Aluminum vs carbon fiber bed carriage.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Aluminum vs carbon fiber bed carriage.

Posted: 11/3/2019 9:28:35 PM EDT

Modding my printer to take the prusa mk3 bed system, including the heating platform. I'm done with glass and glue on pei sheets. I have a clone heated bed and genuine Prusa spring steel sheet coming (textured).

So I don't have to completely redesign the Y motion system, I need to make a custom bed cartridge. The prusa clone model won't work.

This leaves me with either aluminum or carbon fiber.

I can have the local metal place CNC me out an aluminum piece for about $50.

Or

Get a slab of carbon fiber, dig out and put back together the CNC, and make my own carbon fiber model. This will cost about $90 for the carbon fiber.

I'm leaning toward 1/4" aluminum, and really open it up to lighten the load. This should never get hot, the heater bed will be on aluminum standoffs. It would save both time and money.

Anybody think of a great reason to go carbon fiber, or have other ideas? The part is too big to 3d print in one piece, though I may be able to make it a 2 piece carriage and bolt it together.

Posted: 11/4/2019 12:47:36 PM EDT

[#1]

New Y carriage. Comes out to 437 grams made out of aluminum, twice that of the Prusa carriage (theirs is much smaller). This carriage is HALF that of the Robo glass bed, but the glass bed is the whole printing surface & heater. After I put on the MK52 heated bed and build plate, I figure it should come out to about the same, which is fine.

Posted: 11/4/2019 4:25:12 PM EDT

[#2]

No reason to go with CF unless you want it for the bling.

Posted: 11/4/2019 10:36:04 PM EDT

[#3]

Quote History

Quoted:
No reason to go with CF unless you want it for the bling.

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Weight. The lighter the bed, the better.

Posted: 11/5/2019 12:27:31 AM EDT

[#4]

You think I could get away with thinning that middle rib? The middle one is 20mm, smaller ones are 15mm. Shave off a bit more weight.

I don't think I can justify carbon fiber at this point since it's looking like the mod will match OEM bed weight.

Posted: 11/5/2019 12:18:19 PM EDT

[#5]

This version is 433 grams and should be stiffer.

Posted: 11/5/2019 1:45:41 PM EDT

[#6]

Hmm, 3D printable version. Maybe I should print it up for a proof of concept before ordering the CNC aluminum plate.

Posted: 11/5/2019 1:47:35 PM EDT

[#7]

Quote History

Quoted:

Weight. The lighter the bed, the better.

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Unless you're really trying to push the envelope with your print speeds you're not gonna see a difference. I have both an aluminum carriage and a CF carriage for my printer. The CF was a waste of money.

Posted: 11/5/2019 1:48:20 PM EDT

[#8]

Quote History

Quoted:
Hmm, 3D printable version. Maybe I should print it up for a proof of concept before ordering the CNC aluminum plate.

https://www.AR15.Com/media/mediaFiles/165887/Y_bed_carriage;_3D_printable-1149933.png

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FWIW the printed carriage I made worked just as well as the aluminum one. Give it a go. It only costs filament and time b

Posted: 11/5/2019 2:05:16 PM EDT

[#9]

I think CF would be better (weight and such), but the cost-benefit is a different answer that's for you only.

Is the printer in a chamber at all? Aluminum has a higher expansion with temp, and if it's in any sort of chamber, it might still matter.

Posted: 11/5/2019 2:13:15 PM EDT

[#10]

Quote History

Quoted:
I think CF would be better (weight and such), but the cost-benefit is a different answer that's for you only.

Is the printer in a chamber at all? Aluminum has a higher expansion with temp, and if it's in any sort of chamber, it might still matter.

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Yes and no. Its generally NOT in a chamber, but sometimes I have a simple "chamber" for printing ABS.

I'm printing it now in ABS just to get a feel for it.

Eventually, I think this printer will get a volcano hotend and be for chunky, mechanical parts.

Posted: 11/5/2019 2:16:32 PM EDT

[#11]

Quote History

Quoted:
Yes and no. Its generally NOT in a chamber, but sometimes I have a simple "chamber" for printing ABS.

I'm printing it now in ABS just to get a feel for it.

