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Posted: 8/17/2018 2:29:00 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pretty serious dog pound to require and officer present for those that don't show ID and then not allow them to leave if they refuse. Duh. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 2:30:10 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
i have first hand dealt with enough of these fucking idiots to not find any real remorse in their demise. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 2:50:12 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Cops in your area don't ask for ID at a disturbance? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
What legal justification did the officer have to demand his license? He tried to drop off a dog, refused to give the kennel his id and left. None of the cop's business. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 2:50:30 PM EDT
[#4]
Of course the cops can ASK for your ID for pretty much any reason. They can even lie to you and say you have to show it.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:03:28 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If someone tells me they don't have a DL and then they go get in a car and drive away, I have reasonable suspicion that the driver is unlicensed and committing a crime. Good detention. I can see requiring ID to drop off a dog. That ID doesn't have to be a DL, though. Passport, verbal ID with other info, etc. This was a meeting with Erica CArtman, police sergeant, and Willy the Sovereign Idjit, with predictable results. I think where this whole shitshow went off the rails at the very start...even before the officer(s) arrived...was when you think about how the dead guy was supposed to dispose of this dog when they refused to take the dog. If the shelter tried to trump up the situation by calling the police to "force" the dead guy to leave with this dog, well, shame on them. The dog was loose when the dead guy found it, and if the shelter won't take the dog, he should have just driven off and left the dog loose. The dog was already lost or abandoned. I don't think the dead can be made to keep the dog or take the dog. There's about at least a hundred ways that reasonable people could have handled this scenario, but it doesn't seem any of them were present in this case. I'm gonna say it again. The police are the ones who are supposed to inject calm and control in a given problem to which they respond whenever circumstances allow. On many of these videos we see posted here, that's not happening like it should happen. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:06:24 PM EDT
[#6]
You'd think the shelter would have SOP for people without ID, other than unlawfully detaining them until backup arrives.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:16:18 PM EDT
[#7]
Did the shelter end up keeping the dog?
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:19:00 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So what did this guy do to have the cops called? ETA: Cop was already there and his crime was not producing a drivers license for the dog shelter to see and then them saying he couldn't leave? Is that right? That guy was murdered. But if he had just produced a drivers license or was peaceful with the cops having committed no crimes, none of this would have happened. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:24:13 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If someone tells me they don't have a DL and then they go get in a car and drive away, I have reasonable suspicion that the driver is unlicensed and committing a crime. Good detention. I can see requiring ID to drop off a dog. That ID doesn't have to be a DL, though. Passport, verbal ID with other info, etc. This was a meeting with Erica CArtman, police sergeant, and Willy the Sovereign Idjit, with predictable results. I turned in a wallet I found to a police department and was surprised they wanted to see my license, I suppose they could claim maybe I stole it or who knows what, but if I had told them to pound salt they wouldn't've been able to legally get my ID, I don't think. I did consider refusing but whatever. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:25:08 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Probably stole someones dog and wanted to get rid of the evidence. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:26:32 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Confrontational/suspicious activity doesn't warrant a request for ID? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: She had no lawful authority to demand a DL and he had no lawfully duty to produce one. As in theft. Needs to be investigated. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:28:11 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Probably stole someones dog and wanted to get rid of the evidence. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:30:25 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Showing ID, seems racist.  |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:32:51 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I had to provide ID at my county animal shelter when I dropped off a feral cat and her kittens last year. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
They city where I live stopped requiring bicycle licenses after the lack of having one resulted in a nasty physical dispute between a father and a police officer in front of his kids. Maybe they'll stop making you show ID to drop off a stray dog after this. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:36:32 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Bad shoot. Devil's advocate time. Would a reasonable officer suspect that his unwillingness to show his drivers license indicated that he may not have a drivers license? Is driving without a license a crime? Would a reasonable officer suspect that after he expressed his intent on dropping the dog off somewhere else that he may dump the stray dog elsewhere? Is dumping a stray dog a crime? Reasonable suspicion to conduct an investigatory detention. Discuss. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
