For anyone interested, this is an excellent article going through some Universalist passages of the Bible.

The Trees of the Forest Sing for Joy

There are none.

I can’t tell if you’re serious.

If you believe in this, who cares?

If everyone is going to heaven then nothing matters. Do whatever you want. Live your life. Don’t bother proselytizing because it literally doesn’t matter.

And yet you post continually trying to get people to believe this made up fairy tale that is completely unsupported by scripture.

Well that should be your clue.

If my actions don’t make sense based on what you perceive Christian Universalism to be, maybe you’ve misunderstood Christian Universalism.

And we’ve been through this rigamarole before. Christian Universalism has a long history dating back to the early church. That’s a historical fact. Christians over the millennia have found support for it in the Bible. So to say there’s no evidence for it in the Bible is silly.

You should read the article. Might learn something.

I read the article and you are misinterpreting these scriptures entirely. If you read it plainly, it does state ALL are reconciled. However, it also says "Through Him", meaning Jesus. I.E. All believers are reconciled through Him. If a non-believer can get into heaven because of passages like this, then why would He say to some "Depart from Me, I never knew you." ??? I'm not trying to throw dirt on you or your beliefs. I am trying to point you to the truth man.

Colossians 1:16-20

Text

16 For by him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things were created through him and for him. 17 And he is before all things, and in him all things hold together. 18 And he is the head of the body, the church. He is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in everything he might be preeminent. 19 For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.

I think the author did a nice job tying the Universalist position to Holy Scripture.  Unfortunately, that is the danger we incur when we seek to draw our own conclusions independent of tradition.  I disagree with his conclusion and abide with the magisterial hermeneutics of the centuries.

I've read the Bible for decades.  There's no support for your story in it.

I don't misunderstand your story, I reject it.  It is both logically inconsistent and it is unscriptural.

Respectfully, I don’t think you are reading it plainly. You’re bringing assumptions to the text.

Yes, Jesus is the only way. And yes, all things (not some things) will be reconciled to Him.

That doesn’t mean some won’t depart into punishment. But the Greek is clear that punishment is not for forever. And the word used for punishment means correction. So after a time of correction, those who must depart will be reconciled again—meaning all will come to believe and experience salvation thus reconciling everyone to Him.

You should check out the FAQ page on that same website. It may answer some of your questions.

Im not offended. I know you’re sharing what you know to the best of your ability. But know that I’m trying to show you a higher truth. The Good News is really really good.

You keep saying that, but you keep being proven wrong.

Maybe you’re bad at expressing yourself.

Well things are changing in the Catholic Church, especially regarding this topic. Maybe they’ll change their minds so you can change yours.

Why do you believe you've proven something?

Like an atheist singing Christmas carols...how ironic it must be to read the Bible and come to the conclusion that literally everyone is going to heaven (even if eventually, or something).

So I guess we are just going to ignore the passage where Jesus says of Judas (who betrayed him) that it would be better for him if he had never been born...

That's a strange thing to say of someone that you plan on forgiving and letting into heaven later on, don't you think?

I guess I come at it from the opposite angle.

God tells us to love our neighbor as ourself. Yet, on your view, He doesn’t love those same people as much as we are told to. God tells us to always forgive as He does. Yet, on your view, God will stop forgiving billions of people. The Bible says God’s mercy endures forever; He literally sits on the Mercy Seat. Yet, you tell me His mercy will end.

You would have me believe the Good News is billions of people suffering in agony for eternity,
while only a handful make it to Heaven. Doesn’t sound like Good News to me.

The Judas passage can be interpreted a number of different ways. But let me ask you, if that passage is literally true, then wouldn’t Judas’ birth be a bad thing? God is in control of who is born and when. And, more importantly, God is goodness itself. So tell me how God who is good can do something bad? Such literal interpretations are problematic.

Also, here’s a similar passage. On your literal interpretation, this passage reads that the oppressed are better off not being born. Do you really believe that?

