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Posted: 3/12/2006 11:41:09 AM EDT
[#1]
I carry an extra mag for my ccw Glock 27 with me all the time. My 'between the seats' gun is a Ruger 22/45 I keep 3 extra loaded mags for it and 2 boxes of loose ammo.......... I live in rural OK, dispatch a lot of stray dogs, skunks, other critters with the duceduce
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Posted: 3/12/2006 12:07:33 PM EDT
[#2]
Yes.
One with a high cap, two for a single stack. Plus a BUG on occasion. |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 12:10:03 PM EDT
[#3]
I can agree with that, however, depending on dress I find carrying an extra mag cumbersome. I mentioned that I carry a full size pistol however I regularly carry a sub-compact when size and concealabillity is an issue. When in shorts and t-shirt I then switch to a j-frame. I just don't see many situations where an extra mag is necessary and I challenge anyone to post a story where a reload was required in a non-LEO self defense situation.
You examples were outlandish.
Any more stupid scenarios? |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 12:29:19 PM EDT
[#4]
+1 |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 1:18:49 PM EDT
[#5]
It's a personal decision I made a long time ago. I'm not proud of it and I'm not ashamed of it.
There's always a serious problem with analogies (aside from being insulting), they're never exactly precise ... that's why they're analogies. That said, I always carry a spare tire for exactly the same reason I carry a pistol. I don't always carry a spare mag for exactly the same reason I don't carry a second spare tire. 
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Posted: 3/12/2006 2:24:32 PM EDT
[#6]
I keep one in my car, if I get a bad feeling then I put it on my hip. I don't usually put myself in the kind of situation that I would need more than one mag. I CC fullsize guns though, if I had a compact then I might feel like I need more ammo
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Posted: 3/12/2006 2:37:26 PM EDT
[#7]
If we could predict when and where these kind of things would happen, we wouldn't need to carry -- we just wouldn't go out that day. I don't think anyone willingly walks into these "kinds of situations". The problem is that crime happens at any place at any time, it doesn't limit itself to certains times or certain neighborhoods. |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 2:57:14 PM EDT
[#8]
Because a good risk analysis indicates that the potential gain is not worth the actual cost. That is why I have said many times that there is no single answer to so many of these questions, it is situational. Some situations a spare mag is not indicated, in other situations 3 or 4 spare mags might be appropriate. |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 3:19:28 PM EDT
[#9]
I always keep spares in the car too. But if the "gang scenario" thing were to happen, and somehow I made it back to the car in time to retrieve an extra mag, I wouldn't grab an extra mag. I'd grab the "real gun"! 
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Posted: 3/12/2006 3:30:23 PM EDT
[#10]
I always have a spare Glock 17 (17 round) mag with me. Sometimes I have a spare Glock 18 (31 round) mag.
______________________________  |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 3:33:53 PM EDT
[#11]
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Posted: 3/12/2006 3:43:42 PM EDT
[#12]
G19 w/ spare G17 mag. ~nb |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 3:50:49 PM EDT
[#13]
Well put. I carry a PM9 in kydex IWB FIST holster and it is VERY light w/7 rounds inside. An additional magazine would be difficult to comfortably carry considering I fly light. Some may question the wisdom, and its their right to do so. My master plan is to E&E...NOT engage in a running gun battle...I know, I know you never know. Well if that moment happens and I need another mag, I'll think of you all as the feces hits the fan..... Cheers! |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 4:47:55 PM EDT
[#14]
That is the most insane thing I've ever heard. You actually think a risk analysis is the way to determine when to carry a spare magazine? If you are telling the truth, you have just admitted that you can plan for the unexpected. If you are planning for it, its not unexpected and that means you're looking for trouble and have stocked up on ammo to support your efforts. Risk analysis? Seriously dude, I don't believe you and am calling BS. You don't do a risk analysis. You're just making excuses for not taking your own security seriously and you've chosen to make a big deal of this on a public bulletin board. |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 4:48:27 PM EDT
[#15]
I manage to carry a spare mag for my PM9 and it serves as a back up gun. I also carry a GLOCK 19 with spare 19 round mag as a primary weapon. |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 4:58:35 PM EDT
[#16]
Cliffy,
dont worry about Darm. In his 'risk assessment', he doesn't carry chambered either 
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Posted: 3/12/2006 5:08:17 PM EDT
[#17]
You've got to be kidding me. Why do some people even bother to carry a gun? |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 5:14:29 PM EDT
[#18]
i dont have the thread saed but accoring to his training and experience, he is right on carrying a block of metal on his hip.
