Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: If you are affected by crosswinds on an motorcycle it because of improper technique. I could ride a 250 in 60mph crosswinds with no problem. The issue in crosswinds is your arms are locked, the wind blows your torso, causing your arms to steer the motorcycle inadvertently. I don't know man.  I got hit with some 30mph or so crosswinds on my DRZ and I was riding at a serious lean to keep it going straight.  Never had a problem on sportbikes but they did weigh 100+ pounds more than the DRZ. I was riding home through NW Ohio a few weeks ago. It was one of those days where instead of a cloud or a sun, the weather has a giant "WINDY" in it's place. I was tucked in, going straight, and my bike was at a constant 10-15 degrees from vertical for several miles. That being said, that's the most extreme case I've had of wind on my bike, it's not really a big factor, ever.

Oklahoma is the secound windy city in the USA (chicago #1) you would find winds like that every other day,sometimes worse!

Kirp is a qualified bike rider and I'm sure when he gets 36 years of riding behind him he can tell others about how to ride,my rear brake is just as important as my front brake !

When used correctly it can slide you around obstacles,when used with the front brake it can cut the stopping distance by 1/3.

As far as safe bikes my first was a 1957 cushman  and you know about those donnut tires and sandy roads,and on the Allstate push we road double and the guy on the back's duty was to kick the dogs in the chops as they chased us down the road!

Our next venture was a 50cc Delardo italion bike (about the same as the push) except you couln't peddle it!

Then a basket case 68 Norton Atlas ,then a Honda CBX 750(pretty darn fast for it's time).

Every day on the street is like five days on the track!

I wouldn't know how to ride on the track,I'd be so busy looking for cars with hub caps spinning at every intersection I would run off the track(or I would slow down or excerate to make an openning to keep me far away from eventual problems).

I ride well ahead of me(missed a box spring mattress)scared the crap out of me ,but years of riding have searved me well!

It could all end tomorrow such is the nature of the beast!

Bob

I would have to say go with the SV.  Good bike for beginners and with a little work on the rear suspension it's golden

Quoted: Wait for what?  "SV 650" or "get back in the kitchen and fix me a sammich"?

I'd go with the sammich option, personally

TXL

Quoted: Kirp is a qualified bike rider and I'm sure when he gets 36 years of riding behind him he can tell others about how to ride,

I've been riding for 40 years, and I don't want to tell anybody how to ride- I just offer information.  It's like the information buffet- if they want to pick it up and run with it, they are free to do so, and if they wish to pass, they are free to do so also.  Nobody's twisting anybody's arm here.

my rear brake is just as important as my front brake ! When used correctly it can slide you around obstacles,when used with the front brake it can cut the stopping distance by 1/3.

I like Bob, but with all due respects, comments like this are downright dangerous.  Everybody has an opinion, and I fully support their right to express it (especially if I am allowed equal time to express mine).  But their opinion does not change the laws of physics.

The braking information that follows, diverges from the MSF beginner's course, and I have specific, articulable reasons for it:

Braking on a normal motorcycle is not like braking on a car.  The center of gravity is proportionally much higher than cars, the brakes are proportionally much more powerful than cars, and the braking limit is not traction-limited like on cars.  Also, cars have wheels side-by-side, so there is no concern about keeping the car upright.

If you hold a stationary motorcycle with the sidestand up and let go of it, it will fall over.  It falls over because there is nothing to hold it up.  If you ride that same motorcycle down the road and let go of the handlebar at 60 mph, it does not fall over.  It does not fall over, because something is holding it up.  The thing that is holding it up is the gyroscopic effect of the spinning rear wheel.  The speed that you are traveling down the road has nothing to do with it- if the rear wheel is spinning and the motorcycle is stopped, the motorcycle stays up- the rear wheel doesn't even have to be on the ground.  That's why bikes don't fall over when doing stoppies or rolling burn-outs.

When cruising down the road on a normal motorcycle, the weight may be distributed roughly 50% on the front wheel, and 50% on the rear.  As soon as you start braking, more weight is shifted to the front wheel.  Under hard braking (like if a mini-van pulls out in front of you),  you'll shift 100% of the weight onto the front wheel, and with proper front brake modulation, the rear wheel will be just grazing the pavement, or even just off it.  At that point, you can't brake any harder- that's maximum braking.  Touching the rear brake at that point won't do anything to stop you.  What it will do, is lock the rear wheel up instantly.  Refer to the information above to find out what happens to a motorcycle when the rear wheel is no longer turning (you go down).