“Again I saw all the oppressions that are done under the sun. And behold, the tears of the oppressed, and they had no one to comfort them! On the side of their oppressors there was power, and there was no one to comfort them. And I thought the dead who are already dead more fortunate than the living who are still alive. But better than both is he who has not yet been and has not seen the evil deeds that are done under the sun.”
??Ecclesiastes? ?4:1-3? ?ESV??

Maybe I haven’t proven anything to you (I can certainly agree with that), but I’ve proven you’re wrong about Christian Universalism. Two different things.

You’re kinda like a flat-earther. Despite all the evidence otherwise, you keep telling people they’re wrong. Not much anyone can do with that.

Again, you've proven nothing.

You have stated your doctrine.  Everybody goes to heaven.  That's the long and short of it, you can dress it up any way you want with any fancy words you want.  That's the doctrine.

From their page, under the heading "what is universalism":

And under the heading of "what is christian universalism?":
Here's another quote:
Yeah.  Mahatma Ghandi was a Christian.  Right.

The quotes come from here: https://christianuniversalist.org/faq/ -- they don't even require belief in Christ to be a member of their church.

I've given you the logical conclusion.  Nothing matters.  So why are you so invested in converting people to it?  It's just Pascal's wager all over again -- what if you're wrong?  If you're wrong and I'm right, there are massive consequences to following your theology.  If I'm wrong and you're right, there are no consequences to following my beliefs.

Claiming "the early church believed it" is nothing but an appeal to an authority that quite simply does not really exist.  Universalism is essentially a 1950+ theology -- it was generally considered heresy in the early Church, as were many of these kinds of beliefs.

From a purely logistical perspective, there is literally no purpose to attempting to convert anyone or convince anyone, or even talk to anyone about anything if everybody just goes to heaven no matter what they believe.  Jesus' teaching is really not useful if universalism is true.

My position on universalism -- in whatever sheep's clothes you dress it -- is not unique in the Church.  There are books written on it.

Wait. I’m confused. Are you a Christian?

Why would it matter?  Everybody goes to heaven.  Who cares whether I claim to be a Christian or a Muslim or a Hindu.  As long as I live a good life the Christian Universalists say I'm on the right path and everybody is going to heaven anyway.

I’m just curious because you don’t seem well acquainted with the Bible, theology, or the western tradition.

I took a look at the website you referenced and even if you exclude all the universalist aspects of it everything else was mainline orthodox.

And yes, it is entirely possible Gandhi was saved and will be in Heaven. A Calvinist can argue he was unknowingly elect. An Arminian can say he accepted Christ on his deathbed. People like C.S. Lewis and Billy Graham thought pagans could be saved based on the light they were given. (This should remind you of some things Paul said.) And scholars and theologians have long recognized that there were ‘holy pagans’ who were saved in the OT.

All this brings me back to you. Are you a Christian? Because you don’t seem remotely familiar with any of it.

"Depart from me, I never knew you." is quite clear to me. I am very familiar with plain language analysis and I am brining no assumptions to the text. If Jesus says, "Depart from me, I never knew you." He is then, not including said person in the word "ALL" mentioned above, in the text "and through him to reconcile to himself all things". You can't be in the "ALL" if you were "Never Known".

How can Jesus not “know” a person if all things, including every single person, were created through Him? Are you denying God’s omniscience?

See, such literalism creates problems.

If you do not believe what the Bible says, why are you calling your religion anything related to Christianity?

The word "know" doesn't mean what you're pretending it means so you can cram the Bible into your theology.

There are lots of people that I have met, worked with, etc over the years that I don't "know" in the sense the word is used there.

Sophistry causes problems, not literalism.

Really.

I've been a scholar of the Bible since I was 3.  I've studied it in multiple languages.

I don't care what a Universalist says about "theology" or "western tradition" any more than I care what Buddhist says about them.  Their opinions are irrelevant.  They do not believe the Bible is the word of God, they do not accept its teachings.  So why should I care what you say?  Your opinion of whether or not I am a Christian is as meaningful as the opinion of a Muslim about it.  It simply doesn't matter.  And you believe everyone is going to heaven anyway, so who cares?