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Posted: 3/12/2006 5:28:43 PM EDT
[#19]
LOL!!! That explains a lot. |
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Posted: 3/12/2006 6:41:23 PM EDT
[#20]
When I carry, I don't carry a spare mag, I carry TWO of them!
 My carry guns are a M23 Glock, Kimber TacPro II .45ACP or a SA XD40 Service. Since I am "portly", I don't have an "inside" the waist and elect to use various paddle holsters. I wear a jacket or vest during any cool days and Hawaiian shirts on those warmer days. Have never been "made" as carrying. The two mags and my Leatherman balance out my fat ass and conceal just as easily!  
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Posted: 3/13/2006 6:50:44 AM EDT
[#21]
Usually yes, but not always. Depends on what I am wearing mostly. Some clothing doesnt work well with spare mags
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Posted: 3/13/2006 7:06:03 AM EDT
[#22]
I always have an extra mag on my hip.
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Posted: 3/13/2006 9:57:13 AM EDT
[#23]
And thinking that conducting a good risk analysis is insane is the most insane thing I have ever heard!
No, and with that statement it is fairly clear that you do not understand how risk assessment is used.
Amazing that you think you are some sort of mind reader and can determine what I do and why I do it over cyber-space. No wonder you don't understand risk analysis and toss around insane comments. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 9:58:32 AM EDT
[#24]
And once again we see a good example of someone posting a lie instead of trying to discuss the facts. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 10:20:53 AM EDT
[#25]
OK smart guy. You made the claim that some situations do not require carrying a spare magazine and some require the use of 3 or 4. You claim that this is something that is done by risk assessment. Am I right so far? That would mean that there are times when you are aware of a risk that would require an individual to battle it out through several magazines yet chose not to find a different place to be. It also means that you can look ahead at your day and blissfully conclude that there is no possibility that you'll be involved in an armed confrontation that would require more than 5 or 6 rounds. If you are that confident, why do you even carry a gun? Surely you can't look at your coming day and think there's a possibility of needing your gun but not needing to top off. Here's real risk assessment: If I go here, is there a probablility that I'll need my gun? If yes, I choose to be somewhere else. If no, I pack my gun and at least one spare mag. I'm prepared for what I don't expect, not what I do expect. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 10:58:02 AM EDT
[#26]
Carrying a pistol is a very personal thing and I would not criticize another man's choice. If you want to carry an extra magazine, that is your choice (I usually do). You might need one in your situation and he might not.
(See sig. line) |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 11:33:48 AM EDT
[#27]
No.
No.
No. Here is what I said: "That is why I have said many times that there is no single answer to so many of these questions, it is situational. Some situations a spare mag is not indicated, in other situations 3 or 4 spare mags might be appropriate." When you learn the difference between what I said and what you claim was said we might be able to have an intelligent discussion.
Again, no, on both accounts. What I said would not mean that and what you claim I siad would also not mean that.
Once again your failure to understand the concept of risk assessment is glaringly obvious. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 12:01:53 PM EDT
[#28]
Thx for making me think about incontinent crackheads right before lunch.... my bean burrito sounded REAL tasty until I read that.. 
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Posted: 3/13/2006 12:18:45 PM EDT
[#29]
I'm really debating whether or not to even reply to this. I have never seen such sillyness masked as intelligent conversation.
Me: You made the claim that some situations do not require carrying a spare magazine and some require the use of 3 or 4. You: No You again: Some situations a spare mag is not indicated, in other situations 3 or 4 spare mags might be appropriate. Me: WTF?  Risk assessment. Hmmmm... what part of the English language could I be missing here? Let's see... I assess my risk on a given day and determine that there is a remote chance I could be somewhere that 3 to 4 magazines could be needed. My decision based on that assessment is to not go where that could happen. This seems reasonable but apparently, I "fail to understand the concept of risk assessment." Listen dude, its real simple. I don't give a rats ass if you carry a gun with an empty chamber or don't think a spare magazine meets your tactical needs. I don't even care if you pull daisies out of your ass when confronted by a gun wielding mugger. That's your business, but your claims of "risk analysis" belies a complete lack of understanding about legitimate CCW. A person should NOT carry a handgun because they think they might need it on a given day. A person should carry a handgun for the unexpected and the definition of unexpected means you can't predict it. A lack of ability to predict an event makes "analysis" useless. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 12:21:42 PM EDT
[#30]
Agreed. Darm's eulogy is going to read, " Risk assessment.......*click*"
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Posted: 3/13/2006 12:30:24 PM EDT
[#31]
Yes. The fact that you still have to "WTF?" shows that you do not understand the difference in what I said and what you claimed I said. When you learn that difference perhaps we can discuss the issue intelligently.
