User Panel
Posted: 3/21/2019 12:16:36 AM EDT
So my son and I have been riding and storing our dirtbikes at the grandparents home in arizona (Quartzsite) . We live in Washington state.
Grandpa sold the house and it closed last week. Grandpa had a verbal agreement through the realtors that we would collect the bikes this week (less than 7 days after closing). But nothing in writing concerning our bikes. So we show up today and the buyer tells us that any property left was taken away and "donated to charity". So he disposed of our bikes and won't tell us anything further. I filed a report with the local police. The cop wasn't sure what he could do about the situation. Does this guy have a right to steal/dispose of our bikes? He freely admits he took our bikes, is he going to jail or laughing to the bank? |
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What could have stopped you getting your bikes before closing?
It's theirs after closing. |
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This is probably a case of since you didn't have it in writing, it didn't happen.
If he really donated them to charity, will he not tell you where he did so? Perhaps you could get them back with some sort of proof you owned them and a cash donation. ETA: Can the cops ask him where he donated them? Seems simple enough for them to ask. |
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Civil suit. Conversion. Trespass on chattel.
He can call the charity to see if they can give it back. He never had title to those bikes and therefore was not in position to donate them. |
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Quoted:
This is probably a case of since you didn't have it in writing, it didn't happen. If he really donated them to charity, will he not tell you where he did so? Perhaps you could get them back with some sort of proof you owned them and a cash donation. ETA: Can the cops ask him where he donated them? Seems simple enough for them to ask. View Quote |
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I just got to Arizona today and was assured by grandpa that buyers were ok waiting a couple days and that he had discussed with the issue with the realtors.
I have the titles to the bikes... can someone just claim my property? |
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I just got to Arizona today and was assured by grandpa that buyers were ok waiting a couple days and that he had discussed with the issue with the realtors. I have the titles to the bikes... can someone just claim my property? View Quote I'd try to play nice and see if they'll do anything to help track them down. |
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Your property was on their property without their written permission. What happens when your car gets towed? I'd try to play nice and see if they'll do anything to help track them down. View Quote |
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Almost all real estate deals state any property left behind becomes the new owners. With out it in writing you are sol.
I would go after the agent. |
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Quoted:
Almost all real estate deals state any property left behind becomes the new owners. With out it in writing you are sol. I would go after the agent. View Quote |
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I would report them as stolen property and give all details to police. If they were insured contact your insurance company and give them the details.
Check out craigslist and watch for them to show up in a for sale listing. |
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I really doubt he gave them to charity. That mf sold them.
I would report them stolen. |
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That guy would be picking his fucking teeth off of the ground, but I'm not exactly smart about shit like that.
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Almost all real estate deals state any property left behind becomes the new owners. With out it in writing you are sol. I would go after the agent. View Quote Exceptions will be made in writing, along with a specified deadline for pickup. Maybe it didn't get added into the paperwork because the new owner might have wanted the old owner to pay a storage fee. |
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Quoted: I don't think it works that way with a titled vehicle. That's a bit different than a wheelbarrow or a shovel in the garage. View Quote Granted, it's a douche move, but this one is on the grandparents and realtor. |
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Good thing grandpa is currently sitting on a pile of cash from a home sale.
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purely a civil matter, if you can establish to the courts satisfaction, that a verbal agreement took place (going to be hard) as the law normally states, anything on the property at time & date of close, is surrendered. Anything to the contrary must be accompanied with a signed written contract done well in advance, blah blah blahh... which can include storage fees.
This question begs to be asked however, if the bikes where so important, why did it take you so long to go get them?..its not like a house is listed, goes thru escrow &/or sells overnight. |
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Almost all real estate deals state any property left behind becomes the new owners. With out it in writing you are sol. I would go after the agent. View Quote You should contact the state board of realtors to file a complaint. If he values his license, he should want to help you get it resolved. Definitely report vehicles as stolen to Police & Insurance. And finally is nothing else can be done, Grand Pappy owes you replacements. Why in the hell do people think anything oral - unwritten has any validity when it could have been written? |
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Ouch
those things are expensive what kind of dirt bikes were they? |
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I'm sort of amazed (well no, not really) at all of the people advocating filing a false police report.
