with jealousy. Governmental Agencies should have no need to pay former employees years down the road, contribute to 401k that year, and be done. That is the biggest reason pensions take up a whopping 27% of the federal budget. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The bright side for the taxpayers, and the downside for the pensioners, is that eventually gravity and the courts are going to address this nonsense and then everyone is going to learn the new meaning of the word "haircut". $100K+ pensions are practically the norm on Long Island now and is unsustainable. The billions in tax dollars being spent on a retired workforce that produces nothing just cannot go on indefinitely. Either we will reach the point where they are literally confiscating people's entire paychecks and property to keep up with the payments or the pensions will have to be recalculated at pennies to the dollar. Many states including New York have constitutional provisions protecting pensions but the U.S. Constitution does not and there has not yet been a Federal Bankruptcy Court ruling on whether or not pensions obligation can be discharged through Federal bankruptcy. It was looking like Detroit would be the test case but, as has been the case in all municipal bankruptcy cases to date, the parties have made concessions and settlements in order to avoid what would probably be a precedent setting decision that pensions CAN be discharged through bankruptcy. The municipal employees and unions do not want such a decision so are making small concessions and agreements in order to prevent such a decision from being possible. However, it will definitely reach a point where someone does not agree to a settlement and the courts will have to rule. Then maybe we can get our fiscal houses in order, roll out 401K type savings plans to employees and make everyone responsible for his/her retirement savings. Even on Long Island the pensions are NOT $100k for the average retiree. Only for high ranking Officers, Judges, High ranking school officials. And the NYS Constitution calls pensions a "contractual relationship", granting them protection under the US Constitution Contracts Clause. As well, there is NO legal basis for a State to go bankrupt. So stop worrying about haircuts and take the test if you are jealous. I don't think that is fair. I am not "jealous" of state workers, and my taking the test isn't going to solve anything. Is it ok if I do not like the set up, because in reality I do not believe the tax payer is REALLY represented in those "negotiations"? I'm not going to fault anyone for taking a job to feed his family, but do not piss on my leg and tell me it's raining. I would not feel right taking money from NY taxpayers, as a public servant, and getting a pension when the regular tax payer does not get one. It has nothing to do with jealousy. Governmental Agencies should have no need to pay former employees years down the road, contribute to 401k that year, and be done. That is the biggest reason pensions take up a whopping 27% of the federal budget. I think this is the situation where the pension went from a hard earned method of financial security to an entitlement. Pensions were a way of getting the right talent into the industry so you would not have to rely on social security as your only fallback. Then unions came along and made sure you knew you were entitled to this benefit since you worked so hard for 40 hours getting free medical and profit sharing. Pensions are something that we can not afford as a nation, yet the blue states will make sure that they exist until municipalities and mega companies are bled dry and file bankruptcy. See GM and Detroit. .. Those of us who don't have them will have to hope our 401k doesn't just tank out... While working 60 hours on salary |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2014 3:31:50 PM EDT
[#21]
Profit sharing? I was ENTITLED to profit sharing?
Why wasn't I told? |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2014 3:52:50 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Profit sharing? I was ENTITLED to profit sharing? Why wasn't I told? You were working for GM? How about 3M? Maybe Dunlop?.... Unions are not just LE... but they are some of the worst Eta... I mean civil service unions |
|
|
|
Posted: 10/6/2014 4:58:11 PM EDT
[#23]
You cant compare NYPD to any of the counties outside the five boroughs. Upstate and out on the island is ripping the taxpayer off totally and that includes the teachers. These are the two of biggest problems the taxpayer is facing. With the usual threats if raises are not given. Hey what the fuck just raise taxes.
You can make your own conclusions. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
