Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: You dont know what a theory is do you? A theory is a group of FACTS. The theory brings it together. You cant have a theory without fact. yet it cannot be proven with 100% certainty.  it's still a case of "it's probably," not "it is."  yet you state it as if evolution is a natual law... As for the proof of evolution.....well, I could sit here and type for hours but that would suck. Oh, and if you want proof of macro-evolution you only have to look as far as your own DNA. ok....and what, pray tell, am i looking for?  genes in common with an ape?  or genes in common with a chicken? since by that reasoning and the last I heard, humans are closer related to chickens than to apes. and if evolution is all about survival of the fittest and genetic mutations, then why the hell is it that there are still apes (or whatever we're supposedly closest related to) on this earth?  you'd think by now that humans -- being more "fit" -- would have fully supplanted apes.  and why are ALL genetic mutations these days (other than viral) discovered to be detrimental instead of beneficial? Red- Not even close. We are MUCH MUCH closely related to Apes. In fact, we ARE apes. Blue- The apes on this earth NOW, are not our ancestors. Its easier to think of them as our brothers. We did not evolve from the apes present today. We evolved from Homo erectus which there are plenty of fossils for. yellow- Thats not true. Think of sickel cell anemia. For a larger answer you need to look at different races of humans. Different races are less suceptable to different things...like cancer for instance because of genetic mutation.

As far as I know they can't find the evolutionary missing piece between apes and us.

Quoted: Quoted: This thread has evolved into major suckage. We knew that was going to happen. What else did you expect from the religion haters on this site?

Well, I'm not religious, but I know when to let sleeping dogs lie

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: You dont know what a theory is do you? A theory is a group of FACTS. The theory brings it together. You cant have a theory without fact. yet it cannot be proven with 100% certainty.  it's still a case of "it's probably," not "it is."  yet you state it as if evolution is a natual law... As for the proof of evolution.....well, I could sit here and type for hours but that would suck. Oh, and if you want proof of macro-evolution you only have to look as far as your own DNA. ok....and what, pray tell, am i looking for?  genes in common with an ape?  or genes in common with a chicken? since by that reasoning and the last I heard, humans are closer related to chickens than to apes. and if evolution is all about survival of the fittest and genetic mutations, then why the hell is it that there are still apes (or whatever we're supposedly closest related to) on this earth?  you'd think by now that humans -- being more "fit" -- would have fully supplanted apes.  and why are ALL genetic mutations these days (other than viral) discovered to be detrimental instead of beneficial? Red- Not even close. We are MUCH MUCH closely related to Apes. In fact, we ARE apes. Blue- The apes on this earth NOW, are not our ancestors. Its easier to think of them as our brothers. We did not evolve from the apes present today. We evolved from Homo erectus which there are plenty of fossils for. yellow- Thats not true. Think of sickel cell anemia. For a larger answer you need to look at different races of humans. Different races are less suceptable to different things...like cancer for instance because of genetic mutation. As far as I know they can't find the evolutionary missing piece between apes and us.

We ARE apes.....

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: You dont know what a theory is do you? A theory is a group of FACTS. The theory brings it together. You cant have a theory without fact. yet it cannot be proven with 100% certainty.  it's still a case of "it's probably," not "it is."  yet you state it as if evolution is a natual law... As for the proof of evolution.....well, I could sit here and type for hours but that would suck. Oh, and if you want proof of macro-evolution you only have to look as far as your own DNA. ok....and what, pray tell, am i looking for?  genes in common with an ape?  or genes in common with a chicken? since by that reasoning and the last I heard, humans are closer related to chickens than to apes. and if evolution is all about survival of the fittest and genetic mutations, then why the hell is it that there are still apes (or whatever we're supposedly closest related to) on this earth?  you'd think by now that humans -- being more "fit" -- would have fully supplanted apes.  and why are ALL genetic mutations these days (other than viral) discovered to be detrimental instead of beneficial? Red- Not even close. We are MUCH MUCH closely related to Apes. In fact, we ARE apes. Blue- The apes on this earth NOW, are not our ancestors. Its easier to think of them as our brothers. We did not evolve from the apes present today. We evolved from Homo erectus which there are plenty of fossils for. yellow- Thats not true. Think of sickel cell anemia. For a larger answer you need to look at different races of humans. Different races are less suceptable to different things...like cancer for instance because of genetic mutation. As far as I know they can't find the evolutionary missing piece between apes and us. We ARE apes.....

