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Posted: 7/29/2022 9:14:31 AM EDT
Link Posted: 7/29/2022 9:20:54 AM EDT
[#1]
Nice.

IMHO, you should post this on the CMP forum as well, for info purposes, as well as other 1911 forums, if you haven't done so already.
Link Posted: 7/29/2022 9:25:02 AM EDT
[#2]
Nice looking trio!!
Link Posted: 7/29/2022 9:42:34 AM EDT
[#3]
Link Posted: 7/29/2022 11:01:06 AM EDT
[#4]
Great little collection. Currently my only 45 is a 1911A1 CMP gun, Rand frame with colt postwar rebuild barrel and slide, marked as rebuilt at USMC depot Albany GA in 1977.
Link Posted: 7/29/2022 11:13:50 AM EDT
[#5]
Link Posted: 7/29/2022 11:16:04 AM EDT
[#6]
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Quoted:
@WWIIWMD
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Tagged for later when can focus, many thanks bruh.

Respect and thanks to OP for preserving vital early production history. Will be admiring and visiting soon.

Link Posted: 7/29/2022 9:16:50 PM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:



Thanks, it was posted on 1911forum.com first (that's where I was able to do the most digging with serials) and I'll be putting it on 1911addicts later today.   Like many other people I have been patiently waiting for CMP to activate my account on their forum - from what I understand, some people have waited years!
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Quoted:
Nice.

IMHO, you should post this on the CMP forum as well, for info purposes, as well as other 1911 forums, if you haven't done so already.



Thanks, it was posted on 1911forum.com first (that's where I was able to do the most digging with serials) and I'll be putting it on 1911addicts later today.   Like many other people I have been patiently waiting for CMP to activate my account on their forum - from what I understand, some people have waited years!

Link Posted: 7/29/2022 9:49:52 PM EDT
[#8]
Link Posted: 8/2/2022 11:23:31 AM EDT
[#9]
Link Posted: 8/13/2022 1:47:03 PM EDT
[#10]
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Quoted:



some of it is very much that!    Just be careful and remember you're in a tech forum right now and not GD.

Looking forward to any extra info or insight that you might have.
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some of it is very much that!    Just be careful and remember you're in a tech forum right now and not GD.

Looking forward to any extra info or insight that you might have.


Like that hunter cartoon.
Sorry for delay, a couple admiring comments this weekend hopefully.

Congratulations on the shipping record above, a real coup!
Link Posted: 8/20/2022 9:31:42 AM EDT
[#11]
Link Posted: 8/20/2022 12:46:08 PM EDT
[#12]
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Quoted:
@WWIIWMD

Friendly reminder
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Thanks buddy, needed it, for 101 good reasons.

This is the weekend to admire and learn.

"All are important, All have a story to tell."

Even Gordon Bethune, worthy custodian of 7 Singer's, doesn't have your sidearm, or the lowest known Rand Serial Number (see photo), the only Consecutive Pair of 1924 Improved Model of 1911 (from the run of 10,000) and the lowest known Union Switch And Signal pistol (with correct Colt blunted tip hammer) from the FDOP or some relic in 30% condition resting in Bob's closet.

Nor does the retired industrialist who owns Colt US NAVY No. 501, 502 and 503, the very first 3 NAVY's made, all in prime condition. His representative phoned me years ago to discuss finding Navy pistols (we have an original 2nd Shipment US Navy). That dude has unlimited capital, but he doesn't own your Ithaca.

That's the beauty of United States War Relics and the most studied/documented weapon of War ever built; everyone profits in knowledge from the coups and finds of others. As Karl Karash wrote me years ago "Many senior collectors wont look at anything under 95% condition, and in doing so pass by countless interesting, historic and important weapons."

Two more wisdoms from Karl:

1) "A hardworking man feeding his family living check to check may save for years to buy a 1945 Rand with worn finish and irregular parts that you and I might not give a second glance. He will study, oil, shoot, learn and maintain his pistol with appreciation and devotion. Never take these for granted."

2) Phrase near the bottom on every gun show slantback display Company History sign we designed:






The 123rd Remington Rand made of their 877,751

ETA, this is 123rd, not 23rd





Link Posted: 8/21/2022 9:14:21 PM EDT
[#13]
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Quoted:
@WWIIWMD

Friendly reminder
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Your Coup Find, pics, comments and Spoiler demanded reading multiple times.
Your Tuskegee thread stellar too.

