User Panel
Posted: 11/16/2018 7:56:02 PM EDT
Just wondering what GD is using these days as their defense round. Ive heard hornady TAP, Gold dot is good..I remember reading somewhere on here fed fusion is a stupid fast little round and really effective. That's usually what I put in my bedside gun mags.
What do you run? Is there really a best choice or are several options close enough in effect that there is no best round? I'm not looking for what groups the best just what has the best terminal ballistics in close quarters. |
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I shoot a lot of IMI 77g SMK ammo, so that's what I've got. I don't know if it's the best choice, but I think it'll do.
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Hitting the target is more important than the difference between gold dot/TAP/fusion/77g IMI
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The Fusion is a great choice, surprisingly accurate, fast out of short barrels and performs great. 2464 FPS out of a 10.5” barrel
Member here did a great test. https://www.ar15.com/forums/ar-15/Velocity-Tests-From-Noveske-10-5-and-BCM-12-5-Third-Test-2-5-16-results-in-OP-/16-685670/ |
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I like the fusion ammo. It doesn't shoot great for me, about 1 1/4" groups at 100 yards. However, I feel comfortable shooting anything up to deer with it. That includes 2 legged predators. Being a bonded bullet it really holds together. If you were to stock up on 1 load it wouldn't be a bad choice.
I know you don't care about deer but that's the only tissue testing most of us get to do. And the fusion works. |
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In all honesty, I just use M193 ammo and call it a day.
I mean, I'm sure that there is plenty of better stuff out there. But I'm pretty convinced that the basic 55 grain FMJ 5.56 load is more than adequate for most situations inside of 100 yards... And in the event it's not adequate it has 29 little friends ready to back it up. This approach lets me practice (not that I practice all that much if I'm being honest) with what I will be using for defense. That means my rifles are zeroed for my ammo and I know they will run it reliably. As a side note, as your ammo gets more powerful there is less and less of a need to select the absolute best ammo. When I am carrying .380 I want the absolute best ammo I can get. When I am carrying 9mm I still want the best. But if I were selecting a buckshot load for a home defense shotgun I would be significantly less concerned with getting the premium home defense loads. (Do they even make premium home defense loads for 12 gauges?) 5.56 is powerful enough that I don't feel the need to worry too much about whether it is enough to stop that burglar at indoor distances. |
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The Fusion does well on hogs too.
It’s what I load magazines with for HD and what my son uses for hogs (I use a 6.8 for hogs.) ETA: I’ve never had any 5.56/223 ammo have a significant enough POI difference from my zeroed ammo to make a difference shooting steel in practice “drills” at the ranges I practice, which are 25yds to about 75yds. I won’t use FMJ or ball ammo for HD, for fear of exits out of my brick house. |
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In all honesty, I just use M193 ammo and call it a day. I mean, I'm sure that there is plenty of better stuff out there. But I'm pretty convinced that the basic 55 grain FMJ 5.56 load is more than adequate for most situations inside of 100 yards... And in the event it's not adequate it has 29 little friends ready to back it up. This approach lets me practice (not that I practice all that much if I'm being honest) with what I will be using for defense. That means my rifles are zeroed for my ammo and I know they will run it reliably. As a side note, as your ammo gets more powerful there is less and less of a need to select the absolute best ammo. When I am carrying .380 I want the absolute best ammo I can get. When I am carrying 9mm I still want the best. But if I were selecting a buckshot load for a home defense shotgun I would be significantly less concerned with getting the premium home defense loads. (Do they even make premium home defense loads for 12 gauges?) 5.56 is powerful enough that I don't feel the need to worry too much about whether it is enough to stop that burglar at indoor distances. View Quote |
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Fusion MSR is what I use for my 20" AR and 10.5" pistol.
I buy as much as I can when PSA or SG has it on sale. It has performed well for me. |
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Wolf Gold 55gr
It's great for plinking and decent for SD in the unlikely event it gets used for that. |
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Ive been half assedly looking for a good sale on Fed Fusion for HD and in case I want to harvest a deer. (Havent shot a deer in 25 years or so)
HD mags are full of IMI M193 for now. |
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Quoted:
In all honesty, I just use M193 ammo and call it a day. I mean, I'm sure that there is plenty of better stuff out there. But I'm pretty convinced that the basic 55 grain FMJ 5.56 load is more than adequate for most situations inside of 100 yards... And in the event it's not adequate it has 29 little friends ready to back it up. This approach lets me practice (not that I practice all that much if I'm being honest) with what I will be using for defense. That means my rifles are zeroed for my ammo and I know they will run it reliably. As a side note, as your ammo gets more powerful there is less and less of a need to select the absolute best ammo. When I am carrying .380 I want the absolute best ammo I can get. When I am carrying 9mm I still want the best. But if I were selecting a buckshot load for a home defense shotgun I would be significantly less concerned with getting the premium home defense loads. (Do they even make premium home defense loads for 12 gauges?) 5.56 is powerful enough that I don't feel the need to worry too much about whether it is enough to stop that burglar at indoor distances. View Quote I think (someone correct me if I’m wrong) that a lot of the price difference in HD/premium ammo is not just the components but also a higher lever of QC. So less likely to get a dud primer, out of spec case, light powder charge etc. |
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How does M193 do in terms of going thru walls? Some of the specialty rounds don’t overpenetrate drywall the way buckshot and hand gun rounds do.