That's where you hear all these stories from these old guys about how they "had to lay her down" to avoid hitting something, as if chrome sliding across pavement gave more braking and steering control than rubber tires on pavement.  What really happened, is that they nailed the rear brake, locked up the rear wheel, and the next thing you know, they were sliding on their ass across the pavement.  The story was reverse-engineered because they didn't understand what happened, so they just made something up.

I would say that more than 90% of the fatal and non-fatal single bike accidents that I have seen, have been caused by attempting to use the rear brake while in motion.

Like most experienced RIDERS, I only use mine at stops, to keep the bike from rolling, if I need my right hand free (like to fiddle with my visor or something).  

Every day on the street is like five days on the track! I wouldn't know how to ride on the track,I'd be so busy looking for cars with hub caps spinning at every intersection I would run off the track(or I would slow down or excerate to make an openning to keep me far away from eventual problems). Bob

I do not know how someone can make a comparison about riding on the track versus riding on the street if they've never ridden on the track.  I've done both.  I learned more about riding in my first 20 minutes on track, than I did in my 40 years prior.

Kirkp  so you have donut drivers and landscape people and normal stupid ass cell phone drivers on your track?

I could say fifty years riding if I counted the cushman Eagle,and there were times on the double springer forks bycycle pumping double that standing on the rear brake was not enough,and the sneeker was put against the front tire(with descretion)!

I'm 62 Dude and there is not much you can teach me ,unless you know how to make possum grape wine!

Oh and the only race track I get on is I-240  !

And great news flash the same thing happens to all vehicals except rear engine cars!

You are a blow hard as you are preaching to the choiur here,you are great for newbees cause you might save them some skin down the line!

I was riding bikes when your mama was changing your diapers!

Bob




Have a nice (little bike day)  Bob

Quoted: Quoted: Kirp is a qualified bike rider and I'm sure when he gets 36 years of riding behind him he can tell others about how to ride, I've been riding for 40 years, and I don't want to tell anybody how to ride- I just offer information.  It's like the information buffet- if they want to pick it up and run with it, they are free to do so, and if they wish to pass, they are free to do so also.  Nobody's twisting anybody's arm here. my rear brake is just as important as my front brake ! When used correctly it can slide you around obstacles,when used with the front brake it can cut the stopping distance by 1/3. I like Bob, but with all due respects, comments like this are downright dangerous.  Everybody has an opinion, and I fully support their right to express it (especially if I am allowed equal time to express mine).  But their opinion does not change the laws of physics. The braking information that follows, diverges from the MSF beginner's course, and I have specific, articulable reasons for it: Braking on a normal motorcycle is not like braking on a car.  The center of gravity is proportionally much higher than cars, the brakes are proportionally much more powerful than cars, and the braking limit is not traction-limited like on cars.  Also, cars have wheels side-by-side, so there is no concern about keeping the car upright. If you hold a stationary motorcycle with the sidestand up and let go of it, it will fall over.  It falls over because there is nothing to hold it up.  If you ride that same motorcycle down the road and let go of the handlebar at 60 mph, it does not fall over.  It does not fall over, because something is holding it up.  The thing that is holding it up is the gyroscopic effect of the spinning rear wheel.  The speed that you are traveling down the road has nothing to do with it- if the rear wheel is spinning and the motorcycle is stopped, the motorcycle stays up- the rear wheel doesn't even have to be on the ground.  That's why bikes don't fall over when doing stoppies or rolling burn-outs. When cruising down the road on a normal motorcycle, the weight may be distributed roughly 50% on the front wheel, and 50% on the rear.  As soon as you start braking, more weight is shifted to the front wheel.  Under hard braking (like if a mini-van pulls out in front of you),  you'll shift 100% of the weight onto the front wheel, and with proper front brake modulation, the rear wheel will be just grazing the pavement, or even just off it.  At that point, you can't brake any harder- that's maximum braking.  Touching the rear brake at that point won't do anything to stop you.  What it will do, is lock the rear wheel up instantly.  Refer to the information above to find out what happens to a motorcycle when the rear wheel is no longer turning (you go down). That's where you hear all these stories from these old guys about how they "had to lay her down" to avoid hitting something, as if chrome sliding across pavement gave more braking and steering control than rubber tires on pavement.  What really happened, is that they nailed the rear brake, locked up the rear wheel, and the next thing you know, they were sliding on their ass across the pavement.  The story was reverse-engineered because they didn't understand what happened, so they just made something up. I would say that more than 90% of the fatal and non-fatal single bike accidents that I have seen, have been caused by attempting to use the rear brake while in motion. Like most experienced RIDERS, I only use mine at stops, to keep the bike from rolling, if I need my right hand free (like to fiddle with my visor or something).   Every day on the street is like five days on the track! I wouldn't know how to ride on the track,I'd be so busy looking for cars with hub caps spinning at every intersection I would run off the track(or I would slow down or excerate to make an openning to keep me far away from eventual problems). Bob I do not know how someone can make a comparison about riding on the track versus riding on the street if they've never ridden on the track.  I've done both.  I learned more about riding in my first 20 minutes on track, than I did in my 40 years prior.

