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Posted: 12/7/2019 9:01:48 PM EDT
[#1]
I would save the 10mm for after I had some experience.
My first build was .45 ACP, and while I have done .38 Super and 9mm builds, I would recommend a beginner to stick with the .45 for the first build. Don't get in a hurry, and don't worry about cost. But do have fun. |
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Posted: 12/7/2019 9:05:12 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I would save the 10mm for after I had some experience. My first build was .45 ACP, and while I have done .38 Super and 9mm builds, I would recommend a beginner to stick with the .45 for the first build. Don't get in a hurry, and don't worry about cost. But do have fun.  On the other hand you are probably right and I'll end up sticking with the .45 for my first build. |
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Posted: 12/7/2019 10:49:00 PM EDT
[#3]
I did my only one to date with a rock island kit and I'm happy with the results. It's not super flashy but it works. Also pretty cheap so if you mess something up you're not out big money.
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Posted: 12/7/2019 10:53:27 PM EDT
[#4]
I love a.1911. 10mm 1911s suck
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Posted: 12/7/2019 10:56:09 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I love a.1911. 10mm 1911s suck |
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Posted: 12/7/2019 11:07:46 PM EDT
[#6]
I built one several years ago with PSA frame and Sarco parts.
The second one, I ordered better parts. I liked the second better. |
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Posted: 12/7/2019 11:09:55 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Whys that? If there completely problem ridden it'll push me back towards a .45 kit. I'm going back and forth on both of them. |
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Posted: 12/7/2019 11:41:03 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
I fell for the PSA 1911 frame sale and bought one. Building a 1911 has always been something I've wanted to do. So, I'm looking around at all the different build kits. I see SARCO has a ton, there's also Hooper Gun Works has some as well. I'm interested in doing a 10mm build but considering this will be my first build should I just buy one of the lower priced SARCO kits with the understanding that I get what I pay for; they do not have 10mm but they do have .38 Super and 9mm or should I buy an Armscor kit from Hooper Gun Works? I am also aware that I will need some specialty tools and everything will likely need fitting. I'm not the kind of guy that fusses over MIM parts for a budget build. It's what I expect to get when buying the cheapest parts on the market. I highly recommend these budget kits for a first build for exactly the reasons that were mentioned. If you screw something up-you're not out much. ...and you will screw something up. It's all part of the learning process. |
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Posted: 12/7/2019 11:54:33 PM EDT
[#9]
Here's a Sarco kit (.45 auto) going into a Tactical Machining frame.
Also- Sarco sends a roll spin (AKA split pin) for the hammer strut. Throw that puppy in the garbage and replace it with a solid pin. 
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Posted: 12/8/2019 4:13:53 AM EDT
[#10]
The SARCO kits are made by RIA/Armscor
And yes buy one of those. A newbie trying to fit intentionally oversized parts is a recepie for frustration. Caliber must match the feedramp of your frame. My guess is that yours is a 45. IT IS 45 - SO THERE YOU GO |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 9:05:37 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The SARCO kits are made by RIA/Armscor And yes buy one of those. A newbie trying to fit intentionally oversized parts is a recepie for frustration. Caliber must match the feedramp of your frame. My guess is that yours is a 45. IT IS 45 - SO THERE YOU GO |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 9:31:15 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The SARCO kits are made by RIA/Armscor And yes buy one of those. A newbie trying to fit intentionally oversized parts is a recepie for frustration. Caliber must match the feedramp of your frame. My guess is that yours is a 45. IT IS 45 - SO THERE YOU GO OP, stick with 45 for your first build. My psa frames are in and I hope to pick them up tomorrow. Then the fun begins on two more builds. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 9:37:38 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have never heard that sarco was made by ria/armscore. Furthermore, you can easily do a 9mm, 10mm, or 45 on the same feed ramp. I've done both 45 and 9mm on psa frames. Several well known manufacturers such as Fusion offer top end kits in a variety of calibers. Now, that doesn't mean some tweaking or fitting won't be required. Just saying it can be done. OP, stick with 45 for your first build. My psa frames are in and I hope to pick them up tomorrow. Then the fun begins on two more builds. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The SARCO kits are made by RIA/Armscor And yes buy one of those. A newbie trying to fit intentionally oversized parts is a recepie for frustration. Caliber must match the feedramp of your frame. My guess is that yours is a 45. IT IS 45 - SO THERE YOU GO OP, stick with 45 for your first build. My psa frames are in and I hope to pick them up tomorrow. Then the fun begins on two more builds. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 11:15:39 AM EDT
[#14]
The smaller calibers will work with a frame cut for 45 acp. Building a 10mm on a 45 acp frame is really no harder than just doing a 45 acp. One just needs to do a couple of small things differently. I have set up two 45 acp 1911(Springfield Mil Spec and Rock Island Tactical) to ve able to go to smaller calibers, simply by changing the slide and barrel. With the Springfield I can go to 9mm, 38 Super, 9x23, and 10mm. With the Rock, currently I can only go to 9mm, 38 Super, and 9x23. Though I now have a slide with a 40 cut breech face, so i can fit a 10mm barrel.
