Very few things make me gasp when I read them - Page 2

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Very few things make me gasp when I read them (Page 2 of 3)

Posted: 1/26/2006 7:21:09 AM EDT

[#1]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
<snip>

I was thinking the same thing xanadu but we also need to consider the kid was stopped, waiting behind the schoolbus, and the semi rear-ended them all - not her fault.

Yes, but if there was a parent in the car coaching her on her driving, would she have been there at all. Would she have gone a little faster, a little slower.

What if she told her mom, "it's against the law for me to drive with out an adult in the car, please don't ask me to break the law mommy" it's a little like a Zen Buddism exercise - who the hell knows.

Okay, it was all her and her mother's fault. The truck driver knew she was driving illegally, so what he did is okay.

Unfortunately, that is how the scumbag that will represent the Semi driver (and his carrier) will paint this: and win.

I doubt it.

No matter how you shake this tree, hitting someone in the rear with a school bus lights flashing driving that vehicle into the school bus injuring the children inside isn't going to set well with a jury anywhere.

The DA or civil lawyers will stack the jury with family people and parents anywhere will nail this guy to a cross, derservably so.

Tj

TJ, theoretically, the argument has merit: if she was not there, the semi woulda had, what, an add'l 12 feet in order to come to a complete stop WITHOUT hurting a soul.
Trust me...90% of the blame is wiped with that. Especially if that trucker drove for a national carrier: one, he's union and two...refer back to one. (not bashing, just pointing out that the union WILL hire the beast lawyer)

That driver is not in a union. Hardly any national truckload carriers are union. I can't think of any that are.

Posted: 1/26/2006 7:21:45 AM EDT

[#2]

double post

Posted: 1/26/2006 8:23:36 AM EDT

[#3]

boortz pegs it again boortz.com/nuze/200601/01262006.html#driver

OK .. so the driver wasn't at fault in that tragic dump truck-car-school bus accident yesterday. Seven children were killed. Seven. All in one car. The children were all the adopted children of one couple. Here's the kicker. The driver of the car .. .the driver of the car with six child passengers ... was only 15 years old. There were originally seven passengers. The 15-year-old had already dropped one off. Now it is true that the driver of the car ... the 15-year-old driver of the car ... did not cause the accident. The blame for the accident goes to the dump truck driver who smashed into the car while the car was stopped behind a school bus. No skid marks. The dump truck never hit the brakes. The point here is that if the 15-year-old were not driving these seven children may well be alive today. If an adult had been driving that car it is quite probable that something would have changed ... the time spent dropping that one child off .. the time spent loading the kids into the car ... a small delay in hitting the road ... a change in speed .... something would have changed to move that car out from between that truck and that school bus. Some adult made a choice to allow a 15-year-old girl drive a car with seven child passengers on an errand ... and all but one of those kids are dead. The tragedy gets worse ... much worse. Barbara Mann is the mother of these adopted children. When her father learned of the tragic accident he had a massive heart attack and died. Barbara Mann lost her children and her father ... and none of us can even begin to comprehend the sadness this woman feels. I can't help but wonder, though, how things might have been different if Barbara Mann had not let her 15-year-old daughter drive .... illegally.

Posted: 1/26/2006 9:16:52 AM EDT

[#4]

The whole story just made me sick. Union County, where this all happened, is 5 miles from my house. Unlike most places in FL, there is only one very small town there. It's a tight knit place where everyone seems to know everyone else and every third person seems to be related somehow. Accidents can happen anywhere, but nothing truly bad or newsworthy ever seems to happen down there. This is going to affect to whole community for a long time. As for the mother, after losing her children and her father within 24 hour, I don't know how she will be able to deal with it all. I know I'd be hard pressed to go on.

Posted: 1/26/2006 9:16:54 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
boortz pegs it again boortz.com/nuze/200601/01262006.html#driver

