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AL, USA
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Posted: 6/30/2021 12:03:08 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By aplomado: There's a story I heard second hand about my great uncle's service in Europe. Shortly after he arrived, he was assigned to guard some German prisoners. Another American soldier shot them in front of him. I did not hear what happened to killer, if anything. My grandfather (4th ID and D-day Veteran) said matter of factly that they had a guy that would be sent to take the Waffen-SS prisoners to the rear. Everytime that man took SS prisoners to the rear he would get about 5 minutes away and all prisoners would be shot trying to escape. Regular German Army was dealt with differently. Everyone knew about Malmedy. No remorse. |
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Posted: 6/30/2021 12:40:55 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 4v50: Thomas Taylor's The Simple Sounds of Freedom about 506 PIR Joe Beyrle who was captured in Normandy, escaped a PoW camp and fought with the Russians tells of his return home with other former PoWs. They went to a stateside camp where German PoWs were serving food. It was steak, potatoes and all the trimmings. When the Germans refused some Americans seconds, one American noted some SS tattoos. A fight broke out and some Germans were killed with steak knives and food trays. Not quite combat condition killing of PoWs, but something never reported in the local papers and quietly hushed up. See p309. Or a tall tale in a vet memoir. |
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Posted: 6/30/2021 9:34:27 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By FightingHellfish: Or a tall tale in a vet memoir. Ian Gardner's book on Lt. Ed Shames (Third platoon, Co. E, 506 PIR, 101 Airborne) mentions another paratrooper who escaped and fought alongside the Soviets. |
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Posted: 7/1/2021 12:41:05 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Westmalle8: My grandfather (4th ID and D-day Veteran) said matter of factly that they had a guy that would be sent to take the Waffen-SS prisoners to the rear. Everytime that man took SS prisoners to the rear he would get about 5 minutes away and all prisoners would be shot trying to escape. Regular German Army was dealt with differently. Everyone knew about Malmedy. No remorse. I read somewhere that regular german army tank crew uniforms were black and thus risked misidentified as SS. |
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Posted: 7/1/2021 10:10:31 AM EDT
[Last Edit: KitBuilder]
[#5]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By couchlord: I read somewhere that regular german army tank crew uniforms were black and thus risked misidentified as SS. Anyone treated in an SS hospital (which were in numerous locations) could've had one applied as well (since this was the SOP of the SS hospitals). This caused some confusion and mistaken identity around the end of the war. |
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Posted: 7/1/2021 5:59:32 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 4v50: Ian Gardner's book on Lt. Ed Shames (Third platoon, Co. E, 506 PIR, 101 Airborne) mentions another paratrooper who escaped and fought alongside the Soviets. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By 4v50: Originally Posted By FightingHellfish: Or a tall tale in a vet memoir. Ian Gardner's book on Lt. Ed Shames (Third platoon, Co. E, 506 PIR, 101 Airborne) mentions another paratrooper who escaped and fought alongside the Soviets. Beyrle's Eastern Front exploits are pretty well-documented. I'm willing to bet that Hellfish is referring to the post-War mess hall dustup, which sounds extremely suspicious. |
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Posted: 7/5/2021 11:30:07 PM EDT
[#7]
Total war. If there’s an existential threat there are no rules. Lots of wisdom in Lemay’s “make it horrifically unbearable so it’s over instantly” perspective
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Posted: 7/5/2021 11:44:20 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NotMrWizard: I’ve only seen the video once, but it was of a US submarine that sank a German ship. The sub surfaced, then sailors started machine-gunning the survivors in the water, with some using Thompsons. Was pretty brutal to see the bullet impacts around the survivors. Different times and philosophies. What's interesting is that in the early years of the war, Uboats would rescue survivors, and even allow all crew to get on life boats before sinking a ship. Then the Allies used knowledge that to sink Uboats, so no more uboats took on survivors. |
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CO, USA
