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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Rock Island 1911 opinions (Page 2 of 3)

Posted: 1/1/2008 7:54:21 PM EDT

[#1]

Quoted:
im just gonna see what happens at the fun show on the 20th.

also, whoever has one, post it up :) i would love to see a non GI type RIA

www.armscor.net/Pistols.htm

Posted: 1/1/2008 8:17:36 PM EDT

[#2]

I paid 160.00 for my RIA to a GI who was PCSing. 1 box through it. It will eat anything and put them into respectable groups for what it is. The slide is a little loose, the finish is showing wear, and I had to de-horn the hell out of it because the safety was digging in to my hand horribly. For what it is and the price I paid, I'm happy. I also ordered one for my father in law at 335 shipped plus 20 FFL fee. I'd always wanted a 1911, this was my way to test the waters before buying a Colt or Springfield. Now I really see no need to fork out the extra cash just for a name. My RIA will serve me and my purposes well,

Posted: 1/1/2008 8:28:25 PM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Guns made from castings, generally are not outstanding. They are average at best.

This statement is based on what? Caspian has been making very high quality frames out of castings for years and many of the best 1911 'smiths in the world build on these frames.

Caspian does not build outstanding receivers. Just because some gunsmiths utilized their assemblies with success does not make them outstanding.

Remember the first batch of Sig Sauer GSR's? Those pieces of shit were Caspian assemblies. Sig had to start from scratch and make their own frames and slides to make the GSR reliable.

Outstanding 1911's are those which are built out of forgings with near zero clearances but still function reliably. Springfield Custom Shop, SVI, etc. are outstanding 1911's. The rest are average. RIA is the HiPoint or Keltec of the 1911 family. Yes, it looks like a 1911, fires the 45 ACP, and works well enough for novices, but it isn't outstanding by any measure except the price. It is just another entry level gun, like a Rossi revolver or a NEF Handirifle.

Posted: 1/2/2008 2:52:52 AM EDT

[#4]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Guns made from castings, generally are not outstanding. They are average at best.

This statement is based on what? Caspian has been making very high quality frames out of castings for years and many of the best 1911 'smiths in the world build on these frames.

Caspian does not build outstanding receivers. Just because some gunsmiths utilized their assemblies with success does not make them outstanding.

Remember the first batch of Sig Sauer GSR's? Those pieces of shit were Caspian assemblies. Sig had to start from scratch and make their own frames and slides to make the GSR reliable.

Outstanding 1911's are those which are built out of forgings with near zero clearances but still function reliably. Springfield Custom Shop, SVI, etc. are outstanding 1911's. The rest are average. RIA is the HiPoint or Keltec of the 1911 family. Yes, it looks like a 1911, fires the 45 ACP, and works well enough for novices, but it isn't outstanding by any measure except the price. It is just another entry level gun, like a Rossi revolver or a NEF Handirifle.

Forgive me. I didn't realize I'm an idiot.

Posted: 1/2/2008 3:34:17 AM EDT

[#5]

Shoots anything I throw at it and is quite accurate. It's my daily carry gun. Added grips, trigger, ambi safety. At some point I'm going to put a beaver tail on it, when I get my bead blaster back running.

Posted: 1/2/2008 4:30:27 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:

Quoted:

While I'll agree they appear to be fine for what they are, they are a far cry from being Military Spec.

It may not be U.S Mil Spec, but it is Mil Spec.

........... really? Can you please post the Military Specifications that it's built to and for which Country.

Quoted:

www.armscor.net/Pistols.htm

The link you posted shows the RIA to be Mil Spec.

Posted: 1/2/2008 4:39:04 AM EDT

[#7]

If we're going to make this a photo thread, I'll toss these back up.

Posted: 1/2/2008 5:04:00 AM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Guns made from castings, generally are not outstanding. They are average at best.

This statement is based on what? Caspian has been making very high quality frames out of castings for years and many of the best 1911 'smiths in the world build on these frames.

Caspian does not build outstanding receivers. Just because some gunsmiths utilized their assemblies with success does not make them outstanding.
Remember the first batch of Sig Sauer GSR's? Those pieces of shit were Caspian assemblies. Sig had to start from scratch and make their own frames and slides to make the GSR reliable.

Do you base these statements on your personal experience ?

