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Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:43:57 AM EDT
[#1]
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:49:49 AM EDT
[#2]
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Quoted:


I'm planning on going back to Brookwood shortly as In believe there are some MoH recipients as well as participants of the Dieppe and St Nazaire raids
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Thanks Bradders, I didn't know that cemetery existed.

Do you know how many MIAs are in the American Cemetery
and if any are from operation Overlord?

(off to google)

My father's father was MIA at Normandy, therefore, it appears I have another
stop to add to my list for our family's future tour of GB and Europe.


Very possible that your family is memorialized at Madingley. Many of the casualties from Exercise Tiger are also there. The families of Exercise Tiger casualties were often told their loved ones died at Normandy.


I'm planning on going back to Brookwood shortly as In believe there are some MoH recipients as well as participants of the Dieppe and St Nazaire raids


If you do, go past the cemetery at Cardington off the A421...the small cemetery has the crash victims from the R101 there.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:53:09 AM EDT
[#3]
The Veterans cemetery in Hampton has RN and German navy crews buried in it from WWII.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:55:52 AM EDT
[#4]
Great post. Thank you for sharing.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 12:03:31 PM EDT
[#5]
Very nice, hey did I see Bond, James Bond in one of those pics?
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 12:11:48 PM EDT
[#6]
Thank you for sharing.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 12:20:43 PM EDT
[#7]
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 12:22:39 PM EDT
[#8]
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Quoted:


It was done by percentage according to the guy at Madingley.
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How in hell did they know an unknown soldier was jewish?

Thank you for the pics.  Stationed overseas I was always awestruck when visiting war cemeteries.


It was done by percentage according to the guy at Madingley.


interesting.

but patently unfair to the corpse who was, almost unquestionably, not jewish.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 12:26:11 PM EDT
[#9]
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 12:45:46 PM EDT
[#10]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


interesting.

but patently unfair to the corpse who was, almost unquestionably, not jewish.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
How in hell did they know an unknown soldier was jewish?

Thank you for the pics.  Stationed overseas I was always awestruck when visiting war cemeteries.


It was done by percentage according to the guy at Madingley.


interesting.

but patently unfair to the corpse who was, almost unquestionably, not jewish.


In the immortal words of the great internet philosopher Gary Coleman, "Who cares?"

The Bedouins that found CAPT Speicher's body buried it according to their tradition, which was a noble act to the dead.

Link Posted: 8/31/2015 12:49:47 PM EDT
[#11]
Thanks Bradders.  I needed some perspective this morning.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 1:07:30 PM EDT
[#12]
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Quoted:


At the Madingley cemetery, it was intended for WWII war dead, but three American pilots from the 1980s and 1990s are buried there at the request of HMG due to the fact their wives were British.

I went to the cemetery where John Magee is buried in Lincolnshire. At least two or three Luftwaffe crews are buried there.
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Long ago, in another life, I spent a year in Montgomery, AL doing the camp follower thing while my boyfriend was at Air Command and Staff College.  On one of the routes through the city, between Maxwell AFB and Gunter AFS, there was a large municipal cemetery with a small section containing the graves of Brits killed in flight training accidents during the War.  I'd always stop and spend a few minutes reading the names.  I'd think of these young men resting so far from their homes, their loved ones lacking the solace of even a grave to visit.  And I'd cry.  

We remember yours too, Bradders.  We remember yours.


At the Madingley cemetery, it was intended for WWII war dead, but three American pilots from the 1980s and 1990s are buried there at the request of HMG due to the fact their wives were British.

I went to the cemetery where John Magee is buried in Lincolnshire. At least two or three Luftwaffe crews are buried there.

As you might expect, I've long been familiar with the man's verse, though not the manner of his passing.  Sad.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:00:21 PM EDT
[#13]

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I believe that many of the WW2 dead were exhumed and reburied at the American Military Cemetery at Cambridge

See here

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1b/Cambridge_American_Cemetery_and_Memorial.jpg
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Quoted:



Quoted:

Thanks Bradders, I didn't know that cemetery existed.



Do you know how many MIAs are in the American Cemetery

and if any are from operation Overlord?



(off to google)



My father's father was MIA at Normandy, therefore, it appears I have another

stop to add to my list for our family's future tour of GB and Europe.