Correct, you apparently do not understand risk assessment as a concept and/or how it is used. You might want to learn about something before commenting on it.
Since you do not have the faintest understanding of risk analysis any claims you might make regarding it and how it should be used are somewhat questionable at best. When you understand that then you might have some legitimacy to make claims about what I understand and do not.
Again your lack of understanding is glaringly obvious. Perhaps you should go and learn a little bit aout risk analysis and assessment and how it works in conducting a cost/benefit analysis. Then you might be able to talk about it with some intelligence. Until then what is "useless" is your uninformed comment on a concept. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 12:33:53 PM EDT
[#32]
So far good risk assessment and analysis has prevented that eulogy from being needed. I see no reason why it should start to fail now after all those years of success. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 12:49:58 PM EDT
[#33]
Give it up Guys, darms so far out in left field he hasn't seen a fly ball in a few decades.
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Posted: 3/13/2006 12:54:17 PM EDT
[#34]
This is too funny. You don't have any grasp of tactics or how to use your gear properly and you don't seem to get the entire concept of the role of the armed citizen. You attempt to change the subject to your academic views on risk assessment and analysis without ever addressing the glaring holes in your position. Instead, you lash out by putting on a facade of intellectual superiority.
Its OK to admit that you don't take your security seriously. Its OK to admit that you feel safe (I would call this misguided but honest). Its OK to admit that you haven't figured out a way to carry a spare magazine in your daily routine. To hide those ideas by parsing posts and answering them with a single word with no explanation is just childish. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 1:26:43 PM EDT
[#35]
I carry an extra speed loader or maybe a speed strip.
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Posted: 3/13/2006 1:53:49 PM EDT
[#36]
and just to clear something up, whether or not I have a spare mag, I always have my sidearm |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 2:12:56 PM EDT
[#37]
The last time that someone posted this question, darm 441 impressed everyone with his pontificating about risk assessment. During that topic I posted that statistics go out the window when they happen to you. READ THAT TO MEAN; THEY DON'T MATTER ANYMORE. However feel free to discuss them later if you still can. I'm sure he will jump in and quote my original post any minute. However you can assess/study/discuss/make a chart or graph all you want. When the shit hits the fan for you, all that matters is whether you were prepared at that time. Not if someone else was, not if you should have been somewhere else, not if the statistics worked out and certainly not if someone else's figures or assessment were right or wrong. You will win or lose, you will live or die and it won't matter at all what someone else said or did. The only thing that will matter is whether you had the equipment mindset and skills to prevail. Oh and to answer the original question, carry at least one spare mag
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Posted: 3/13/2006 2:27:04 PM EDT
[#38]
you sound like a JROTC cadet who learned a new phrase, 'risk assessment' i hate to revert to name calling, but that is how your comming. And dont confuse success with avoidance. I can be 'successful' too, with my minute by minute risk assessment and simply not go outside. Real word. come join us, but to join us you need to atleast have a round chambered in your weapon. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 2:50:52 PM EDT
[#39]
This is Mrs. xm17sbullpup.
Here is risk assessment at it's finest. The FBI and the CIA got reports that terrorists could use airplanes as weapons against major targets in the US. With all thier resources and formulas they deemed the risk assessment to be too low as to be a concern. That risk assessment just proved that all the math and statistics in the world can be shot to hell in an instant. That risk assessment failed many people. The widows, widowers, parents and orphans find little comfort in those statistics. Short of a crystal ball with 100% accuracy the best defense is a powerful offense. Victims don't give a damn about statistics. Oh and I carry 2 spare mags. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 2:59:55 PM EDT
[#40]
He's gonna keep on with risk assessment, but I'm gonna just keep carrying reloads. Maybe we're ALL safer that way. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 3:00:48 PM EDT
[#41]
Bingo. I'll do my own risk assessment. If there is anything above 0.00%, the risk, maybe its very small, is still there. I think the Boy Scouts have this motto, or well, they used to have it. It went something to the effect of "Always be prepared." Any calculated risk is still that, a risk. It's there, act how you want. I'll carry my spare mag. One question for darm. What risk do you have carrying an extra mag? The extra risk of being spotted? I carry my extra mag in a Gerber nylon pouch. Even if someone saw it, they wouldn't even suspect a thing. |
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Posted: 3/13/2006 3:04:41 PM EDT
[#42]
Nope, only the 5 in the cylinder. I carry a S&W 2" titanium .38 and a speedloader or Bianchi clip strip would weigh my pants down so much they might fall off (no ass to speak of!).
