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I'm just amazed that someone employed part time was ordered to pay almost $800 a month in addition to $10,000 in back child support.

I work full time making decent money and I couldn't afford that.

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There is a procedure, a procedure I am all too well aware of, that will fix that problem.

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I truly think that if the state can somehow understand what is a minimum wage, or what is considered a liveable unemployment figure for a family, HOW THE FUCK can they not have a set standard for raising a child in a healthy manner. Seriously it blows my mind that a rich rock star should be force to pay more than a drunken high school kid who forgot to wrap it up. Once the child is born, and healthy, there is no difference in cost to raise that child from a basic needs standpoint. Sure we'd all love to give our children every opportunity to excel in life, but the truth is that even with money some people cannot raise a child worth bent nickel.

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mhoffman––––––––––WHAT can I add?   Nothing!  You stated it clearly.  You hit the proverbial nail on the head.  Thank you!

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I understand that you are posting these articles in the hopes of raising awareness, Jim_Tash, but please explain to me how you are directly affected by this situation.  Do you have children you are paying child support for?  

With regards to the other article about women waiting into their 30s and missing their window of opportunity, are you one of those men dating women in their 20s when you are in your 30s?  For that matter, why did YOU wait until your mid-late 30s to marry and procreate?  

Does focusing on the negatives of the male/female relationships HELP you in any way?  Might it be coloring your view of women and relationships thus making it harder to find a mate and essentially reinforcing your dim view of females and marriage and children?

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This is a really tricky subject.  And I KNOW I'll get blasted, but here goes...

First, YES, he had the choice to not fuck her, or to wear a condom.  He made bad choices.  Better choices would have completely avoided the situation.  (Of course, she had the same options, not only with him, but the other guys who were tested.)  But the deed has been done...

This woman DOES raise an interesting argument about rights.  (I am anti-abortion, but that is irrelevant here.  My beliefs are not law, and abortion is legal.)  As a woman, if I find myself pregnant, I can choose to have the baby and keep it, have the baby and give it up for adoption, have the baby and drop it off in a safe place (ABANDON it), or have an abortion.  The sperm donor has ONE option: wait to see what I decide to do, and then if I decide to keep it, he finds out how much he has to pay me every month for the next 18 years (or maybe even longer, if I get a good lawyer and my offspring chooses to become a professional student...)

It's fucked either way.  The WOMAN decides whether she wants to be a parent or not, and makes her choice.  The MAN has no say.  Even if he WANTS the baby, she can abort it because it is her body.  And if he doesn't, he's still held financially responsible.  It doesn't matter if it was a one night stand, or a long term relationship.  It doesn't matter if the woman intentionally mislead him about fertility/birth control.  HE IS ON THE HOOK AT HER WHIM, while she has so many options out.  I'm not saying that every man should be off scot free, but I do think there needs to be some accountability on the part of the female, too.  The kid in this article wasn't off "busting it" in every ho he could lay –– he was the lucky winner of several possibles.  That girl is a slut, and now she gets a nice fat check from the baby daddy every month, plus a huge back settlement, plus now that she's a single mom, she's eligible for all kinds of bennies off the gov't teat.  Where's HER incentive to keep her legs closed or use a condom?!?

And then, for the love of God, where do some of these child support amounts come from?!?!?  If the father is financially responsible, he should only be 50% responsible, and some of these ridiculous amounts are obviously "baby momma support" or even just punitive, as well as child support.  Frankly, by forcing people to pay amounts well beyond their means, we also force them to become "dead beat dads".  There are a lot of cases where they are perpetually behind, not because they DON'T pay, but because they CAN'T.  Then it comes out of their wages, and they can no longer pay their rent, they lose their vehicles, etc., costing them the ability to work, and therefore fall even FARTHER behind.  Where the hell is this obviously immature kid going to find $10 K in back support?   Plus keep up with $700+ a month in current support?  I guess the court system will love seeing him again when he gets busted for turning to drug dealing or other criminal activity to pay his debt...  Desperate people do desperate things...

If I had my way, I'd be home during the day taking care of the house and in the kitchen cooking supper in heels and a dress every night.  (I DO, to the extent our schedules permit.)   I never was a Women's Libber.  I miss the hell out of Leave It to Beaver, and think our country has had a downward spiral since we've earned our equal rights.  (But again, that's just me.)  But with sex as with race, equal should mean EQUAL.  A person is not "more equal" just because he is not white, and a woman, just because she happens to house the baby factory, should not be "more equal"  than a man, but that's the way it is.  "I want to be  EQUAL... until it suits me better the other way..."

It's bullshit, and it needs to be addressed: both the pregnant woman holding the man's future hostage, as well as the courts making insane decisions like this.  (Hell, I'd rather be ass-raped by a pack of mules than be a man going to paternity/child support/divorce court.  I don't know how y'all do it!  I know it doesn't ALWAYS happen - my case was just the opposite, I got screwed in spite of being abused, but I know that's far from the norm.)  

In an attempt to be fair, we have tipped the scales WAY too far on one side.  But then, we seem to be getting good at that...

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Because you owe a debt and an obligation to society to care for the helpless child that you have created.  You make a mess, you clean it up.  You make a messy baby, you clean its ass for 18 years.  

There are rights, and there are duties.  When you have created a kid, your life no longer revolves around you.  Walking away is abandonment.  