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Posted: 7/6/2021 12:26:04 AM EDT
[Last Edit: fluwoebers]
[#9]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Phocks: It was fairly well understood by both sides that certain actions led to losing your right to quarter...for example snipers were almost universally executed out if hand. Machine gunners that fought until they ran out of ammo or were outflanked were also often refused surrender. SS were executed out if hand by some Allied units (the Canadians, of all people were notorious for this, although they had a pretty good reason). Also, by far the most likely time to be killed was during the actual surrender act or immediately after. Once the MPs had you it was exceptionally rare for the Allies to execute prisoners. Not so much for prisoners of the Germans. I don’t have a citation, but the stats I remember reading indicated that fewer than 1% of POWs held by US died in captivity. 4% for Germany, and over 30% for Japan. ETA: that’s after they were processed into camps. The rates were undoubtedly much higher for all parties during or shortly after capture. |
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Posted: 7/6/2021 12:31:09 AM EDT
[#10]
Originally Posted By 4v50: Fred Smith has done some research on the US killing of enemy combatants after their surrender was accepted. My own research confirms it (I discuss it in three pages of my book) and Fred & I agree that it's universal. Every WW II belligerent is guilty of it and no one has clean hands. Not to condemn anyone who did it (except the SS), but under the stress of combat and ability to keep prisoners or set them free, the choice was pragmatic. Anyway, here is a link to Fred's collection of data: https://www.yumpu.com/en/document/read/65329152/killing-after-combat Who thought we didn’t? I thought it was common knowledge. |
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Posted: 7/6/2021 1:41:59 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Wolfpack]
[#11]
My dad was WW2 Navy. He was a Torpedoman on DD-652, Ingersoll. He was a drunk his entire life, he only ever told me two stories of the war, one involved his brother, also Navy and he recounted how scared he was escorting the Missouri into Toyko Bay for the surrender.
I've always wondered of the ships he got credited for sinking haunted him the rest of his life...the reason he drank so much. What was protocol when a destroyer sank a ship? They couldn't take all the people that were floating in the water onboard and make them prisoners....did they just leave them? I wonder if my dad saw that a few times on ships he sank and it was a memory he couldn't erase. |
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Posted: 7/7/2021 11:15:31 AM EDT
[#12]
Here is the tank battalion commander Maj. Aleksandra Samusenko who allowed 101 paratrooper Beyrle to join her battalion. Her command to attack was, "Follow my ass as if you can have it!" Her tankers and desantis (tank riding infantrymen) would respond with an enthusiastic, "Urrah!"
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Posted: 7/7/2021 11:27:03 AM EDT
[#13]
I've seen articles/video stories how toward the end of the war the Germans would hide in a hole by the side of the road with a panzerfaust.
Wait for a tank or truck to roll by, blow it away, then surrender. After that happened several times the Americans started shooting the surrendering Germans and that shit stopped. |
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Posted: 7/7/2021 11:39:26 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MisterPX: What's interesting is that in the early years of the war, Uboats would rescue survivors, and even allow all crew to get on life boats before sinking a ship. Then the Allies used knowledge that to sink Uboats, so no more uboats took on survivors. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By MisterPX: Originally Posted By NotMrWizard: I’ve only seen the video once, but it was of a US submarine that sank a German ship. The sub surfaced, then sailors started machine-gunning the survivors in the water, with some using Thompsons. Was pretty brutal to see the bullet impacts around the survivors. Different times and philosophies. What's interesting is that in the early years of the war, Uboats would rescue survivors, and even allow all crew to get on life boats before sinking a ship. Then the Allies used knowledge that to sink Uboats, so no more uboats took on survivors. Laconia Incident. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laconia_incident German U-boat sank a liner that had many Italian prisoners of war from North Africa plus Civilian passangers. The U-boat surfaces and helps survivors - only to come under attack by US Army Airforce Anti-Submarine B-24s. Donitz then orders no more assistance or rescues by U-boats. |
