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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:47:23 PM EDT
[#1]
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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:48:48 PM EDT
[#2]
Any chance they just turned it off and then say it was sabotage?
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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:49:41 PM EDT
[#3]
Russia has been known to manipulate undersea cables with their submarines. It wouldn’t surprise me if they scuttled a pipeline.
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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:50:16 PM EDT
[#4]
Well, there you go.
Anyone wanting to gain knowledge on the global energy environment we are currently living in should search out “Doomberg” and give him a listen. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:50:30 PM EDT
[#5]
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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:53:24 PM EDT
[#6]
Should’ve never put all of their eggs in Putin’s basket
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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:54:50 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Should’ve never put all of their eggs in Putin’s basket Shame no one tried to warn them. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:56:54 PM EDT
[#8]
The whole pipeline, all 700 miles and 45 inches in diameter of it, drained from 105 bar to 7 bar? Overnight?!
That's a helluva leak. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 8:59:56 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Russia has been known to manipulate undersea cables with their submarines. It wouldn’t surprise me if they scuttled a pipeline. Russia doing that would serve them no purpose. If they didn’t want to send material through all they have to do is say “no” and they get their way AND have a bargaining tool. Damaging the pipe only removes their bargaining power. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:02:33 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Russia doing that would serve them no purpose. If they didn’t want to send material through all they have to do is say “no” and they get their way AND have a bargaining tool. Damaging the pipe only removes their bargaining power. Russia's making plenty of bank on selling discount oil to the Chinese, India, even the Saudi's are buying it and selling it to other countries. Green Europe is not a cash cow for petroleum a lot of people are trying to make them out to be. Besides, they were warned. They can freeze. There's even a German word for that: schadenfreude |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:03:41 PM EDT
[#11]
It's definitely leaking. Danish F16s overflew the area (near the Danish island of Bornholm) and reportedly saw "bubbling" on the surface.
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:04:24 PM EDT
[#12]
Claiming the pipe is "damaged" allows them to restrict flow to prevent Germany & Europe from filling stockpiles to draw against come winter.
Gee Guys - we'd LOVE to send you more gas to stockpile, but the danged pipeline has a leak somewhere ... Sorry! Bigger_Hammer 
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:04:57 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Any chance they just turned it off and then say it was sabotage?  William Shatner Commercial Outtakes |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:05:55 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Russia's making plenty of bank on selling discount oil to the Chinese, India, even the Saudi's are buying it and selling it to other countries. Green Europe is not a cash cow for petroleum a lot of people are trying to make them out to be. Besides, they were warned. They can freeze. There's even a German word for that: schadenfreude Making bank on oil sales while the rest of their economy implodes and all the young and educated males flee the country. Russia is utterly fucked long term and only has themselves to blame. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:07:23 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Claiming the pipe is "damaged" allows them to restrict flow to prevent Germany & Europe from filling stockpiles to draw against come winter. Gee Guys - we'd LOVE to send you more gas to stockpile, but the danged pipeline has a leak somewhere ... Sorry! Bigger_Hammer This pipeline was not in use, and Russia halted sales to Europe overall weeks ago. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:08:11 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Claiming the pipe is "damaged" allows them to restrict flow to prevent Germany & Europe from filling stockpiles to draw against come winter. Gee Guys - we'd LOVE to send you more gas to stockpile, but the danged pipeline has a leak somewhere ... Sorry! ... Except for the fact that Germany already said "no thanks" to Nord Stream 2 right before the Russian invasion of Ukraine ... so NO gas has been flowing through it to Germany. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:09:34 PM EDT
[#17]
Were they not warned by someone 4 years ago?
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:12:37 PM EDT
[#18]
I thought Nordstream 2 was never fully completed?
ETA completed in Sept 21 but never entered service |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:16:44 PM EDT
[#19]
anyone in Europe who thinks they are getting a drop of energy from Russia this winter are the biggest fools in a sea of fools.