It began with a stray dog. Robert Earl Lawrence said he found the dog wandering a Wal-Mart parking lot in Dothan in south Alabama. He put the canine in his car with his girlfriend and their three small children, each child under the age of 10. The family drove to the Dothan Animal Shelter. There Lawrence was asked for his driver's license, he declined to show it. City employees said they couldn't accept a stray dog if he didn't show a license. He said they didn't have the right to require a license. He said he'd drop the dog elsewhere. They said he couldn't leave if he was going to dump the dog. He was stuck, grew agitated, walked outside. Devil's advocate time. Would a reasonable officer suspect that his unwillingness to show his drivers license indicated that he may not have a drivers license? Is driving without a license a crime? Would a reasonable officer suspect that after he expressed his intent on dropping the dog off somewhere else that he may dump the stray dog elsewhere? Is dumping a stray dog a crime? Reasonable suspicion to conduct an investigatory detention. Discuss. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:43:31 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sage advice as usual. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I'll take the ride to jail and sue them. Going to the trouble to capture, transport, and turn in a loose dog sets off to many alarm bells. Maybe he stole a dog and is trying to ditch the evidence. Not everyone gets a mutt from the pound. My last Labrador was from a prize winning blood line and the puppy was over $2,000. She had thousands of dollars and hours of training. I could actually make a decent amount of money 'renting' her to dick hunters. She understood hand signals, whistle command, verbal command. If I needed to I could easily demonstrate a decent economic value and costs for the animal. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:49:37 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Or you can snatch your neighbors annoying dog, dump it at the shelter, and hope it gets the needle before neighbor figures out what's going on. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
They city where I live stopped requiring bicycle licenses after the lack of having one resulted in a nasty physical dispute between a father and a police officer in front of his kids. Maybe they'll stop making you show ID to drop off a stray dog after this. But the dog was dead and they did not have the ID of the guy that brought it in. Now you have to have a valid ID or they will not take the dog. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:52:10 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
there a few notable families of them in this area. most are shitbirds that steal copper and sling dope for a living. pretty much every interaction with them is an event. they have slung bogus lawsuits against cities and city employees as well as made direct written and verbal threats in some cases. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: That's crazy. How often do those sovereign citizen clowns threaten you guys?  . Stay frosty.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 3:53:47 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Perhaps she was such a shit show that they sent her to work there to avoid problems. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I agree 100% in this case. When he attempted to take the cops taser, things went pear shaped. The whole deal was exacerbated by the incorrect actions of the police. It shouldn't have happened in the first place and wouldn't have if they had followed their own laws. EDIT: That said, Sovereign citizenship is not something that I support. In a just world she should have been fired without repercussion. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:02:30 PM EDT
[#20]
Cop legally got away with murder. I hope her PTSD is real and unrelenting.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:05:21 PM EDT
[#21]
What a shit show.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:08:20 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Those three kids (and society in general) are better off without that loser. Don't grab an officer's taser and you won't die. Sovereign citizen lol |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:17:47 PM EDT
[#23]
The dog seemed the calmest of everyone.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:18:48 PM EDT
[#24]
What gave the dog shelter the authority to detain him?
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:21:03 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's fucked up. The dude had every right to leave and the cunt murdered him. Sovern citizens are idiots. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:26:07 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sovereign citizens are retarded. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:29:17 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Stealing a neighbors dog and then dumping in anonymously on the shelter hoping it gets killed would be a problem. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
It began with a stray dog. Robert Earl Lawrence said he found the dog wandering a Wal-Mart parking lot in Dothan in south Alabama. He put the canine in his car with his girlfriend and their three small children, each child under the age of 10. The family drove to the Dothan Animal Shelter. There Lawrence was asked for his driver's license, he declined to show it. City employees said they couldn't accept a stray dog if he didn't show a license. He said they didn't have the right to require a license. He said he'd drop the dog elsewhere. They said he couldn't leave if he was going to dump the dog. He was stuck, grew agitated, walked outside. Devil's advocate time. Would a reasonable officer suspect that his unwillingness to show his drivers license indicated that he may not have a drivers license? Is driving without a license a crime? Would a reasonable officer suspect that after he expressed his intent on dropping the dog off somewhere else that he may dump the stray dog elsewhere? Is dumping a stray dog a crime? Reasonable suspicion to conduct an investigatory detention. Discuss. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:30:12 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
What was her legal reason for detaining him? This is all on her. She'll never have to answer to it in court, thats just how the thin blue line works. Sovern citizens are idiots. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:30:19 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, your overreaching government is. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Sovereign citizens are retarded. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:30:32 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's fucked up. The dude had every right to leave and the cunt murdered him. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:42:41 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is how actual adults deal with problems. Going to the trouble to capture, transport, and turn in a loose dog sets off to many alarm bells. Maybe he stole a dog and is trying to ditch the evidence. Not everyone gets a mutt from the pound. My last Labrador was from a prize winning blood line and the puppy was over $2,000. She had thousands of dollars and hours of training. I could actually make a decent amount of money 'renting' her to dick hunters. She understood hand signals, whistle command, verbal command. If I needed to I could easily demonstrate a decent economic value and costs for the animal. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:45:33 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, your overreaching government is. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Sovereign citizens are retarded. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:49:26 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is how actual adults deal with problems. Going to the trouble to capture, transport, and turn in a loose dog sets off to many alarm bells. Maybe he stole a dog and is trying to ditch the evidence. Not everyone gets a mutt from the pound. My last Labrador was from a prize winning blood line and the puppy was over $2,000. She had thousands of dollars and hours of training. I could actually make a decent amount of money 'renting' her to dick hunters. She understood hand signals, whistle command, verbal command. If I needed to I could easily demonstrate a decent economic value and costs for the animal. Is this a thing? I waited tables and bar-tended for 10 years and even spent a year in the hospitality industry so I thought I had a pretty good notion of the happenings in the culture. But using dogs for "dick hunting" that's a new one. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:51:45 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I hear you. You’re likely right. In a just world she should have been fired without repercussion. Maybe they have enough disturbances there to warrant a cop being there. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:53:02 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This is how actual adults deal with problems. Going to the trouble to capture, transport, and turn in a loose dog sets off to many alarm bells. Maybe he stole a dog and is trying to ditch the evidence. Not everyone gets a mutt from the pound. My last Labrador was from a prize winning blood line and the puppy was over $2,000. She had thousands of dollars and hours of training. I could actually make a decent amount of money 'renting' her to dick hunters. She understood hand signals, whistle command, verbal command. If I needed to I could easily demonstrate a decent economic value and costs for the animal. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
I'll take the ride to jail and sue them. Going to the trouble to capture, transport, and turn in a loose dog sets off to many alarm bells. Maybe he stole a dog and is trying to ditch the evidence. Not everyone gets a mutt from the pound. My last Labrador was from a prize winning blood line and the puppy was over $2,000. She had thousands of dollars and hours of training. I could actually make a decent amount of money 'renting' her to dick hunters. She understood hand signals, whistle command, verbal command. If I needed to I could easily demonstrate a decent economic value and costs for the animal. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 4:53:39 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Maybe the pound has a lot of people raising hell because their dog got impounded for whatever reason and they're pissed they're having to pay to get it out. Maybe they have enough disturbances there to warrant a cop being there. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I hear you. You’re likely right. In a just world she should have been fired without repercussion. Maybe they have enough disturbances there to warrant a cop being there. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:00:44 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
what ???? You watched that video and don't know if it was a good shoot or bad shoot ? The lady drew her gun, suspected was pinned against a car defenseless, and she leans in and point blank shoots the dude. I am no cop hater nor cop lover .... but that was fucked up. Yeah maybe he is an idiot but he wasn't shoot him dead level idiot. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted: Huh? He didn't want Government to get involved in his life and Government killed him.  He was an asshole trying to prove a point and get attention, and it worked. Good shoot? Bad shoot? Dunno. I’m just saying it’s hard to give a damn about people like this What if the bullet over penetrated and killed one of the kids? I think it sucks that the media and many in the public piss all over the police every chance they get. I know that many people today do everything they can to make their jobs harder. They are disrespectful, refuse to follow simple and reasonable instructions, and endanger themselves and the officers with their combative behavior and attitude. This officer wasn't the one struggling with the driver, she wasn't embroiled in subduing him, there is no excuse for what she did. The other officer had the man subdued, and the man did not pose a threat at all. Trying to get away, run away, isn't threatening. This is unconscionable. The callous disregard for the safety of the other officer, the suspect, the children, and other bystanders is reprehensible. This is criminal and I hope she spends many years in prison for what she'd done. As to the many, and surprisingly callous comments about the man deserving what he got. I see a man, trying to live his life, take care of his family and do the best he can with what he has to work with. He's obviously not wealth, well educated, or high up on the social ladder. He's doing what he thinks is right. As misguided and foolish as I think his methods are and may be, he's not trying to screw with the cops or attack them. He's just a man trying to do his best and he sure didn't deserve to loose his life. I know this the internet and there are trolls.. etc... But some things are just wrong. If watching that video didn't twist your gut... If you really think he deserves to die... you're just soulless and evil. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:00:57 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In Dothan? Lol. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:05:07 PM EDT
[#39]
I am really torn on this one. Yes the guy was ass and once the cops engaged him he should just complied and fought this in court. I can't excuse the cops though. The guy was an asshole that I think needlessly escalated this and I can't believe she shot him like that. She should serve time.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:22:37 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Pretty serious dog pound to require and officer present for those that don't show ID and then not allow them to leave if they refuse. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:33:16 PM EDT
[#41]
Good shoot.