There were no "holy pagans" saved in the OT.

God gave the law, he gave sacrifice, and that is how those in the OT were saved.  Abraham followed God, he was not a pagan.

Mmhmm

So many problems with what you've typed here.

-Love your neighbor as yourself: something to aspire to, yet completely impossible with our sin nature. Jesus knew this, and it is spoken in that passage to show the weight of the law. God doesn't have this problem. What makes you think he doesn't love those that end up in hell? His holiness and righteousness demand justice, though. I love my kid even as I spank them for disobedience. What would you say of a God that is "love" but doesn't punish evil??

-Forgiveness: this is only available in THIS LIFE. Once you die, that's it, your decision is locked in. He never stops forgiving those who accept Christ, no matter how much they sin in this life. Keep in mind, he doesn't even HAVE to offer us this forgiveness. There is none for the angels (or fallen angels - the demons), after all. How does his mercy ever end? He is immutable and changeless and that is an attribute of his holiness. You seem to be inferring things and setting up a straw man here. I never said these things, I don't think them, and the Bible doesn't say them.

-The Good News: no, I wouldn't have you believe that...I never said that. Again, a straw man. How can you claim to have such a grasp of the Bible and not understand the core of the Gospel? The Good News is that while no man can live up to the law, we have a savior in Christ. If there is no eternal hell, then the Good News isn't even needed, because we'd all be going to heaven anyway. Also, it isn't a small number of people making it to heaven -- it is a vast amount that no one can number (see Revelation -- you can look it up). If you have a problem with hell, you have a problem with God - do you claim to know better how to punish a soul that is eternal and will CONTINUE TO SIN in hell? If there is no end to their sin nature (and there can't be without the Holy Spirit and Christ's forgiveness), then there is no end to their sin, therefore, an eternal hell. They are constantly racking up more sin even as they burn in hell. This is just one of a number of reasons hell is justly eternal...

-How is the birth of a child itself a bad thing? You are reaching here. Jesus said it would be better FOR HIM (Judas) if he had never been born, not that his birth was the bad thing -- but partly because of Judas' actions, we have a crucifixion which is how Jesus saves us from our sins. In God's accounting, this is apparently "worth it". Yes, God is sovereign over all things and COULD choose to either protect Judas from Satan entering into him or just have him never be born, but one thing we see time and time again is the exercise of free will. God lets people make their own choices and Judas chose his path, even if Satan encouraged him along the way. He could have resisted the temptation, because lets not forget, "I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me". God respects our free will, even if our choices are to turn against him, never accept Christ, and we end up in hell for our MULTITUDE of sins against him. God forcing everyone to do what he wants isn't love and it isn't righteous either...we call that a dictatorship here on earth and it never ends well.

-Ecclesiastes: have you read the whole book of Ecclesiastes? You should. It is Solomon's reflection on his life and is essentially him lamenting all the evil that man does, the pursuit of wealth, the ignoring of our Lord and creator, etc. That verse is Solomon's lamenting of the evil and oppressive powers that existed in the world in his time. He is using hyperbole and stating that the people who have it best are the ones that haven't experienced the woes of this world yet (the unborn) -- i.e. everyone experiences evil and it's effects. If you are using that one verse to point a finger at God and call him "wrong" for making all this then you might want to check yourself. You don't know the mind of your creator, and you haven't seen the final glory that will be after the great judgment. I'm willing to bet it will all be worthwhile, because God thinks it is, and he's never been wrong...he kind of already knows how it all plays out, after all.

I think you've been taken captive by the commandments of men. A lot of what you said is not found in the Bible.

“‘This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me; in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’” Matthew 15:8-9

You have got to be trolling at this point.

Everything he said is clearly supported in the Bible and has been accepted Christian doctrine for two millenia.

No, most of what he said was imagined by Augustine, adopted by the Catholic Church, and transmitted to Protestantism. (I notice you haven't given chapter and verse to support his spurious claims.)