Posted: 1/2/2008 5:22:36 AM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
If we're going to make this a photo thread, I'll toss these back up.

img.photobucket.com/albums/v221/tokarev/Rock%20Island%20Tactical/S1030192.jpg
img.photobucket.com/albums/v221/tokarev/Rock%20Island%20Tactical/S1030190.jpg

miller custom i believe right?

Posted: 1/2/2008 5:52:57 AM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:
now that, was the best arguement for the RIA ive ever heard. so, seeing as you mentioned it, how accurate are they? i really dont know now....damn you and all yall's good points

. i do want reliability, i do want the ability to add accessories, like better barrels, grips, guide rods, and the such, and i dont want to spend $1200 on a Kimber (right now).... idk, i found a Kimber Custom II for around $650, is that an average price? i might get the RIA, but if i can get a good enough deal on a Springer or Kimber, i might do that. but, the reliability is an issue for me, and the RIA seems to win in that department....

I am a supporter of the Rock Island for a GI style 1911 that is reliable with ball ammo and accurate enough for defensive use. That said if I was buying a 1911 I was planning on upgrading the Rock Island would NOT be it. If the Rock Island Tactical has all the updates you want then it is probably fine although I would test it extensively with ammo other then ball. If you want to do your own updates slowly then I would really hold out for that deal on a new or used Kimber or Springer. Just my 2 cents.
YMMV

Posted: 1/2/2008 7:33:43 AM EDT

[#11]

Quoted:

Do you base these statements on your personal experience ?

Yes, I had the opportunity to examine a Caspian based 1911, and everyone knows about all the problems with the first batch of Sig GSR's.

Posted: 1/2/2008 7:51:29 AM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Guns made from castings, generally are not outstanding. They are average at best.

This statement is based on what? Caspian has been making very high quality frames out of castings for years and many of the best 1911 'smiths in the world build on these frames.

Caspian does not build outstanding receivers. Just because some gunsmiths utilized their assemblies with success does not make them outstanding.
Remember the first batch of Sig Sauer GSR's? Those pieces of shit were Caspian assemblies. Sig had to start from scratch and make their own frames and slides to make the GSR reliable.

Do you base these statements on your personal experience ?

Do you own a Ford Focus? Why not? Personal experience, or did you form an opinion by reading up on it? Do you have to buy a Toyota T-100 with a 4 cylinder engine to opine that 4 cylinder engines do not belong in full-size pickups?

Do you know what "outstanding" means?

Posted: 1/2/2008 8:26:32 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Guns made from castings, generally are not outstanding. They are average at best.

This statement is based on what? Caspian has been making very high quality frames out of castings for years and many of the best 1911 'smiths in the world build on these frames.

Caspian does not build outstanding receivers. Just because some gunsmiths utilized their assemblies with success does not make them outstanding.
Remember the first batch of Sig Sauer GSR's? Those pieces of shit were Caspian assemblies. Sig had to start from scratch and make their own frames and slides to make the GSR reliable.

Do you base these statements on your personal experience ?

Do you own a Ford Focus? Why not? Personal experience, or did you form an opinion by reading up on it? Do you have to buy a Toyota T-100 with a 4 cylinder engine to opine that 4 cylinder engines do not belong in full-size pickups?

Do you know what "outstanding" means?

I think you have answered any questions I have about your knowledge of Caspian and 1911s.

Posted: 1/2/2008 8:39:40 AM EDT

[#14]

I think your question made no sense. For the record, I examined a Caspian based gun in the past and wasn't impressed. I prefer guns machined from forgings.

Posted: 1/2/2008 8:43:43 AM EDT

[#15]

I had one for a year. I just sold it last week. It was a great starter 1911 for me. I was able to experiment with this pistol without fear of breaking or ruining a more valuable one. In the end, I upgraded the stock model to have hogue grips, a wilson combat beaver tail grip safety, new wilson combat spur hammer, and a match trigger. I don't have any complaints execpt for the standard sights. It's a great piece for the price you pay.

Posted: 1/2/2008 9:35:26 AM EDT

[#16]

The only reason I don't own one for a "beater" 1911 is because I already have 2 Auto-Ordnance 1911s that fill that role. I have no need for a third.