I disagree.  Real apes are behind the glass at the zoo.

Deuteronomy...

22:23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;       (22:23-24)

22:24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.  

That's some fucked up shit--stoned to death because you didn't cry out loud enough when being raped..

As for the link...it was funny.  Especially this:
"Invoking the name of God, he summons motherfucking bears to come and claw the shit out of them"

Quoted: Deuteronomy... 22:23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;       (22:23-24) 22:24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.   That's some fucked up shit--stoned to death because you didn't cry out loud enough when being raped..

"she cried not" = went along willingly

Quoted: Deuteronomy... 22:23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;       (22:23-24) 22:24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.   That's some fucked up shit--stoned to death because you didn't cry out loud enough when being raped..

You do realize you are looking at a translation of a 3000 year old document. It is not like they had CSI or anything.

The intent is obvious, if she ain't being raped, then you are commiting adultery.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: This thread has evolved into major suckage. We knew that was going to happen. What else did you expect from the religion haters on this site? Well, I'm not religious, but I know when to let sleeping dogs lie

Hey I have no problem with anyone not being religious, its none of my business. I rarely mention my faith unless I am inquired about it. But I expect the same respect from those who disagree with my personal beliefs.

So props on bieng respectful.

tagged for reading later...

Last time I checked it is God not god.....

i must say i'm shocked, i mean SHOCKED, that i bible thread turned into an evolution debate.

that being said, i myself prefer the LOLcat Bible

1 Oh hai. In teh beginnin Ceiling Cat maded teh skiez An da Urfs, but he did not eated dem. 2 Da Urfs no had shapez An haded dark face, An Ceiling Cat rode invisible bike over teh waterz. 3 At start, no has lyte. An Ceiling Cat sayz, i can haz lite? An lite wuz. 4 An Ceiling Cat sawed teh lite, to seez stuffs, An splitted teh lite from dark but taht wuz ok cuz kittehs can see in teh dark An not tripz over nethin. 5 An Ceiling Cat sayed light Day An dark no Day. It were FURST!!!1 6 An Ceiling Cat sayed, im in ur waterz makin a ceiling. But he no yet make a ur. An he maded a hole in teh Ceiling. 7 An Ceiling Cat doed the skiez with waterz down An waterz up. It happen. 8 An Ceiling Cat sayed, i can has teh firmmint wich iz funny bibel naim 4 ceiling, so wuz teh twoth day.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: You dont know what a theory is do you? A theory is a group of FACTS. The theory brings it together. You cant have a theory without fact. yet it cannot be proven with 100% certainty.  it's still a case of "it's probably," not "it is."  yet you state it as if evolution is a natual law... As for the proof of evolution.....well, I could sit here and type for hours but that would suck. Oh, and if you want proof of macro-evolution you only have to look as far as your own DNA. ok....and what, pray tell, am i looking for?  genes in common with an ape?  or genes in common with a chicken? since by that reasoning and the last I heard, humans are closer related to chickens than to apes. and if evolution is all about survival of the fittest and genetic mutations, then why the hell is it that there are still apes (or whatever we're supposedly closest related to) on this earth?  you'd think by now that humans -- being more "fit" -- would have fully supplanted apes.  and why are ALL genetic mutations these days (other than viral) discovered to be detrimental instead of beneficial? Red- Not even close. We are MUCH MUCH closely related to Apes. In fact, we ARE apes. Blue- The apes on this earth NOW, are not our ancestors. Its easier to think of them as our brothers. We did not evolve from the apes present today. We evolved from Homo erectus which there are plenty of fossils for. yellow- Thats not true. Think of sickel cell anemia. For a larger answer you need to look at different races of humans. Different races are less suceptable to different things...like cancer for instance because of genetic mutation. As far as I know they can't find the evolutionary missing piece between apes and us.