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Posted: 7/7/2021 6:38:58 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Desert_AIP: I've seen articles/video stories how toward the end of the war the Germans would hide in a hole by the side of the road with a panzerfaust. Wait for a tank or truck to roll by, blow it away, then surrender. After that happened several times the Americans started shooting the surrendering Germans and that shit stopped. I've read similar things where a German would shoot some Americans, exhaust his ammo, throw down his gun and come out with his arms up. "Kamerad!" The Americans would be so incensed that they would fill him with lead instead. One BAR armed GI said, "Kamerad my a**," before firing a burst into the German. |
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Posted: 7/8/2021 3:27:44 PM EDT
[Last Edit: NoMoAMMO]
[#16]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By couchlord: I read somewhere that regular german army tank crew uniforms were black and thus risked misidentified as SS. Yep Black Panzer wrap and a Deaths Head does not an Allgemeine make.  Attached FileETA The assault Gun crews (StuG etc) had gray wraps. |
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Posted: 7/9/2021 8:06:17 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Bigger_Hammer: Laconia Incident. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laconia_incident German U-boat sank a liner that had many Italian prisoners of war from North Africa plus Civilian passangers. The U-boat surfaces and helps survivors - only to come under attack by US Army Airforce Anti-Submarine B-24s. Donitz then orders no more assistance or rescues by U-boats. |
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Posted: 7/9/2021 8:13:05 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NotMrWizard: I've only seen the video once, but it was of a US submarine that sank a German ship. The sub surfaced, then sailors started machine-gunning the survivors in the water, with some using Thompsons. Was pretty brutal to see the bullet impacts around the survivors. Different times and philosophies. |
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Posted: 7/10/2021 9:01:37 AM EDT
[#19]
Alex Kershaw's book, The Liberator discusses American GI's executing some concentration camp guards. Their CO was not present but put a halt to it immeidately.
Otto Carius, the Tiger Tank commander, said because of his black uniform and panzer death head insignia was temporarily dumped into a stockade with SS men. You can read about it in Tigers In The Mud. |
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Posted: 7/11/2021 11:42:53 AM EDT
[#20]
There are two books I've read recently ("The Longest Winter" by Alex Kershaw and (Fatal Crossroads" by Danny Parker) that describe Jochen Peiper's comments after the 1st SS was tasked to help with humanitarian aid after the bombing of the German city of Duren. After witnessing the population of women and children killed in the raid, he was quoted "I'd like to take those responsible and castrate them with a piece of dull glass". Approximately a month later... he was at the infamous Baugnez crossroads just south of Malmedy. I point this out, not as an excuse... but perhaps more of a possible explanation.
In WWII, we'd firebomb a city to make a point.... today, we pay an Afghan shepherd $1000 because we accidentally killed one of his goats... ....we live in a different world today. |
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Posted: 8/9/2021 5:13:14 PM EDT
[#21]
I am late to this one. My dad was a D-day and Market Garden vet . 101st Abn. He said in France they did not take any prisoners alive because the Germans would shoot at you until they ran out of ammo and then surrender. He said they did not have the manpower to guard them nor did they want to. His best friend got headshot fighting in the hedgerows. I have in his pictures a row of dead Germans laying along a hedgerow. He was wounded in France recovered in England and jumped again in Market Garden. He never talked much about anything that happened in Holland except a bank liberation by him and a guy named Tice from Pa. Dad was wounded in Holland with a german hand grenade and it ended his war. He died with German grenade fragments in his back.
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Posted: 8/23/2021 10:31:59 AM EDT
[#22]
Was reading the transcripts of Jews who served in the Soviet Army. It was a crime to kill prisoners - sometimes. It depends on the circumstances. On the order of the platoon commander, a jr. lieutenant, a Vlasov traitor was executed immediately after he was captured. Once a person surrendered and was taken to the rear, then it became more of a crime. The Soviets saw prisoners as a labor force to be worked to death.