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:19:49 PM EDT
[#20]
The now defunct Russian-owned Nord Stream 2 suffered a gas leak and it has now been followed by a drop of pressure on Nord Stream 1, with German officials reportedly believing that the pipelines have been attacked.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/breaking-nord-stream-2-pipeline-28088792 |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:21:24 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Should’ve never put all of their eggs in Putin’s basket Just like WE shouldn’t have put all our eggs in China’s basket Bunch of dumb F politicians…all over the place! |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:24:42 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Making bank on oil sales while the rest of their economy implodes and all the young and educated males flee the country. Russia is utterly fucked long term and only has themselves to blame. These aren't the sand people, they actually have a functioning oil economy, so much so, Europe's going bananas because they threw their lot in with Putin. Member? Chancellor Merkel was a STASI agent, aka the East German KGB. Russia has a ton of people. European "countries" are like American states. View this as Mississippi begging for the world's money while the rest of the US goes after them. Without their welfare handouts, Ukraine its corrupt government would be sunk. Then realize, that even after all these billions of dollars, military support, the Ukrainians are barely hanging on. Without our tax money or weapons we're giving them (while ignoring China), Zelisnksy would be hopping trains to Switzerland with suitcases of Biden Bucks. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:24:44 PM EDT
[#23]
I told you guys way back in the earlier pages of the Ukraine invasion thread that the NORD 2 was being used. It's just that Germany has been calling it certification testing to get around the EU ban.
I don't think 7 bar poses a big issue, but if it drops lower, sea water could leak in and damage the pipe. So I believe this is the russians cutting off Germany's under the table gas supply with just enough pressure to prevent pressure from the ocean to damage the pipeline. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:26:52 PM EDT
[#24]
What is the fine print on the insurance policy and loan covenants?
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:28:51 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Claiming the pipe is "damaged" allows them to restrict flow to prevent Germany & Europe from filling stockpiles to draw against come winter. Gee Guys - we'd LOVE to send you more gas to stockpile, but the danged pipeline has a leak somewhere ... Sorry! Quoted: ... Except for the fact that Germany already said "no thanks" to Nord Stream 2 right before the Russian invasion of Ukraine ... so NO gas has been flowing through it to Germany. You are 100% Correct Sir!! Nord Stream 2 was completed but not used to pump natural gas to Germany because of the Ukraine Invasion (Oops!! - "Special Russian Military Operation to De-Nazi-fy Ukraine" ) But if the Russians claimed that the new pipe were "damaged" then the Russians could try to use that as an excuse to NOT pump in extra natural gas now for the Europeans to try to stockpile now in Europe - before "Winter Comes". If there is a time for maximum leverage, The Depths of Winter, is when I'd expect the Russians to try for maximum disruption in cutting the Natural Gas supply in Europe - Especially as the Ukrainians push back the Russians with the assistance of Modern NATO weapons. My Advice to Europeans? Now would be the Time to be stocking up on extra sweaters, mittens & sleeping bags and to chop & dry some firewood pronto... Bigger_Hammer
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:31:26 PM EDT
[#26]
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:32:34 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You are 100% Correct Sir!! Nord Stream 2 was completed but not used to pump natural gas to Germany because of the Ukraine Invasion (Oops!! - "Special Military Operation to De-Nazi-fy Ukraine" ) But if the Russians claimed that the new pipe were "damaged" then the Russians could try to use that as an excuse to NOT pump in extra natural gas now for the Europeans to stockpile in Europe before "Winter Comes". If there is a time for maximum leverage, The Depths of winter, is when I'd expect the Russians to try for maximum disruption in cutting the Natural Gas supply in Europe - Especially as the Ukrainians push back the Russians with the assistance of Modern NATO weapons. My Advice to Europeans? Now would be the Time to be stocking up on extra sweaters, mittens & sleeping bags and to chop & dry some firewood pronto... Bigger_Hammer Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Claiming the pipe is "damaged" allows them to restrict flow to prevent Germany & Europe from filling stockpiles to draw against come winter. Gee Guys - we'd LOVE to send you more gas to stockpile, but the danged pipeline has a leak somewhere ... Sorry! Quoted: ... Except for the fact that Germany already said "no thanks" to Nord Stream 2 right before the Russian invasion of Ukraine ... so NO gas has been flowing through it to Germany. You are 100% Correct Sir!! Nord Stream 2 was completed but not used to pump natural gas to Germany because of the Ukraine Invasion (Oops!! - "Special Military Operation to De-Nazi-fy Ukraine" ) But if the Russians claimed that the new pipe were "damaged" then the Russians could try to use that as an excuse to NOT pump in extra natural gas now for the Europeans to stockpile in Europe before "Winter Comes". If there is a time for maximum leverage, The Depths of winter, is when I'd expect the Russians to try for maximum disruption in cutting the Natural Gas supply in Europe - Especially as the Ukrainians push back the Russians with the assistance of Modern NATO weapons. My Advice to Europeans? Now would be the Time to be stocking up on extra sweaters, mittens & sleeping bags and to chop & dry some firewood pronto... Bigger_Hammer lol |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:32:45 PM EDT
[#28]
There's a man out there with tons of oil industry experience who can solve this problem:
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:32:55 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just like WE shouldn’t have put all our eggs in China’s basket Bunch of dumb F politicians…all over the place! Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Should’ve never put all of their eggs in Putin’s basket Just like WE shouldn’t have put all our eggs in China’s basket Bunch of dumb F politicians…all over the place! When they do it because they are bribed by a foreign country they aren't stupid, they're traitors. Stupid is thinking that it was a mistake while knowing they were and still are in china's pocket. |
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:34:47 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's definitely leaking. Danish F16s overflew the area (near the Danish island of Bornholm) and reportedly saw "bubbling" on the surface. So if you dropped some flares in the plume, what would happen 
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:34:58 PM EDT
[#31]
Quick, send money to fix it...