OK .. so the driver wasn't at fault in that tragic dump truck-car-school bus accident yesterday. Seven children were killed. Seven. All in one car. The children were all the adopted children of one couple. Here's the kicker. The driver of the car .. .the driver of the car with six child passengers ... was only 15 years old. There were originally seven passengers. The 15-year-old had already dropped one off. Now it is true that the driver of the car ... the 15-year-old driver of the car ... did not cause the accident. The blame for the accident goes to the dump truck driver who smashed into the car while the car was stopped behind a school bus. No skid marks. The dump truck never hit the brakes. The point here is that if the 15-year-old were not driving these seven children may well be alive today. If an adult had been driving that car it is quite probable that something would have changed ... the time spent dropping that one child off .. the time spent loading the kids into the car ... a small delay in hitting the road ... a change in speed .... something would have changed to move that car out from between that truck and that school bus. Some adult made a choice to allow a 15-year-old girl drive a car with seven child passengers on an errand ... and all but one of those kids are dead. The tragedy gets worse ... much worse. Barbara Mann is the mother of these adopted children. When her father learned of the tragic accident he had a massive heart attack and died. Barbara Mann lost her children and her father ... and none of us can even begin to comprehend the sadness this woman feels. I can't help but wonder, though, how things might have been different if Barbara Mann had not let her 15-year-old daughter drive .... illegally.

Humm... sounds oddly familiar.

I also wonder how a mother would allow 8 children in a passenger vehicle with seat belts for 6 at the most, add in the 2 car seats each for the 1 and 3 year olds.

The Truck driver is apparently a fault here...

...but...

Bad parenting was a contibuting factor.

Posted: 1/26/2006 9:23:27 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
boortz pegs it again boortz.com/nuze/200601/01262006.html#driver

OK .. so the driver wasn't at fault in that tragic dump truck-car-school bus accident yesterday. Seven children were killed. Seven. All in one car. The children were all the adopted children of one couple. Here's the kicker. The driver of the car .. .the driver of the car with six child passengers ... was only 15 years old. There were originally seven passengers. The 15-year-old had already dropped one off. Now it is true that the driver of the car ... the 15-year-old driver of the car ... did not cause the accident. The blame for the accident goes to the dump truck driver who smashed into the car while the car was stopped behind a school bus. No skid marks. The dump truck never hit the brakes. The point here is that if the 15-year-old were not driving these seven children may well be alive today. If an adult had been driving that car it is quite probable that something would have changed ... the time spent dropping that one child off .. the time spent loading the kids into the car ... a small delay in hitting the road ... a change in speed .... something would have changed to move that car out from between that truck and that school bus. Some adult made a choice to allow a 15-year-old girl drive a car with seven child passengers on an errand ... and all but one of those kids are dead. The tragedy gets worse ... much worse. Barbara Mann is the mother of these adopted children. When her father learned of the tragic accident he had a massive heart attack and died. Barbara Mann lost her children and her father ... and none of us can even begin to comprehend the sadness this woman feels. I can't help but wonder, though, how things might have been different if Barbara Mann had not let her 15-year-old daughter drive .... illegally.

Actually its worse than the old scifi go back in time and step on a butterfly then who wins the presidential election changes in the present.

Regardless if how much time one took to drop off kid 1, if any car with any driver had been stopped behind that school bus then they would be dead.

If he wants to "What If" well what if the car hadn't been there. I'll tell you, we'd have alot more famillies going to funerals for then the truck would have hit nothing but the bus.

Yes, that mother is going to regret that decision every moment of her natural life. Regardless it has nothing to do with the fault of what happened. The girls age and license status simply had nothing to do with the accident. She stopped, the truck didn't so obviously in this case the girl did better than the truck driver.

I'm beginning to think Playmoreminds is right. This truck driver could have been drunk as a skunk and despite he didn't put the brakes on the girls age and license status will cloud this issue so much he may walk.

One needs to only ask themself, what would you have done differently setting behind that bus and be honest about it to know the truth of this matter.

Tj

Posted: 1/26/2006 9:37:09 AM EDT

[#7]

truck driver not paying attenton- seems to be the cause

I guarantee that they would not of been at that exact spot if the girl had followed the rules and not taken the van.

no I am not blaming the girl. peopel in the other cars would have been killed and maybe on the bus too.

wrong place at the wrong time.

very sad. hope they can go on.

Posted: 1/26/2006 9:58:25 AM EDT

[#8]

Lets say a martian on heroin, drinking gin, with 3 illegal machine guns and a pound of blow in the trunk, was driving a stolen car full of underaged hookers. A truck driver with a 40000 pound missile smashes them into a school bus.

Some arfcommers say we ignore that nice truck driver and nuke Mars from orbit, because the planet of Mars is responsible for destroying 2 fine M16s and a belt fed M60E3, hookers, and blow.

Do I have this right? I hope those few ignorant commentors are not too stupid to get out of jury duty. Here is a clue. Get one.