I talked to Bigbore at his retail shop about these once and he said pretty much everyone who worked there and they had no problems with them. He added that they were a good pistol, for what you pay for them and if you remember what they actually are. If I recall correctly, he said they had sold 30 or so, with no complaints from the buyers.

In other words, if you're not doing any high-speed work, they're probably fine.

Posted: 1/2/2008 12:40:56 PM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:

........... really? Can you please post the Military Specifications that it's built to and for which Country.

Quoted:

www.armscor.net/Pistols.htm

The link you posted shows the RIA to be Mil Spec.

Rock Island FS Parkerized
1911-A1
Caliber: 45 ACP
Action: Semi-Auto Overall Length: 7 3/4"
Capacity: 8 Rounds Weight: 2.4 lbs
Finish: Parkerized Sights: GI
(Mil-spec)

- It also shows it to be a left handed firearm with a lowered and flared ejection port. I'll REPEAT MYSELF, Can you please post the Military Specifications that it's built to and for which Country.

Posted: 1/2/2008 1:05:38 PM EDT

[#18]

Posted: 1/2/2008 1:26:30 PM EDT

[#19]

This thread will only get worse. FWIW, don't blame Caspian if you don't like the gun. Blame the guy who assembled it.

Posted: 1/2/2008 1:54:25 PM EDT

[#20]

I just bought one.... pretty happy with it. It will work great for what I need it for.

1st - my first 1911. I wanted one I could screw with, learn the 1911 without fear of screwing up a more pricey weapon.

2nd - It goes into my GHB, which stays in my vehicle. I can abuse it, again, without fear of screwing up a more pricey weapon.

So... works for me... eventually, I will get another, nicer... and if history repeats itself... then another, nicer... yada yada

I love my wife... she lets me buy guns!!

Posted: 1/2/2008 2:00:56 PM EDT

[#21]

yeah, the
Tactical has most of what i want. i would change the grips, maybe the sights, guide rod. but, other than that, im not too worried. so, if i can get one cheap enough next gun show, i might for the hell of it. then, later, i will get a Kimber. im saying i will get it if i can get a good enough deal. what im really gonna look for is a used Kimber Custom II

Posted: 1/2/2008 2:10:31 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
yeah, the
Tactical has most of what i want. i would change the grips, maybe the sights, guide rod. but, other than that, im not too worried. so, if i can get one cheap enough next gun show, i might for the hell of it. then, later, i will get a Kimber. im saying i will get it if i can get a good enough deal. what im really gonna look for is a used Kimber Custom II

Here's a review on the RIA Tactical for ya

ezine.m1911.org/RIATactical.htm

Posted: 1/2/2008 3:02:14 PM EDT

[#23]

Quoted:
I think your question made no sense. For the record, I examined a Caspian based gun in the past and wasn't impressed. I prefer guns machined from forgings.

Yes. Cast frames are junk, especially those made by Caspian. Has anybody told Larry Vickers that he's a hack and a general all-around clown for building $3,000 guns on Caspian frames?

Posted: 1/2/2008 3:24:51 PM EDT

[#24]

There's a Heinie built gun listed on PT's website that I know for a fact is built on a cast frame.

Posted: 1/2/2008 3:53:54 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Guns made from castings, generally are not outstanding. They are average at best.

This statement is based on what? Caspian has been making very high quality frames out of castings for years and many of the best 1911 'smiths in the world build on these frames.

Caspian does not build outstanding receivers. Just because some gunsmiths utilized their assemblies with success does not make them outstanding.
Remember the first batch of Sig Sauer GSR's? Those pieces of shit were Caspian assemblies. Sig had to start from scratch and make their own frames and slides to make the GSR reliable.

Do you base these statements on your personal experience ?

Do you own a Ford Focus? Why not? Personal experience, or did you form an opinion by reading up on it? Do you have to buy a Toyota T-100 with a 4 cylinder engine to opine that 4 cylinder engines do not belong in full-size pickups?

Do you know what "outstanding" means?

HEY!
Don't go knocking the Ford Focus now. Yeah, it set records for recalls back when it came out. But Ford has made it into a pretty darn good little car. We just bought my wife a Kiwi green Focus coupe three days ago and she loves it just fine. It's a great little do everything car that has enough power to do just fine in traffic and excellent gas mileage to boot! They improved it very nicely for '08 too.

Posted: 1/2/2008 5:52:52 PM EDT

[#26]

Quoted:

........... really? Can you please post the Military Specifications that it's built to and for which Country.