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I have some mags loaded with Fusions. I’ve seen the damage they do to whitetail deer and know they will work well should they need to be used on a bad guy.
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I just use M193.
I have many cases of it stockpiled and I have lots of mags already loaded, so it's my go to "action" ammo. My main concern is defeating multiple tangos that have body armor, 193 has the best chance of punching armor especialy if it's AR500 plate. Me and my crew also practice doing a lot of suppressive fire and maneuver by fire drillls where we might dump several thousand rounds in a few minutes....so using premium ammo gets pricey. I always like to practice with what I plan to go into battle with. |
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Depends. Wolf Gold or Federal M193 for general purpose, Silver Bear soft point for hunting, CBC/Magtech MK262 for distance shooting, etc.
PSA daily deals on ammo/mags for practice is my preference. 200 rounds and ten Pmags for $130 is hard to beat. ETA: Forgot, got a stash of M855 for a rainy day. Been working on modified Mozambique drills for dealing with hostile targets wearing body armor; two to the chest, then one to the pelvis. Bigger target, guaranteed to put you on the ground. |
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Black Hills Mk262. I like to defend my home with class and style
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If you get shot with ANY .233 or 5.56 round at home defense ranges, you are going to have a very bad day. The difference between the best rounds and the average rounds is measured in percentage points, not in orders of magnitude.
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Fusion is good stuff.
I have my HD mags full of FBIT3 just because SGAmmo had it for a good price several years ago and I bought a lot of it. Fusion or Gold Dots is what I would use if I didn't have the T3 stuff. |
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If you get shot with ANY .233 or 5.56 round at home defense ranges, you are going to have a very bad day. The difference between the best rounds and the average rounds is measured in percentage points, not in orders of magnitude. View Quote |
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I forget the necessary specifics to back it up, but yes Federal Fusion MSR 62gr is one of the better defense loads available currently.
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I shoot a lot of IMI 77g SMK ammo, so that's what I've got. I don't know if it's the best choice, but I think it'll do. I used to have nuisance permits and got to experiment a lot. I'll still use 556 on occasion for shooting deer but hunting, where bad angles might be the only shot, Id prefer something bigger. My favorite 556 load is my 77 nosler hpbt reloads. I would like to do some more work with 64 grain bonded bullets. |
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I shoot a lot of IMI 77g SMK ammo, so that's what I've got. I don't know if it's the best choice, but I think it'll do. I used to have nuisance permits and got to experiment a lot. I'll still use 556 on occasion for shooting deer but hunting, where bad angles might be the only shot, Id prefer something bigger. My favorite 556 load is my 77 nosler hpbt reloads. I would like to do some more work with 64 grain bonded bullets. |
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FYI, there's a difference between Fusion and Fusion MSR. The MSR is most definitely loaded hotter and is better for SBRs.
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How does M193 do in terms of going thru walls? Some of the specialty rounds don't overpenetrate drywall the way buckshot and hand gun rounds do. View Quote |
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I like the fusion ammo. It doesn't shoot great for me, about 1 1/4" groups at 100 yards. However, I feel comfortable shooting anything up to deer with it. That includes 2 legged predators. Being a bonded bullet it really holds together. If you were to stock up on 1 load it wouldn't be a bad choice. I know you don't care about deer but that's the only tissue testing most of us get to do. And the fusion works. View Quote 1.25 MOA is excellent. |
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Nosler 64gr bonded...Winchester Ranger uses the same bullet I believe. https://shop.nosler.com/media/extendware/ewimageopt/media/inline/b6/7/223-rem-64gr-bonded-solid-base-defensetm-ammo-20ct-404.jpg View Quote |
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I like the fusion ammo. It doesn't shoot great for me, about 1 1/4" groups at 100 yards. However, I feel comfortable shooting anything up to deer with it. That includes 2 legged predators. Being a bonded bullet it really holds together. If you were to stock up on 1 load it wouldn't be a bad choice. I know you don't care about deer but that's the only tissue testing most of us get to do. And the fusion works. 1.25 MOA is excellent. |
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Awesome round. It is basically the same thing my agency uses - Federal XM223SP1 ETSP 62g.
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