Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
BCM
Durkin Tactical Franklin Armory
User Panel

Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 3
Posted: 7/29/2018 7:44:44 AM EDT
Link

Buttleggers love New York.

That’s because it is fertile ground for their illegal activities, since it is now more expensive than ever to buy smokes in the Big Apple.

New York has “the worst smuggling problem in America,” said Scott Drenkard, with the Tax Foundation.

The least one can now legally pay for a pack in New York City is $13, which was recently raised from $10.50.

“For someone who smokes cigarettes regularly, cigarettes [for a month] can cost as much as two months’ worth of groceries, family cell phone bills for a year, or a vacation,” according to Dr. Mary Travis Bassett, New York City Health and Mental Hygiene Commissioner.

Cigarette taxes and a new minimum price rule have raised the price of a pack by about 200 percent over the past decade.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 7:46:15 AM EDT
[#1]
NYC Cigarette smuggling and sales rampant with new taxes...
View Quote
Welcome to.....always.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:02:32 AM EDT
[#2]
No shit! Who would have thought
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:06:16 AM EDT
[#3]
Will the NYPD choke me to death for selling them?
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:14:57 AM EDT
[#4]
Up next, NYC bemoans lost cigarette tax income, which they use to fund some health care program and call for new taxes to make up the lost revenue.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:25:21 AM EDT
[#5]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Will the NYPD choke me to death for selling them?
View Quote
Pay the tax man!
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:27:17 AM EDT
[#6]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Will the NYPD choke me to death for selling them?
View Quote
Absolutely. There is plenty of video documenting the procedure.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:35:12 AM EDT
[#7]
Can I buy them here and ship them up there?

Serious question
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:38:21 AM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
Link

Buttleggers love New York.

That’s because it is fertile ground for their illegal activities, since it is now more expensive than ever to buy smokes in the Big Apple.

New York has “the worst smuggling problem in America,” said Scott Drenkard, with the Tax Foundation.

The least one can now legally pay for a pack in New York City is $13, which was recently raised from $10.50.

“For someone who smokes cigarettes regularly, cigarettes [for a month] can cost as much as two months’ worth of groceries, family cell phone bills for a year, or a vacation,” according to Dr. Mary Travis Bassett, New York City Health and Mental Hygiene Commissioner.

Cigarette taxes and a new minimum price rule have raised the price of a pack by about 200 percent over the past decade.
View Quote
Yet GD tells me that if pot is legalized and taxed then all the criminal behavior that surrounds the drug trade will disappear.

Call me NOT surprised.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:38:32 AM EDT
[#9]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Up next, NYC bemoans lost cigarette tax income, which they use to fund some health care program and call for new taxes to make up the lost revenue.
View Quote
Accurate
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:41:14 AM EDT
[#10]
Sin taxes strike again.

Who would have thunk it? If you raise taxes on a product to an arbitrary punitive point that the price no longer reflects the value the people will simply avoid the taxes. Fucking crazy pills the world must be taking.

This shit is like economics 101 level stuff. I got a 5 year old kid that could see that coming.

Of course, NY has *always* felt they can overcome human behavior through Draconian enforcement, rather than reasonable laws. I'm sure it'll all work out, in the finish.

They'll just choke a few hundred "smugglers" to death and eventually their vision will b realized.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:43:45 AM EDT
[#11]
Good. Piss on the targeted tax...
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:43:52 AM EDT
[#12]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Yet GD tells me that if pot is legalized and taxed then all the criminal behavior that surrounds the drug trade will disappear.

Call me NOT surprised.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Link

Buttleggers love New York.

That's because it is fertile ground for their illegal activities, since it is now more expensive than ever to buy smokes in the Big Apple.

New York has "the worst smuggling problem in America," said Scott Drenkard, with the Tax Foundation.

The least one can now legally pay for a pack in New York City is $13, which was recently raised from $10.50.

"For someone who smokes cigarettes regularly, cigarettes [for a month] can cost as much as two months' worth of groceries, family cell phone bills for a year, or a vacation," according to Dr. Mary Travis Bassett, New York City Health and Mental Hygiene Commissioner.