Both guns run just fine with all calibers, though low powered 9mms can be a bit iffy. I've actually done this conversion 4 times. 2 full sized 1911s, one Commander sized, and one Detonics size.  Attached File Attached File |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 11:41:40 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The smaller calibers will work with a frame cut for 45 acp. Building a 10mm on a 45 acp frame is really no harder than just doing a 45 acp. One just needs to do a couple of small things differently. I have set up two 45 acp 1911(Springfield Mil Spec and Rock Island Tactical) to ve able to go to smaller calibers, simply by changing the slide and barrel. With the Springfield I can go to 9mm, 38 Super, 9x23, and 10mm. With the Rock, currently I can only go to 9mm, 38 Super, and 9x23. Though I now have a slide with a 40 cut breech face, so i can fit a 10mm barrel. Both guns run just fine with all calibers, though low powered 9mms can be a bit iffy. I've actually done this conversion 4 times. 2 full sized 1911s, one Commander sized, and one Detonics size. https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/99251/SAI1911ScanA_jpeg-1187828.JPG https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/99251/RIATactical_jpg-1187831.JPG |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 1:27:30 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have never heard that sarco was made by ria/armscore. I've had feeding issues in the past using 9mm on a 45 frame so I just match them now. You're correct that 40/10mm is pretty much an easy swap. Obviously need the correct slides with the appropriate breech face. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 1:55:07 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
They have advertised them as such in their emails. I've had feeding issues in the past using 9mm on a 45 frame so I just match them now. You're correct that 40/10mm is pretty much an easy swap. Obviously need the correct slides with the appropriate breech face. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 3:11:01 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ah, I don't their emails. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 4:06:13 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah I sometimes wish I didn't. I route them to spam now. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Ah, I don't their emails. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 4:12:31 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Miserable to shoot, cracked frames and Slides. DW doesn’t even cut out the slide stop hole on their 10mm frames. Maybe they don’t know what they’re doing, or maybe they know something we don’t ? Now I’m not saying you’re wrong; I’m just saying that I haven’t seen any evidence of this and I’m always going through and reading various forums and web pages devoted to the 1911. I’ve set mine up with a flat bottomed firing pin stop, an 18.5# recoil spring, and a 25# mainspring. If it cracks, I’ll let everyone know. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 4:14:06 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So what needs to be done differently? I was looking at a 10mm/.40 Cal. combination kit from Hooper it comes with one slide and two barrels. I've since taken that kit out of my cart and replaced it with a .45 ACP kit. I'm most likely just going to order the .45 kit but I'm just curious because if all goes well and PSA still had the frames in stock when I finish my first build I may end up doing the 10mm build if things went well with the first one. If starting with a complete 45 acp, and wants to make a switch caliber gun, one must install a 38 Super ejector. Then, the ejector slot on the 45 acp Govt slide needs to be slightly widened and made taller, to fit over the new ejector. Once both slides fit over the ejector, you can start fitting barrels to the slide. I used Fusion made ejectors for my builds, as they are slightly longer than the standard Colt style 38 Super ejector. Gives a little better ejection for the 9mm. I can trim it back a bit if necessary. If loaded 45 acp and 38 Super rounds don't cleanly eject. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 4:32:17 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If just building as a straight 10mm, you need to install a 38 Super style ejector. A slide with a 40 cut breechface should fit over it with no problem. Install/fit a flat bottom firing pin stop, instead of the standard round bottom one. Use a 25/26# main spring(hammer spring), and an 18-20# recoil spring, instead of the stock 16# of the 45 acp. If starting with a complete 45 acp, and wants to make a switch caliber gun, one must install a 38 Super ejector. Then, the ejector slot on the 45 acp Govt slide needs to be slightly widened and made taller, to fit over the new ejector. Once both slides fit over the ejector, you can start fitting barrels to the slide. I used Fusion made ejectors for my builds, as they are slightly longer than the standard Colt style 38 Super ejector. Gives a little better ejection for the 9mm. I can trim it back a bit if necessary. If loaded 45 acp and 38 Super rounds don't cleanly eject. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