Chromosome 13 IIRC.

Quoted: Thou shall not Kill?????? Are the ten commandments not directly from god?

Actually the better translation is “do not murder.”

And you seem to be having some problem understanding the concept of the Sovereignty of God. I doubt I can help you, but I’ll try.

Do you believe that children should follow the same rules as their parents? Why or why not? Why do parents have the right to make rules for their children? Why can parents punish their children? Think about and answer these questions. And while you are doing it, ask yourself, who has the right to tell you what to do and why?

“Sovereignty” is the right to tell someone what to do. In the United States we generally hold that the individual is sovereign except in certain areas were we have collectively granted some of our sovereignty to the various Governments.

Parents have the right to tell their children how to behave because the parents hold the sovereignty of the child until the child legally reaches adulthood.

Got that?

Now, from a theistic standpoint... God created the Universe. God is sovereign over the Universe and everything in it. God allows humans to exercise sovereignty over their own lives. However he has also set up a system of moral laws which we all instinctively know. But God is not bound to those laws any more than a parent is bound to follow the bedtime they set for their children. They only exist to govern humans. (A dog that steals a slice of pizza isn’t a thief. A bear that kills another bear isn’t a murderer either.)

None of this means that God doesn’t exhibit the moral characteristics of justice and mercy. But he is operating on a level humans can’t grasp. Remember, from a theistic standpoint, every thing a person has is a gift on loan from God, including their life. God is free to give and take his gifts as he sees fit.

My explanations are probably totally inadequate… but that brings up another point that I think you really should understand…

Suppose someone used radon gas as proof the Earth was very young. Radon has a short half life and it should have all decayed by now if the Earth was billions of years old, right?

Assuming you know anything about nuclear reactions you would laugh at this. Radon does have a short half life but it’s created by the decay of heavier radioactive elements with long half lives. (uranium>thorium>radium>radon, I believe.) Anyone who made a claim like the one above would either be completely ignorant or trying to deceive people. But they wouldn’t just be ignorant of nuclear decay, they would be ignorant of the amount of brainpower that has been devoted to the study of nuclear physics.

Do you have any idea just how much brainpower has been dedicated to the study of Christian Theology over the MILLENIA? And it’s not just the Christians, there’re the Jewish scholars as well. They’ve been studying this stuff for much longer than the Christians have. For centuries the smartest people of an entire continent devoted themselves to studying, debating, and analyzing Christian theology. You aren’t going to poke holes in the theology with a few questions that any Sunday school student should be able to answer.

Quoted: i must say i'm shocked, i mean SHOCKED, that i bible thread turned into an evolution debate. that being said, i myself prefer the LOLcat Bible 1 Oh hai. In teh beginnin Ceiling Cat maded teh skiez An da Urfs, but he did not eated dem. 2 Da Urfs no had shapez An haded dark face, An Ceiling Cat rode invisible bike over teh waterz. 3 At start, no has lyte. An Ceiling Cat sayz, i can haz lite? An lite wuz. 4 An Ceiling Cat sawed teh lite, to seez stuffs, An splitted teh lite from dark but taht wuz ok cuz kittehs can see in teh dark An not tripz over nethin. 5 An Ceiling Cat sayed light Day An dark no Day. It were FURST!!!1 6 An Ceiling Cat sayed, im in ur waterz makin a ceiling. But he no yet make a ur. An he maded a hole in teh Ceiling. 7 An Ceiling Cat doed the skiez with waterz down An waterz up. It happen. 8 An Ceiling Cat sayed, i can has teh firmmint wich iz funny bibel naim 4 ceiling, so wuz teh twoth day.