Quoted:

www.armscor.net/Pistols.htm

The link you posted shows the RIA to be Mil Spec.

\

www.armscor.net/RIA_fs.JPG
Rock Island FS Parkerized
1911-A1
Caliber: 45 ACP
Action: Semi-Auto Overall Length: 7 3/4"
Capacity: 8 Rounds Weight: 2.4 lbs
Finish: Parkerized Sights: GI
(Mil-spec)

- It also shows it to be a left handed firearm with a lowered and flared ejection port. I'll REPEAT MYSELF, Can you please post the Military Specifications that it's built to and for which Country.

I have no idea why I get sucked into these threads. I could couldn't care less what people spend there cash on, but here it goes.

SGB you have have me on this one. I don't have any records other than other post on different gun forums that states they were built to Philipino or any other military's specifications. All I can say is that I saw many police and mil in SE Asia, the Caribian and South America carring them.

I'm not an expert on 1911s by any stretch. So could you educate us, with a link of course as to what is out of U.S. Mil Spec on the RIA.

Posted: 1/2/2008 6:08:41 PM EDT

[#27]

height=8

Quoted:
height=8

Quoted:
yeah, the
Tactical has most of what i want. i would change the grips, maybe the sights, guide rod. but, other than that, im not too worried. so, if i can get one cheap enough next gun show, i might for the hell of it. then, later, i will get a Kimber. im saying i will get it if i can get a good enough deal. what im really gonna look for is a used Kimber Custom II

Here's a review on the RIA Tactical for ya href=ezine.m1911.org/RIATactical.htm

thanks man, that really helps me. i went and looked at some Taurus's today, and that made it a definate, the XD is out of the picture....for now. im gonna try to pick something up at the fun show. after reading that review, i feel better about the RIA. but, one question. does this mean the sights can't be changed? what if i want to put night sights on?

Posted: 1/2/2008 6:15:52 PM EDT

[#28]

Quoted:

Quoted:
yeah, the
Tactical has most of what i want. i would change the grips, maybe the sights, guide rod. but, other than that, im not too worried. so, if i can get one cheap enough next gun show, i might for the hell of it. then, later, i will get a Kimber. im saying i will get it if i can get a good enough deal. what im really gonna look for is a used Kimber Custom II

Here's a review on the RIA Tactical for ya

ezine.m1911.org/RIATactical.htm

thanks man, that really helps me. i went and looked at some Taurus's today, and that made it a definate, the XD is out of the picture....for now. im gonna try to pick something up at the fun show. after reading that review, i feel better about the RIA. but, one question. does this mean the sights can't be changed? what if i want to put night sights on?

They're dovetailed, so I'd think they could be replaced with pretty much any dovetail sight set.

I see Adco sells these for $452. That ain't so bad. I don't REALLY need another 1911, but it might be nice to have a reasonably capable model around when I get around to sending my Colt off for custom work.

Posted: 1/2/2008 7:21:37 PM EDT

[#29]

Quoted:

I have no idea why I get sucked into these threads. I could couldn't care less what people spend there cash on, but here it goes.

SGB you have have me on this one. I don't have any records other than other post on different gun forums that states they were built to Philipino or any other military's specifications. All I can say is that I saw many police and mil in SE Asia, the Caribian and South America carring them.

I'm not an expert on 1911s by any stretch. So could you educate us, with a link of course as to what is out of U.S. Mil Spec on the RIA.

I'll see if I can't dig up the Original 96 year old specs for ya.

as well as the 1924 changes from 1911 to 1911a1.

Until then I can tell you that the US Military specified Forgings for the 1911 and 1911a1 frames and slides. The Philippine made guns are cast. The 1911 and the 1911a1 specified the extractor to be made of spring steel, to my knowledge the Philippine guns are cast. The 1911a1 guns require an arched mainspring housing unlike the flate mainspring housing on the Philippine made version. The 1911a1 specifies a short trigger unlike the medium length trigger in the Philippine made version. I also believe you'll find the front strap dimensions on the Philippine guns to not conform to the original specified dimensions as well. Further the US Military Specifications had no requirement for a lowered and relieved ejection port such as the Philippine guns posses.