Bullsjhit  why even have a rear brake?

You dont have the skills to make it work,I have a dumb ass harley friend whomn I keep telling him the front brake is the king pin,he says he never uses the front brake!

I give up!  I say both applyed together will get the job done,your expeareance on the round track may differ,but here in real traffic it is different!

Bob

Quoted: On motorcycles, the mirrors are not like cars.  You cannot see directly behind you.  Heck, many motorcycle mirrors are so bad, that all you can see is your own elbows.

This problem is solved by using bar-end mirrors. I put Napoleans on mine and can see EVERYTHING behind me with no problems. These should be standard issue.

Quoted: Quoted: Kirp is a qualified bike rider and I'm sure when he gets 36 years of riding behind him he can tell others about how to ride, I've been riding for 40 years, and I don't want to tell anybody how to ride- I just offer information.  It's like the information buffet- if they want to pick it up and run with it, they are free to do so, and if they wish to pass, they are free to do so also.  Nobody's twisting anybody's arm here. my rear brake is just as important as my front brake ! When used correctly it can slide you around obstacles,when used with the front brake it can cut the stopping distance by 1/3. I like Bob, but with all due respects, comments like this are downright dangerous.  Everybody has an opinion, and I fully support their right to express it (especially if I am allowed equal time to express mine).  But their opinion does not change the laws of physics. The braking information that follows, diverges from the MSF beginner's course, and I have specific, articulable reasons for it: Braking on a normal motorcycle is not like braking on a car.  The center of gravity is proportionally much higher than cars, the brakes are proportionally much more powerful than cars, and the braking limit is not traction-limited like on cars.  Also, cars have wheels side-by-side, so there is no concern about keeping the car upright. If you hold a stationary motorcycle with the sidestand up and let go of it, it will fall over.  It falls over because there is nothing to hold it up.  If you ride that same motorcycle down the road and let go of the handlebar at 60 mph, it does not fall over.  It does not fall over, because something is holding it up.  The thing that is holding it up is the gyroscopic effect of the spinning rear wheel.  The speed that you are traveling down the road has nothing to do with it- if the rear wheel is spinning and the motorcycle is stopped, the motorcycle stays up- the rear wheel doesn't even have to be on the ground.  That's why bikes don't fall over when doing stoppies or rolling burn-outs. When cruising down the road on a normal motorcycle, the weight may be distributed roughly 50% on the front wheel, and 50% on the rear.  As soon as you start braking, more weight is shifted to the front wheel.  Under hard braking (like if a mini-van pulls out in front of you),  you'll shift 100% of the weight onto the front wheel, and with proper front brake modulation, the rear wheel will be just grazing the pavement, or even just off it.  At that point, you can't brake any harder- that's maximum braking.  Touching the rear brake at that point won't do anything to stop you.  What it will do, is lock the rear wheel up instantly.  Refer to the information above to find out what happens to a motorcycle when the rear wheel is no longer turning (you go down). That's where you hear all these stories from these old guys about how they "had to lay her down" to avoid hitting something, as if chrome sliding across pavement gave more braking and steering control than rubber tires on pavement.  What really happened, is that they nailed the rear brake, locked up the rear wheel, and the next thing you know, they were sliding on their ass across the pavement.  The story was reverse-engineered because they didn't understand what happened, so they just made something up. I would say that more than 90% of the fatal and non-fatal single bike accidents that I have seen, have been caused by attempting to use the rear brake while in motion. Like most experienced RIDERS, I only use mine at stops, to keep the bike from rolling, if I need my right hand free (like to fiddle with my visor or something).   Every day on the street is like five days on the track! I wouldn't know how to ride on the track,I'd be so busy looking for cars with hub caps spinning at every intersection I would run off the track(or I would slow down or excerate to make an openning to keep me far away from eventual problems). Bob I do not know how someone can make a comparison about riding on the track versus riding on the street if they've never ridden on the track.  I've done both.  I learned more about riding in my first 20 minutes on track, than I did in my 40 years prior.