335,466 Ithaca were built, third behind Colts 575,632 and Rand's 877,751

Before forget, in addition to research, one of your priorities should be to find (and/or buy) owners, photos and data on ANY pistol from your production era for vital A-B comparison. This is where 'tells' and nuances really emerge, other like examples. As always, one lower and one higher of similar vintage are preferred.

Lots to digest and consider at Ithaca in context with manufacturing then underway at Colts, US&S well into production by March and Rand's early struggles (damn civilians!) later overcome to record setting effect (50,000/Month for 4 consecutive months). Colt's also supplied Switch with parts until their fixtures and tooling came on line, the Women-Built pistols of WWII (9 of 10 workers at Swissvale were WOW's) receiving the only official War Department commendation.

Engineering schematics were provided by Colts to Rand, they sent parts to Switch and Ithaca, it was Total War. Also rare were the new replacement slides already finished and stored at Ithaca ordered used on new Ithaca pistol production to accelerate deliveries. No one else did that but Ithaca. Can post a photo of a mint Double Logo Ithaca if you like. ETA recall a rarity having shipping records on that one, from a case of 50 in September 1943.

Arsenal Bombs are a favorite, a relatively low total of the 2.3 million or so WWII service pistols had them, Ithaca shared the feature with Colts early production.

You're fortunate to document this much with an Ithaca. Here are Rockwell Hardness strikes on the 29th Switch John Holbrook's once owned. There's typically no mistaking these marks as accidents.

Some of your photos seem more color correct than others, True Temperature lighting deserved for your historically important pistol. Factory workers were still getting used to equipment and processes in all early production, blunted hammers, unfinished finger cut machining, scarred minor parts and more observed on examples from each of the 4 prime contractors. Would be on the lookout for those variables that might seem innocent at first glance.  

Of the 4 major companies, prime examples reveal no two park processes are the same color. Blue black to for us is more interesting than matte gray. In your internal photo of the bomb by the disconnector it sure has a blue hue to it, might just be lighting.



Differing minor parts color (always darker) is common, some early pistols for at least two companies were more uniform. We would benefit from great photos of this (or any) pistol as you have observed overall wear/internal firing signature are limited.

All bets are off with early builds but other than those, fixture indexing marks are not common; failure to complete surface machining steps was very common since over 600 machining operations, 239 fixtures and 447 different gauges were used on each pistol. Fun Fact: 1 receiver fixture remains at Colts that has been in use since 1911, every 1911 receiver ever made for any market has gone through that fixture.

Would love to see the striking finish difference of Shipment 8 - Crate 41 and this later 184xxxx

Have you taken any new photos yet?  




ETA: comment above on Double Logo Ithaca - shipped 24 September, 1943 in a case of 50
not this Ithaca


Link Posted: 8/22/2022 1:27:31 PM EDT
[#14]
Link Posted: 8/22/2022 2:28:25 PM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Of the 4 major companies, prime examples reveal no two park processes are the same color. Blue black to for us is more interesting than matte gray. In your internal photo of the bomb by the disconnector it sure has a blue hue to it, might just be lighting.

View Quote

Early Ithaca was finished in DuLite (bluing over sandblasted surface), not Parkerized. OP's pistol appears to be one of those. Fewer than 35,000 received the DuLite finish.
Link Posted: 8/22/2022 9:20:24 PM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Early Ithaca was finished in DuLite (bluing over sandblasted surface), not Parkerized. OP's pistol appears to be one of those. Fewer than 35,000 received the DuLite finish.
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Quoted:
Quoted:

Of the 4 major companies, prime examples reveal no two park processes are the same color. Blue black to for us is more interesting than matte gray. In your internal photo of the bomb by the disconnector it sure has a blue hue to it, might just be lighting.


Early Ithaca was finished in DuLite (bluing over sandblasted surface), not Parkerized. OP's pistol appears to be one of those. Fewer than 35,000 received the DuLite finish.


Natch. Of the bulk of each companies work, color differences are always striking, few can put 4 Gold Standard pistols on the same table.
Most Ithaca's made are the later finish (obviously), love the later all-serrated minor parts. Have an irrational affection for Switch's, unsure how it started, railway company in part. Around 2003, two new crossing guard barriers installed near the house. Just had to get out and look. Sure enough, on the back of each casting...

(one of the pistol stand data plates we designed into computer for sign building)





Link Posted: 8/22/2022 9:51:08 PM EDT
[#17]
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Quoted:
@WWIIWMD



Precisely why I wanted to jump on this one when it was offered to me!




