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Posted: 5/8/2023 2:56:41 PM EDT
I live in/under a Military Operational Area.

This morning it sounds like an air show above our house. I know that most likely these are EA-18G’s out of Whidbey Island but they are high and fast and sweet Jose do they love flying into the sun.

Today is a perfect viewing day. Some clouds for reference but big chunks of bright blue sky.

I use ADSB for most “watching” but these guys don’t show up.
Link Posted: 5/8/2023 3:56:20 PM EDT
[#1]
Of course they don't.  

Why would the military squawk in a military operations area?  Do you think they squawk or have mode-S or even basic ADS-B on all the time?
Link Posted: 5/8/2023 4:05:47 PM EDT
[#2]
ADSBExchange is the only flight tracker site to not respect the LADD privacy program, so that's the one you want to use.

https://nbaa.org/aircraft-operations/security/privacy/ads-b-privacy-faq/

However, there may not be coverage where you need it. And there are a LOT of (most?) military aircraft that are not even equipped with ADS-B yet. And even if they are they don't always have Mode S enabled (what those with hobby ADS-B receivers use to track aircraft).

In some areas there are sufficient ADSBExchange receivers so that aircraft that are only squawking Mode C (non-ADS-B aircraft) can be tracked with MLAT (multi-lateration).

So it's kind of a crapshoot. Sometime you see them on the tracking websites and sometimes you don't, depending on where you are, what ground resources are available around there, how the aircraft are equipped, and how they are operating.
Link Posted: 5/14/2023 1:53:07 AM EDT
[#3]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Of course they don't.  

Why would the military squawk in a military operations area?  Do you think they squawk or have mode-S or even basic ADS-B on all the time?
View Quote


My airspace doesn't have a MOA but there are a couple Guard battalion airports with a lot of helicopter operations.  Some have local discrete codes to operate on but often are on 1200 doing their own thing.  On our radar scopes we have a button to push that when we see a 1200 beacon, we hit it and it shows the tail number no matter what registration (and it discriminates between types).  That's ADS-B working, so whatever civilian means of ADS-B tracking you use, just use that.  Can they turn that off?  I have no clue.
Link Posted: 5/14/2023 7:10:21 AM EDT
[#4]
If properly equipped they can turn Mode S off:

https://nbaa.org/aircraft-operations/communications-navigation-surveillance-cns/ads-b/faa-permits-ads-b-off-military-sensitive-flights/

Even civilian aircraft can. If I go into the engineering menu of my transponder before flight I can do it. Of course in that case as soon as I try to fly in the ATC system controllers will be telling me my transponder is broken!
Link Posted: 5/16/2023 11:35:32 AM EDT
[#5]
European air space rules seem to be different….

Over England it’s common to see the Euro-Fighters and F-15’s on ADS-B. I’ve seen F-16’s and even F-35’s over parts of Europe.

As mentioned our high performance.mil guys must just turn that transponder off here.
Link Posted: 5/17/2023 9:18:49 PM EDT
[#6]
Another thing to consider (in the US) is that ATC may request (or require) the a/c to turn off their transponders while operating in the MOA or restricted area. Back when I worked (cue the kids chorus of "When Dinosaurs roamed the earth...") on the east coast, we had control of R 6608. When military a/c entered the airspace, we asked them to squawk standby so we would not get all the annoying low altitude and other conflict alerts while they played around in their little space.
Link Posted: 5/18/2023 1:55:59 AM EDT
[#7]
We were always squawking a discreet code in the MOA, but that was before ads-b.  I've been out of that loop for a while so I dont know how they do it now.
Link Posted: 5/18/2023 7:15:35 PM EDT
[#8]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

As mentioned our high performance.mil guys must just turn that transponder off here.
View Quote


No, they're on, just not mode-S.  They're using mode A/C. The flight tracking site only works with mode-S.
Link Posted: 9/20/2023 1:00:19 PM EDT
[#9]
Well, they sure are not shy about making their presence known. Lots of training going on now and while they don’t break the sound barrier they use a lot of afterburner.
Link Posted: 9/22/2023 2:14:02 PM EDT
[#10]
Although not a requirement, a NOTAM normally is issued when MOA is active. If not, just call flight service and ask if your specific MOA is active or is scheduled to be active.
Link Posted: 9/22/2023 5:24:36 PM EDT
[#11]
I always wanted to know, without violating a TFR, how to get jets to form up on me or intercept me for fun.
Link Posted: 9/25/2023 2:07:42 PM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I always wanted to know, without violating a TFR, how to get jets to form up on me or intercept me for fun.
View Quote


That sounds a bit like asking to see where the sniper is in a hostage situation.

Link Posted: 10/7/2023 7:01:01 PM EDT
[#13]
Nah, I was more thinking of calling up the MOA operator, volunteer to be a target as a meander through. I know it doesn't work like that, but it sounded fun.
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