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Posted: 3/15/2006 9:52:08 AM EDT
[#43]
That is quite a claim from someone who has no idea what my background is. Let's see now, how about a brief list of just part of my credentials--I'm a multiple grad of Thunder Ranch, Farnam's DTI, Shoot-n-Iron, Gunsite, and others. I'm an NRA instructor, a Glock instructor, and have been both an LE and military firearms trainer. I've been hired by encyclopedias to write articles about firearms history and training, and have been selected to teach firearms at national instructor seminars. I am one of the first certified CHL instructors in my state. I've also been in a few shootings, and I'm still here. Perhaps you would share with us some of your qualifications and we'll see if they are anywhere close.
Perhaps that is because risk assessment is an integral part of the problem, not changing the subject as you seem to think. As for holes in my position, I'm still waiting to see any that go beyond the "I think you are wrong" variety.
What is not OK is for you to make claims like that without any proof. What is not OK is for you to make up things and then try to attribute them to me. Doing so is dishonest and when yo get right down to it is lying.
Don't ask a yes or no question if you don't want a yes or no answer. To do so and then cry about it is childish. |
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Posted: 3/15/2006 9:56:03 AM EDT
[#44]
But what is important is that you cannot have the equipment and skills to prevail in every possible incident, so you have to determine what equipment and skill syou will have. That is risk assessment whether you like to admit it or not, and we all do it. The question is if one should make a risk asssessment based on reality or base on watching the TV or movies. One is real, the other is not. I know whaich I pick, and suggest for others!
Which is an excellent example of not knowing how statistics are used. |
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Posted: 3/15/2006 10:02:01 AM EDT
[#45]
At least I sound like I have learned something, which is more than I can say for some of the responses here. Rarely have I seeen so many actually glory in their inability to understand facts and simple research. Real word. come join us, but to join us you need to atleast have a round chambered in your weapon.{/quote] Real world--find out something about the facts of DGU incidents and you won't make silly claims that have no basis in reality. |
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Posted: 3/15/2006 11:09:16 AM EDT
[#46]
i just read this whole thing while eating my black walnut ice cream....yall owe me 40mins of my life back
 like i said: 2 spares--why: b/c when we got robbed a couple of yrs back, there was more than 1 bad guy (3+1 in the car, strong arm, through the front door, 1 w/ visible long arm) cant prepare for it all and i learned that you cant ever have too much ammo, and if SHTF, it'll hit HARD |
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Posted: 3/15/2006 1:04:12 PM EDT
[#47]
Actually it is an example of poor risk assessment. Information was available but it was not shared among agencies and certain laws prohibited some agents from giving information to others. Because of that there was no way to conduct a good, valid risk assessment.
So how would you go about conducting risk analysis--use a crystal ball? Read the entrails of a dead chicken? Watch the latest zombie movie?? Folks, you all do risk assessment and analysis. You can either do it based on facts and reality or you can do it based on make-believe.
So what? That does not mean that statistics are bad or should not be used. The fact that some people here keep wanting to misuse statistics and research, or that they don't know how to understand statistics, research, risk assessmant, etc. does not mean those tools should be ignored. |
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Posted: 3/15/2006 1:08:04 PM EDT
[#48]
Close. It is "Be Prepared." And that is a good example. "Be prepared" involves risk assessment and analysis, coupled with cost/benefit analysis. You cannot be prepared for everything, so you instead prepare for what is likely. The more likely, the better the preparation one should have.
Usually very little. YOu might note that nowhere in this thread have I said a person should never carry a spare mag. Quite to the contrary I have suggested everyone should look at their own situation and decide what they want to do. Having a spare mag usually doesn't cost (risk) very much. Of course, not having one also doesn't usually cost (risk) very much. |
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Posted: 3/15/2006 1:11:33 PM EDT
[#49]
1 or 2 extra. Not carrying a spare ammo source for a primary weapon, that could be used to save your life, is idiotic.
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Posted: 3/15/2006 1:38:34 PM EDT
[#50]
agreed. I dont care what people's credentials are, especially those who claim this and that on the internet. It is weighed in at absolutely ZERO in my book when it comes to a common sense situation where risk assessment/education/insert argument distractor here, dont play a role. I feel bad for anyone you instruct, flat out. You will eventually cause someone to get killed. And I guess the glaring question here is, what 'risk assessment' calls for rendering a personal defense tool obsolete (by carring it unchambered)? What 'risk' assessment calls for not taking the extra 2 minutes to put a magazine on your hip, or in your pocket? |
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