So what needs to be done differently? I was looking at a 10mm/.40 Cal. combination kit from Hooper it comes with one slide and two barrels. I've since taken that kit out of my cart and replaced it with a .45 ACP kit. I'm most likely just going to order the .45 kit but I'm just curious because if all goes well and PSA still had the frames in stock when I finish my first build I may end up doing the 10mm build if things went well with the first one. If starting with a complete 45 acp, and wants to make a switch caliber gun, one must install a 38 Super ejector. Then, the ejector slot on the 45 acp Govt slide needs to be slightly widened and made taller, to fit over the new ejector. Once both slides fit over the ejector, you can start fitting barrels to the slide. I used Fusion made ejectors for my builds, as they are slightly longer than the standard Colt style 38 Super ejector. Gives a little better ejection for the 9mm. I can trim it back a bit if necessary. If loaded 45 acp and 38 Super rounds don't cleanly eject. |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 5:20:25 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
But if I were to buy a 10mm/.40 kit would it be safe to assume that all of those things have been done? |
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Posted: 12/8/2019 11:57:21 PM EDT
[#24]
I got a 45 kit from Hooper. I haven't begun measuring anything yet but it appears that the barrel and bushing have already been fit.
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Posted: 12/9/2019 3:17:54 AM EDT
[#25]
OP here is a great read about 10mm in the 1911 platform: specifically ramped or unramped barrels.
RangeHot |
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Posted: 12/9/2019 8:02:34 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
OP here is a great read about 10mm in the 1911 platform: specifically ramped or unramped barrels. RangeHot |
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Posted: 12/9/2019 8:38:05 AM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I’ve heard this happened a lot on the 1990’s built Colt Delta Elites, but I haven’t seen any evidence suggesting that this is common with newer 1911 10mm’s built with modern metallurgy and manufacturing processes. DW doesn’t even cut out the slide stop hole on their 10mm frames. Maybe they don’t know what they’re doing, or maybe they know something we don’t ? Now I’m not saying you’re wrong; I’m just saying that I haven’t seen any evidence of this and I’m always going through and reading various forums and web pages devoted to the 1911. I’ve set mine up with a flat bottomed firing pin stop, an 18.5# recoil spring, and a 25# mainspring. If it cracks, I’ll let everyone know. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Miserable to shoot, cracked frames and Slides. DW doesn’t even cut out the slide stop hole on their 10mm frames. Maybe they don’t know what they’re doing, or maybe they know something we don’t ? Now I’m not saying you’re wrong; I’m just saying that I haven’t seen any evidence of this and I’m always going through and reading various forums and web pages devoted to the 1911. I’ve set mine up with a flat bottomed firing pin stop, an 18.5# recoil spring, and a 25# mainspring. If it cracks, I’ll let everyone know. |
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Posted: 12/9/2019 9:49:23 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My experience is with USPSA and IDPA in the early 2000s. Lots of cracked slides and frames mostly Colt Delta Elites. May be our clubs had a higher than normal failure rate. To the OP. My remarks on building were primarily from the standpoint of converting an existing gun, or getting the parts one by one. If you get a kit, all the proper parts should be there. I believe the Hooper kits use Rock Island/Armscor parts, and Armscor uses ramped barrels for their 10mm/40 guns. When I did my build, I used an aftermarket, unramped, semi drop in barrel from Numrich. Primarily because I didn't want to modify my existing frames. Not being ramped has not caused me any problems. I have shot several boxes of the hot Underwood ammo through my gun, without problem, or hint of a "smile". A 10mm does not "need" a ramped barrel. What it needs is a properly cut chamber, and decent brass. Some of the early Delta Elites had sloppy cut chambers, and there are reports of undersized bores, which can raise pressures and cause case blowouts, I am currently doing a little load testing with a Barnes solid copper hollow point, and I am up to 10% over max without pressure signs. I should be able to do 20% without issue. I did my first build on a budget, since I didn't know how well it would go. On my next build, which I am just starting, I am using a slide with a Novak cut, so I can mount an adjustable sight. Helps me deal with POI changes due to my multiple barrels. Everything else will remain the same. |
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Posted: 12/9/2019 3:58:32 PM EDT
[#29]
@TheTallest
If you haven't ordered yet, their parts kits are cheaper when purchased through their ebay site vs. their actual website for some reason |
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Posted: 12/9/2019 4:10:36 PM EDT
[#30]
Thanks to all - my FIL has a mill, so even though Sarco is out of 80% standard 5" frames, was able to order him an 80% Hooper frame, a Sarco 1911 parts kit w/ bbl, and a Sarco CAST slide blank.
