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Quoted:
hell no. I'd go join a resistence group. No invader is welcome, as far as I am concerned. Death before dishonor, mother fucker. This |
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Quoted: Quoted: when did it change? The Oath of Enlistment has been the same since October of 1962. The Oath of Office since August of 1959. which is what I posted, your post omits obeying the orders of the presidency and the officers appointed above you. |
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whether I'm military or civilian I will not surrender if my country is invaded. they will just have to kill me.
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If I'm not wrong, the oath sworn by officers is different than the oath of enlisted personnel.
This is the one offers swear to: "I, _____, having been appointed an officer in the (Branch of Service), as indicated above in the grade of _____ do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign or domestic, that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservations or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office upon which I am about to enter; So help me God." Oh, and I don't take orders from that peckerhead, we go for broke! |
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If Obama told me to not jump off a bridge, I just might do it anyway to spite that cocksucker.
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Quoted: I would say that once he surrenders he is no longer the president... This. |
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I prefer liberty with danger to peace with slavery. ~Author Unknown
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If I'm not wrong, the oath sworn by officers is different than the oath of enlisted personnel. This is the correct answer. I don't want to derail this thread. But there are reasons for the difference, and there are ramifications. |
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I don't take orders from the President. He only has rule over me due to threat of force. I didn't volunteer to obey the President, much less a treasonous one who has failed to obey the USC.
When the cat's away, the mice will play. |
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The president did not grant my rights. I'll give them up for no one.
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when did it change? The Oath of Enlistment has been the same since October of 1962. The Oath of Office since August of 1959. which is what I posted, your post omits obeying the orders of the presidency and the officers appointed above you. What he posted was the oath which those "officers appointed over you" take, which is not the same as the enlistment oath, and makes no mention of the president. Regardless, surrendering the United States to a Foreign power would be a clear and indisputable violation of his oath to "defend the constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic", and would be disregarded as being an unlawful order. There is no fucking way the military will stand by and let the enemy march right in. Further, as far as civilians are concerned, the president of the United States serves the people of the United States, not the other way around. Civilians don't take orders from the president. |
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I mean no disrespect to the President. He is of course my Commander in Chief and will be obeyed. I merely point out that I have no moral obligation that supersedes the Constitution. I do have legal obligations to obey orders... And I intend to do so unless it means breaking my Oath.
Raoc gets it, and his words are wise. |
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It would be a lawful order... to a member of the armed forces. He is their commander in chief. Wrong. If the President abdicates his position, he is no longer President, hence he has no authority. |
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No. A President giving such an order would be arrested, (tried, convicted and shot as well).
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This would be one of a whole long list of things that I would tell obama to go fuck himself.
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"You're outmanned and you're outgunned. There's too many of us and we are too desperate to give up. You cannot win this. I'm giving you one last chance. Walk away. Put your guns down and return to town, and no one else will be harmed.
I need an answer, what's it gonna be?" "NUTS!" |
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not today, not tomorrow,not ever. Not for any pres.
Sovereign United States National Texas Citizen my life by my rules |
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40% of the country would surrender. I'm not in that 40%. True I would be right there with you. |
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riiiight
what is he going to do if you don't he just abdicated his office in effect by giving that order It would make for a great "legal" debate The ramifications of such an order by a sitting POTUS would most likely be earth shattering |
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As stated before, once he surrenders he is no longer the president,
Technicaly he is a public servant, I.E. he serves the public, we are the public, therefore he serves us and has no power to order us to do anything. all he can do is surrender his own sorry ass to whoever he can. I say let him so we can get an American back in that office. |
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After watching the movie "Downfall" it did get me to thinking about how the Germans and other nations in the past have offered unconditional surrenders and how their military did largely obey. |
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what is this word "surrender" everyone is talking about?? I'm not familiar with it....
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Lawful orders don't matter when you don't have a country anymore.....
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If a President were to give that order I would assume that only 99.9% of us would be dead. At that point It wouldn't really matter now would it?
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After watching the movie "Downfall" it did get me to thinking about how the Germans and other nations in the past have offered unconditional surrenders and how their military did largely obey.
There was more resistance than most people realize now, but less than was feared. |
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(1) I am an American, fighting in the forces which guard my country and our way of life. I am prepared to give my life in their defense (2) I will never surrender of my own free will. If in command, I will never surrender the members of my command while they still have the means to resist. (3) If I am captured, I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy. (4) If I become a prisoner of war, I will keep faith with my fellow prisoners. I will give no information or take part in any action which might be harmful to my comrades. If I am senior, I will take command. If not, I will obey the lawful orders of those appointed over me, and will back them up in every way (5) When questioned, should I become a prisoner of war, I am required to give only my name, rank, service number, and date of birth. I will evade answering further questions to the utmost of my ability. I will make no oral or written statements disloyal to my country and its allies or harmful to their cause. (6) I will never forget that I am an American, fighting for freedom, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and in the United States of America. |
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I would say that once he surrenders he is no longer the president... This |
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I would say that once he surrenders he is no longer the president... First post nails it! |
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That is not a lawful order as the oath says that I will defend against all enemies foreign and domestic.
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Article IV, Section 4
"The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened) against domestic Violence." Surrender is actually unconstitutional. |
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Quoted: I mean no disrespect to the President. He is of course my Commander in Chief and will be obeyed. I merely point out that I have no moral obligation that supersedes the Constitution. I do have legal obligations to obey orders... And I intend to do so unless it means breaking my Oath. Raoc gets it, and his words are wise. Yes, we are sworn to obey the orders of the President and the officers appointed above us. However, the Constitution, in MY opinion is the ultimate authority. If the President gave me an order to surrender to an invading force, which will or has desolved the Constitution, that is no longer a lawful order, and in fact, I wouldn't even consider said man as the President any longer. I would fight and probably die to have the Constitution reinstated and the enemies driven back into the sea. This isn't just some internet tough guy talk here, many of us (combat vets) have actually put our money where our mouths are. |
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I would have a "change order". A whole lot shorter chain of command as well.
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If the President ordered that, He's no american... F that, fight til the end...
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I for one would not care if the President was Obama or any other in our history-
They can give up all they want to I will never do so. Ask yourself, what in the hell do you have to lose............ that's right........ nada But what do you have to gain............. nothing....but glory............ |
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If a President were to give that order I would assume that only 99.9% of us would be dead. At that point It wouldn't really matter now would it? This President? Really? I'd say it depended on the country in question. Don't forget about World Apology Tour I & II. Barack Obama would possibly write:
"My fellow Americans... Canada may possibly declare war on the US. While we have a much stronger military, I feel that they have a much better National Healthcare Plan, so I am hereby preemptively surrendering to Canada. –– John |
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They would tell stories of my brutality towards the invaders...
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HELL G––DAMN MOTHERFUCKING TO THE nTH DEGREE FUCKING NO-with two snaps and a bag of chips!Any enemy powerful enough to invade CONUS and cause the POTUS to surrender can be counted on to immediately begin packing us into boxcars(where have we seen this before?)Since we'd be going down anyway might as well go down standing up and take as many of those pissmops with us!Hey potential commie invaders-SEE YOU IN HELL MOTHERFUCKERS!WOLVERINES-AAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
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If the President ordered that, He's no American... F that, fight til the end... Damn right he's not. |
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Quoted: It would be a lawful order... to a member of the armed forces. He is their commander in chief. Not if he surrenders as he would really no longer be the CoC....but if you add a "K" to CoC then it's a little more accurate (just FYI ) |
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