Posted: 1/26/2006 10:17:36 AM EDT

[#9]

Oh, sh*t I have to stop laughing this is a tragedy.

I just popped in to suggest that the trucker may have had a brake failure, but it seems he would have taken it off the road to either side it that were true.

Truckers are known to do that -- even if it means risking their own lives. Whatever this driver's guilty of, I have to agree with the above statements re: Truckers=>A#1/ standup guys -- with very few exceptions.

Posted: 1/26/2006 2:29:32 PM EDT

[#10]

Well hell, lets just kill the mother then.

Evidently to some she just hated her kids.

I can't help but believe she really loved kids and had a big heart and open arms for the ones nobody wanted. I can't imagine the pain she feels now.

As for the teen driver, my unofficial and unscientific observation from my years is that the older kids of large families tend to grow up fast. The extra work and responsibility they have to give to help raise and care for thier younger siblings teaches them to become responsibile little adults sooner. My wife was the oldest of seven kids, with the one just after her being four years younger.
She was a primary cook and caregiver for the younger for most of her youth. When we maried I sometimes felt I married a mother with six kids.

I really doubt the mother wold have left the care of the other kids in the 15 year olds hands if she reaally didn't trust her with the prizes of her life. I believe it's really short sighted of those who want to bash this mother. Compassion, not scorn is the ticket here. fullclip

Posted: 1/26/2006 2:32:16 PM EDT

[#11]

The grandfather of the children had a heart attack and died when he heard the news.

Just heard it on Fox..

I seriously think that mother will kill herself in the coming months...

Posted: 1/26/2006 2:43:58 PM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
The grandfather of the children had a heart attack and died when he heard the news.

Just heard it on Fox..

I seriously think that mother will kill herself in the coming months...

Damn that family is having a rough time.

I imagine the driver isn't feeling too good about himself right about now either.

Posted: 1/26/2006 2:46:31 PM EDT

[#13]

I just read the headline.

It was enough.

Posted: 1/26/2006 2:51:36 PM EDT

[#14]

Serious question...What could you do to punish this trucker or mother that's any worse than what they are living through now? fullclip

Posted: 1/26/2006 2:56:48 PM EDT

[#15]

Quoted:
Serious question...What could you do to punish this trucker or mother that's any worse than what they are living through now? fullclip

I can't imagine what either are going through. I hope I never have to find out.

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:08:49 PM EDT

[#16]

Part of being a good driver is having situational awareness and being able to anticipate/react to the screwups of others...I'm not saying that the girl had time to react..but just because she wasn't at fault doesn't mean her age wasn't a factor. Nightmare for all involved

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:09:36 PM EDT

[#17]

it took you guys a and hald to bring this up first of all.

if the mom or dad was in the car same thing would have happened only 1 more dead body.

the next thing since it took you all a day and half to bring this up.

is that the GRANDFATHER of the kids died as a result of hearing the news of the deaths of the 7 kids get the damn story right before you post.

it has been posted on cnn.com,msnbc.com,and more thane likely foxnews.com

so i count 8 DOA as of now.

moot point TRUCK DRIVER hit van which was stopped for school BUS which 15 year old was doing what the driver was supposed to do stop for the bus.

ASSHOLE truck driver killed them not the 15 year old driver had the mother been driving or with them still DEAD.

OHH since this just got POSTED,those of you in texas might not have heard TRUCKDRIVER did it again today killed 7 or 8 people i a pickup truck. so 16 deaths in a day and half by 2 truck drivers.

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:12:01 PM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
In a lot of rural areas it is common for young teens to drive early. If you live in a large town or city, its hard to understand the rural lifestyle. My dad was driving a pickup and farm equipment when he was 10yrs old. Here in the desert, we see 13yr old kids drive a vehicle to the school bus stop, leave the vehicle there and pick it up in the afternoon. My brother was rear-ended and rolled by a speeding big rig and broke his back. Two years later he was rear-ended and killed by a pickup driver going over 100mph on the same highway. People drive way too fast nowadays. The truck driver should be hung by the balls.

+1. I drove a pickup and towed compressor to paint barns when the other hired man got sick. The boss drove the boom truck. That was when I was 14 years old.

All this BS about the outcome being different is BS. Pull her out of the equation, you probably have her mother in the driver's seat instead, and in the same place and time.
It sounds like her mother had spent time with her and made a decision, as a responsible adult, that she was skilled enough to drive without an adult. Halleluja! Isn't that one of the things we all rant and rave about?