it seems to be the whole bible lol

Quoted: Quoted: Thou shall not Kill?????? Are the ten commandments not directly from god? Actually the better translation is “do not murder.” And you seem to be having some problem understanding the concept of the Sovereignty of God. I doubt I can help you, but I’ll try. Do you believe that children should follow the same rules as their parents? Why or why not? Why do parents have the right to make rules for their children? Why can parents punish their children? Think about and answer these questions. And while you are doing it, ask yourself, who has the right to tell you what to do and why? “Sovereignty” is the right to tell someone what to do. In the United States we generally hold that the individual is sovereign except in certain areas were we have collectively granted some of our sovereignty to the various Governments. Parents have the right to tell their children how to behave because the parents hold the sovereignty of the child until the child legally reaches adulthood. Got that? Now, from a theistic standpoint... God created the Universe. God is sovereign over the Universe and everything in it. God allows humans to exercise sovereignty over their own lives. However he has also set up a system of moral laws which we all instinctively know. But God is not bound to those laws any more than a parent is bound to follow the bedtime they set for their children. They only exist to govern humans. (A dog that steals a slice of pizza isn’t a thief. A bear that kills another bear isn’t a murderer either.) None of this means that God doesn’t exhibit the moral characteristics of justice and mercy. But he is operating on a level humans can’t grasp. Remember, from a theistic standpoint, every thing a person has is a gift on loan from God, including their life. God is free to give and take his gifts as he sees fit. My explanations are probably totally inadequate… but that brings up another point that I think you really should understand… Suppose someone used radon gas as proof the Earth was very young. Radon has a short half life and it should have all decayed by now if the Earth was billions of years old, right? Assuming you know anything about nuclear reactions you would laugh at this. Radon does have a short half life but it’s created by the decay of heavier radioactive elements with long half lives. (uranium>thorium>radium>radon, I believe.) Anyone who made a claim like the one above would either be completely ignorant or trying to deceive people. But they wouldn’t just be ignorant of nuclear decay, they would be ignorant of the amount of brainpower that has been devoted to the study of nuclear physics. Do you have any idea just how much brainpower has been dedicated to the study of Christian Theology over the MILLENIA? And it’s not just the Christians, there’re the Jewish scholars as well. They’ve been studying this stuff for much longer than the Christians have. For centuries the smartest people of an entire continent devoted themselves to studying, debating, and analyzing Christian theology. You aren’t going to poke holes in the theology with a few questions that any Sunday school student should be able to answer.

Ok, you made your point, but nobody has responded to the points I made above. All they did was say, "its not kill, its murder." Nobody adressed my point about the flood and god being all knowing.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: No. Have you ever read, "The Origin of Species"? you're a fool if you think Origin of Species is as or more influential on our culture (and therefore required reading) than the Bible. Darwin has his place, but the two aren't even in the same league influence-wise. You think the bible is required reading????? Yes, if you're going to debate any topic about it with any modicum of credibility or shred of intelligence.

Does that mean you have to read the Koran or any other religion's holy book before you can discuss them?