Go to the Blavatnk Archive Foundation and they've plenty of interviews in Russian but you can read the transcripts (much faster anyway).n |
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Posted: 8/31/2021 6:31:01 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Screechjet1: I had a neighbor who was a B-24 bombardier. Two airmen from his group were captured and lynched by townspeople in some tiny rural burg in Germany. He said whenever possible they would save a bomb for that town on their return trip. How could he possibly know what happened to downed airmen during a war? While survivors taken prisoner would eventually have their names submitted to the Red Cross, those that died on impact or lynched would just be KIA or MIA. I think your neighbor was pulling your leg at best. |
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Posted: 9/3/2021 1:09:04 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DogtownTom: How could he possibly know what happened to downed airmen during a war? While survivors taken prisoner would eventually have their names submitted to the Red Cross, those that died on impact or lynched would just be KIA or MIA. I think your neighbor was pulling your leg at best. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By DogtownTom: Originally Posted By Screechjet1: I had a neighbor who was a B-24 bombardier. Two airmen from his group were captured and lynched by townspeople in some tiny rural burg in Germany. He said whenever possible they would save a bomb for that town on their return trip. How could he possibly know what happened to downed airmen during a war? While survivors taken prisoner would eventually have their names submitted to the Red Cross, those that died on impact or lynched would just be KIA or MIA. I think your neighbor was pulling your leg at best. Hanns Scharff As for saving "a bomb," that's the wishful thinking of GIs everywhere through all times. Bombardiers could release bombs individually, but that would have to be done before the toggle switch was flipped to "SALVO." A release on SALVO means that all bombs are released right then. No way to save the last one. |
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ME, USA
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Posted: 9/3/2021 5:25:48 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Homesteader375]
[#25]
Double post
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ME, USA
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Posted: 9/3/2021 6:02:10 PM EDT
[#26]
Both of my grandfathers were in the war, one was at Prarl, the other found his way to Europe and was there on VE day. He never spoke much about it, at least to me, until I came back from the suck. It was then that he told me of finding the concentration camps and seeing what the nazi's had done. He tells me they didn't take a single prisoner for a week afterwards, regardless of how many tried to surrender. My grandfather was a good man and served the sheriff's department for over 30 years. Even the best of men can do things under extraordinary circumstances that they might otherwise think twice about.
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Posted: 10/15/2021 3:54:07 PM EDT
[#27]
Just read Conti's Few Survived. It's about the remnants of an Italian Corps that evaded encirclement during Uranus (Stalingrad) and along with a German unit returned to Axis lines. Anyway, a Soviet major was captured and interrogated. Afterward he was shot by the Germans. Conti said that that was normal for the Germans to do.
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TN, USA
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Posted: 10/17/2021 2:23:22 PM EDT
[#28]
My grandfather wrote letters home about his guard duty in Germany. It really fucked him up. They were hiding a Christmas tree made of toilet paper from him. He saw some commando on grunt murders on our side, too. All in all he left home a chipper guy, and came back very angry, and mistrustful of the government. it changed the course of our family.
Ill pop an expert up here. Not a intense as photos of dead bodies, but he was a fine writer, so... I think this is a good subject, whichever side you come down on. |
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IN, USA
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Posted: 11/3/2021 3:46:41 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GonvilleBromhead: Was that actual B&W wartime footage of shooting prisoners? There was a scene in War & Remembrance (1988) that fits your description exactly, down to using Thompsons Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GonvilleBromhead: Originally Posted By NotMrWizard: I've only seen the video once, but it was of a US submarine that sank a German ship. The sub surfaced, then sailors started machine-gunning the survivors in the water, with some using Thompsons. Was pretty brutal to see the bullet impacts around the survivors. Different times and philosophies. Apologies,I just saw this question. This was B&W footage I saw during a documentary. I just wish I could remember what it was, but it’s been 20 years since I’ve seen it. I’ll have to see if I can find it. |
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Posted: 11/3/2021 9:21:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: Riter]
[#30]
Fred Borch III article on Sgt. Theodore West and Capt. Compton, the men behind the Biscari Airfield Massacre. West borrowed a Thompson and killed some PoWs. What was really damning was he inserted a fresh magazine and administered a coup de grace to each fallen prisoner. At last I learn that his sentence was remitted because Ike wanted him returned to duty (that could have been a death sentence too).
https://tjaglcspublic.army.mil/war-crimes-in-sicily-sergeant-west-captain-compton-and-the-murder-of-prisoners-of-war-in-1943 I discuss Sgt. West in my book. |
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Posted: 11/4/2021 10:34:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: MochaJava]
[#31]
I'll add this: about 20 years ago the husband of a friend of my wife, who was a company commander in Europe, told me that after Malmedy, they were told, that if ordered to take prisoners for e.g. interrogation purposes, that they had to do it.