I believe that many of the WW2 dead were exhumed and reburied at the American Military Cemetery at Cambridge

See here

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1b/Cambridge_American_Cemetery_and_Memorial.jpg




 
US personnel KIA in France during OVERLORD and associated operations  are buried at the Normandy American Cemetery.




The American Battlefield Monuments Commission is in charge of oversees military cemeteries.  One of my old battalion commanders, retired general Jim Dickey, used to be the secretary or whatever for Europe.  I used to know all the staff at the Florence and the Sicily-Rome Military Cemeteries.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:04:21 PM EDT
[#14]

Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


Thanks Bradders, I didn't know that cemetery existed.



Do you know how many MIAs are in the American Cemetery

and if any are from operation Overlord?



(off to google)



My father's father was MIA at Normandy, therefore, it appears I have another

stop to add to my list for our family's future tour of GB and Europe.
View Quote




 
Search ABMC Burials and Memorializations
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:07:12 PM EDT
[#15]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

As you might expect, I've long been familiar the man's verse, though not the manner of his passing.  Sad.
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Long ago, in another life, I spent a year in Montgomery, AL doing the camp follower thing while my boyfriend was at Air Command and Staff College.  On one of the routes through the city, between Maxwell AFB and Gunter AFS, there was a large municipal cemetery with a small section containing the graves of Brits killed in flight training accidents during the War.  I'd always stop and spend a few minutes reading the names.  I'd think of these young men resting so far from their homes, their loved ones lacking the solace of even a grave to visit.  And I'd cry.  

We remember yours too, Bradders.  We remember yours.


At the Madingley cemetery, it was intended for WWII war dead, but three American pilots from the 1980s and 1990s are buried there at the request of HMG due to the fact their wives were British.

I went to the cemetery where John Magee is buried in Lincolnshire. At least two or three Luftwaffe crews are buried there.

As you might expect, I've long been familiar the man's verse, though not the manner of his passing.  Sad.


Midair collision over Lincolnshire. RAF Digby is still an active RAF Base, and the base crest still has the Maple Leaf on it to honor the Canadians that served there.

Digby also has a couple of great historical elements...on May 8th 1945, the air defense sector operations room was closed, and kept that way until it was opened by happy accident in the late 1990s. When it was opened, save for some minor water damage, it was pretty much the way it was left 50 years previously.

Also, some of the last extant fighter alert revetments are at Digby.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:14:53 PM EDT
[#16]
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:19:18 PM EDT
[#17]
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Quoted:
How in hell did they know an unknown soldier was jewish?
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Might have found some of the body?
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:22:50 PM EDT
[#18]
So, here's a bizarre WWII military cemetery note.



My father was in the 313th Infantry Regiment, 79th Division from post OCS (Jul 1942) until his second wound in France (Oct 1944) - except while he was in the hospital in the UK from his first wound (he went AWOL and rejoined his unit - there was a form for that)..




In the Lorraine American Cemetery there is a PFC buried with our last name, but from Iowa (Dad was born in Indiana), from the same unit.  That fellow died in January 1945.  




Dad was unaware of the guy - you'd think somebody would have said "hey, Lieutenant, are you related to PFC Jim in Company _?"




Dad was surprised when he was shown the grave (the cemetery superintendent looked up names as people signed in the visitors book so he could show them where family members were buried and assumed Dad was related).




The regimental history lists this fellow, but not when he joined the regiment (after Dad was wounded?).  He also shows up as being assigned to the AT Company, 307th Infantry Regiment, 77th Division.  Maybe he was wounded and then assigned to the 313th?
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:28:05 PM EDT
[#19]
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Quoted:


interesting.

but patently unfair to the corpse who was, almost unquestionably, not jewish.
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Quoted:
Quoted:
How in hell did they know an unknown soldier was jewish?

Thank you for the pics.  Stationed overseas I was always awestruck when visiting war cemeteries.


It was done by percentage according to the guy at Madingley.


interesting.

but patently unfair to the corpse who was, almost unquestionably, not jewish.


Can't prove he was Chrstian either. Or Muslim, or Buddhist, or anything. So you've got decent odds of being "unfair", even if you put up no symbol,  so the most "fair" thing is actually to allocate it by percentage. Then, at least, the numbers are properly represented.

Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:35:17 PM EDT
[#20]
thanks for sharing those, OP.





Link Posted: 8/31/2015 2:56:52 PM EDT
[#21]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:


In the immortal words of the great internet philosopher Gary Coleman, "Who cares?"