Cigarette taxes and a new minimum price rule have raised the price of a pack by about 200 percent over the past decade.
Yet GD tells me that if pot is legalized and taxed then all the criminal behavior that surrounds the drug trade will disappear.

Call me NOT surprised.
There's precious little criminal activity surrounding virtually ALL other property that ISN'T punitively taxed.

I don't think you've seen many proponents of legalization who ALSO champion the cause of levying taxes of multiple hundreds of percent over the value of the product in order to justify allowing it to be sold.

You'd have to be a moron to think people are going to put up with that shit.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:45:43 AM EDT
[#13]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Yet GD tells me that if pot is legalized and taxed then all the criminal behavior that surrounds the drug trade will disappear.

Call me NOT surprised.
View Quote
The difference here is New York blatantly creates this black market.  If all states legalize pot and one state sets a tax rate  200% higher than others, then yes, you're going to get "criminal" activity.  I suppose I used to be a criminal.  I lived in NJ and worked in Manhattan.  I'm from the Ohio Valley.  When I came home, I brought back multiple cartons of cigs for coworkers.  That's when they were cheap in NY, like $10 a pack.  I'd get cartons in WV for like $30-35.  They gave me a few bucks for my gas and trouble.  I should have become a full blown Cig dealer.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:50:51 AM EDT
[#14]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The difference here is New York blatantly creates this black market.  If all states legalize pot and one state sets a tax rate  200% higher than others, then yes, you're going to get "criminal" activity.  I suppose I used to be a criminal.  I lived in NJ and worked in Manhattan.  I'm from the Ohio Valley.  When I came home, I brought back multiple cartons of cigs for coworkers.  That's when they were cheap in NY, like $10 a pack.  I'd get cartons in WV for like $30-35.  They gave me a few bucks for my gas and trouble.  I should have become a full blown Cig dealer.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

Yet GD tells me that if pot is legalized and taxed then all the criminal behavior that surrounds the drug trade will disappear.

Call me NOT surprised.
The difference here is New York blatantly creates this black market.  If all states legalize pot and one state sets a tax rate  200% higher than others, then yes, you're going to get "criminal" activity.  I suppose I used to be a criminal.  I lived in NJ and worked in Manhattan.  I'm from the Ohio Valley.  When I came home, I brought back multiple cartons of cigs for coworkers.  That's when they were cheap in NY, like $10 a pack.  I'd get cartons in WV for like $30-35.  They gave me a few bucks for my gas and trouble.  I should have become a full blown Cig dealer.
Yeah, there's a risk-reward metric going on here. At a low level of taxation, it simply isn't worth the criminal activity.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:53:29 AM EDT
[#15]
Are loosies packs without NY tax stamps or individual cigarettes?
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:53:44 AM EDT
[#16]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Yeah, there's a risk-reward metric going on here. At a low level of taxation, it simply isn't worth the criminal activity.
View Quote
Right.  I think smoking is stupid, but the taxes on cigarettes in some states are fucking disgusting.  They only hurt the people that those states pretend to care about.  Wealthy people aren't going to be smoking at the same rates and they don't give a fuck how much cigarettes cost if they do.  Po folk get fuuuucked by the very people that pretend to want to help them.  Then they get fucked because they become criminal "buttleggers."
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:54:15 AM EDT
[#17]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Are loosies packs without NY tax stamps or individual cigarettes?
View Quote
Individual
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:54:52 AM EDT
[#18]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Can I buy them here and ship them up there?

Serious question
View Quote
What would be funny is if somebody set up a website where red staters could "gift"  carton of smokes to an NYC voter. Start winning hearts and minds and votes lol.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:56:14 AM EDT
[#19]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Sin taxes strike again.

Who would have thunk it? If you raise taxes on a product to an arbitrary punitive point that the price no longer reflects the value the people will simply avoid the taxes. Fucking crazy pills the world must be taking.

This shit is like economics 101 level stuff. I got a 5 year old kid that could see that coming.

Of course, NY has *always* felt they can overcome human behavior through Draconian enforcement, rather than reasonable laws. I'm sure it'll all work out, in the finish.