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:35:59 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So if you dropped some flares in the plume, what would happen Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It's definitely leaking. Danish F16s overflew the area (near the Danish island of Bornholm) and reportedly saw "bubbling" on the surface. So if you dropped some flares in the plume, what would happen I don't k ow, but I would.like to see it! 
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:40:40 PM EDT
[#33]
This is terrible for Europe, we should send Ukraine a few more billion dollars.
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Posted: 9/26/2022 9:54:31 PM EDT
[#34]
The Russians were credibly accused of attacking an underwater telecom cable that ran to Svalbard earlier this year I think...maybe late last year.
Even though the dedicated minisub losharik (their version of NR-1) caught fire and burned badly in 2019 they seem to still have the ability to attack underwater infrastructure. I know very little about sub sea pipelines but I would think it's not something you can just use explosives on and hope to maintain any predictable pressure. If they did attack it they probably had to work at it. I don't understand though, why attack a supposedly unused pipeline that they can just turn off? |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 1:30:32 AM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Russians were credibly accused of attacking an underwater telecom cable that ran to Svalbard earlier this year I think...maybe late last year. Even though the dedicated minisub losharik (their version of NR-1) caught fire and burned badly in 2019 they seem to still have the ability to attack underwater infrastructure. I know very little about sub sea pipelines but I would think it's not something you can just use explosives on and hope to maintain any predictable pressure. If they did attack it they probably had to work at it. I don't understand though, why attack a supposedly unused pipeline that they can just turn off? I don’t see why it would have to be the Russians who sabotaged it. In fact, there are many others who gain from this. Cui bono? -Ukraine. Cutting potential Russian revenue sources would be job #1. - US - reduce options for Eur dependency on Rus. - Any oil producing Eur country, or Eur country wanting to steer a non-Russian energy dependency path. - Any major non-Russian oil producer. - Many I am not even thinking of. I personally wanted to sabotage the pipeline back in March as a preventative (being anti-Putin). It’s narrow to think it’s a Russian job. It’s also entirely possible it’s an accident. |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 1:51:57 AM EDT
[#36]
I find this a bit…perplexing.
Doesn’t make sense for Russia to attack their own pipeline; they can just shut it off (which it sounds like they had more or less done anyway?). Destroying it only takes both leverage and potential much-needed revenue away from them. A genuine accident / unforeseen consequence of shutting it down (or whatever) would seem to be a possibility, but the Germans seem pretty confident it was an intentional attack. And other actors with something to gain (Ukraine, OPEC nations, USA) probably either don’t have the undersea capability to sabotage the line, or are strong enough European allies to probably not want to do this. |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 2:06:04 AM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I told you guys way back in the earlier pages of the Ukraine invasion thread that the NORD 2 was being used. It's just that Germany has been calling it certification testing to get around the EU ban. I don't think 7 bar poses a big issue, but if it drops lower, sea water could leak in and damage the pipe. So I believe this is the russians cutting off Germany's under the table gas supply with just enough pressure to prevent pressure from the ocean to damage the pipeline. |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 2:08:47 AM EDT
[#38]
It's happening!