The Bedouins that found CAPT Speicher's body buried it according to their tradition, which was a noble act to the dead.

View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
How in hell did they know an unknown soldier was jewish?

Thank you for the pics.  Stationed overseas I was always awestruck when visiting war cemeteries.


It was done by percentage according to the guy at Madingley.


interesting.

but patently unfair to the corpse who was, almost unquestionably, not jewish.


In the immortal words of the great internet philosopher Gary Coleman, "Who cares?"

The Bedouins that found CAPT Speicher's body buried it according to their tradition, which was a noble act to the dead.



The latter example does not exactly equate to graves registration in WW2, however.

A minor detail that at least you explained the reasoning.

I wonder what the ratio was for the various religions.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 3:46:27 PM EDT
[#22]
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 4:22:39 PM EDT
[#23]
Thanks for posting OP.  

I was able to visit the Cambridge American Cemetery back in February.  A beautiful and well maintained place.  

Was able to get an incredible tour on a cold windy day by one of the staff members.  

Unfortunately I don't have any pictures, but the chapel interior is something to see if you haven't been there.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 4:45:58 PM EDT
[#24]

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Quoted:
Unless they were Medevac'd back to Britain and died there

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Quoted:



Quoted:


Quoted:


Quoted:

Thanks Bradders, I didn't know that cemetery existed.



Do you know how many MIAs are in the American Cemetery

and if any are from operation Overlord?



(off to google)



My father's father was MIA at Normandy, therefore, it appears I have another

stop to add to my list for our family's future tour of GB and Europe.




I believe that many of the WW2 dead were exhumed and reburied at the American Military Cemetery at Cambridge

See here

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1b/Cambridge_American_Cemetery_and_Memorial.jpg


  US personnel KIA in France during OVERLORD and associated operations  are buried at the Normandy American Cemetery.





The American Battlefield Monuments Commission is in charge of oversees military cemeteries.  One of my old battalion commanders, retired general Jim Dickey, used to be the secretary or whatever for Europe.  I used to know all the staff at the Florence and the Sicily-Rome Military Cemeteries.





Unless they were Medevac'd back to Britain and died there





 
Separated by a common language!




Killed In Action in France means they died in France.  If they were medically evacuated (ya'll say "casevac'd") to Blighty and died on fair Albion's soil, then they "Died Of Wounds" in Britain.




KIA in Normandy, buried in Normandy.  DOW in the UK, buried in the UK.  Unless the family requested the return of the remains postwar.










After the war, our folks had some serious rules about where bodies were re-interred when the field cemeteries were consolidated in Europe, but there are exceptions (the six Yanks buried in your Commonwealth cemetery in Durenbach, Germany - in Bavaria - should have been moved to the Epinal American Cemetery where those that were KIA in Germany are buried, but weren't - we have no cemeteries in Germany).




Your Commonwealth war Graves Commission has smaller cemeteries - we consolidated
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:00:55 PM EDT
[#25]
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Quoted:


Names of the 21 US servicewomen still missing in action from World War II
2 March 2011 at 05:53
Among the 74000 Americans still missing from World War II are 21 American servicewomen, listed below.  It is to America's shame that the remains of these courageous women and of all the other American MIAs of World War II are still unrecovered after so many years, largely due to the grossly insufficient funds our Government allocates to our military's remains recovery program.  In honor of Women's History Month (2011), please demand from our Congressional representatives that our Government start adequately funding this program.

WASP Gertrude V. Tompkins-Silver of Jersey City, New Jersey
Army Nurse Corps 2nd Lt. Eloise M. Richardson of Marseilles, Illinois
Army Nurse Corps 2nd Lt. Thelma M. LaFave of Elmwood, Michigan
WAC PFC Rose Brohinsky of San Francisco, California
WAC Sgt. Doris Cooper of Champaign, Illinois
WAC PFC Flossie D. Flannery of Springport, Indiana
WAC PFC Frieda C.  Friend of New York, New York
WAC PFC Mary M. Gollinger of Tacoma, Washington
WAC CPL Velma E. Holden of Asheville, North Carolina
WAC PFC Odessa Lou Hollingsworth of Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
WAC PFC Alice D. King of Oswego, Oregon
WAC PFC Wilma E. Liles of Dallas, Texas
WAC PFC Evelyn L. McBride of Inglewood, California
WAC PFC Alice Pauline McKinney of Big Bay, Michigan
WAC PFC Rose F. Puchalla of Minneapolis, Minnesota
WAC PFC Mildred E. Rice of Kansas City, Kansas
WAC PFC Pearl Roomsburg of Lomita, California
WAC PFC Helen F. Rozzelle of Washington, D.C.
WAC PFC Leona M. Seyfert of Chicago, Illinois
WAC PFC Ruth E. Warlick of Goldthwaite, Texas
WAC PFC Bonnie L. Williams of Glenda Springs, Kansas