They'll just choke a few hundred "smugglers" to death and eventually their vision will b realized.
View Quote
Well, it worked so well during Prohibition...............
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:56:37 AM EDT
[#20]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Right.  I think smoking is stupid, but the taxes on cigarettes in some states are fucking disgusting.  They only hurt the people that those states pretend to care about.  Wealthy people aren't going to be smoking at the same rates and they don't give a fuck how much cigarettes cost if they do.  Po folk get fuuuucked by the very people that pretend to want to help them.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:

Yeah, there's a risk-reward metric going on here. At a low level of taxation, it simply isn't worth the criminal activity.
Right.  I think smoking is stupid, but the taxes on cigarettes in some states are fucking disgusting.  They only hurt the people that those states pretend to care about.  Wealthy people aren't going to be smoking at the same rates and they don't give a fuck how much cigarettes cost if they do.  Po folk get fuuuucked by the very people that pretend to want to help them.
The idea is to make it so expensive that the poor will stop smoking. As if an addict is going to choose fresh kale over their pack of smokes, based solely on tax hikes, and suddenly turn into Warren Buffet.

You know, moral busybodies playing the nanny state.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:57:59 AM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Well, it worked so well during Prohibition...............
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Sin taxes strike again.

Who would have thunk it? If you raise taxes on a product to an arbitrary punitive point that the price no longer reflects the value the people will simply avoid the taxes. Fucking crazy pills the world must be taking.

This shit is like economics 101 level stuff. I got a 5 year old kid that could see that coming.

Of course, NY has *always* felt they can overcome human behavior through Draconian enforcement, rather than reasonable laws. I'm sure it'll all work out, in the finish.

They'll just choke a few hundred "smugglers" to death and eventually their vision will b realized.
Well, it worked so well during Prohibition...............
You say "during prohibition" as if you're not sitting in the middle of one, right now.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:58:17 AM EDT
[#22]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
The idea is to make it so expensive that the poor will stop smoking. As if an addict is going to choose fresh kale over their pack of smokes, based solely on tax hikes, and suddenly turn into Warren Buffet.

You know, moral busybodies playing the nanny state.
View Quote
I know what the idea is.  Everyone knows for serious addicts it doesn't work.  And fuck that shit anyway.   Tax them by making them pay more for healthcare.  Actual consequences for their actions.  Live free and live with the consequences.

Imma start a side hustle mailing cigs to a few people in new york lol
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:59:36 AM EDT
[#23]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I know what the idea is.  Everyone knows for serious addicts it doesn't work.  And fuck that shit anyway.   Tax them by making them pay more for healthcare.  Actual consequences for their actions.  Live free and live with the consequences.

Imma start a side hustle mailing cigs to a few people in new york lol
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
The idea is to make it so expensive that the poor will stop smoking. As if an addict is going to choose fresh kale over their pack of smokes, based solely on tax hikes, and suddenly turn into Warren Buffet.

You know, moral busybodies playing the nanny state.
I know what the idea is.  Everyone knows for serious addicts it doesn't work.  And fuck that shit anyway.   Tax them by making them pay more for healthcare.  Actual consequences for their actions.  Live free and live with the consequences.

Imma start a side hustle mailing cigs to a few people in new york lol
I'd settle for "pay for their healthcare" but, now we're splitting hairs.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 8:59:46 AM EDT
[#24]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Up next, NYC bemoans lost cigarette tax income, which they use to fund some health care program new welfare program and call for new taxes to make up the lost revenue.
View Quote
Fixed.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:01:15 AM EDT
[#25]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
There's precious little criminal activity surrounding virtually ALL other property that ISN'T punitively taxed.

I don't think you've seen many proponents of legalization who ALSO champion the cause of levying taxes of multiple hundreds of percent over the value of the product in order to justify allowing it to be sold.

You'd have to be a moron to think people are going to put up with that shit.
View Quote
Purely anecdotal, but a good number of friends who are proponents argue for taxing the shit out of marijuana while using the argument "if it's legalized, the weed dealers (and the associated problems) will go away.  They see it as a panacea of taxes paying for everything under the sun.  The "loosies" trade is glaring evidence that adding excessive sin taxes to legalized marijuana will likely lead to a similar result.  I tried weed in my younger days and didn't like it, but don't give a shit if they legalize it.  I just don't want to see excessive sin taxes if/when they do.  It won't "fix" anything.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:03:34 AM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Yet GD tells me that if pot is legalized and taxed then all the criminal behavior that surrounds the drug trade will disappear.