Otherwise, they were under no obligation to accept anyone's surrender--and they didn't. That actually sounds legal to me. Obviously this practice eventually ended because the Germans and their allies surrendered in droves towards the end of the war. Long before that, when I was a little kid, I asked the Pacific war army vet brother of my uncle by marriage, why the Japs never surrendered. He gave me a funny look that I still remember and said "oh yes they did..." He died a few years later from the effects of some tropical disease (I think tropical sprue) that the Army/VA failed to diagnose and just claimed that he was mental. |
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Posted: 11/16/2021 12:09:54 AM EDT
[#32]
A Soviet remembered: "Regiment commander Verdiukov was beating up some large German, a young guy. We asked: 'Why are you beating him?' He said: 'This is my neighbor, he is a Vlasovite.' He killed him."
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NJ, USA
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Posted: 11/17/2021 9:02:20 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NotMrWizard: Apologies,I just saw this question. This was B&W footage I saw during a documentary. I just wish I could remember what it was, but it’s been 20 years since I’ve seen it. I’ll have to see if I can find it. Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By NotMrWizard: Originally Posted By GonvilleBromhead: Originally Posted By NotMrWizard: I've only seen the video once, but it was of a US submarine that sank a German ship. The sub surfaced, then sailors started machine-gunning the survivors in the water, with some using Thompsons. Was pretty brutal to see the bullet impacts around the survivors. Different times and philosophies. Apologies,I just saw this question. This was B&W footage I saw during a documentary. I just wish I could remember what it was, but it’s been 20 years since I’ve seen it. I’ll have to see if I can find it. Sounds like when Mush Morton and the Wahoo shot up survivors of a sunken Japanese ship. |
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Posted: 12/17/2021 8:22:15 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Screechjet1: Honestly, I’ve had people tell me stuff that could be construed as war crimes and I would never ask how they did it. All were interested in telling me why. Some were frankly mercy killings, others terrible mistakes, others revenge. But all of these people were also what I’d consider good, decent men, carrying a burden from war they’d take to their graves. Yup. The ONLY WW2 vet I ever went off on and criticized was a guy that was doing shore bombardment in the Navy and was nearing the end of his life that blurted out he hoped and prayed that none of his rounds ever killed a single Japanese. My mouth ran away with me and I snapped, "Oh. So you wanted to leave it to the Marines and GIs, huh? You were sitting in a ship offshore and in relative safety with a little armor around you and now you want to leave things to those poor bastards in cotton shirts for armor to clean up your mess for you before you go to meet Jesus, right? I lost a Marine cousin at Iwo that I never got to meet. We're ALL going to hell." For a while I wondered about that but after 15 or so years I believe I said the right thing. |
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Posted: 12/22/2021 1:05:25 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By piccolo: Yup. The ONLY WW2 vet I ever went off on and criticized was a guy that was doing shore bombardment in the Navy and was nearing the end of his life that blurted out he hoped and prayed that none of his rounds ever killed a single Japanese. My mouth ran away with me and I snapped, "Oh. So you wanted to leave it to the Marines and GIs, huh? You were sitting in a ship offshore and in relative safety with a little armor around you and now you want to leave things to those poor bastards in cotton shirts for armor to clean up your mess for you before you go to meet Jesus, right? I lost a Marine cousin at Iwo that I never got to meet. We're ALL going to hell." For a while I wondered about that but after 15 or so years I believe I said the right thing. You did. Those Marines were praying for those shells to do their work. |
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NJ, USA
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Posted: 12/24/2021 7:36:15 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By piccolo: Yup. The ONLY WW2 vet I ever went off on and criticized was a guy that was doing shore bombardment in the Navy and was nearing the end of his life that blurted out he hoped and prayed that none of his rounds ever killed a single Japanese. My mouth ran away with me and I snapped, "Oh. So you wanted to leave it to the Marines and GIs, huh? You were sitting in a ship offshore and in relative safety with a little armor around you and now you want to leave things to those poor bastards in cotton shirts for armor to clean up your mess for you before you go to meet Jesus, right? I lost a Marine cousin at Iwo that I never got to meet. We're ALL going to hell." For a while I wondered about that but after 15 or so years I believe I said the right thing. I lost a Marine uncle on Okinawa...... feel the same way brother. |
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USA
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Posted: 1/3/2022 7:15:17 PM EDT
[#37]
I had something similar happent to me in MP school of all places. We had an unescorted (no ground guide) ambulance back up towards our position, and when the rear doors flew upon there was an OPFOR sitting there with an M16. I lit him up with my M60, and had a captian all over me about never firing on the red cross. I pointed out that the presence of armed insurgents in a marked ambulance negated the protection of the red cross, and he finally backed down.