So, the man is going to have some fun putting all that stuff together. Oh, and Sarco has shoulder stocks back in stock, so if you've paid the King's stamp tax, or bought one of Sarco's 16" bbls in the past, now is the time. |
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Posted: 12/9/2019 4:28:01 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@TheTallest If you haven't ordered yet, their parts kits are cheaper when purchased through their ebay site vs. their actual website for some reason |
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Posted: 12/13/2019 11:00:38 PM EDT
[#32]
Ordered a government .45 ACP from Hooper this evening.
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Posted: 12/14/2019 4:09:29 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ordered a government .45 ACP from Hooper this evening. |
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Posted: 12/14/2019 4:19:40 AM EDT
[#34]
How difficult is a 1911 build?
I wouldn’t mind having a 1911a1 clone. |
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Posted: 12/14/2019 11:07:38 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How difficult is a 1911 build? I wouldn’t mind having a 1911a1 clone. Hope for the best, prepare for the worst. 
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Posted: 12/14/2019 11:27:11 AM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How difficult is a 1911 build? I wouldn’t mind having a 1911a1 clone.
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Posted: 12/14/2019 11:34:10 AM EDT
[#37]
Can anyone recommend some tools I may need to install these parts?
I'm already planning on picking up this staking tool. For those wondering this is th kit I ordered: RIA 1911 Full Size Tactical Builder's Kit .45 ACP non-ramped. With government profile slide and Novak sights. only I ordered it from their ebay store not realizing there was a coupon code.  I also plan on replacing the pins that come in the kit with a Wilson Combat kit.
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Posted: 12/14/2019 11:46:18 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thanks to all - my FIL has a mill, so even though Sarco is out of 80% standard 5" frames, was able to order him an 80% Hooper frame, a Sarco 1911 parts kit w/ bbl, and a Sarco CAST slide blank.
So, the man is going to have some fun putting all that stuff together. Oh, and Sarco has shoulder stocks back in stock, so if you've paid the King's stamp tax, or bought one of Sarco's 16" bbls in the past, now is the time. |
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Posted: 12/14/2019 6:30:37 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Can anyone recommend some tools I may need to install these parts? I'm already planning on picking up this staking tool. For those wondering this is th kit I ordered: RIA 1911 Full Size Tactical Builder's Kit .45 ACP non-ramped. With government profile slide and Novak sights. only I ordered it from their ebay store not realizing there was a coupon code. I also plan on replacing the pins that come in the kit with a Wilson Combat kit. |
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Posted: 12/14/2019 7:06:06 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
1911 armorers block, pin punch set, barrel bushing wrench to start Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Can anyone recommend some tools I may need to install these parts? I'm already planning on picking up this staking tool. For those wondering this is th kit I ordered: RIA 1911 Full Size Tactical Builder's Kit .45 ACP non-ramped. With government profile slide and Novak sights. only I ordered it from their ebay store not realizing there was a coupon code. I also plan on replacing the pins that come in the kit with a Wilson Combat kit. |
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Posted: 12/14/2019 10:55:10 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Miserable to shoot, cracked frames and Slides. |
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Posted: 12/14/2019 11:52:09 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've already got all of those. So I'm looking for additional tools I may need to help with putting it together. Hammer sear jig and stones I'd you want to tweak the trigger. Those are two things worth getting. The needle file set is an amazing deal and I have yet to wear mine out after 10 years of working on guns fairly regularly. You will want to pick up a slide slot file as well so you can fit your slide to the frame. I got mine from matrix precision but I'm sure they have some elsewhere. It's a file with two sides ground safe. This is one from Brownells....all praise be to our supreme ARFCOM Overlords |