Quoted: Quoted: Thou shall not Kill?????? Are the ten commandments not directly from god? Actually the better translation is “do not murder.” And you seem to be having some problem understanding the concept of the Sovereignty of God. I doubt I can help you, but I’ll try. Do you believe that children should follow the same rules as their parents? Why or why not? Why do parents have the right to make rules for their children? Why can parents punish their children? Think about and answer these questions. And while you are doing it, ask yourself, who has the right to tell you what to do and why? “Sovereignty” is the right to tell someone what to do. In the United States we generally hold that the individual is sovereign except in certain areas were we have collectively granted some of our sovereignty to the various Governments. Parents have the right to tell their children how to behave because the parents hold the sovereignty of the child until the child legally reaches adulthood. Got that? Now, from a theistic standpoint... God created the Universe. God is sovereign over the Universe and everything in it. God allows humans to exercise sovereignty over their own lives. However he has also set up a system of moral laws which we all instinctively know. But God is not bound to those laws any more than a parent is bound to follow the bedtime they set for their children. They only exist to govern humans. (A dog that steals a slice of pizza isn’t a thief. A bear that kills another bear isn’t a murderer either.) None of this means that God doesn’t exhibit the moral characteristics of justice and mercy. But he is operating on a level humans can’t grasp. Remember, from a theistic standpoint, every thing a person has is a gift on loan from God, including their life. God is free to give and take his gifts as he sees fit. My explanations are probably totally inadequate… but that brings up another point that I think you really should understand… Suppose someone used radon gas as proof the Earth was very young. Radon has a short half life and it should have all decayed by now if the Earth was billions of years old, right? Assuming you know anything about nuclear reactions you would laugh at this. Radon does have a short half life but it’s created by the decay of heavier radioactive elements with long half lives. (uranium>thorium>radium>radon, I believe.) Anyone who made a claim like the one above would either be completely ignorant or trying to deceive people. But they wouldn’t just be ignorant of nuclear decay, they would be ignorant of the amount of brainpower that has been devoted to the study of nuclear physics. Do you have any idea just how much brainpower has been dedicated to the study of Christian Theology over the MILLENIA? And it’s not just the Christians, there’re the Jewish scholars as well. They’ve been studying this stuff for much longer than the Christians have. For centuries the smartest people of an entire continent devoted themselves to studying, debating, and analyzing Christian theology. You aren’t going to poke holes in the theology with a few questions that any Sunday school student should be able to answer.

Bravo

Quoted: cdn-www.cracked.com/articleimages/wong/badass2.jpg

+1

Quoted: Quoted: I think Darwin was a believer.   I think he died one, and I think that is something the left NEVER wants you to know... IIRC.

He was a believer on his voyage on the Beagle and while he wrote Origins, but later in life he became an unbeliever.

He had a lot of deaths in his family that led to him losing his faith.  Losing faith had little to do with his work, he originally viewed what he did as discovering the method God used to populate the world.

He did not make a deathbed conversion as some people claim.  

here is a link from a Christian source if you want more info.

www.creationontheweb.com/content/view/689/

cheers!

Quoted: Nobody adressed my point about the flood and god being all knowing.

This will sound odd but ....... the flood was an act of mercy.  Sorta like putting a dog down.

Jesus hadn't come so there was no way for man to get out of his wickedness.


Genesis 6

5 The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time.
6 The LORD was grieved that he had made man on the earth, and his heart was filled with pain.
7 So the LORD said, "I will wipe mankind, whom I have created, from the face of the earth—men and animals, and creatures that move along the ground, and birds of the air—for I am grieved that I have made them."

Thats pretty good.

ok no more lolcat, i promise!

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Are those the "real" versus from the bible??? Yes. Moses killed people.....but, but, I thought that was a sin????

Killing is not the same as murder.  One is can be justified, the other cannot.

Quoted: Thou shall not Kill?????? Is the "wrong" translation from the original ancient Hebrew. It is Thou shall not MURDER Are the ten commandments not directly from god? God, yes..god, no.

Kill and Murder have 2 different and distinct meanings.

Quoted: Quoted: Deuteronomy... 22:23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;       (22:23-24) 22:24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.   That's some fucked up shit--stoned to death because you didn't cry out loud enough when being raped.. You do realize you are looking at a translation of a 3000 year old document. It is not like they had CSI or anything. The intent is obvious, if she ain't being raped, then you are commiting adultery.

More from Deuteronomy..

22:20 But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:  
22:21 Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.

And the following verses, also pertaining to rape-not adultery...Deut.

22:23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;       (22:23-24)

22:24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.  
22:25 But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die.   22:26 But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbour, and slayeth him, even so is this matter:  
22:27 For he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her.

Quoted: Ok, you made your point, but nobody has responded to the points I made above. All they did was say, "its not kill, its murder." Nobody adressed my point about the flood and god being all knowing. "God knows everything......except that the first civilization he created was screwed up and full of non-belivers and he had to redo it (the flood)."

Yea, something like that…

But remember that God is sovereign so he can do what he wants and really owes no explanation to anyone.