Ok, so how do you get out of it?  "proper front brake modulation"? what's that?  

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Kirp is a qualified bike rider and I'm sure when he gets 36 years of riding behind him he can tell others about how to ride, I've been riding for 40 years, and I don't want to tell anybody how to ride- I just offer information.  It's like the information buffet- if they want to pick it up and run with it, they are free to do so, and if they wish to pass, they are free to do so also.  Nobody's twisting anybody's arm here. my rear brake is just as important as my front brake ! When used correctly it can slide you around obstacles,when used with the front brake it can cut the stopping distance by 1/3. I like Bob, but with all due respects, comments like this are downright dangerous.  Everybody has an opinion, and I fully support their right to express it (especially if I am allowed equal time to express mine).  But their opinion does not change the laws of physics. The braking information that follows, diverges from the MSF beginner's course, and I have specific, articulable reasons for it: Braking on a normal motorcycle is not like braking on a car.  The center of gravity is proportionally much higher than cars, the brakes are proportionally much more powerful than cars, and the braking limit is not traction-limited like on cars.  Also, cars have wheels side-by-side, so there is no concern about keeping the car upright. If you hold a stationary motorcycle with the sidestand up and let go of it, it will fall over.  It falls over because there is nothing to hold it up.  If you ride that same motorcycle down the road and let go of the handlebar at 60 mph, it does not fall over.  It does not fall over, because something is holding it up.  The thing that is holding it up is the gyroscopic effect of the spinning rear wheel.  The speed that you are traveling down the road has nothing to do with it- if the rear wheel is spinning and the motorcycle is stopped, the motorcycle stays up- the rear wheel doesn't even have to be on the ground.  That's why bikes don't fall over when doing stoppies or rolling burn-outs. When cruising down the road on a normal motorcycle, the weight may be distributed roughly 50% on the front wheel, and 50% on the rear.  As soon as you start braking, more weight is shifted to the front wheel.  Under hard braking (like if a mini-van pulls out in front of you),  you'll shift 100% of the weight onto the front wheel, and with proper front brake modulation, the rear wheel will be just grazing the pavement, or even just off it.  At that point, you can't brake any harder- that's maximum braking.  Touching the rear brake at that point won't do anything to stop you.  What it will do, is lock the rear wheel up instantly.  Refer to the information above to find out what happens to a motorcycle when the rear wheel is no longer turning (you go down). That's where you hear all these stories from these old guys about how they "had to lay her down" to avoid hitting something, as if chrome sliding across pavement gave more braking and steering control than rubber tires on pavement.  What really happened, is that they nailed the rear brake, locked up the rear wheel, and the next thing you know, they were sliding on their ass across the pavement.  The story was reverse-engineered because they didn't understand what happened, so they just made something up. I would say that more than 90% of the fatal and non-fatal single bike accidents that I have seen, have been caused by attempting to use the rear brake while in motion. Like most experienced RIDERS, I only use mine at stops, to keep the bike from rolling, if I need my right hand free (like to fiddle with my visor or something).   Every day on the street is like five days on the track! I wouldn't know how to ride on the track,I'd be so busy looking for cars with hub caps spinning at every intersection I would run off the track(or I would slow down or excerate to make an openning to keep me far away from eventual problems). Bob I do not know how someone can make a comparison about riding on the track versus riding on the street if they've never ridden on the track.  I've done both.  I learned more about riding in my first 20 minutes on track, than I did in my 40 years prior. Ok, so how do you get out of it?  "proper front brake modulation"? what's that?

It's called bump fireing  the rear disk brake is on the right side,and the front disk brake  is on the left side!

You can hit the rear brake just enough to make your 700 +your fat ass,thats 950 lbs get some bite (not lock up)then with the back brake applied use the front brake .

You will feel the effect you may have to pump both rear and front brakes together.

But It can be done!!!

If you cannot preform this then you need never ride in rain,I tried to ride in the snow to work got about one mile then came back home(useing only my front brake)it acted like a skid  I beleve if I had a ski instead of a front tire I could have gone to work that day!