Thank you, the Tuskegee pistol is incredibly special, as is this - but for obviously different reasons.

A few months ago I located and attempted contact with the owners of I-856500 (182 away) and 856650 (only 32 away!) with the hopes I could get more information/data as well as additional photos of their pistols but have not heard back from either. One of them has been active online recently and must simply not want to share, while the other has been inactive for a few years.  My search continues!

Here are the changes I have found in the serial numbers - all of these are Colt frames (except maybe the very last) as evidenced by the larger tang/extension by the grip safety.  Some may be old M1911 frames from 1918, while 856650 and 856682 are M1911A1 frames.

I-856500 with the I-prefix and different/early font, the 96th serial!  I was lucky enough to receive a copy of the Ithaca shipping records from another collector and this serial appears to my eyes to be located in Shipment #8 chest #36, 23 Mar 1943 (same shipment as mine)

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/856500-6-2498585.jpg

856650 with different/early font (but no I-prefix). Has flaming bomb by disconnector.  (This serial also appears in Shipment #8 chest #39, 23 Mar 1943)

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/856650R3-2498586.jpg

856682 (mine) with new serial font which remained through the rest of the contract. (Again, this serial is in Shipment #8 chest #41, 23 Mar 1943) The later contract used a slightly larger version of the same font.
https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/000-2498602.jpg

858032 was arsenal refurbished (AA stamp) and at least the slide was parkerized (frame also appears park'd over pitting near mag release) so I passed on buying it for now.  No flaming bomb found on frame. (This serial also appears to my eyes in Shipment #8 chest #45, 23 Mar 1943)

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/IMG_5230__1_-2498666.jpg


859526 - look at the differing shape of the frame near the safety! (This serial is in Shipment #9 chest #57, 5 April Mar 1943, to Augusta Ordnance)

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/0859526R-2498633.jpg






You're right, I've see you post that triple Rockwell photo before so this one on my 856682 in a similar location was very obvious:
https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/Rockwell-2498655.jpg

A double Ithaca is on my "want" list!



Yes! That photo was taken outside with indirect light and there is a blue/black sheen to the interior of both the frame and slide, much like the barrel but the finish is not as polished. Most of the other photos were taken indoors.





Bring it on over, we can take a side-by-side photo!

I plan on taking detailed shots of all the small parts, as well as some nice natural indirect light of the whole pistol with the hopes that the camera will have the correct color balance.  The photos in the original post were to show the general lack of wear - it's a shame this was stored in a holster for so long, but at least it is now being properly cared for.

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Quoted:
@WWIIWMD

Quoted:


........
That's the beauty of United States War Relics and the most studied/documented weapon of War ever built; everyone profits in knowledge from the coups and finds of others. As Karl Karash wrote me years ago "Many senior collectors wont look at anything under 95% condition, and in doing so pass by countless interesting, historic and important weapons."

.......




Precisely why I wanted to jump on this one when it was offered to me!


Quoted:


Your Coup Find, pics, comments and Spoiler demanded reading multiple times.
Your Tuskegee thread stellar too.

335,466 Ithaca were built, third behind Colts 575,632 and Rand's 877,751

Before forget, in addition to research, one of your priorities should be to find (and/or buy) owners, photos and data on ANY pistol from your production era for vital A-B comparison. This is where 'tells' and nuances really emerge, other like examples. As always, one lower and one higher of similar vintage are preferred.




Thank you, the Tuskegee pistol is incredibly special, as is this - but for obviously different reasons.

A few months ago I located and attempted contact with the owners of I-856500 (182 away) and 856650 (only 32 away!) with the hopes I could get more information/data as well as additional photos of their pistols but have not heard back from either. One of them has been active online recently and must simply not want to share, while the other has been inactive for a few years.  My search continues!

Here are the changes I have found in the serial numbers - all of these are Colt frames (except maybe the very last) as evidenced by the larger tang/extension by the grip safety.  Some may be old M1911 frames from 1918, while 856650 and 856682 are M1911A1 frames.