Damn.......

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:13:23 PM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
The 15 year apparently was a better driver than the clown driving the truck. She has stopped for a school bus and the idiot driving the truck failed to do the same.

Indeed.

Usually when the cops see dead kids they are quite quick to hammer those responsible. If the officer on scene didn't have the inclination to fault the parents, then there is usually good reason.

Having an adult behind the wheel who was rear-ended by a truck would not have solved the problem.

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:14:35 PM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
boortz pegs it again boortz.com/nuze/200601/01262006.html#driver

OK .. so the driver wasn't at fault in that tragic dump truck-car-school bus accident yesterday. Seven children were killed. Seven. All in one car. The children were all the adopted children of one couple. Here's the kicker. The driver of the car .. .the driver of the car with six child passengers ... was only 15 years old. There were originally seven passengers. The 15-year-old had already dropped one off. Now it is true that the driver of the car ... the 15-year-old driver of the car ... did not cause the accident. The blame for the accident goes to the dump truck driver who smashed into the car while the car was stopped behind a school bus. No skid marks. The dump truck never hit the brakes. The point here is that if the 15-year-old were not driving these seven children may well be alive today. If an adult had been driving that car it is quite probable that something would have changed ... the time spent dropping that one child off .. the time spent loading the kids into the car ... a small delay in hitting the road ... a change in speed .... something would have changed to move that car out from between that truck and that school bus. Some adult made a choice to allow a 15-year-old girl drive a car with seven child passengers on an errand ... and all but one of those kids are dead. The tragedy gets worse ... much worse. Barbara Mann is the mother of these adopted children. When her father learned of the tragic accident he had a massive heart attack and died. Barbara Mann lost her children and her father ... and none of us can even begin to comprehend the sadness this woman feels. I can't help but wonder, though, how things might have been different if Barbara Mann had not let her 15-year-old daughter drive .... illegally.

Obviously Boortz is a moron. Just because not letting her drive MAY have altered the timing a little bit, focus on the unlicensed driver who was doing nothing wrong?????

He sounds like one of the whiny baby soccer moms around Madison WI (Liberal capital of the Midwest). Glad I don't read him!

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:22:11 PM EDT

[#21]

Quoted:
Oh, sh*t I have to stop laughing this is a tragedy.

I just popped in to suggest that the trucker may have had a brake failure, but it seems he would have taken it off the road to either side it that were true.

Truckers are known to do that -- even if it means risking their own lives. Whatever this driver's guilty of, I have to agree with the above statements re: Truckers=>A#1/ standup guys -- with very few exceptions.

I disagree. One of the biggest risks I see in my job (I was a railroad engineer, now in the office) was dump truck drivers. Either they just plain don't look at the crossing, or they look, see you coming, and just keep going right in front of you....almost like they think they're stupid dump truck is bigger than a 380,000 lb. locomotive, with two more in trail and 7000 tons of train. In 5 years of train and engine service, I had more close calls with dump trucks than any other vehicle. I can recall twice I threw myself on the floor thinking we were going to get a cab full of gravel via the front windows. We have a saying on the railroad...

"Dickheads in Dumptrucks"

I won't get into the one on the road that cut ME off on the highway (I HAD to jump into the breakdown lane to avoid getting smashed up), then when I pulled alongside of him at the next light, he yelled "fuck you asshole!" and flipped me off.......sweaty dirty uncouth uneducated dickhead......

[/rant]

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:23:15 PM EDT

[#22]

Quoted:
Quoted:
boortz pegs it again boortz.com/nuze/200601/01262006.html#driver

OK .. so the driver wasn't at fault in that tragic dump truck-car-school bus accident yesterday. Seven children were killed. Seven. All in one car. The children were all the adopted children of one couple. Here's the kicker. The driver of the car .. .the driver of the car with six child passengers ... was only 15 years old. There were originally seven passengers. The 15-year-old had already dropped one off. Now it is true that the driver of the car ... the 15-year-old driver of the car ... did not cause the accident. The blame for the accident goes to the dump truck driver who smashed into the car while the car was stopped behind a school bus. No skid marks. The dump truck never hit the brakes. The point here is that if the 15-year-old were not driving these seven children may well be alive today. If an adult had been driving that car it is quite probable that something would have changed ... the time spent dropping that one child off .. the time spent loading the kids into the car ... a small delay in hitting the road ... a change in speed .... something would have changed to move that car out from between that truck and that school bus. Some adult made a choice to allow a 15-year-old girl drive a car with seven child passengers on an errand ... and all but one of those kids are dead. The tragedy gets worse ... much worse. Barbara Mann is the mother of these adopted children. When her father learned of the tragic accident he had a massive heart attack and died. Barbara Mann lost her children and her father ... and none of us can even begin to comprehend the sadness this woman feels. I can't help but wonder, though, how things might have been different if Barbara Mann had not let her 15-year-old daughter drive .... illegally.