Bob

Quoted: Ok, so how do you get out of it?  "proper front brake modulation"? what's that?

Proper braking takes LOTS of practice to get it right and to make it muscle memory.

If you grab the front brake too hard, too fast, the front wheel will lock up and you will immediately go down. You need to apply the front brake with increasing force for about 1/2 second before you can really squeeze the lever hard. This gives time for weigh to transfer to the front tire, increasing traction at the front end. While braking, you should squeeze the tank with your knees and try to keep weight off of your arms/hands.

A cruiser has a longer wheelbase and lower center of gravity than a standard or sport bike, making them less likely to "stoppie" or flip over the front wheel, and instead they will skid the front wheel. Because of this, the rear brake on a cruiser does have use, but it still less than 30% of stopping power, whereas on a standard or sport bike it is under 10% (and 0% after the first 1/2 second when the rear wheel is off of the ground).

Quoted: Ok, so how do you get out of it?  "proper front brake modulation"? what's that?

It comes from practice.  You'll feel the back tire get light and start wiggling, and if you keep braking too hard, you'll feel the back tire come all the way off the ground.  This is why a track day is so important as part of your learning curve, BEFORE you attempt to ride on public roads.  At a track day, you'll have the opportunity to practice braking as hard as you want, probably several times a minute, all day, until you're too tired to ride anymore.  

That way, when a soccer mom tries to punch your ticket, it'll be like "Okay, I've done this before".  If you don't do a track day to practice maximum braking, the very first time you try it, it will be in a life-or-death situation.  If you get it wrong at the track, it's no big deal- you'll just try again on the next lap.  If you get it wrong on the street, you die.

FWIW, track days have groups for all skill levels.  My wife did her first track day on her SV650 as soon as she took her MSF beginner's course.  They are not a race.  The track is typically available for your group 20 minutes out of each hour.  You can go out whenever you feel like it, and come in whenever you feel like it, as long as the track is "green" for your particular group.  You'll also find plenty of helpful instructors willing to work one-on-one with you.  It's a tremendous learning experience, and it's infinitely more safe than public roads.

Quoted: Ok, so how do you get out of it?  "proper front brake modulation"? what's that?

I take it as finding your chosen bike's threshold for maximum braking and staying at or just under it.  It takes practice in a controlled environment to get the muscle memory.

Quoted: You can hit the rear brake just enough to make your 700 +your fat ass,thats 950 lbs get some bite (not lock up)then with the back brake applied use the front brake . You will feel the effect you may have to pump both rear and front brakes together.

More like 580 lbs total.

You should not pump your brakes on a motorcycle, you use threshold braking, where when the wheel begins to lockup you release pressure on the brake to avoid the skid. This can be felt in the bars as a slight oscillation if your arms are loose.

Persephone, the risks of the rear brake are even worse in a corner.  If you lock up the rear wheel in a straight line, you fall down.  If you cause the rear tire to slide from attempting to use the rear brake in a corner, it causes the bike to go sideways.  It takes the brain a split second to diagnose the problem, and to cause the operator to let go of the rear brake.   The rear tire will suddenly regain full traction, with the bike still sideways, and then snap bolt upright.  The bike weighs three times what you do, so if you're holding onto it, it's going to flick you like a booger, right over the "high side" of the bike.  You'll be up in the air, going about twice as fast as you were going, and to add insult to injury, your bike is now following you, into whatever you are going to hit.  It's kind of like when Wile E. Coyote falls off the cliff, with the anvil behind him.  A high-side is a very dangerous way to crash.

Quoted: Quoted: On motorcycles, the mirrors are not like cars.  You cannot see directly behind you.  Heck, many motorcycle mirrors are so bad, that all you can see is your own elbows. This problem is solved by using bar-end mirrors. I put Napoleans on mine and can see EVERYTHING behind me with no problems. These should be standard issue.

Yes.  They are cool.  I run one on the left side of my bike.  But most bikes don't come with bar-end mirrors on them, and they make the bike really, really wide.

Quoted: A cruiser has a longer wheelbase and lower center of gravity than a standard or sport bike, making them less likely to "stoppie" or flip over the front wheel, and instead they will skid the front wheel. Because of this, the rear brake on a cruiser does have use, but it still less than 30% of stopping power, whereas on a standard or sport bike it is under 10% (and 0% after the first 1/2 second when the rear wheel is off of the ground).