But in one sense what he said is true. Many people now call that (flawed) interpretation by Augustine 'Christianity'.

I know I've said this before, but I'll say it again. If you step back and try to consider this impartially, you will see the truth of it. Start with the little things. Like, How can Hell be eternal if it's destroyed? Or, How can death be destroyed if people remain in a constant state of death for eternity? Or, How can Christ draw all men to Himself if only a portion come?

Seriously, please. Stop trying to prove me wrong. Start looking for the truth. At the very minimum you will enlarge your perspective and understanding.

I've looked for truth my whole life.  What you're preaching simply isn't it.

I don't need to "prove you wrong", what you're selling isn't in the Bible.   You have built what you want, and then attempt to torture the Bible into supporting it.

It's not that you 'need' to prove me wrong. It's that you can't. If you could, you would have already.

Before now you were nursed with milk. Now you are given meat.

Sear this into your mind: Christ will reconcile the whole cosmos to Himself, including every single person. The final and everlasting glory of God will be all of creation loving and worshiping Him. No creature will remain in rebellion, everything will be reconciled to God. He will be everything to everyone.

That's the telos of creation.

So why witness.  Why did he give the great commission.  Who cares?  Nothing matters if everyone is saved.

You are arguing that we have no free will, and that all are predestined to be saved no matter what they will.  Do what you want.  Live how you want.  Might as well be a hedonist satanist if everyone goes to heaven regardless.

That is contrary to the teachings of Christ and the Bible.

And that's all I'm going to say on that and I'm done with you.

Don't quit. These are your growing pains. I once had the same questions. They can all be answered.

You should pick up Gregory of Nyssa's On the Soul and the Resurrection . I think it'll help you to see it all better.

While I agree, that won't help illustrate the error to simply say, you're wrong.

It's shocking you're not as Rob Bell guy.

Do you believe Jesus was created?

John 15:1 KJV
I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman

15 “I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. (NKJV)

15 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the vinedresser. (ESV)

15 “I am the true vine, and my Father is the gardener. (NIV)

Inference: If there is a true vine, there is false vine(s).

People walked with Jesus and still didn’t believe. It’s not a right, logic, empiricism thing.

It’s about recognizing a need, coming to sonship through Truth, and walking with Jesus by God’s Spirit

Well duh.

I’m not following. I don’t see how this responds to what I said above.

We “could beat him if we added a dash of logic.”  Your words.

I stated it’s not about beating him. Or logic. Then I took it a step further and stated people who walked with Jesus didn’t believe.  The Spirit illumines minds of those He indwells to see Jesus as who He is.

Ah. I see now.

Who?

I think everyone here is genuinely trying to speak truth, or most certainly including OP

Are you kidding me? None of this is commandments of men...it's been the position of the church since the time of Christ, and based on His teachings. Jesus believed in an eternal hell and it was taught that there WOULD be damnation, no one questioned this, all of the 12 disciples and everyone in the Bible from Acts on understood this -- yet here you are trying to wipe it all away by personally misinterpreting scripture to fit your narrative. Who is more likely to be wrong? ALL of the church since the time of Christ? Or YOU?

You actually misinterpret many of my comments there in your point by point "highlighted in red" response. I can't believe you missed some of those points. Like, is this for real? This is stuff that my 6 year old understands. Are you doing this on purpose just to get a rise out of people? That would be highly inappropriate for such a serious topic. For instance, the mercy comment you made: you completely missed my point. Mercy is contingent on accepting Christ, but once you do, you are forgiven for ALL of your sins. God doesn't grow impatient as you age and decide he's given you enough mercy...it never ends for our time on earth. After we die, there is no more need for mercy (in that way) from sin because the Christian is no longer sinful in heaven. Those who go to hell never get the mercy of Christ because they REJECTED HIM. Duh. For those who never hear of Christ, they are judged based on their works, and found lacking in every instance. But the trial is still fair because EVERY single thing they have done is recorded.