Obviously Boortz is a moron. Just because not letting her drive MAY have altered the timing a little bit, focus on the unlicensed driver who was doing nothing wrong?????

He sounds like one of the whiny baby soccer moms around Madison WI (Liberal capital of the Midwest). Glad I don't read him!

Take a couple law classes and pay attention to "contributory negligence".

Neither I nor Boortz said the driver of the 7 dead were at fault.

Aside from their tragic deaths, I have to ask, why are there 7 occupants, one, maybe 2 that needs child restraint seats, no adult driver in the vehicle, etc. Not that that's deserving of death, but shows a pattern of negligence on behalf of their parents. How many of the 7 were wearing seat belts?, not that it woud of saved them, but still, it would look bad if they weren't and supporting the reason why 15 yo's with learning permits should not be on the road noway no how without an adult licensed driver as the law requires.

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:27:26 PM EDT

[#23]

Ya' know, maybe they're right. If that girl had only been 16 the truck would have leaped over the car and just hit the school bus.

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:35:41 PM EDT

[#24]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
boortz pegs it again boortz.com/nuze/200601/01262006.html#driver

OK .. so the driver wasn't at fault in that tragic dump truck-car-school bus accident yesterday. Seven children were killed. Seven. All in one car. The children were all the adopted children of one couple. Here's the kicker. The driver of the car .. .the driver of the car with six child passengers ... was only 15 years old. There were originally seven passengers. The 15-year-old had already dropped one off. Now it is true that the driver of the car ... the 15-year-old driver of the car ... did not cause the accident. The blame for the accident goes to the dump truck driver who smashed into the car while the car was stopped behind a school bus. No skid marks. The dump truck never hit the brakes. The point here is that if the 15-year-old were not driving these seven children may well be alive today. If an adult had been driving that car it is quite probable that something would have changed ... the time spent dropping that one child off .. the time spent loading the kids into the car ... a small delay in hitting the road ... a change in speed .... something would have changed to move that car out from between that truck and that school bus. Some adult made a choice to allow a 15-year-old girl drive a car with seven child passengers on an errand ... and all but one of those kids are dead. The tragedy gets worse ... much worse. Barbara Mann is the mother of these adopted children. When her father learned of the tragic accident he had a massive heart attack and died. Barbara Mann lost her children and her father ... and none of us can even begin to comprehend the sadness this woman feels. I can't help but wonder, though, how things might have been different if Barbara Mann had not let her 15-year-old daughter drive .... illegally.

Obviously Boortz is a moron. Just because not letting her drive MAY have altered the timing a little bit, focus on the unlicensed driver who was doing nothing wrong?????

He sounds like one of the whiny baby soccer moms around Madison WI (Liberal capital of the Midwest). Glad I don't read him!

Take a couple law classes and pay attention to "contributory negligence".

Neither I nor Boortz said the driver of the 7 dead were at fault.

Aside from their tragic deaths, I have to ask, why are there 7 occupants, one, maybe 2 that needs child restraint seats, no adult driver in the vehicle, etc. Not that that's deserving of death, but shows a pattern of negligence on behalf of their parents. How many of the 7 were wearing seat belts?, not that it woud of saved them, but still, it would look bad if they weren't and supporting the reason why 15 yo's with learning permits should not be on the road noway no how without an adult licensed driver as the law requires.

Just because it's "The Law" doesn't always mean it's right.

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:45:11 PM EDT

[#25]

Quoted:

Just because it's "The Law" doesn't always mean it's right.

How is the law against unrestrained kids in a car driven illegally by untrained drivers on the road is wrong then? That's your assertion. Again my assertion isn't that that's the cause of the accident, but the driver was driving illegally.