Also, you are starting with the assumption that God wanted creation to be perfect. And why wouldn’t he? Why would God purposefully create something that is flawed? I honestly don’t know. I do know possible answers though.

God is all knowing, but we aren’t. According to the Bible there are also other consciousnesses in the universe that are not all knowing but that are created higher than we are. (Angels)

Imagine a physics class where the professor wants to demonstrate that perpetual motion is impossible. He might do so by demonstrating several proposed perpetual motion machines. All of them would fail, just as the professor expected. But the failure of the machines would justify the professor’s knowledge that perpetual motion was impossible.

So, God creates the universe and allows it to run in condition “x.” (X being a certain set of philosophical variables) Creation fails as God knew it would. He then wipes out the experiment (flood) saving the parts of it that he believed to be worth saving. Then he starts everything over with condition “y.” Y fails too, again as God expected. But he introduces variable “z” (Christianity) which slowly starts to move part of the world in a better direction… (At least I hope its better.)

Now, as to what really happened in the flood, I don’t honestly know. I’m pretty sure it didn’t physically happen, at least on this planet. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t true, just that it’s probably not literal.

I’m sure many different knowledgeable theologians would come up with completely different answers to the question you asked. Many would probably say my answer is very poorly thought out and tear it apart. But I think my answer is right enough for our purposes here.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: This thread has evolved into major suckage. God did it then. Blame him. I'm not a Christian, so I'll blame you instead.

Oh, snap!

I LOL'd at the article.

Quoted: ... but nobody has responded to the points I made...

Probably because you're a trolling child.

Quoted: Thou shall not MURDER!  not kill.

Yes, in the english translation.


ETA: The Flying Spaghetti Monster is the one true god. Anything else is blasphemy.

Quoted: Quoted: Ok, you made your point, but nobody has responded to the points I made above. All they did was say, "its not kill, its murder." Nobody adressed my point about the flood and god being all knowing. "God knows everything......except that the first civilization he created was screwed up and full of non-belivers and he had to redo it (the flood)." Yea, something like that… But remember that God is sovereign so he can do what he wants and really owes no explanation to anyone. Also, you are starting with the assumption that God wanted creation to be perfect. And why wouldn’t he? Why would God purposefully create something that is flawed? I honestly don’t know. I do know possible answers though. God is all knowing, but we aren’t. According to the Bible there are also other consciousnesses in the universe that are not all knowing but that are created higher than we are. (Angels) Imagine a physics class where the professor wants to demonstrate that perpetual motion is impossible. He might do so by demonstrating several proposed perpetual motion machines. All of them would fail, just as the professor expected. But the failure of the machines would justify the professor’s knowledge that perpetual motion was impossible. So, God creates the universe and allows it to run in condition “x.” (X being a certain set of philosophical variables) Creation fails as God knew it would. He then wipes out the experiment (flood) saving the parts of it that he believed to be worth saving. Then he starts everything over with condition “y.” Y fails too, again as God expected. But he introduces variable “z” (Christianity) which slowly starts to move part of the world in a better direction… (At least I hope its better.) Now, as to what really happened in the flood, I don’t honestly know. I’m pretty sure it didn’t physically happen, at least on this planet. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t true, just that it’s probably not literal. I’m sure many different knowledgeable theologians would come up with completely different answers to the question you asked. Many would probably say my answer is very poorly thought out and tear it apart. But I think my answer is right enough for our purposes here.

There is much evidence for many Vary Large flood events all over the planet.  The Idea of the whole planet covered by water at the same time may by a somewhat simplistic interpretation of the Bible.  All parts of the planet being hit by flood events over a reasonable period of time may be more accurate.  

The OPs link was very funny I enjoyed it.

I am going to turkey slap the next bastard that continues with the C vs E crap...go shit on another thread you pukes.  Pull the stick out of your ass and have a chuckle....or leave...

SUBSCRIBE

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: No. Have you ever read, "The Origin of Species"? you're a fool if you think Origin of Species is as or more influential on our culture (and therefore required reading) than the Bible. Darwin has his place, but the two aren't even in the same league influence-wise. You think the bible is required reading?????

