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Posted: 12/15/2018 4:58:25 PM EDT
I got a new job with a great increase in pay.  The problem is that they do not have a 401k or any other retirement.

I will probably only be able to partially fund a Roth due to hitting income limits.

What are my options?  All I am familiar with is 401k's and Roths.
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 5:40:58 PM EDT
[#1]
For tax-deferred, you can start a personal IRA, the contributions to which are tax-free up to a certain yearly limit. Roth is just a type of personal IRA that is not tax-deferred, but from which you can draw tax-free distributions later.

Also investing in mutual funds, stocks and bonds are available to you.
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 5:41:25 PM EDT
[#2]
IRA
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 5:51:21 PM EDT
[#3]
Fund Roth to the limit, then fund conventional IRA to the limit, then buy property
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 6:01:15 PM EDT
[#4]
That would be very disappointing, the personal IRA limitations are significant vs 401k/sep/etc
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 6:02:19 PM EDT
[#5]
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Quoted:
Fund Roth to the limit, then fund conventional IRA to the limit, then buy property
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Roth + conventional (non-deductible) IRA limit is $5500.

Buying property seems risky to me, and I'm not sure I want to take that gamble with all my retirement savings over $5500 a year.
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 6:04:29 PM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
For tax-deferred, you can start a personal IRA, the contributions to which are tax-free up to a certain yearly limit. Roth is just a type of personal IRA that is not tax-deferred, but from which you can draw tax-free distributions later.

Also investing in mutual funds, stocks and bonds are available to you.
View Quote
I honestly didn't know I could buy mutual funds directly, like one would buy a stock.  That seems like a good way to go, even if I don't get the benefits of tax deductions that a 401k gives.

How complicated does buying mutual funds/stocks directly make my taxes?  I've always done my own taxes.
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 6:09:00 PM EDT
[#7]
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Quoted:
That would be very disappointing, the personal IRA limitations are significant vs 401k/sep/etc
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Agreed, but the bump in pay (and job satisfaction since it's a new role) are very significant.

I understand 401k have quite a bit of paperwork/expenses.  My company employs maybe 400 people total across the nation, so that's probably why they don't have a 401k setup.
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 6:37:38 PM EDT
[#8]
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Quoted:
I honestly didn't know I could buy mutual funds directly, like one would buy a stock.  That seems like a good way to go, even if I don't get the benefits of tax deductions that a 401k gives.

How complicated does buying mutual funds/stocks directly make my taxes?  I've always done my own taxes.
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Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
For tax-deferred, you can start a personal IRA, the contributions to which are tax-free up to a certain yearly limit. Roth is just a type of personal IRA that is not tax-deferred, but from which you can draw tax-free distributions later.

Also investing in mutual funds, stocks and bonds are available to you.
I honestly didn't know I could buy mutual funds directly, like one would buy a stock.  That seems like a good way to go, even if I don't get the benefits of tax deductions that a 401k gives.

How complicated does buying mutual funds/stocks directly make my taxes?  I've always done my own taxes.
It’s not complicated, but you do need to be sure you buy things that are tax efficient in a taxable account, where that wouldn’t have been a concern in an IRA or 401k. Things like passive index mutual funds with low turnover.
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 8:13:16 PM EDT
[#9]
You can set up a brokerage account with Fidelity, Vanguard, or one of many others.  Fidelity and Vanguard have very low cost mutual funds. I did Vanguard since I had an IRA with them. Index funds are pretty tax friendly (not a lot of dividends distributed).  Good news is that long-term capital gains are (currently) taxed lower than my regular income tax rate.
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 8:35:36 PM EDT
[#10]
Quoted:
I got a new job with a great increase in pay.  The problem is that they do not have a 401k or any other retirement.

I will probably only be able to partially fund a Roth due to hitting income limits.

What are my options?  All I am familiar with is 401k's and Roths.
View Quote
There's no particular reason why retirement funds must be in a tax advantaged account like an IRA or a 401k.  It's good to use them if you have them but they aren't the be all end all of places to store assets for retirement.

You can always just open up a regular brokerage account and buy all the same stuff.  I can no longer contribute to an IRA so everything I save above and beyond my 401k limit just goes in a regular brokerage account.
Link Posted: 12/15/2018 8:35:55 PM EDT
[#11]
If you can’t do a Roth can you do a traditional IRA so you can have at least some tax advantaged space?

I’d put Total Market in taxable and max the IRA into Total Bond depending on your AA.
Link Posted: 12/17/2018 12:28:54 PM EDT
[#12]
I R A
Link Posted: 12/17/2018 1:43:14 PM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Roth + conventional (non-deductible) IRA limit is $5500.

Buying property seems risky to me, and I'm not sure I want to take that gamble with all my retirement savings over $5500 a year.
View Quote
Starting in 2019, the IRS raised the IRA contribution limit to $6,000 per year plus an extra $1,000 catch-up contribution if you’re over 50.
Link Posted: 12/17/2018 1:46:15 PM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

I honestly didn't know I could buy mutual funds directly, like one would buy a stock.  That seems like a good way to go, even if I don't get the benefits of tax deductions that a 401k gives.