Thank you brother Jerremy  because we crusiers have big fat bikes,and the rear brakes are the real deals!

If you ever see me lean out with one knee nearly touching the ground (please shoot me)!

Bob

Jessus KirkP  Does every body have to lock  up thier brakes!

Maybe you should teach those that would ride to use the brakes first!

No reverse clam shells,maybe a 747 should land at 300 MPH!

Brakes are really big on sport bikes,I can hold my brake handle down and have the dixie chicks all of them set on it and my bike may slide but never flip!


Teach others how to safely break,then teach them to ride!

I know you can do it!

Bob

Persephone, Jeremy is right, and I kind of glossed over the actual application of the front brakes.

When you need to brake hard, you'll "squeeze" the front brake lever, to transfer the weight onto the front tire, before you can truly crush the brake lever.  Jeremy used the arbitrary time of about 1/2 second, which for the purpose of discussion, is just fine.  His point is valid- if someone (through panic) snaps the front brake lever on, it is theoretically possible for them to lock the front tire.  In actual practice, the squeezing of the brake lever and the subsequent full application, happens all in one smooth motion, very quickly, through muscle memory (as Jermey pointed out).

Once you're at maximum braking, if the rear tire comes up, you have to let off some, or it'll keep coming up.  To offer an extreme example, you can brake hardest when the rear tire is grazing the pavement, and if the rear tire comes all the way up to where the bike is almost balanced on the front wheel, you can't hardly use any front brake without sending it all the way over (like you see the stunt guys do).  So it's best not to let the rear tire get too high.

It is important to practice it the same way every time, because how you practice is how you'll respond in an emergency.  Some motorcycle operators tell themselves that they will only use the rear brake if it's not an emergency, but in an emergency, they respond like they always do, with disasterous results.  How you train is how you'll fight.

Two good examples of high-sides:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzsScCnW9AA

www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCxizE_yef4

Quoted: Two good examples of high-sides: www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzsScCnW9AA www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCxizE_yef4

Thanks, man.  

Quoted: Jessus KirkP  Does every body have to lock  up thier brakes!

I'm not KirkP, but I gotta ask. Can you just not read, or what? It has been repeated numerous times. Maximum braking force does not come from locking the brakes, but riding the fine line just before.

And I, for one, would pay money to see you using your rear brake to slide around an obstacle on pavement.  

Quoted: Two good examples of high-sides: www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzsScCnW9AA www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCxizE_yef4

Both of these are from chopping the throttle when the rear the rear end loses traction exiting a turn from too much throttle. Different cause, but same results.

On that note, if your back end starts coming around on the exit of a turn, you must resist the urge to close the throttle. Keep it steady, or back off like 2-4% (NOT 50%) if you can, it will many times correct itself, and if not, better to lowside than highside.

Quoted: Quoted: Two good examples of high-sides: www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzsScCnW9AA www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCxizE_yef4 Both of these are from chopping the throttle when the rear the rear end loses traction exiting a turn from too much throttle. Different cause, but same results. On that note, if your back end starts coming around on the exit of a turn, you must resist the urge to close the throttle. Keep it steady, or back off like 2-4% (NOT 50%) if you can, it will many times correct itself, and if not, better to lowside than highside.

Ah, that actually makes more sense. I just searched for "high side" and didn't take into account it could have been from chopping the throttle.

BTW, I will definitely say it's a hard urge to fight, but I'm now MUCH better at not chopping the throttle (sometimes I get the urge when I go over some sand that's on the road and my tires slide a bit).

Here's another highside

Quoted: Quoted: Jessus KirkP  Does every body have to lock  up thier brakes! I'm not KirkP, but I gotta ask. Can you just not read, or what? It has been repeated numerous times. Maximum braking force does not come from locking the brakes, but riding the fine line just before. And I, for one, would pay money to see you using your rear brake to slide around an obstacle on pavement.

Tell ya what, do a search for SuperMotard, there is your proof!
OR, come down to NC and I will swap out some rims/tires and teach you how to do it....



HA HA HA! page 2 and FOUR ......boyeee....

Quoted: Here's another highside

I lol'd.

Quoted: Quoted: Here's another highside I lol'd.

Izzat KirkP pre trackmaster days?

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Here's another highside I lol'd. Izzat KirkP pre trackmaster days?

Yep.  You found me out.  Crashing the two-wheeled weed-wacker.

Quoted: Here's another highside

you fail at linking.