Only for the literate.

Or, perhaps "donkey's jawbone" was mistranslated from the original Hebrew word for "minigun."    




Good stuff.  We have strayed too far from the original ass kicking intent of the Old Testament.

Quoted: Quoted: You do realize you are looking at a translation of a 3000 year old document. It is not like they had CSI or anything. The intent is obvious, if she ain't being raped, then you are commiting adultery. More from Deuteronomy.. 22:20 But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:   22:21 Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the whore in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you. And the following verses, also pertaining to rape-not adultery...Deut. 22:23 If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;       (22:23-24) 22:24 Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.   22:25 But if a man find a betrothed damsel in the field, and the man force her, and lie with her: then the man only that lay with her shall die.   22:26 But unto the damsel thou shalt do nothing; there is in the damsel no sin worthy of death: for as when a man riseth against his neighbour, and slayeth him, even so is this matter:   22:27 For he found her in the field, and the betrothed damsel cried, and there was none to save her.

What's your point?

Prior to the verses you cite, we get CONTEXT. If a woman falsely advertises herself as a virgin and is not, it is a problem. If the man falsely accuses, there is a problem. Getting lied to by /lying about a marriage partner is an enormous betrayal of trust.

It isn't like STD's didn't exist 3000 years ago. The difference is that they didn't have condoms, penicillin, etc.....

Secondly, only an arsehole would actually drag a woman out to be stoned, but simply having the power would be a good deterrent. In actual practice, we see that Joseph was going to put Mary away privately even though he had the power to drag her out to be stoned.

Quoted: Quoted: In fact, we ARE apes. Speak for yourself monkey boy.

Actually, apes and monkeys are very different and followed a very different evolutionary path, but Im sure that you are intelligent enough to already know that. Right??

Didn't you see the link about Moses killing the man,there it was  SAM FISHER,that's mil-surp,vince-vaga ect.
Bob

if i remember correctly it was thow shalt not MURDER==very differant understanding compared to the new age PC bible thumpers.
               
                        ( more sheeple)
still a personal thing and man does change things a lot to justify their behavior keep religion out of govmnt sharia law is a prime example!!!

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Are those the "real" versus from the bible??? Yes. Moses killed people.....but, but, I thought that was a sin????

Where does it ever claim that Moses was without sin?

Someone doesn't know what they are talking about...

Best I've seen all year...

Quoted: I am a very dedicated believer, but some things are just funny. www.cracked.com/article_15699_9-most-badass-bible-verses.html

1 Samuel 18:25-27 (King James Version) 25 And Saul said, Thus shall ye say to David, The king desireth not any dowry, but an hundred foreskins of the Philistines, to be avenged of the king's enemies. But Saul thought to make David fall by the hand of the Philistines. 26 And when his servants told David these words, it pleased David well to be the king's son in law: and the days were not expired. 27 Wherefore David arose and went, he and his men, and slew of the Philistines two hundred men; and David brought their foreskins, and they gave them in full tale to the king, that he might be the king's son in law. And Saul gave him Michal his daughter to wife.

Nothing like reading the Bible to reassure me in my atheism.

Quoted: Sigh.....The more I learn about the bible the more contradictory I see it is. Take this thread for example. You cant kill......but god can. God knows everything......except that the first civilization he created was screwed up and full of non-belivers and he had to redo it (the flood).

God brought the flood to destroy the wicked that had overtaken creation.  The reason God allowed the wicked to perpetrate their evil acts is because he loves us.  If God had made a "perfect" creation that did not allow man to choose to sin he would have simply created a race of slaves with no free will.  God knew we would fuck up creation and he lets us do it time and time again because if he denied us the right to make a wrong decision he would remove our capacity to choose to love him.

Yes, the bible may seem contradictory to someone who has never received some sort of insight into bible but when properly understood the contradictions vanish.  It is hard to start reading a text that is thousands of years old without having a prior understanding of the language and meaning behind the writings.