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By feudist: In 1985 I was a Buck Sergeant Infantry Team leader. We were conducting Squad Ambush training with an emphasis on SSE and prisoner handling. Using Role players as OPFOR we would execute the ambush and assault forward through the OBJ and set security. Then my team would begin securing the prisoner and grabbing intel, weapons etc. Several repetitions into this and during SSE we got counterattacked. I was covering a prisoner while my guy was securing him. At the shots, I told my private to move and I fired a burst into the captive, "killing" him. "Apparently this is frowned on in this establishment " My CO at the time was a ring knocker and hauled me in, demanding to know why I'd murdered a prisoner. I told him simply that a surrender that can't be enforced doesn't have to be accepted. We had an unsecured enemy soldier in our perimeter while his buddies were attacking us. I hadda get it on. My Platoon Sergeant, First Sergeant and CSM(all Vietnam vets) looked at the Captain and said "He's 100% right" Privately they told me that the CO should have known that, but the role player's CO made a fuss. The best part of the incident was the look on the OPFOR face when I pulled the trigger. He actually screeched "You can't do that !" |
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WV, USA
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Posted: 1/16/2022 5:17:50 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GonvilleBromhead: People tell tall tales all the time, and that story sure sounds better than they lost all their teeth because they never brushed or flossed... here we are decades later still talking about it. Just like capturing a P38 off a German general sounds better than "I won it in a card game" or "I picked it up in a pawn shop". I bought a K98 off one of the most honest veterans I ever met. Rather than storming a German machine gun nest and personally taking it off a dead general, he said he said he found it lying on the ground. He said near the end of the war there were guns lying and stacked everywhere so you could pick up about anything you wanted. He found a nice K98 and M38 Mosin. I bought both off him before he passed away. |
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Posted: 1/16/2022 7:45:43 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By Sgt_Gold: ..... We had an unescorted (no ground guide) ambulance back up towards our position, and when the rear doors flew upon there was an OPFOR sitting there..... The Dirty Dozen was a great movie!  
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Posted: 1/16/2022 8:03:43 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GS_mk2: Cigarette? Winters said that he sent Speirs a copy of what he was going to write about him in his book and that Speirs wrote back that he was ok with it. |
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Posted: 1/16/2022 9:57:28 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By jtb1967: Just like capturing a P38 off a German general sounds better than "I won it in a card game" or "I picked it up in a pawn shop". I bought a K98 off one of the most honest veterans I ever met. Rather than storming a German machine gun nest and personally taking it off a dead general, he said he said he found it lying on the ground. He said near the end of the war there were guns lying and stacked everywhere so you could pick up about anything you wanted. He found a nice K98 and M38 Mosin. I bought both off him before he passed away. I'm the oldest of the generation and one time one of the younger kids asked my Seabee uncle where he got the Japanese sword he picked up in the Pacific. My uncle told some wild tale of "I grabbed my Tommy gun and hosed down these fourteen nips and when I ran out of ammo I took a Jap's bayonet and dove on top of the major...." Kee-rist! Hollywood couldn't have done better! I looked at him rather dubiously and a few minutes later we were along he said " I traded for that sword and I gave the guy a Jap signed battle flag we made out of a sheet. The Japanese writing on it was something we copied out of some Japanese book we found somewhere. Don't tell the kids!" Typical Seabee |
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Posted: 2/3/2022 5:31:13 PM EDT
[#42]
"The Marines bring back stories, sourvenirs and wounds. They report hard fighting, and at times they have had to call in auxiliary organizations. Some of the stories are as follows: finding marines tied to trees and bayoneted; surrounding a contingent of Japs, including a group of Jap nurses who came running toward U S. lines nearly nude to show they were females. The marines cut them down unmercifully, claiming revenge for Bataan. Three Japs were surrounded when one came out who spoke English and wanted to surrender. He explained that he had a wife and three children. A marine shot him and quietly said, 'Now he has a widow and three orphans.'"