I-856500 with the I-prefix and different/early font, the 96th serial!  I was lucky enough to receive a copy of the Ithaca shipping records from another collector and this serial appears to my eyes to be located in Shipment #8 chest #36, 23 Mar 1943 (same shipment as mine)

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/856500-6-2498585.jpg

856650 with different/early font (but no I-prefix). Has flaming bomb by disconnector.  (This serial also appears in Shipment #8 chest #39, 23 Mar 1943)

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/856650R3-2498586.jpg

856682 (mine) with new serial font which remained through the rest of the contract. (Again, this serial is in Shipment #8 chest #41, 23 Mar 1943) The later contract used a slightly larger version of the same font.
https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/000-2498602.jpg

858032 was arsenal refurbished (AA stamp) and at least the slide was parkerized (frame also appears park'd over pitting near mag release) so I passed on buying it for now.  No flaming bomb found on frame. (This serial also appears to my eyes in Shipment #8 chest #45, 23 Mar 1943)

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/IMG_5230__1_-2498666.jpg


859526 - look at the differing shape of the frame near the safety! (This serial is in Shipment #9 chest #57, 5 April Mar 1943, to Augusta Ordnance)

https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/0859526R-2498633.jpg




Quoted:

Lots to digest and consider at Ithaca in context with manufacturing then underway at Colts, US&S well into production by March and Rand's early struggles (damn civilians!) later overcome to record setting effect (50,000/Month for 4 consecutive months). Colt's also supplied Switch with parts until their fixtures and tooling came on line, the Women-Built pistols of WWII (9 of 10 workers at Swissvale were WOW's) receiving the only official War Department commendation.

Engineering schematics were provided by Colts to Rand, they sent parts to Switch and Ithaca, it was Total War. Also rare were the new replacement slides already finished and stored at Ithaca ordered used on new Ithaca pistol production to accelerate deliveries. No one else did that but Ithaca. Can post a photo of a mint Double Logo Ithaca if you like. ETA recall a rarity having shipping records on that one, from a case of 50 in September 1943.

Arsenal Bombs are a favorite, a relatively low total of the 2.3 million or so WWII service pistols had them, Ithaca shared the feature with Colts early production.

You're fortunate to document this much with an Ithaca. Here are Rockwell Hardness strikes on the 29th Switch John Holbrook's once owned. There's typically no mistaking these marks as accidents.




You're right, I've see you post that triple Rockwell photo before so this one on my 856682 in a similar location was very obvious:
https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/166952/Rockwell-2498655.jpg

A double Ithaca is on my "want" list!

Quoted:

Some of your photos seem more color correct than others, True Temperature lighting deserved for your historically important pistol. Factory workers were still getting used to equipment and processes in all early production, blunted hammers, unfinished finger cut machining, scarred minor parts and more observed on examples from each of the 4 prime contractors. Would be on the lookout for those variables that might seem innocent at first glance.  

Of the 4 major companies, prime examples reveal no two park processes are the same color. Blue black to for us is more interesting than matte gray. In your internal photo of the bomb by the disconnector it sure has a blue hue to it, might just be lighting.



https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-JnKJKrF/0/d5abe67a/O/i-JnKJKrF.jpg



Yes! That photo was taken outside with indirect light and there is a blue/black sheen to the interior of both the frame and slide, much like the barrel but the finish is not as polished. Most of the other photos were taken indoors.


Quoted:

Differing minor parts color (always darker) is common, some early pistols for at least two companies were more uniform. We would benefit from great photos of this (or any) pistol as you have observed overall wear/internal firing signature are limited.

All bets are off with early builds but other than those, fixture indexing marks are not common; failure to complete surface machining steps was very common since over 600 machining operations, 239 fixtures and 447 different gauges were used on each pistol. Fun Fact: 1 receiver fixture remains at Colts that has been in use since 1911, every 1911 receiver ever made for any market has gone through that fixture.

Would love to see the striking finish difference of Shipment 8 - Crate 41 and this later 184xxxx

Have you taken any new photos yet?  


https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-ktLgCGR/0/913046bf/O/i-ktLgCGR.jpg

ETA: comment above on Double Logo Ithaca - shipped 24 September, 1943 in a case of 50
not this Ithaca





Bring it on over, we can take a side-by-side photo!

I plan on taking detailed shots of all the small parts, as well as some nice natural indirect light of the whole pistol with the hopes that the camera will have the correct color balance.  The photos in the original post were to show the general lack of wear - it's a shame this was stored in a holster for so long, but at least it is now being properly cared for.



Early s/n's? Stop! My sides!! Looks 'fake' compared to the rest of production, like this fake Switch number!




Klekturs will come out of the woodwork over time as word get out, or you post it on the bigger A1 sites. Treat yourself to those low cost True Temp lights for pics.

There he is again, our buddy, Assembler 2 and Like Colts Assembler 63, they seem familiar, found those numbers on countless sidearms across the country for many decades.