An earlier version of this note incorrectly included the names of the following individuals, all of whom have, upon further investigation, been determined to be interred in individual or common graves at US military cemeteries:

PFC Alethia M. Fair of Los Angeles, California
Sgt. Helen G. Kent of Los Angeles, California
PFC Mary M. Landau of Brooklyn, New York
Sgt. Belle G. Naimer of New York, New York
TEC3 Marion W. McMonagle of Philadelphia County, Pennsylvania
S/Sgt. Laura E. Besley of Dauphin County, Pennsylvania
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Quoted:
Question,

And I mean no disrespect, but how many women went "missing" during the war? I am assuming that they were military veterans, and usually one goes missing either from capture or you body was utterly destroyed from a shell and you just disappeared or you drown at the bottom of a body of water etc.

Were there many women in areas of combat that were vaporized or drowned and therefore disappeared?

Or would a percentage (small I know) just say "fuck it, I'm out" and just drop out? (AWOL) Again no disrespect meant, I was just wondering how many women went "missing" during a war that were due to enemy engagement of some sort that qualified them for the wall/memorial.

Let me reiterate, I mean no disrespect to the women that served and were included to the memorial, I just wondered how a woman came to the distinction during the war.

Perhaps they were on a ship that was sunk?


Names of the 21 US servicewomen still missing in action from World War II
2 March 2011 at 05:53
Among the 74000 Americans still missing from World War II are 21 American servicewomen, listed below.  It is to America's shame that the remains of these courageous women and of all the other American MIAs of World War II are still unrecovered after so many years, largely due to the grossly insufficient funds our Government allocates to our military's remains recovery program.  In honor of Women's History Month (2011), please demand from our Congressional representatives that our Government start adequately funding this program.

WASP Gertrude V. Tompkins-Silver of Jersey City, New Jersey
Army Nurse Corps 2nd Lt. Eloise M. Richardson of Marseilles, Illinois
Army Nurse Corps 2nd Lt. Thelma M. LaFave of Elmwood, Michigan
WAC PFC Rose Brohinsky of San Francisco, California
WAC Sgt. Doris Cooper of Champaign, Illinois
WAC PFC Flossie D. Flannery of Springport, Indiana
WAC PFC Frieda C.  Friend of New York, New York
WAC PFC Mary M. Gollinger of Tacoma, Washington
WAC CPL Velma E. Holden of Asheville, North Carolina
WAC PFC Odessa Lou Hollingsworth of Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
WAC PFC Alice D. King of Oswego, Oregon
WAC PFC Wilma E. Liles of Dallas, Texas
WAC PFC Evelyn L. McBride of Inglewood, California
WAC PFC Alice Pauline McKinney of Big Bay, Michigan
WAC PFC Rose F. Puchalla of Minneapolis, Minnesota
WAC PFC Mildred E. Rice of Kansas City, Kansas
WAC PFC Pearl Roomsburg of Lomita, California
WAC PFC Helen F. Rozzelle of Washington, D.C.
WAC PFC Leona M. Seyfert of Chicago, Illinois
WAC PFC Ruth E. Warlick of Goldthwaite, Texas
WAC PFC Bonnie L. Williams of Glenda Springs, Kansas

An earlier version of this note incorrectly included the names of the following individuals, all of whom have, upon further investigation, been determined to be interred in individual or common graves at US military cemeteries:

PFC Alethia M. Fair of Los Angeles, California
Sgt. Helen G. Kent of Los Angeles, California
PFC Mary M. Landau of Brooklyn, New York
Sgt. Belle G. Naimer of New York, New York
TEC3 Marion W. McMonagle of Philadelphia County, Pennsylvania
S/Sgt. Laura E. Besley of Dauphin County, Pennsylvania

Got it, but it still doesn't answer my question.