I said we only get THIS LIFE to make a choice for Christ -- you said that's not in the Bible. Really? What is the great white throne judgement then? What are all the books being opened for? We give an account of our whole lives...is that just a "quarterly check in" or something? No, it is a final judgment. We lived our life, we died, and now it's time to be judged. If your name is in the book of life, you are saved. If not, God refers to the books with your works listed in them and you are found wanting, and you get tossed into hell (Revelation 20:10-15, where it also mentions the "lake of fire" lasting "for ever and ever" - that would be that whole eternal hell thing you say isn't in the Bible, and this being tossed in the lake of fire is referred to as the second death. One bodily death, and now a spiritual death, as it were).

As far as people continuing to sin in hell, this is just common sense. We are born spiritually broken and with a sin nature in our very soul. Only Christ can fix that. If we never accepted Christ and had the regeneration of the Holy Spirit, and are forever separated from Christ and tossed into hell for eternity, do you think our sin nature suddenly vanishes? This is pretty basic logic, and not a new groundbreaking viewpoint...

You even take the Bible verse you quoted there out of context! Who said it? Who was it said to? Who was it said about? Am I a modern equivalent of that group of people? On it's face, you can try and apply that verse to me, but you are trying to warp the scriptures to suit your purposes.

This is like how everyone likes to misquote Jeremiah 29:11! Geez, read the whole chapter and ask who it is being said to.

The links below are all about Hell, and why it IS Biblically sound. I don't expect you to read it, but others scrolling through this dumpster fire of a thread will find these links far more valuable than anything you spout off. Sorry, I have to TRY to do my part to defend Christianity when I can:

"Hell Interrupted"

Part 1: https://www.str.org/SolidGroundSept2017HellInterrupted#.Xkxm9i2ZNBw
Part 2: https://www.str.org/solidgroundnovember2017hellinterruptedpart2#.XkxnPC2ZNBw
Part 3: https://www.str.org/SolidGroundJuly2019-hell-interrupted-3#.XkxnSy2ZNBw

Lol

How bout you supply chapter and verse for THAT little gem?

Lets see what references you take out of context to support that claim. Keep in mind that there are many verses that speak to the conquering of Jesus. He absolutely DOES win the war on sin. But those going to hell are not reconciled and do not love and worship him for all eternity. And I don't even know what you mean by "he will be everything to everyone". What kind of BS is that?

That's all you got, huh? Mmmkay. You do you man. Good luck to you. I don't think you are actually searching for the truth though. No, instead you think you are above everyone here and you've already found it. You might want to get back to basics and just read the New Testament. Slowly. Study it. Use your time wisely, you only have this life to make up your mind.

Edit: since you have all the answers, why not refute the info in the links I provided?

Here’s your chapter and verse:

Romans 11:36
For from him and through him and to him are all things. To him be glory forever. Amen.

Romans 14:11
“As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.”

1 Corinthians 15:28
When all things are subjected to him, then the Son himself will also be subjected to him who put all things in subjection under him, that God may be all in all.

Ephesians 1:7-10
In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of his grace, which he lavished upon us, in all wisdom and insight making known to us the mystery of his will, according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ as a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth.

Ephesians 1:22-23
And he put all things under his feet and gave him as head over all things to the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills all in all.

Ephesians 4:4-6
There is one body and one Spirit—just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call—one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

Ephesians 4:9-10
In saying, “He ascended,” what does it mean but that he had also descended into the lower regions, the earth? He who descended is the one who also ascended far above all the heavens, that he might fill all things.

Philippians 2:9-11
Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Colossians 1:19-20
For in him all the fullness of God was pleased to dwell, and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether on earth or in heaven, making peace by the blood of his cross.

And my "he will be everything to everyone" is a variant reading of 1 Corinthians 15:28. Want to know how I know you can’t read Greek?

Lol.

Across the denominations and "Christian" faiths we tend to use a lot of the same lingo but have very different definitions for much of it.

I'd like to know what OP means by reconciled.