32 away... imagine, same crate when the stars align. He will be a helluva photo resource.
We reunited a pair of consecutive 1918's that spent 1,202 months apart, it CAN BE DONE! They had no business being original/same condition, but were.

Here is that 'youngster'. Might be Charles' book stated some 6500 new production pistols were made with new Replacement Slides repurposed to the Line, this one perhaps the highest condition known. There has never been a screwdriver touch most of this one, no slide or grip safety abrasions from cocking/squeezing/holding.





Another example of middle-period Ithaca finish that had 21 rounds at proof testing making the single finish abrasion at the dust cover. Not the slightest abrasion on grip safety, thumb safety or trigger. Coincidental fitment determines individual wear rates, some metal points are scratched with 1 round, others defy round count guess. Reduced light test here for minor parts contrast.

This is key in deducing parts changes. A minor part on any pistol may have been changed 14 months after built, still during the War, with a part from the same crate, year, company or era. Learning to tell the difference begins with Gold Standard examples continuing right down to the 30% relics. We have a legendary RemIthaca A1 that's been more fun than most could imagine. It doesn't have to be 'pretty' to be instructive.




Many thanks for the great photos, a rare treat for a very little discussed era of Ithaca production, 'little' since almost no one has them.
More data on the way.

Link Posted: 8/22/2022 10:29:08 PM EDT
[#18]
My 1943 Ithaca is one of my most prized possessions.
Shipped to the US Naval Supply Depot in Oakland, CA. Re-arsenalled almost four decades later in 2/81, at USMC Logistics Base, Albany Georgia.


Link Posted: 8/23/2022 1:01:50 PM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
My 1943 Ithaca is one of my most prized possessions.
Shipped to the US Naval Supply Depot in Oakland, CA. Re-arsenalled almost four decades later in 2/81, at USMC Logistics Base, Albany Georgia.
https://i.imgur.com/je5Fg5a.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/W9jSdgm.jpeg
https://i.imgur.com/AZlv6qA.jpeg
View Quote


Absolutely delish! More Rockwell Hardness punch marks! Rare in themselves!

Look at the feathering at rear  of trigger guard, a characteristic repeated often at that time, each one "handmade", many men and women handled them, no two are exactly alike.  

Machining signatures abound throughout the production cycle at every company.

Here on 4 different US&S ranging from incomplete MSH machining to a unique scarred hammer to a rare finger cut, its round-the-clock production after all.

Based on many thousands of reviewed photos and many too in person, trigger guard feathering marks are rarely found on Colt, but Switch, Ithaca and Rand have 'em.







Link Posted: 8/23/2022 3:38:59 PM EDT
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Absolutely delish! More Rockwell Hardness punch marks! Rare in themselves!

Look at the feathering at rear  of trigger guard, a characteristic repeated often at that time, each one "handmade", many men and women handled them, no two are exactly alike.  

Machining signatures abound throughout the production cycle at every company.

Here on 4 different US&S ranging from incomplete MSH machining to a unique scarred hammer to a rare finger cut, its round-the-clock production after all.

Based on many thousands of reviewed photos and many too in person, trigger guard feathering marks are rarely found on Colt, but Switch, Ithaca and Rand have 'em.


https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-Hm3cJMQ/0/e2ddb0b1/O/i-Hm3cJMQ.jpg
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-GbQbJzW/0/058b1989/X2/i-GbQbJzW-X2.jpghttps://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-wZwMgGB/0/cff3ef26/X2/i-wZwMgGB-X2.jpg
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-3gTg3nv/0/34422784/X2/i-3gTg3nv-X2.jpg


View Quote

Very impressive photos. I guess it's war time and that hammer got through inspection because the pistol go BAM! without issue.
Link Posted: 8/23/2022 6:36:05 PM EDT
[#21]
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Quoted:

Very impressive photos. I guess it's war time and that hammer got through inspection because the pistol go BAM! without issue.
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Quoted:
Quoted:


Absolutely delish! More Rockwell Hardness punch marks! Rare in themselves!

Look at the feathering at rear  of trigger guard, a characteristic repeated often at that time, each one "handmade", many men and women handled them, no two are exactly alike.  

Machining signatures abound throughout the production cycle at every company.

Here on 4 different US&S ranging from incomplete MSH machining to a unique scarred hammer to a rare finger cut, its round-the-clock production after all.