This was from Between Tedium & Terror, page 58. |
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Posted: 2/3/2022 9:43:26 PM EDT
[Last Edit: GonvilleBromhead]
[#43]
Here is the scene from War & Remembrance I mentioned earlier. 2m20s is where the sub skipper gives the order to start shooting
https://youtu.be/eKXEHh1OG7c |
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Posted: 2/23/2022 12:54:28 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By GonvilleBromhead: Here is the scene from War & Remembrance I mentioned earlier. 2m20s is where the sub skipper gives the order to start shooting https://youtu.be/eKXEHh1OG7c Made hot:  War and Remembrance - 3 Capt. Charles MacDonald discussed the slaying of PoWs in his classic account of infantry combat, Company Commander. Anybody got the page #? |
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TX, USA
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Posted: 4/3/2022 5:06:04 AM EDT
[#45]
Just like the Axis powers, we did it too.
But the Victors get to write the history. |
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Posted: 4/13/2022 11:27:34 AM EDT
[Last Edit: Riter]
[#46]
Near run thing.
Leutnant Hans Hoeller survived the Normandy battles and the Falaise Gap only to be captured by the American equipped French Army. Being a member of the 21st Panzer Div., he had skulls on his uniform and was almost shot by his captor who had shoved a 1911 into his face. He was saved when a French officer spotted the "Afrika" cuff on his sleeve and asked him about his Africa service. Unhesitantly Hoeller mentioned the areas he fought in as well as a few towns in Tunisia along with the barracks (Marshal Foch) that he stayed at when redeployed to Africa following a bout with dystentary. This convinced the officer that he was not SS and his life was spared. Several times though angry French soldiers wanted to kill him and other German prisoners but a French speaking German PoW pleaded with them and their French guard (a NCO) to spare them. They survived. Hoeller went to Oklahoma and sat out the war there. Hoeller mentions an incident in Normandy where one distraut NCO who had orders to execute a French civilian who was possibly a member of the Resistance. Hoeller told the NCO to take him behind a building and send him on the way. The NCO was visibly relieved. Along with other PoWs, Hoeller boarded a Liberty ship going to America. When their voyage was almost over, they saw the American sailors tossing boxes of supplies overboard. This puzzled the Germans and they asked why. The sailors told them that when they got to port, they would receive fresh supplies. The PoWs then realized that unlike Germany, America enjoyed abundance and knew that America could not be defeated. The book is D-Day Tank Hunter by Hans Hoeller. |
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OH, USA
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Posted: 9/10/2022 7:47:45 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryOriginally Posted By piccolo: I'm the oldest of the generation and one time one of the younger kids asked my Seabee uncle where he got the Japanese sword he picked up in the Pacific. My uncle told some wild tale of "I grabbed my Tommy gun and hosed down these fourteen nips and when I ran out of ammo I took a Jap's bayonet and dove on top of the major...." Kee-rist! Hollywood couldn't have done better! I looked at him rather dubiously and a few minutes later we were along he said " I traded for that sword and I gave the guy a Jap signed battle flag we made out of a sheet. The Japanese writing on it was something we copied out of some Japanese book we found somewhere. Don't tell the kids!" Typical Seabee  Attached File |
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Posted: 9/10/2022 7:54:54 PM EDT
[#48]
WW II was not the heroic struggle between good and evil that it’s marketed as.
It’s shocking that people believe propaganda…but they do. |
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Posted: 9/10/2022 8:03:52 PM EDT
[Last Edit: FDC]
[#49]
edit.
Completely missed the op's 'US' |
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Posted: 9/10/2022 8:08:08 PM EDT
[Last Edit: garr]
[#50]
My Grandfather said everyone wearing an SS or Gestapo uniform were shot on sight weather their hands were up or not, regular German infantry usually were taken prisoner.
My uncle Joey (found out he won a silver star at his funeral in 2000, he never mentioned it to anyone.) told me every Jap got the bullet, everyone hated them & they could not be trusted, he said there were "Unofficial orders" to kill every Jap. |
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