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If females can make unilateral decisions to abort, then males should be able to make the same choice to walk away from the consequences of their sexual activity.

ETA: beaten by 2 minutes

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Like Jesus Christ took upon himself the sins of mankind, Jim takes to himself the suffering of every man who has ever been treated poorly by a woman.  He is the world's preeminent victim of the evil that is womankind.

Jane

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If a slut can spread her legs and choose to kill, or let be adopted a child, and do whatever she wants regardless of what the man wants, a man should have every right to opt out of being responsible for the child, turnabout is fair play

Its bullshit if you say otherwise

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Yeah, you should have raised hm better and told him to wait

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Woman decides to abort = no child support/responsibility on the sperm donor



Woman decides to put up for adoption = no child support/responsibility on the sperm donor



Where it gets sticky (bad pun intended) would be the woman carrying the fetus to term and the sperm donor raising the child - does the mother pay child support to the father?



Brian

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I've never heard of a doctor that will do that for an 18 year old.

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No, to be equal, a guy should have the right to terminate the pregnancy, not just walk away from it.  Imagine how well that would fly.


ETA: I do not believe that this is a solution, but the logic used in most proabortion arguments leads this to be a conclusion.  

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what i have never understood ids the PRICE of child support.


It is both parents fault and unless the father wants custody he should have to pay for his child.  The problem is the price.  I make decent money but i buy my kids clothing at goodwill,  we feed her good food and pay for her daycare.


daycare is 500 a month  feeding her is probably 100 a month.  clothing her is probably 20 dollars a month.  doctor checkups are about 200 a year so well just add another 20 a month for that.  diapers at first are aroun 50 a month.


so withe daycare we are at around 700 a month.  therefore the father should not be paying more than 350 dollars a month for the child.  Thhe inequality comes from the fact that men aren't paying child suport. they are paying WAY more than it costs for their half of raising a child.  They are paing baby moma support.

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Because you owe a debt and an obligation to society to care for the helpless child that you have created.  You make a mess, you clean it up.  You make a messy baby, you clean its ass for 18 years.  

There are rights, and there are duties.  When you have created a kid, your life no longer revolves around you.  Walking away is abandonment.  

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#1 Why should he PAY retroactive if the whore didnt even know who the father was? Because paternity has been established in fact. Afterward, yes it's apparently true. But it's still his.
#2 Why is it not a percentage of his income? A set rate of $759 a month is pretty steep thats for sure! Wtf could the kid make working part time? Thats nuts! I don't know, and yes I think it's a bit fucked up.

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Exactly.



It should 50% of the bottom amount. Nothing more.

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In an attempt to be fair, we have tipped the scales WAY too far on one side.  But then, we seem to be getting good at that...

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I bet that Mommy wont have to tell him to wrap it up next time....he just learned an expensive lesson

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I've never heard of a doctor that will do that for an 18 year old.

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This is a really tricky subject.  And I KNOW I'll get blasted, but here goes...<SNIP>

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If people would just get married first and have sex with only their spouse this would not happen.  If people would get married and stay married the world would be a better place.
Don't go around poking any pussy you can at 16 years of age and you will not have to learn these lessons.

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I have been told by people on this forum that's it's more than the cost because it includes trips to the zoo, dancing lessons, and karate.   These are apparently rights for children to have.

 

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In an attempt to be fair, we have tipped the scales WAY too far on one side.  But then, we seem to be getting good at that...

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You raise some very good points.  Most people would get hung up on the hideous idea of a court forcing a woman to undergo an abortion.  And if you didn't do that, then you're back at square one with society paying to raise the child if the sperm donor is not help culpable.

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Get a lawyer who specializes in cases like this, and get a new hearing.  How the hell do you go to court in a case like this without one?

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The reason why the boy got screwed over, and the mother got seemingly great treatment is because they didn't factor into the decision. The court will always decided in favor of what is in the best interest of the child. Sometimes that means the parents (really, the father) gets screwed over. The reasoning is that it is preferential for the father to be screwed financially then the child mother.

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In the old common law, ownership of the child remained with the man.  You owned your kids like property.   The bond between mother and child kept them together, and the law would give ownership to the man, which would keep the family together.  It worked just fine for a long long time.  if the woman wanted to leave, she could pack up and go, but she had to leave the kid.  

If I was in that kids position, the judge would tell me my new monetary obligations, and I would refuse to sign anything, saying that the kids werent mine, I signed them over to the state of ________ when I signed the birth certificate, furthermore, I have looked over the contract she wanted me to sign, and I have come to the conclusion that it is not in my best interests and she can not compel me to contract with the state of __________.

of course, I would have to barter or trade for property instead of earn income from that point forward, but it would be better than the huge tax imposed, and I would come out ahead.

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She does raise a good point.  If the mother can abort the child, why can the father not abort his parental responsibility?

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While abortion is (was) a legal choice for this mother, she made the correct decision not to murder her baby.  Now Mr. "Pardon me while I whip this out" needs to take the high road and help pay for it.  

The amount seems high, but we don't know the other circumstances of this case.  Legal representation should definitely been an option for the young man, and seems lacking from the article as presented.

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The mother could put the kid up for adoption and if the courts were not artificially subsidizing the raising of the kid, she probably would. So all that has happened because of this decision is some kid will forever be poor and some childless family will continue to have a hole in their hearts.