Based on many thousands of reviewed photos and many too in person, trigger guard feathering marks are rarely found on Colt, but Switch, Ithaca and Rand have 'em.


https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-Hm3cJMQ/0/e2ddb0b1/O/i-Hm3cJMQ.jpg
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-GbQbJzW/0/058b1989/X2/i-GbQbJzW-X2.jpghttps://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-wZwMgGB/0/cff3ef26/X2/i-wZwMgGB-X2.jpg
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-3gTg3nv/0/34422784/X2/i-3gTg3nv-X2.jpg



Very impressive photos. I guess it's war time and that hammer got through inspection because the pistol go BAM! without issue.


Ever higher on the Irony Meter, Union Switch was the only company to never suffer a malfunction during proof testing... its them 90%-of-workers-are-women thing at Swissvale.  
Link Posted: 8/23/2022 6:38:23 PM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Very impressive photos. I guess it's war time and that hammer got through inspection because the pistol go BAM! without issue.
View Quote View All Quotes
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:


Absolutely delish! More Rockwell Hardness punch marks! Rare in themselves!

Look at the feathering at rear  of trigger guard, a characteristic repeated often at that time, each one "handmade", many men and women handled them, no two are exactly alike.  

Machining signatures abound throughout the production cycle at every company.

Here on 4 different US&S ranging from incomplete MSH machining to a unique scarred hammer to a rare finger cut, its round-the-clock production after all.

Based on many thousands of reviewed photos and many too in person, trigger guard feathering marks are rarely found on Colt, but Switch, Ithaca and Rand have 'em.


https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-Hm3cJMQ/0/e2ddb0b1/O/i-Hm3cJMQ.jpg
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-GbQbJzW/0/058b1989/X2/i-GbQbJzW-X2.jpghttps://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-wZwMgGB/0/cff3ef26/X2/i-wZwMgGB-X2.jpg
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-3gTg3nv/0/34422784/X2/i-3gTg3nv-X2.jpg



Very impressive photos. I guess it's war time and that hammer got through inspection because the pistol go BAM! without issue.


FDOP blunted hammer

"Hey, gimme chance ta get used to this machine will ya?"


Link Posted: 8/24/2022 4:37:04 PM EDT
[#23]
Link Posted: 8/24/2022 4:37:23 PM EDT
[#24]
Link Posted: 8/25/2022 6:21:53 PM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


I've got 9 of those lights, evidently I just can't figure out how to use them or the camera properly when it comes to photographing pistols I think I need to incorporate a non-white backdrop, I use the photo booth for items I sell online for work.

Two in the same case would be ideal, consecutive would be icing on the cake!

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Quoted:



Klekturs will come out of the woodwork over time as word get out, or you post it on the bigger A1 sites. Treat yourself to those low cost True Temp lights for pics.

.....

Many thanks for the great photos, a rare treat for a very little discussed era of Ithaca production, 'little' since almost no one has them.
More data on the way.





I've got 9 of those lights, evidently I just can't figure out how to use them or the camera properly when it comes to photographing pistols I think I need to incorporate a non-white backdrop, I use the photo booth for items I sell online for work.

Two in the same case would be ideal, consecutive would be icing on the cake!



Very cool indeed. Lighting is so key. Have spent hours adjusting settings on Nikon D to accentuate or contrast minor parts, etc.

Digital images are a dichotomy; they reveal details no eye or mag lens can see, allow for study, reflection and comparison with other relics. But they also deceive, skew and lie, many intentional and unintentional fibs found on Gun Broker and the webz. One of the hardest Authentication problems are weapons altered over 60 years ago, often without guile intent.

Its perhaps hardest to capture in your era with multiple finishes used by the 4 prime WWII contractors (some changing finishes during the production cycle), all different colors fading at different rates affected by handling and use, hand oils a plague on all weapons over many decades.

One of the hardest shots of all was The Plum Gun. Certain minimally used Colt 1921 Thompsons evidence finish loss due to oiling and care over time, a unique patina not found elsewhere because their unduplicatable original bluing wears unlike any other.  

In the countless relics owned, examined, handled or studied, only one pistol have ever seen was loved, oiled, rubbed and cherished for a century in a way that finish loss resembled the few Thompsons with this patina. It only occurs on Colts, only with those not holstered, carried or fired much by long-term owner(s).

Its harder to capture as these were made with bone, coals, chemicals and ovens no one can exactly duplicate, then hand assembled by men born circa 1865 to 1900 to precise tolerances so inflexible they often don't interchange using other parts from pistols in the same shipment. Have encountered common interchange problems for our UMC, SA and Colts made 100+ years ago.  

1914 Walter G. Penfield serifs Colt with bluing loss of a kind seldom encountered





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