Quoted: Quoted: Two good examples of high-sides: www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzsScCnW9AA www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCxizE_yef4 Both of these are from chopping the throttle when the rear the rear end loses traction exiting a turn from too much throttle. Different cause, but same results. On that note, if your back end starts coming around on the exit of a turn, you must resist the urge to close the throttle. Keep it steady, or back off like 2-4% (NOT 50%) if you can, it will many times correct itself, and if not, better to lowside than highside.

Here, this one is ALL rear brake.  Sucks to lose control and crash in a straight line.  Extra lame-ness points for blaming it on water on the ground.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7wH7WDUvF0

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Two good examples of high-sides: www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzsScCnW9AA www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCxizE_yef4 Both of these are from chopping the throttle when the rear the rear end loses traction exiting a turn from too much throttle. Different cause, but same results. On that note, if your back end starts coming around on the exit of a turn, you must resist the urge to close the throttle. Keep it steady, or back off like 2-4% (NOT 50%) if you can, it will many times correct itself, and if not, better to lowside than highside. Here, this one is ALL rear brake.  Sucks to lose control and crash in a straight line.  Extra lame-ness points for blaming it on water on the ground. www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7wH7WDUvF0

Darwin is chomping at the bit for that one.  

Nice protective gear/helmet  

Nice place to be practicing such dumbassery

It's like he's trying to crack his mellon and unfortunately fails at that too.  

Quoted: Quoted: Here's another highside you fail at linking.

You fail at clicking a link. Worked for everyone else

Quoted: Here, this one is ALL rear brake.  Sucks to lose control and crash in a straight line.  Extra lame-ness points for blaming it on water on the ground. www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7wH7WDUvF0

Ok, I lol'd EVEN MORE at that one.

jeremy223, the photobucket link temporarily didn't work. I watched it once, it worked....came back later and tried to watch it again (hey, it's funny, of course I'll watch it twice) and it didnt.

I just checked before posting this and it did work for me.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Here's another highside you fail at linking. You fail at clicking a link. Worked for everyone else

Saw it.  I mean, damn!

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Jessus KirkP  Does every body have to lock  up thier brakes! I'm not KirkP, but I gotta ask. Can you just not read, or what? It has been repeated numerous times. Maximum braking force does not come from locking the brakes, but riding the fine line just before. And I, for one, would pay money to see you using your rear brake to slide around an obstacle on pavement.   Tell ya what, do a search for SuperMotard, there is your proof!

ETA- He's saying he does it on a cruiser, not a dirt bike with street tires.

Pick up a used Ninja 500.  

Quoted: Pick up a used Ninja 500.

Half the horsepower of an SV650
Half of the brakes of an SV650
Weighs more than an SV650
Mild steel frame instead of aluminum
Carburetors instead of fuel injection
Wrapped in expensive plastic instead of naked

I'd take a pass on that one.

Persephone ... If the Beemer is on your list (and you've priced it) you should consider the F800 BMWs, also.   I've had the "S" for a year/7K miles and am still in the honeymoon phase.  I bought a demo for <$10K.  It can be had with a 1" lower seat, although my rear appears to be closer to the ground than yours and I've got both feet flat on the ground at red lights.   Twin cylinder, ABS, fuel injection, tire pressure monitoring,  +420 pounds, 80+ HP, belt-drive, and God-honest 56 MPG around town.  The ST model has more fairing, a tail "rack", and a more upright riding position.  My 2c.

Stay safe

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Jessus KirkP  Does every body have to lock  up thier brakes! I'm not KirkP, but I gotta ask. Can you just not read, or what? It has been repeated numerous times. Maximum braking force does not come from locking the brakes, but riding the fine line just before. And I, for one, would pay money to see you using your rear brake to slide around an obstacle on pavement.   Tell ya what, do a search for SuperMotard, there is your proof! ETA- He's saying he does it on a cruiser, not a dirt bike with street tires.

Hows abouts a dirt bike wiff knobbies?

Gary Busey and George Clooney high sided,I had on a norton 750 atlas came upon a left turn too quickly and hit the rear brake and slid 15 feet (slowed down enough )that I could tap the front brake same hand with trottle and recover and make that turn!

I was going slow enough and leaning far left and did not flip!

Believe it or not,and the feel you get just before a front or rear brake is about to break traction is what you learn from years of ridding,I say yes for the track unless you have wide open spaces.

I think you are saveing lives,even if by putting them on 2 wheels is always a danger!

Respectfully   Bob