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Posted: 12/15/2019 11:21:18 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Harbor freight diamond needle file set (hfqpdb.com for coupon or 20% off coupon) Hammer sear jig and stones I'd you want to tweak the trigger. Those are two things worth getting. The needle file set is an amazing deal and I have yet to wear mine out after 10 years of working on guns fairly regularly. You will want to pick up a slide slot file as well so you can fit your slide to the frame. I got mine from matrix precision but I'm sure they have some elsewhere. It's a file with two sides ground safe. This is one from Brownells....all praise be to our supreme ARFCOM Overlords Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I've already got all of those. So I'm looking for additional tools I may need to help with putting it together. Hammer sear jig and stones I'd you want to tweak the trigger. Those are two things worth getting. The needle file set is an amazing deal and I have yet to wear mine out after 10 years of working on guns fairly regularly. You will want to pick up a slide slot file as well so you can fit your slide to the frame. I got mine from matrix precision but I'm sure they have some elsewhere. It's a file with two sides ground safe. This is one from Brownells....all praise be to our supreme ARFCOM Overlords As for the jig, I'm probably not going to build a ton of these maybe another one after this one. I can't really justify $160 on a jig I may only use once. I took the needle files out of my cart because I already have the set they're selling so it looks like the only thing I'll be getting is the plunger tube jig and some stones. |
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Posted: 12/15/2019 2:54:03 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
$51 for a file? A file? As for the jig, I'm probably not going to build a ton of these maybe another one after this one. I can't really justify $160 on a jig I may only use once. I took the needle files out of my cart because I already have the set they're selling so it looks like the only thing I'll be getting is the plunger tube jig and some stones.
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Posted: 12/15/2019 3:29:16 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So how do you expect to fit the slide to the frame then? If you have a mill or bench grinder you can grind a mill file to have safe sides yourself. Having done that previously I'd rather pay for the pre made file Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
$51 for a file? A file? As for the jig, I'm probably not going to build a ton of these maybe another one after this one. I can't really justify $160 on a jig I may only use once. I took the needle files out of my cart because I already have the set they're selling so it looks like the only thing I'll be getting is the plunger tube jig and some stones. |
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Posted: 12/15/2019 4:21:05 PM EDT
[#46]
If your doing a 80% 1911/2011 build you will a lot of specialized tools and jigs to do the job correctly...even if your
building from a 100% stripped 1911 frame like a PSA you will still need some specialized 1911 tools like a 1911 rail file, various stones, emery cloth/paper of different grits, funsmith punch set, etc. You may even need a barrel feet cutter and they don't come cheap...Specialized 1911 tools and jigs are not cheap by any means and prices stack up pretty fast. For those that want to build a 1911/2011 pistol from the ground up (100% finished stripped frame) which can be very rewarding for sure, I would recommend purchasing a fitted frame and slide kit...this way there is a minimum amount of need to buy specialized tools and jigs, etc. Usually the slide to frame fitting cost you the most time and effort, follow by the barrel to slide fitting, and then the sight installation and fitting (provided you have purchased funsmith fit parts for your build). Ignition parts are best purchased as a kit from a well known manufacturer...If your building a bare-bones 1911 as you may have decided that of course would not apply to you. Good luck. |
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Posted: 12/15/2019 5:06:56 PM EDT
[#47]
So I've spent all day looking online for safe edge files and I'm coming up with nothing. Fucking Brownells wins dammit. My wife is going to have a fit. 'You spent how much on a file!?!?!?'
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Posted: 12/15/2019 7:02:20 PM EDT
[#48]
Matrix precision gas a rail stoning fixture and stones for $6 ea. The fixture IIRC is $31. Only marginally cheaper.
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Posted: 12/15/2019 8:17:10 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Matrix precision gas a rail stoning fixture and stones for $6 ea. The fixture IIRC is $31. Only marginally cheaper. |
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Posted: 12/16/2019 9:50:25 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Ordered a government .45 ACP from Hooper this evening. To update my earlier post, the barrel actually is not fitted to the slide yet. I need to take some off the hood. It just felt like it was locking up when I initially looked at it quickly, but now that I measured stuff and looked closer I can tell it is not. The bushing does fit the barrel and slide without needing any material removed though, just needs some cleaning up. I got my slide fitted up this weekend, I think I've spent about 12 hours so far decking the frame, drilling holes, cutting rails, and lapping the slide. |
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