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Link Posted: 9/10/2010 11:47:32 PM EDT
[#1]
Mostly because people have a hard time discerning the difference between fact and opinion when it is a subject they feel strongly about.



There are facts... such as ACOG's use tritium.  This is a fact.




Then there are opinions... such as Aimpoints are better than ACOGS.  This is an opinion.




We have a problem when one "clique", I guess, holds the same opinion and can outweigh the other.




It doesn't make them right, it just means their opinion holds weight.




It's another thing entirely when discussing facts, even if only one person in the discussion is right... there is still a right and wrong statement.




Of course that cliquish dogpile can and still will often times use their weight to over ride facts, even in the face of incontestable evidence (such as the ACOG/tritium example above).




A lot of what goes on in GD is strictly opinion based.




If the majority of people could reliably discern the difference between factual statements, and opinions... and treat it accordingly, there wouldn't be much issue.




But, since that often isn't the case... the dogpile seems like the easiest way to "prove" or "justify" your side of the opinion.




The above is all strictly my opinion.
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 12:03:21 AM EDT
[#2]
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 12:17:54 AM EDT
[#3]
I'm not aware of the Tier 1, holier than thou bunch. I suppose that makes my opinion invalid. I'll offer it anyway.

As far as freedom of speech, we certainly wouldn't say that means all speech is of equal value. Just because I believe you have the right or opportunity to speak your mind doesn't mean you are saying anything of value. Just look at GSF if you need proof.

Surely there is some value in most things posted. But obviously some posts have more value than others. But everybody, with the possible exception of GSF, posts stuff that they think they know to be the best. They are offering the best that they know. Well, you certainly cant expect them to react well when someone comes along and says something that is different. Different is not equal. So if one guy says one thing, and another guy says another thing, then they obviously are going to think the other is an idiot.

So if some idiot comes along and posts something after me, he's basically calling me an idiot to my face right? If I say you should mow with a riding mower, and he says that riding mowers tear up the grass, he's basically saying I'm trying to set you up for failure. How should I react to that? I'm certainly not going to be happy about it. So, if I'm feeling good, I'm going to defend my claim; and if I'm feeling shitty, I'm going to just criticize his claim, but either way, it's not likely to be received well.

What I'm getting at is that it's human nature to defend yourself against perceived attack, and that posting something that is different than what somebody else posted will be perceived as an attack. Chances are though, that someone is right and someone is wrong. The person that is wrong, might even know he's wrong, but admitting it isn't really human nature. That person who is wrong will try to attack the other folks, but in the end, he'll still be wrong.

I suspect that if you looked at any of the threads where you perceived this dog-piling going on, you will probably see that the guy getting attacked probably did offer substandard advice, and probably had an opportunity to admit it, but chose not to. If that thread has me getting attacked, I guarantee you that's what happened.

ETA: Going back and reading Council of Dave's post makes me realize I should point out that I'm talking about opinions.
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 12:27:31 AM EDT
[#4]


My opinion on this is that it's a load of crap. Just my opinion.

Can we get a dog-pile here please?
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 12:29:02 AM EDT
[#5]
Quoted:


My opinion on this is that it's a load of crap. Just my opinion.

Can we get a dog-pile here please?


ok but some one else has to start and ill follow
Link Posted: 9/11/2010 12:35:19 AM EDT
[#6]
Quoted:
Ahhh, a clique memeber. In groups, well you'd be strong, but alone...you bail. This is where that miniscule extract form quotes without context thing comes in.

I'll come back to answer this one:

Ah yes! You have me pegged scottfire1957! I submit to you're keen eye sir!  You've outted me, touche!! Yes I am a clique member. A special breed. A member of the ARFcom elders. Someone who looks down on others and judges harshly. The super Christian! Yep, that's me. I'm exposed due to your genius and intuitive quantum powers to know someone's personality from a few lines of text. Fuck me you're good! Wish I was that good.

Talk about minuscule extract.  

In CONTEXT, genius, right and wrong is defined by rules. Nothing more, nothing less. Rules are what set the precedence for such a question as to "what is right and what is wrong." If there's no rules...wait for it....there's no right or wrong! HOLY SHIT! What a concept! So far as I know there's no rules to how you cut your grass unless you're under an HOA, which fammyman never mentioned, so we're left to assume there's no rules for cutting the grass.

Now if fammyman said an HOA outlined a certain way to mow a persons lawn (the rules) then described how said person mowed his lawn (whether he followed the rules or not) I would be able to judge if he was right or wrong. Since 99.9% of people mow their lawns however the fuck they want to, the example he used is just plain ineffective in justifying or proving wrong the tier 1 group who dog pile others. The example used is just abstract bolder dash and this life to short to participate in such mental masturbation therefore I chose not to participate. Guess I'll be going back to my clique now.




Link Posted: 9/14/2010 6:56:52 PM EDT
[#7]
Quoted:
Quoted:
Ahhh, a clique memeber. In groups, well you'd be strong, but alone...you bail. This is where that miniscule extract form quotes without context thing comes in.

I'll come back to answer this one:

Ah yes! You have me pegged scottfire1957! I submit to you're keen eye sir!  You've outted me, touche!! Yes I am a clique member. A special breed. A member of the ARFcom elders. Someone who looks down on others and judges harshly. The super Christian! Yep, that's me. I'm exposed due to your genius and intuitive quantum powers to know someone's personality from a few lines of text. Fuck me you're good! Wish I was that good.

Talk about minuscule extract.  

In CONTEXT, genius, right and wrong is defined by rules. Nothing more, nothing less. Rules are what set the precedence for such a question as to "what is right and what is wrong." If there's no rules...wait for it....there's no right or wrong! HOLY SHIT! What a concept! So far as I know there's no rules to how you cut your grass unless you're under an HOA, which fammyman never mentioned, so we're left to assume there's no rules for cutting the grass.

Now if fammyman said an HOA outlined a certain way to mow a persons lawn (the rules) then described how said person mowed his lawn (whether he followed the rules or not) I would be able to judge if he was right or wrong. Since 99.9% of people mow their lawns however the fuck they want to, the example he used is just plain ineffective in justifying or proving wrong the tier 1 group who dog pile others. The example used is just abstract bolder dash and this life to short to participate in such mental masturbation therefore I chose not to participate. Guess I'll be going back to my clique now.









You're typing loudly. That must mean you're correct.



ETA> I corrected a spelling thing.


Link Posted: 9/14/2010 7:18:36 PM EDT
[#8]
Quoted:
Quoted:
The simple answer is that we have a HUGE membership made up of all sorts of people. It's inevitable that some will form cliques.

Smaller fora are a lot more cohesive.


i agree with you. but why is one clique better than the other ? cliques should be able to co exist peacefully should they not ?


Because in my mind I'm better than you.  I always will be.  Even with non-anonymous e-mail accounts and a lot of people here having their pictures in their avatars and local hometown forum shoots getting together all the time, there is still a keyboard, a computer screen, and a gray arfcom background between you and me.  And that leads to a lack of repercussion for not being tactful, discreet, and polite.  Therefore...

I. AM. BETTER. THAN. YOU  

ETA: Also, the only thing better than chili without beans is a full-size 1911.
Link Posted: 9/14/2010 7:23:16 PM EDT
[#9]
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