Wish they had shot the worthless, asslicking dog too though. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:38:59 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Again? where did this idea come from? why do folks believe if? |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:39:57 PM EDT
[#43]
Bad shoot, good fuck up. After reading this guys police history (link in main article) he was a damn nut job that would've killed someone sooner than later. Yeah maybe the cops fucked up, but sovereign citizens turn every police encounter into a shit show and that part is on him.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:41:21 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
i do not understand. this is like a computer virus. somehow folks gets this weird argument about being as sovereign citizen in their head and then just do stupid things and when confronted with cops, argue with the cop about rights that no one has and refuse to realize that their actions are only going to lead to them being fucked. where did this idea come from? why do folks believe if? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Again? where did this idea come from? why do folks believe if? Dunning–Kruger effect shows that people that are really stupid think they are much smarter than they really are. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 5:59:05 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
i do not understand. this is like a computer virus. somehow folks gets this weird argument about being as sovereign citizen in their head and then just do stupid things and when confronted with cops, argue with the cop about rights that no one has and refuse to realize that their actions are only going to lead to them being fucked. where did this idea come from? why do folks believe if? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Again? where did this idea come from? why do folks believe if? https://www.ar15.com/forums/general/Video-of-fatal-police-shooting-involving-sovereign-citizen/5-2138317/ |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 6:36:32 PM EDT
[#46]
In on page five of the dupe
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Posted: 8/17/2018 6:42:33 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
@LittlePony Is this a thing? I waited tables and bar-tended for 10 years and even spent a year in the hospitality industry so I thought I had a pretty good notion of the happenings in the culture. But using dogs for "dick hunting" that's a new one. And what does one do with their trophies after a successful hunt Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: This is how actual adults deal with problems. Going to the trouble to capture, transport, and turn in a loose dog sets off to many alarm bells. Maybe he stole a dog and is trying to ditch the evidence. Not everyone gets a mutt from the pound. My last Labrador was from a prize winning blood line and the puppy was over $2,000. She had thousands of dollars and hours of training. I could actually make a decent amount of money 'renting' her to dick hunters. She understood hand signals, whistle command, verbal command. If I needed to I could easily demonstrate a decent economic value and costs for the animal. Is this a thing? I waited tables and bar-tended for 10 years and even spent a year in the hospitality industry so I thought I had a pretty good notion of the happenings in the culture. But using dogs for "dick hunting" that's a new one. And what does one do with their trophies after a successful hunt |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 6:44:26 PM EDT
[#48]
More stupid shit from both sides.
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Posted: 8/17/2018 6:50:57 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
My last Labrador was from a prize winning blood line and the puppy was over $2,000. She had thousands of dollars and hours of training. I could actually make a decent amount of money 'renting' her to dick hunters. |
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Posted: 8/17/2018 7:27:06 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: i do not understand. this is like a computer virus. somehow folks gets this weird argument about being as sovereign citizen in their head and then just do stupid things and when confronted with cops, argue with the cop about rights that no one has and refuse to realize that their actions are only going to lead to them being fucked. where did this idea come from? why do folks believe if? At some point LE will crush all decent or 3% will rise up and history repeats. Or DT drains the swamp and that relieves some of the pressure on the keg. IMO |
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