Posted: 1/26/2006 3:58:25 PM EDT

[#26]

www.thedenverchannel.com/nationalnews/6463433/detail.html... Police say truck driver Alvin Wilkerson has two arrests in Jacksonville:
1997 - Accessory after the fact to murder
1999 - Soliciting for prostitution
Wilkerson also has four traffic citations since 1999.

edition.cnn.com/2006/US/01/26/bus.crash/.... Wilkerson was cited in 2000 and 2001 for operating a vehicle in unsafe conditions and also for driving on a suspended or revoked license in 2000.

Posted: 1/26/2006 9:05:51 PM EDT

[#27]

Quoted:
www.thedenverchannel.com/nationalnews/6463433/detail.html... Police say truck driver Alvin Wilkerson has two arrests in Jacksonville:
1997 - Accessory after the fact to murder
1999 - Soliciting for prostitution
Wilkerson also has four traffic citations since 1999.

edition.cnn.com/2006/US/01/26/bus.crash/.... Wilkerson was cited in 2000 and 2001 for operating a vehicle in unsafe conditions and also for driving on a suspended or revoked license in 2000.

Soliciting isnt something that would make him drive poorly. Lot Lizzards abound in truck stops. However, that and the accessory charge do go against his character.

The unsafe conditions tickets could be DOT inspection tickets, but those dont normally go on a record. Having family that have driven tractor-trailer dump trucks, I can tell you that it is EFFING SCARY what maintenance issues those trucks are driven with. Trucks with bad brakes, transmissions, tires, etc. Deplorable. He shouldn't have driven the vehicle if it was unsafe though.

Quoted:
Quoted:
This particular truck driver is at fault for this incident. But lets not turn this into a truck driver bashing thread. For every asshat, there are 1000 professionals out there that took their training seriously and realize exactly what kind of beheamoth they are at the helm of and the extra care it takes to pilot it.

Thank you.

I did not realize that this was turning into a truck driver bashing thread. I have seen nothing stated about any truck driver except this one clown.

Merely preventative maintenance. Not directed at anyone that had posted previously.

Posted: 1/26/2006 11:20:51 PM EDT

[#28]

The accessory to murder (after the fact) does raise my eyebrow too but you're right - not germane. Lot-lizard, could have been a sting, not really a big deal but I'm pretty liberal on that topic anyway and - not germane.

That undefined (so far) license suspension has me curious. Something led to the suspension and all we know at this point is that he got busted for driving while it was suspended. You also nailed it on mechanical problem tickets too but if he let it go before, twice... Mmmmm.....

What you offer is certainly plausible Mike. We'll have to wait a while to find out.

Posted: 1/27/2006 12:56:36 AM EDT

[#29]

The truck that caused this is not a dump truck

Posted: 1/27/2006 1:50:15 AM EDT

[#30]

The truck driver is scuzz bucket!

My family has been in the trucking business for over 30 years. Not one has had a suspended license, soliciting prostitution, or an accessory to murder after the fact.

This is not even someone I would want to associate with even casually let alone drive one of the family trucks.

I certainly wouldn't want to be anywhere near this guy with my family in the car while he's driving a truck.

Tj

Posted: 1/27/2006 3:12:15 PM EDT

[#31]

Quoted:
The accessory to murder (after the fact) does raise my eyebrow too but you're right - not germane. Lot-lizard, could have been a sting, not really a big deal but I'm pretty liberal on that topic anyway and - not germane.

That undefined (so far) license suspension has me curious. Something led to the suspension and all we know at this point is that he got busted for driving while it was suspended. You also nailed it on mechanical problem tickets too but if he let it go before, twice... Mmmmm..... What you offer is certainly plausible Mike. We'll have to wait a while to find out.

"In 1997, Wilkerson was charged with accessory to murder after the fact, but those charges were later dropped." which means they were probably bullshit charges (http://www.wesh.com/news/6474562/detail.html). All of the other charges were for non-violent acts, what's the big deal?

Posted: 1/27/2006 4:44:14 PM EDT

[#32]

Quoted:
Quoted:
The accessory to murder (after the fact) does raise my eyebrow too but you're right - not germane. Lot-lizard, could have been a sting, not really a big deal but I'm pretty liberal on that topic anyway and - not germane.

That undefined (so far) license suspension has me curious. Something led to the suspension and all we know at this point is that he got busted for driving while it was suspended. You also nailed it on mechanical problem tickets too but if he let it go before, twice... Mmmmm..... What you offer is certainly plausible Mike. We'll have to wait a while to find out.