How complicated does buying mutual funds/stocks directly make my taxes?  I've always done my own taxes.
View Quote
I’ve been doing my own taxes with mutual funds and ETFs for a few years now. It’s not much more complicated. Just need to make sure you buy the right software level to handle it. For example, I use Turbo Tax and have to buy a higher level than the basic edition to be able to file investments tax data. With Turbo Tax, my Vanguard account data is imported quite easily. Adds maybe 5 minutes to filling out my return. It usually takes about an extra week from when I can download the tax forms from my Vanguard account to when Turbo Tax can import them electronically directly from Vanguard.
Link Posted: 12/17/2018 1:47:51 PM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Agreed, but the bump in pay (and job satisfaction since it's a new role) are very significant.

I understand 401k have quite a bit of paperwork/expenses.  My company employs maybe 400 people total across the nation, so that's probably why they don't have a 401k setup.
View Quote
Yes, there’s a good bit of paperwork and work associated with managing a 401k; however, your company can source that out to the investment firm that operates it.

Does your company have anything else like SEP IRA or SIMPLE?
Link Posted: 12/17/2018 1:50:18 PM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
There's no particular reason why retirement funds must be in a tax advantaged account like an IRA or a 401k.  It's good to use them if you have them but they aren't the be all end all of places to store assets for retirement.

You can always just open up a regular brokerage account and buy all the same stuff.  I can no longer contribute to an IRA so everything I save above and beyond my 401k limit just goes in a regular brokerage account.
View Quote
@woodsie Have you considered a backdoor Roth IRA? If you’re income is too high for a Roth, it’s also too high to claim a tax deduction on a traditional IRA. However, you can still use a backdoor Roth instead of a taxable brokerage account. That way, all of the earnings in the Roth are tax-free unlike your taxable brokerage account.
Link Posted: 12/17/2018 1:54:21 PM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
If you can’t do a Roth can you do a traditional IRA so you can have at least some tax advantaged space?

I’d put Total Market in taxable and max the IRA into Total Bond depending on your AA.
View Quote
Yes, because he is not covered by a retirement plan at work, he can claim the full tax deduction on a traditional IRA.

Read this IRS page and the links on it.
Link Posted: 12/17/2018 5:45:37 PM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Yes, there’s a good bit of paperwork and work associated with managing a 401k; however, your company can source that out to the investment firm that operates it.

Does your company have anything else like SEP IRA or SIMPLE?
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

Agreed, but the bump in pay (and job satisfaction since it's a new role) are very significant.

I understand 401k have quite a bit of paperwork/expenses.  My company employs maybe 400 people total across the nation, so that's probably why they don't have a 401k setup.
Yes, there’s a good bit of paperwork and work associated with managing a 401k; however, your company can source that out to the investment firm that operates it.

Does your company have anything else like SEP IRA or SIMPLE?
Seriously, companies like Fidelity will step all over themselves to sign a couple hundred employee company up. I'd be nagging said new employer for something...
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 12:09:43 AM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Seriously, companies like Fidelity will step all over themselves to sign a couple hundred employee company up. I'd be nagging said new employer for something...
View Quote
Exactly right. Any company of more than 10 employees can easily get setup. The company I’m with now has 8 and we have 401k and benefits package
Link Posted: 12/18/2018 2:29:28 AM EDT
[#20]
1.  Do a personal traditional IRA
2.  Convert above IRA to Roth if you want (see BackDoor Roth)
3.  Fun a personal Roth IRA as much as your income allows.
4.  Open a regular taxable account, and fund it with regular purchases of ETF's.  ETF's are more tax efficient when held in a non-tax advantaged account.
5.  If your company offers an HSA - fully fund it, and don't spend it (pay out of pocket for medical care).  Invest the money in market funds/ETFs and let it grow tax free to be used in retirement.

The loss of having a 401k would be a HUGE issue for me to consider changing companies.  You lose the tax benefits of lowering your taxable income AND lose the company match.  A company would have to pay me at least $15,000 more a year to even break even losing that benefit.
Link Posted: 12/20/2018 11:10:10 AM EDT
[#21]
Max your IRA, then open an account with Vanguard.  Taxes are reasonably straightforward.  Vanguard will send you a tax statement that contains the information you need.  Do not be surprised if you get a "revised" tax statement later.  If you have already filed, you may need to file an amended return.  As a result, we typically don't file until the deadline.

I believe that it is wise to save additional retirement funds outside or government regulated IRA/401K/TSP/pension plans.  It would be far easier for a democrat communist majority government to "nationalize" your government regulated tax advantaged retirement savings than it would be to confiscate other investments.  Most people do not have enough saved, and all the commies need is a serious market drop to justify a government take over of retirement funds "for your own good."

That said, I maximize the employer match on my 401k, and my wife maximizes the match in her TSP plan.  I wouldn't worry too much about the government nationalizing IRA/401k/TSP plans until your net worth exceeds a few million.  Even then, maximize employer match before you worry about retirement savings outside regulated plans.
Link Posted: 12/20/2018 12:59:46 PM EDT
[#22]
Your company should be doing a SIMPLE plan IRA for all of you.

Easy AF to set up and administer.

But in the mean time...talk to a fee based FA. They will charge you like $200 and get you straight.
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