Call me NOT surprised.
View Quote
Taxing and regulating goods and services is fucking retarded.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:05:27 AM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Welcome to.....always.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
NYC Cigarette smuggling and sales rampant with new taxes...
Welcome to.....always.
Been going on my whole life
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:06:15 AM EDT
[#28]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Purely anecdotal, but a good number of friends who are proponents argue for taxing the shit out of marijuana while using the argument "if it's legalized, the weed dealers (and the associated problems) will go away.  They see it as a panacea of taxes paying for everything under the sun.  The "loosies" trade is glaring evidence that adding excessive sin taxes to legalized marijuana will likely lead to a similar result.  I tried weed in my younger days and didn't like it, but don't give a shit if they legalize it.  I just don't want to see excessive sin taxes if/when they do.  It won't "fix" anything.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
There's precious little criminal activity surrounding virtually ALL other property that ISN'T punitively taxed.

I don't think you've seen many proponents of legalization who ALSO champion the cause of levying taxes of multiple hundreds of percent over the value of the product in order to justify allowing it to be sold.

You'd have to be a moron to think people are going to put up with that shit.
Purely anecdotal, but a good number of friends who are proponents argue for taxing the shit out of marijuana while using the argument "if it's legalized, the weed dealers (and the associated problems) will go away.  They see it as a panacea of taxes paying for everything under the sun.  The "loosies" trade is glaring evidence that adding excessive sin taxes to legalized marijuana will likely lead to a similar result.  I tried weed in my younger days and didn't like it, but don't give a shit if they legalize it.  I just don't want to see excessive sin taxes if/when they do.  It won't "fix" anything.
I'm sorry your friends are retarded. Please, offer them my condolences.

I should have said "many proponents of legalization with an IQ above their shoe size" instead.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:07:48 AM EDT
[#29]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Individual
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Are loosies packs without NY tax stamps or individual cigarettes?
Individual
Do they come in some sort of box? Seems like they would be easy to crush and hard to transport. Or do you just buy 1 cigarette to smoke it on the spot?
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:08:36 AM EDT
[#30]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
You say "during prohibition" as if you're not sitting in the middle of one, right now.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Sin taxes strike again.

Who would have thunk it? If you raise taxes on a product to an arbitrary punitive point that the price no longer reflects the value the people will simply avoid the taxes. Fucking crazy pills the world must be taking.

This shit is like economics 101 level stuff. I got a 5 year old kid that could see that coming.

Of course, NY has *always* felt they can overcome human behavior through Draconian enforcement, rather than reasonable laws. I'm sure it'll all work out, in the finish.

They'll just choke a few hundred "smugglers" to death and eventually their vision will b realized.
Well, it worked so well during Prohibition...............
You say "during prohibition" as if you're not sitting in the middle of one, right now.
Oh, I know we are..................I was referring to the original prohibition................you would think they would have learned that when you tell someone they cant have something, the reply is "watch this"
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:09:00 AM EDT
[#31]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Will the NYPD choke me to death for selling them?
View Quote
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:09:59 AM EDT
[#32]
Can we sell them cigarette kits like selling magazines to California? Let them assemble them into a taxed box?

How about cutting 2/3rds of the length off?
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:10:01 AM EDT
[#33]
They'll take care of it.

Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:15:45 AM EDT
[#34]
Wait, hold up. Are you telling me that crazy high taxes on a high demand product that is easy to acquire and sell illegally, has a large black market? No way. I don't buy it. There has to be another reason.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:18:46 AM EDT
[#35]
This is nothing new. In North Carolina, Highway 301 and now I-95 has been lined with cigarette stores to catch the snowbirds shuttling back and forth between Florida and New York.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:19:07 AM EDT
[#36]
Tea prices are way down.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:19:09 AM EDT
[#37]
$13! Soon it will be a buck a stick.