"In 1997, Wilkerson was charged with accessory to murder after the fact, but those charges were later dropped." which means they were probably bullshit charges (http://www.wesh.com/news/6474562/detail.html). All of the other charges were for non-violent acts, what's the big deal?

The big deal is that the company that I drive for should never have hired some scumbag with the remaining things on his record. I thought we were better than that.

Posted: 1/27/2006 4:53:37 PM EDT

[#33]

Why is a school bus stopping to let children off on a road with a posted 60 MPH speed limit?

Shouldn't they be routed to drop off on a side street instead of a highway?

Posted: 1/27/2006 6:34:41 PM EDT

[#34]

Quoted:
Why is a school bus stopping to let children off on a road with a posted 60 MPH speed limit?

Shouldn't they be routed to drop off on a side street instead of a highway?

Maybe no side streets? maybe at a posted School Bus Stop ahead school Bus stop. In Joizy a lot of streets have 50 mph limits.

Most over the road trivers are extremely professional.

That said you need to see the bozos running containers around the Ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach, and we've had a lot of dump trucks and double dirt/rock hauler accidents in So Cal with fatalities to the cars involved. But the worst was a double hauler drove in front of a commuter train up by Somis and got himself killed, luckily the train derailed but stayed upright. About a month later another truck from the same work site did the same thing at the same crossing, got himself killed.

Posted: 1/27/2006 9:35:44 PM EDT

[#35]

Posted: 1/27/2006 9:57:04 PM EDT

[#36]

Quoted:
I'll be stopping a lot faster than you if something happens.

Actually you won't.

Posted: 1/28/2006 1:08:10 AM EDT

[#37]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:

The big deal is that the company that I drive for should never have hired some scumbag with the remaining things on his record. I thought we were better than that.

I would be all over either the person who was supposed to do a background check or the person that hired him, not the company. Lawyers will try to discredit the company but your personal professionalism leads me to conclude you and your teammates probably work for a fine company that's going to get beat up for a hiring error. That's not right or fair but it is legal.

Posted: 1/28/2006 4:47:18 AM EDT

[#38]

The driver of the truck is the sole individual to blame. He was a speeder, he was ticketed for speeding in the past, the rest of profile shows that he was an fucking asshole which supports an aggressive driver profile. MHO

Kids on the bus heard him blowing his horn, the kids on the bus knew he was going to hit them.

The age for a Restricted Driver permit is 15 in Florida, kid has to have an adult in the car and can only drive during daylight hours. Would have made no difference, just that an adult would have been killed.

There is one and only one person at fault, that's the driver of the truck. I won't be surprised if they find drugs in his system. Woe to him if they do as he will get life in prison at the very least, possibly he'll get the needle in Starke, just up the road from Lake Butler.

Posted: 1/28/2006 4:59:05 AM EDT

[#39]

Quoted:
Well hell, lets just kill the mother then. Evidently to some she just hated her kids.

I can't help but believe she really loved kids and had a big heart and open arms for the ones nobody wanted. I can't imagine the pain she feels now.

As for the teen driver, my unofficial and unscientific observation from my years is that the older kids of large families tend to grow up fast. The extra work and responsibility they have to give to help raise and care for thier younger siblings teaches them to become responsibile little adults sooner. My wife was the oldest of seven kids, with the one just after her being four years younger.
She was a primary cook and caregiver for the younger for most of her youth. When we maried I sometimes felt I married a mother with six kids.

I really doubt the mother wold have left the care of the other kids in the 15 year olds hands if she reaally didn't trust her with the prizes of her life. I believe it's really short sighted of those who want to bash this mother. Compassion, not scorn is the ticket here. fullclip

+1,000

I am sick of anyone blaming the girl. She did absolutely nothing to contribute to this accident.

Posted: 1/28/2006 5:00:34 AM EDT

[#40]

Quoted:
The driver of the truck is the sole individual to blame. He was a speeder, he was ticketed for speeding in the past, the rest of profile shows that he was an fucking asshole which supports an aggressive driver profile. MHO

Kids on the bus heard him blowing his horn, the kids on the bus knew he was going to hit them.

The age for a Restricted Driver permit is 15 in Florida, kid has to have an adult in the car and can only drive during daylight hours. Would have made no difference, just that an adult would have been killed.