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Posted: 9/27/2022 2:27:35 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I find this a bit…perplexing. Doesn’t make sense for Russia to attack their own pipeline; they can just shut it off (which it sounds like they had more or less done anyway?). Destroying it only takes both leverage and potential much-needed revenue away from them. A genuine accident / unforeseen consequence of shutting it down (or whatever) would seem to be a possibility, but the Germans seem pretty confident it was an intentional attack. And other actors with something to gain (Ukraine, OPEC nations, USA) probably either don’t have the undersea capability to sabotage the line, or are strong enough European allies to probably not want to do this. And that’s the really perplexing thing. Those who might do it, can’t. Those which can do it, wouldn’t. Very, very weird. |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 2:28:23 AM EDT
[#40]
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Posted: 9/27/2022 2:48:27 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's definitely leaking. Danish F16s overflew the area (near the Danish island of Bornholm) and reportedly saw "bubbling" on the surface. Pretty sure I couldn't resist a fly-by flair drop on that. |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 2:59:51 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This pipeline was not in use, and Russia halted sales to Europe overall weeks ago. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Claiming the pipe is "damaged" allows them to restrict flow to prevent Germany & Europe from filling stockpiles to draw against come winter. Gee Guys - we'd LOVE to send you more gas to stockpile, but the danged pipeline has a leak somewhere ... Sorry! Bigger_Hammer This pipeline was not in use, and Russia halted sales to Europe overall weeks ago. Yes, facts are hard for some folks |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 3:15:41 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I told you guys way back in the earlier pages of the Ukraine invasion thread that the NORD 2 was being used. It's just that Germany has been calling it certification testing to get around the EU ban. I don't think 7 bar poses a big issue, but if it drops lower, sea water could leak in and damage the pipe. So I believe this is the russians cutting off Germany's under the table gas supply with just enough pressure to prevent pressure from the ocean to damage the pipeline. Are the Russians also bubbling gas up from the sea floor to make it look like a leak? |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 3:36:27 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are the Russians also bubbling gas up from the sea floor to make it look like a leak? Pretty sure it's safe to say Russians don't float, otherwise the Kursk wouldn't have been such an issue...
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Posted: 9/27/2022 4:51:36 AM EDT
[#45]
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Posted: 9/27/2022 4:58:27 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Russia's making plenty of bank on selling discount oil to the Chinese, India, even the Saudi's are buying it and selling it to other countries. Green Europe is not a cash cow for petroleum a lot of people are trying to make them out to be. Besides, they were warned. They can freeze. There's even a German word for that: schadenfreude Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Russia doing that would serve them no purpose. If they didn’t want to send material through all they have to do is say “no” and they get their way AND have a bargaining tool. Damaging the pipe only removes their bargaining power. Russia's making plenty of bank on selling discount oil to the Chinese, India, even the Saudi's are buying it and selling it to other countries. Green Europe is not a cash cow for petroleum a lot of people are trying to make them out to be. Besides, they were warned. They can freeze. There's even a German word for that: schadenfreude Europe being green forces the Europeans to buy Russian gas. The leak definitely harms Russia. |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 5:12:05 AM EDT
[#47]
Damage reported in three strings of the Nord Stream pipelines.
Nord Stream AG said it was impossible to estimate when the gas network system's working capability would be restored. "The destruction that occurred on the same day simultaneously on three strings of the offshore gas pipelines of the Nord Stream system is unprecedented. It is not yet possible to estimate the timing of the restoration of the gas transport infrastructure," it said in comments to reporters. https://finance.yahoo.com/news/1-nord-stream-operator-says-083712944.html |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 5:43:38 AM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I don’t see why it would have to be the Russians who sabotaged it. In fact, there are many others who gain from this. Cui bono? -Ukraine. Cutting potential Russian revenue sources would be job #1. - US - reduce options for Eur dependency on Rus. - Any oil producing Eur country, or Eur country wanting to steer a non-Russian energy dependency path. - Any major non-Russian oil producer. - Many I am not even thinking of. I personally wanted to sabotage the pipeline back in March as a preventative (being anti-Putin). It’s narrow to think it’s a Russian job. It’s also entirely possible it’s an accident. A number of underwater pipelines & undersea communication cables are damaged every year by nothing more "evil" than ships anchors, fishing trawler nets & other 'normal activities' ... Or we can consider the factor of the much vaunted "Russian Initial Build Quality" for which the Lada (a Russian built Fiat) was famously known  ...  Bigger_Hammer
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Posted: 9/27/2022 5:54:50 AM EDT
[#49]
Or Russians opened the other valves end?
 Kharn |
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Posted: 9/27/2022 5:58:23 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Damage reported in three strings of the Nord Stream pipelines. Nord Stream AG said it was impossible to estimate when the gas network system's working capability would be restored. "The destruction that occurred on the same day simultaneously on three strings of the offshore gas pipelines of the Nord Stream system is unprecedented. It is not yet possible to estimate the timing of the restoration of the gas transport infrastructure," it said in comments to reporters. https://finance.yahoo.com/news/1-nord-stream-operator-says-083712944.html Where did Hunter last drop anchor? How much does the big guy get for undersea trench-less pipe relining? Kharn |
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