I quit smoking a couple years ago, but even then I know some places I could score a pack for 4 bucks, that NY Tax is insane.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:19:12 AM EDT
[#38]
I got the car, who has the truck?

Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:34:38 AM EDT
[#39]
The article says:

"With already almost the highest cigarette taxes in the nation, New York officials haven’t added more taxes. Instead, they now require sellers raise the minimum price of a pack by $2.50."

Where are the taxes higher and why aren't we hearing about that place?

Not that I give a shit, tried smoking as a kid(doesn't everyone?) and decided to pass.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:37:08 AM EDT
[#40]
This thread, OMG, I  can't breath
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:37:22 AM EDT
[#41]
Bordering states must change their laws to make NY safer.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:41:21 AM EDT
[#42]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Been going on my whole life
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
NYC Cigarette smuggling and sales rampant with new taxes...
Welcome to.....always.
Been going on my whole life
I used to see it as a rookie walking a footpost on Fulton Street 24 years ago. Guys standing next to their cars with a truck full of cartons they were selling.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:42:27 AM EDT
[#43]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Do they come in some sort of box? Seems like they would be easy to crush and hard to transport. Or do you just buy 1 cigarette to smoke it on the spot?
View Quote
To smoke on the spot.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:42:52 AM EDT
[#44]
This is one of the reasons they keep wanting to get rid of cash.  That way they could eliminate the black market and squeeze people for all the taxes they want.

Black markets are just a sign that the system of above board commerce isn't serving the market.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:43:06 AM EDT
[#45]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Sin taxes strike again.

Who would have thunk it? If you raise taxes on a product to an arbitrary punitive point that the price no longer reflects the value the people will simply avoid the taxes. Fucking crazy pills the world must be taking.

This shit is like economics 101 level stuff. I got a 5 year old kid that could see that coming.

Of course, NY has *always* felt they can overcome human behavior through Draconian enforcement, rather than reasonable laws. I'm sure it'll all work out, in the finish.

They'll just choke a few hundred "smugglers" to death and eventually their vision will b realized.
View Quote
No doubt. It’s been done befo
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:43:12 AM EDT
[#46]
Cigs should be sold on Amazon for this reason alone. Crush NY sales of cigs and the taxes they collect.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:44:50 AM EDT
[#47]
Uh cahnt breeve
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:45:58 AM EDT
[#48]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Right.  I think smoking is stupid, but the taxes on cigarettes in some states are fucking disgusting.  They only hurt the people that those states pretend to care about.  Wealthy people aren't going to be smoking at the same rates and they don't give a fuck how much cigarettes cost if they do.  Po folk get fuuuucked by the very people that pretend to want to help them.  Then they get fucked because they become criminal "buttleggers."
View Quote
Like the “sugary drink”/soda taxes to help poor folk live better, attend school, whatever...they’re regressive.  Those paying the burden are those the tax is allegedly trying to help.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:46:02 AM EDT
[#49]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Welcome to.....always.
View Quote
Yup, when I was with NYSDTF we had several investigations going with the FBI and ATF on cig smuggling. Terrorist organizations used to traffic them up from the South because the profit margins were as good as drugs, and if you got caught... slap on the wrist.
Link Posted: 7/29/2018 9:47:55 AM EDT
[#50]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
I'd settle for "pay for their healthcare" but, now we're splitting hairs.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The idea is to make it so expensive that the poor will stop smoking. As if an addict is going to choose fresh kale over their pack of smokes, based solely on tax hikes, and suddenly turn into Warren Buffet.

You know, moral busybodies playing the nanny state.
I know what the idea is.  Everyone knows for serious addicts it doesn't work.  And fuck that shit anyway.   Tax them by making them pay more for healthcare.  Actual consequences for their actions.  Live free and live with the consequences.

Imma start a side hustle mailing cigs to a few people in new york lol
I'd settle for "pay for their healthcare" but, now we're splitting hairs.
On a roll this morning, HK
Arrow Left Previous Page
Page / 3
Close Join Our Mail List to Stay Up To Date! Win a FREE Membership!

Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!

You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.


By signing up you agree to our User Agreement. *Must have a registered ARFCOM account to win.
Top Top