The RIA no more meets US Milspec than does the the Springfield Milspec. It's just a commonly misused term used by many to describe some Copy's of true Military Spec firearms.

Now before you get in a huff you'll notice that in no way during the course of this thread have I defamed or bad mouthed the Philippine made 1911s. They are what they are and they can stand and fall on their own merits without the addition of inaccurate information.

Posted: 1/2/2008 7:25:18 PM EDT

[#30]

Quoted:

They're dovetailed, so I'd think they could be replaced with pretty much any dovetail sight set.

You may wish to contact Armscor and insure that they don't use a proprietary sight cut on their tactical package.

Posted: 1/2/2008 8:04:51 PM EDT

[#31]

HEY!
Don't go knocking the Ford Focus now. Yeah, it set records for recalls back when it came out. But Ford has made it into a pretty darn good little car. We just bought my wife a Kiwi green Focus coupe three days ago and she loves it just fine. It's a great little do everything car that has enough power to do just fine in traffic and excellent gas mileage to boot! They improved it very nicely for '08 too.

We have been using the Focus as the primary vehicle in our fleet for six years and the car has proven to be a complete piece of crap. Chevy Cavaliers were night and day better. Then some green a-hole decided to buy some Honda Civic Hybrids. Those turned out to be crap as well (although the interiors were nice). $8200 to replace the variable speed tranny after 60000 miles. POS!

Posted: 1/2/2008 8:13:15 PM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:

Quoted:
I think your question made no sense. For the record, I examined a Caspian based gun in the past and wasn't impressed. I prefer guns machined from forgings.

Yes. Cast frames are junk, especially those made by Caspian. Has anybody told Larry Vickers that he's a hack and a general all-around clown for building $3,000 guns on Caspian frames?

Where did I say that Caspian frames were junk?

You build a false straw man and then hammer away. How can anyone ever have a reasonable debate with some like you?

I said that Caspian frames were not outstanding (I never said they were junk), and that is a fact. Ruger is not outstanding either. Any time a manufacturer chooses an inferior production method to reduce costs, he removes himself from the outstanding category.

Posted: 1/3/2008 6:46:42 AM EDT

[#33]

well, thanks verybody, i didnt expect to get near this many responses, i figures not even a page full

Posted: 1/3/2008 8:32:12 AM EDT

[#34]

You'll find that anytime somebody asks about RIA guns it always generates 3 or four pages of crap.

Posted: 1/3/2008 8:50:44 AM EDT

[#35]

height=8

Quoted:
You'll find that anytime somebody asks about RIA guns it always generates 3 or four pages of crap.

is there a smiley for ROFL?!

Posted: 1/3/2008 8:52:54 AM EDT

[#36]

oh, quick question, has anybody seen any grips like this but in Tan? or is thers something i can put on the front strap to give some grip?

http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=88998622

Posted: 1/3/2008 9:01:06 AM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:
oh, quick question, has anybody seen any grips like this but in Tan? or is thers something i can put on the front strap to give some grip?

http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=88998622

There's an excellent list of grip and parts sources at the top of the main page here on the board.

If you're trying to stay on the cheap, some skateboard tape is a good way to add traction and keep costs down.

Posted: 1/3/2008 9:06:32 AM EDT

[#38]

Quoted:

Quoted:

They're dovetailed, so I'd think they could be replaced with pretty much any dovetail sight set.

You may wish to contact Armscor and insure that they don't use a proprietary sight cut on their tactical package.

Yeah, I was going to add that, but forgot.

Posted: 1/3/2008 9:07:57 AM EDT

[#39]

height=8

Quoted:
height=8

Quoted:
oh, quick question, has anybody seen any grips like this but in Tan? or is thers something i can put on the front strap to give some grip?

http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=88998622

There's an excellent list of grip and parts sources at the top of the main page here on the board.

If you're trying to stay on the cheap, some skateboard tape is a good way to add traction and keep costs down.

im not looking to stayt TOO cheap. and sorry, i should have looked before i asked. thanks.

EDIT: are you talking about that Combat Grip link?

Posted: 1/3/2008 9:10:12 AM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:

Quoted:
You'll find that anytime somebody asks about RIA guns it always generates 3 or four pages of crap.

is there a smiley for ROFL?!