There is one and only one person at fault, that's the driver of the truck. I won't be surprised if they find drugs in his system. Woe to him if they do as he will get life in prison at the very least, possibly he'll get the needle in Starke, just up the road from Lake Butler.

Man! If that's true he was hitting his horn and not his brakes, this guy may deserve the needle.

Posted: 1/28/2006 5:06:09 AM EDT

[#41]

The truck was not a dump truck. It was your everyday tractor-trailer, 18 wheeler, carrying a load of bottled water, according to the news and the dozens of pics I saw.

Posted: 1/28/2006 4:51:12 PM EDT

[#42]

Quoted:
The truck was not a dump truck. It was your everyday tractor-trailer, 18 wheeler, carrying a load of bottled water, according to the news and the dozens of pics I saw.

Yup, and loads of bottled water are heavy, usually close to the 80,000 lb legal limit for the truck's gross weight.

I keep hearing that there was no evidence at the scene that the driver braked...he may have braked when it was far too late, however. In 1.2 million miles of driving tractor-trailers, I have never locked up the brakes leaving skid marks in a fully loaded truck. I am not even sure if it is possible to lock up the brakes on a clean dry road in a fully loaded truck.

Posted: 1/28/2006 4:58:06 PM EDT

[#43]

I started driving when I was 12 and am a much better driver than someone who just turned 16 and got the keys thrown to them, I and she bother were better drivers than the truck driver, He just as easily could have ran over a school yard full of kids for the amount of attn. he was paying

Posted: 2/3/2006 12:58:35 PM EDT

[#44]

Federal Investigators Release Lake Butler Crash Investigation

"...Friday, the NTSB said the driver of the truck was not under the influence of drugs or alcohol. Investigators said they had recreated the crash and had determined the truck driver was able to see the bus from 1,400 feet away. They believe fatigue and distraction may have caused him to lose control and hit the vehicle..."

Posted: 2/3/2006 1:12:06 PM EDT

[#45]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Her driving, be it legally or illegally, it entirely moot. She had stopped for a school bus, as you are supposed to do. Idiot driving semi fails to stop, killing many people.

He is entirely at fault, everything else is irrelevant.

Before you get your panties in a wad Larry, I agree that the truck driver was totally at fault.

But the point I'm making is that the mother is to blame for her children being in that vehicle, on that road, behind that school bus in the first place.

YAY! Libtard logic!!

Posted: 2/4/2006 7:50:14 PM EDT

[#46]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Her driving, be it legally or illegally, it entirely moot. She had stopped for a school bus, as you are supposed to do. Idiot driving semi fails to stop, killing many people.

He is entirely at fault, everything else is irrelevant.

Before you get your panties in a wad Larry, I agree that the truck driver was totally at fault.

But the point I'm making is that the mother is to blame for her children being in that vehicle, on that road, behind that school bus in the first place.

YAY! Libtard logic!!

No.. just shitty parenting.

Posted: 2/10/2006 2:06:51 AM EDT

[#47]

Lawsuit filed against driver

Sad but predictably the way this thing would go. I imagine there will be more from others too.

BTW - xanadu (and others that pass blame to the foster parents), I disagree with y'all because the only way poor parenting would have gotten involved was if the under-age driver was the one who did something stupid and caused the wreck. The kids in the car (including the driver) did nothing to cause the wreck so how can any blame for the accident be directed at them or their foster parents?

The only alternative that would please y'all seems to be adding one of the parents to the list of dead so the rules were followed and another person would have gotten killed.

Posted: 2/10/2006 6:05:14 AM EDT

[#48]

Awful, just awful.

Posted: 2/10/2006 6:08:11 AM EDT

[#49]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
<snip>

I was thinking the same thing xanadu but we also need to consider the kid was stopped, waiting behind the schoolbus, and the semi rear-ended them all - not her fault.

Yes, but if there was a parent in the car coaching her on her driving, would she have been there at all. Would she have gone a little faster, a little slower.

What if she told her mom, "it's against the law for me to drive with out an adult in the car, please don't ask me to break the law mommy" it's a little like a Zen Buddism exercise - who the hell knows.

Blame the victim...

Posted: 2/10/2006 6:33:53 AM EDT

[#50]

Quoted:
When God wants them, he takes them. Theyre serving a purpose somewhere.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Very few things make me gasp when I read them (Page 2 of 3)

General » General Discussion

Warning

Confirm Action

About AR15.COM

Stay Connected

Newsletter

Contact Us