Nothing like being fed a shit sandwich and than going back to ask for seconds and a "take home" box. |
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Depends on the state laws.
Your DMV or grandpa's DMV would probably know best in terms titles and such. In many cases an abandoned vehicle on private property isn't considered property of the land owner until attempts are made to contact the vehicle's owner. What the new land owner should have done was applied for a title first. The new home owner might just have sold someone else's property. He didn't even have the title to sell it. Both him and the buyer are screwed and the case should go in your favor. Get a copy of the contract and double check that the bikes are not in the "included in sale" section. Find out the laws and contact a lawyer. |
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Depends on the state laws. Your DMV or grandpa's DMV would probably know best in terms titles and such. In many cases an abandoned vehicle on private property isn't considered property of the land owner until attempts are made to contact the vehicle's owner. What the new land owner should have done was applied for a title first. The new home owner might just have sold someone else's property. He didn't even have the title to sell it. Both him and the buyer are screwed and the case should go in your favor. Get a copy of the contract and double check that the bikes are not in the "included in sale" section. Find out the laws and contact a lawyer. View Quote He was under no obligation to store a third party's property after buying the house. This is completely on the seller - he should be the one reimbursing OP or doing the leg work. |
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So soon after, he didn't sell them. He gave them to his kid or nephew or a friend or something, or they're at his cabin, someplace like that. Bet me.
They're still around. Question is, are they still yours, and can you find them, and can you get them back? Legally, this may create the awkward situation of you having a claim against nobody but your grandfather. But I am not a lawyer. Good luck. |
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You know who could tell you right away? A lawyer licensed to practice in Arizona.
But nobody ever does that. |
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What's Arizona law on abandoned property?
Your Grandpa's contract was with the realtor ... and he sold the house to the buyer. California law is that anything left behind is abandoned property/found treasure. I found $1500 worth of gold (one ounce) and silver (many ounces) in my attic. |
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Titled vehicle makes a difference.
If the new property owner claims they didn't know about you picking them up, they would have been required to contact the DMV and submit an abandoned vehicle form. Example: MVD receives a request from a tow company to file a vehicle as abandoned. MVD sends notice to the owner, lien holder and any other interested party providing information that they have 30 days to reclaim the vehicle. If the vehicle is not claimed, ownership may be transferred free and clear to the towing company. |
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Somebody should have taken the 5 minutes to put it in writing.
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First question is: What is the value of the bikes, realistically?
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Quoted:
What's Arizona law on abandoned property? Your Grandpa's contract was with the realtor ... and he sold the house to the buyer. California law is that anything left behind is abandoned property/found treasure. I found $1500 worth of gold (one ounce) and silver (many ounces) in my attic. View Quote |
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Read the section in here about personal property and then see a lawyer.
http://www.harperlawaz.com/blog/2013/9/10/the-nuts-and-bolts-of-arizona-real-estate-contracts "The rule is that the buyer purchases the fixtures annexed to the real property, but not the personal property unless it is specified in the purchase contract." |
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You as the owner should have liked your motorcycles enough to go get them . Did grandpa just list the house for sale 2 weeks ago? If so then okay. If not then you had time and ignored the facts and created the situation by being busy. Now it is up to civil courts and /or police to sort it out.
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Quoted:
Read the section in here about personal property and then see a lawyer. http://www.harperlawaz.com/blog/2013/9/10/the-nuts-and-bolts-of-arizona-real-estate-contracts The rule is that the buyer purchases the fixtures annexed to the real property, but not the personal property unless it is specified in the purchase contract. View Quote OP, what day of the week did the closing take place on? |
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The new homeowner should have applied for a title for an abandoned vehicle, which given the short period of time, I doubt he did. I find it hard to believe a charity would haul off the bikes without clear title.
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A charity would require a title.
Even to scrap you need to prove ownership (registration, ID). |
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Should have been in writing somewhere or it goes with the sale.
Titled vehicles are going to muddy the waters here a bit. |
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