Eventually, I think this printer will get a volcano hotend and be for chunky, mechanical parts.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
I think CF would be better (weight and such), but the cost-benefit is a different answer that's for you only.

Is the printer in a chamber at all? Aluminum has a higher expansion with temp, and if it's in any sort of chamber, it might still matter.

Yes and no. Its generally NOT in a chamber, but sometimes I have a simple "chamber" for printing ABS.

I'm printing it now in ABS just to get a feel for it.

Eventually, I think this printer will get a volcano hotend and be for chunky, mechanical parts.

This being BARFCOM, I am bound by the COC to state: buy once, cry once.

Posted: 11/5/2019 2:31:55 PM EDT

[#12]

Quote History

Quoted:

This being BARFCOM, I am bound by the COC to state: buy once, cry once.

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So you vote aluminum or carbon fiber?

Posted: 11/5/2019 2:33:24 PM EDT

[#13]

While printing, the pei sheet lifted off

Shit like this is why I'm upgrading.

Posted: 11/5/2019 10:53:19 PM EDT

[#14]

I vote alum just because of the bang for buck factor, but carbon will always be better.

On you model above, do the lin rods move with the bed, or are they fixed and the bed moves on them?
If they move with the bed, no point in worrying about weight to much.

Posted: 11/5/2019 11:00:15 PM EDT

[#15]

Rods move with the bed.

You can kind of see the setup in the first pic I posted.

Posted: 11/6/2019 12:26:50 PM EDT

[#16]

Woke up to this...

I think the Y stepper (or driver) skipped steps, as the Prusa Slicer has them running hard. I mellowed out the settings in Prusa Slicer, trying again.

Maybe I do need that mainboard upgrade with Trinamics... Could buy the Silent Sticks to just replace the drives, but it will cost some $60 IIRC for just drivers, and when I could get a Duet Mistro for something like $120, a new mainbord just makes more sense.

Posted: 11/6/2019 3:24:38 PM EDT

[#17]

If you are handy with the fw and can config and compile your own, look linto the BigTreeTech SKR line of boards.
Also look into thier tmc2209 drivers.
Killer bang for the buck with these guys.

Posted: 11/6/2019 4:11:13 PM EDT

[#18]

A set of tmc2209s is $40 on amazon.

Posted: 11/6/2019 4:28:59 PM EDT

[#19]

Quote History

Quoted:
A set of tmc2209s is $40 on amazon.

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I'll look into them (found a set of 5 for $30), but I think they are knockoffs.

Posted: 11/6/2019 5:37:24 PM EDT

[#20]

Maybe. I haven't heard of knock off trinamic drivers, but it's certainly possible.

Posted: 11/6/2019 9:04:03 PM EDT

[#21]

Quote History

Quoted:
I'll look into them (found a set of 5 for $30), but I think they are knockoffs.

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If you gotta have tier1 gear, shell out the dough for Watterotts or Panucats or whatever, doesnt make every other version on the planet a knock-off.

I have a set of 2208s that just scream china bling, but pretty sure they are nicer than the original Watterotts.
I kid you not. Its like they actually cared about wtf they were doing and took the time to improve them.
Rarer than hens teeth, but sometimes the knock-offs are actually better.

Posted: 11/6/2019 9:40:57 PM EDT

[#22]

Quote History

Quoted:

If you gotta have tier1 gear, shell out the dough for Watterotts or Panucats or whatever, doesnt make every other version on the planet a knock-off.

I have a set of 2208s that just scream china bling, but pretty sure they are nicer than the original Watterotts.
I kid you not. Its like they actually cared about wtf they were doing and took the time to improve them.
Rarer than hens teeth, but sometimes the knock-offs are actually better.

View Quote

Half or better off my printing is at the office for work, and I don't like messing with knockoff stuff if I can avoid it, especially when we are talking $50, that much money is insignificant compared to even a single day messing with something.

Posted: 11/6/2019 10:22:56 PM EDT

[#23]

Ya, the work thing is a major consideration.

In the years that I have played with this stuff, and all the "knockoff" gizmos, the only one I have ran into that was a headache was the clone all metal heatbreaks for a v6.
I got them to work, but took waayy too much effort when I should have been doing other things

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Aluminum vs carbon fiber bed carriage.

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