Posted: 1/3/2008 9:15:58 AM EDT

[#41]

this is the exact grip i want, but in tan. anybody seen any? i cant seem to find them anywhere. do they even exist?

http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/yhst-73824383396943_1970_158607

Posted: 1/3/2008 4:32:22 PM EDT

[#42]

another question. would the RIA shoot ammunition like this?

http://academy.com/index.php?page=content&target=products/outdoors/hunting/centerfire_handgun_ammunition&start=0&selectedSKU=0326-40350-0303

im not going to be using that ammo all te time, just checking to see if it will use your basic sporting goods store crap. i will be buying basic bulk ammunition. but i dont know **** about handgun ammunition. so, whats ball compared to....? im also gonan go search, im sure there is a post about this somewhere

Posted: 1/3/2008 6:27:04 PM EDT

[#43]

Quoted:
another question. would the RIA shoot ammunition like this?

http://academy.com/index.php?page=content&target=products/outdoors/hunting/centerfire_handgun_ammunition&start=0&selectedSKU=0326-40350-0303

im not going to be using that ammo all te time, just checking to see if it will use your basic sporting goods store crap. i will be buying basic bulk ammunition. but i dont know **** about handgun ammunition. so, whats ball compared to....? im also gonan go search, im sure there is a post about this somewhere

Yes. Mine shoots anything that i feed it. I mean anything.

Posted: 1/3/2008 6:57:29 PM EDT

[#44]

sweet, thats good to hear. although, as of about an our ago, ive been contemplating building my own. but, thats for another thread....

Posted: 1/4/2008 8:37:39 AM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:

Quoted:
another question. would the RIA shoot ammunition like this?

http://academy.com/index.php?page=content&target=products/outdoors/hunting/centerfire_handgun_ammunition&start=0&selectedSKU=0326-40350-0303

im not going to be using that ammo all te time, just checking to see if it will use your basic sporting goods store crap. i will be buying basic bulk ammunition. but i dont know **** about handgun ammunition. so, whats ball compared to....? im also gonan go search, im sure there is a post about this somewhere

Yes. Mine shoots anything that i feed it. I mean anything.

almost anything. Mine will not fire speer lawman 200 grn. That is the only one that I have found that will not reliably cycle.

get blazer brass from walmart. It is cheaper.

Posted: 1/4/2008 9:08:34 AM EDT

[#46]

Quoted:

Quoted:
another question. would the RIA shoot ammunition like this?

http://academy.com/index.php?page=content&target=products/outdoors/hunting/centerfire_handgun_ammunition&start=0&selectedSKU=0326-40350-0303

im not going to be using that ammo all te time, just checking to see if it will use your basic sporting goods store crap. i will be buying basic bulk ammunition. but i dont know **** about handgun ammunition. so, whats ball compared to....? im also gonan go search, im sure there is a post about this somewhere

Yes. Mine shoots anything that i feed it. I mean anything.

almost anything. Mine will not fire speer lawman 200 grn. That is the only one that I have found that will not reliably cycle.

get blazer brass from walmart. It is cheaper.

i don't shop at Walmart, won't support that damn place. but, its ceaper than surplus?

Posted: 1/4/2008 11:01:02 AM EDT

[#47]

Quoted:
Ruger is not outstanding either. Any time a manufacturer chooses an inferior production method to reduce costs, he removes himself from the outstanding category.

Yeah, because Ruger No. 1 receivers are notoriously weak....

Posted: 1/4/2008 12:32:41 PM EDT

[#48]

well, just gt back from Cabela's, and they have the Taurus on sale for $549 with extra grips and 2 mags, think im just gonna do it! or they have the same one used for $50 cheaper....

Posted: 1/5/2008 12:08:43 PM EDT

[#49]

http://www.advancedtactical.com/sweeneyarticle.pdf

Posted: 1/5/2008 12:55:40 PM EDT

[#50]

Quoted:

Quoted:
Ruger is not outstanding either. Any time a manufacturer chooses an inferior production method to reduce costs, he removes himself from the outstanding category.

Yeah, because Ruger No. 1 receivers are notoriously weak....

See, you are just not capable of understanding the category of "Outstanding". If Ruger were outstanding, then the No.1 receiver would be machined from a forging, like the Dakota. If Ruger were outstanding, then their shotguns would not be fitted/finished like a cheap coach gun.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Rock Island 1911 opinions (Page 2 of 3)

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