How did they die in such a way that they were missing in action? (or captured) Specifically I am most curious about WW I and WW II
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:38:06 PM EDT
[#26]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:

Got it, but it still doesn't answer my question.

How did they die in such a way that they were missing in action? (or captured) Specifically I am most curious about WW I and WW II
View Quote View All Quotes
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Question,

And I mean no disrespect, but how many women went "missing" during the war? I am assuming that they were military veterans, and usually one goes missing either from capture or you body was utterly destroyed from a shell and you just disappeared or you drown at the bottom of a body of water etc.

Were there many women in areas of combat that were vaporized or drowned and therefore disappeared?

Or would a percentage (small I know) just say "fuck it, I'm out" and just drop out? (AWOL) Again no disrespect meant, I was just wondering how many women went "missing" during a war that were due to enemy engagement of some sort that qualified them for the wall/memorial.

Let me reiterate, I mean no disrespect to the women that served and were included to the memorial, I just wondered how a woman came to the distinction during the war.

Perhaps they were on a ship that was sunk?


Names of the 21 US servicewomen still missing in action from World War II
2 March 2011 at 05:53
Among the 74000 Americans still missing from World War II are 21 American servicewomen, listed below.  It is to America's shame that the remains of these courageous women and of all the other American MIAs of World War II are still unrecovered after so many years, largely due to the grossly insufficient funds our Government allocates to our military's remains recovery program.  In honor of Women's History Month (2011), please demand from our Congressional representatives that our Government start adequately funding this program.

WASP Gertrude V. Tompkins-Silver of Jersey City, New Jersey
Army Nurse Corps 2nd Lt. Eloise M. Richardson of Marseilles, Illinois
Army Nurse Corps 2nd Lt. Thelma M. LaFave of Elmwood, Michigan
WAC PFC Rose Brohinsky of San Francisco, California
WAC Sgt. Doris Cooper of Champaign, Illinois
WAC PFC Flossie D. Flannery of Springport, Indiana
WAC PFC Frieda C.  Friend of New York, New York
WAC PFC Mary M. Gollinger of Tacoma, Washington
WAC CPL Velma E. Holden of Asheville, North Carolina
WAC PFC Odessa Lou Hollingsworth of Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
WAC PFC Alice D. King of Oswego, Oregon
WAC PFC Wilma E. Liles of Dallas, Texas
WAC PFC Evelyn L. McBride of Inglewood, California
WAC PFC Alice Pauline McKinney of Big Bay, Michigan
WAC PFC Rose F. Puchalla of Minneapolis, Minnesota
WAC PFC Mildred E. Rice of Kansas City, Kansas
WAC PFC Pearl Roomsburg of Lomita, California
WAC PFC Helen F. Rozzelle of Washington, D.C.
WAC PFC Leona M. Seyfert of Chicago, Illinois
WAC PFC Ruth E. Warlick of Goldthwaite, Texas
WAC PFC Bonnie L. Williams of Glenda Springs, Kansas

An earlier version of this note incorrectly included the names of the following individuals, all of whom have, upon further investigation, been determined to be interred in individual or common graves at US military cemeteries:

PFC Alethia M. Fair of Los Angeles, California
Sgt. Helen G. Kent of Los Angeles, California
PFC Mary M. Landau of Brooklyn, New York
Sgt. Belle G. Naimer of New York, New York
TEC3 Marion W. McMonagle of Philadelphia County, Pennsylvania
S/Sgt. Laura E. Besley of Dauphin County, Pennsylvania

Got it, but it still doesn't answer my question.

How did they die in such a way that they were missing in action? (or captured) Specifically I am most curious about WW I and WW II



Your google-fu is weak.

18 were on a C-47 that went missing in Africa

https://www.facebook.com/notes/gary-zaetz/pentagon-has-forgotten-americas-mia-women-of-world-war-ii/461751670518219
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:41:03 PM EDT
[#27]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Quoted:
Long ago, in another life, I spent a year in Montgomery, AL doing the camp follower thing while my boyfriend was at Air Command and Staff College.  On one of the routes through the city, between Maxwell AFB and Gunter AFS, there was a large municipal cemetery with a small section containing the graves of Brits killed in flight training accidents during the War.  I'd always stop and spend a few minutes reading the names.  I'd think of these young men resting so far from their homes, their loved ones lacking the solace of even a grave to visit.  And I'd cry.  

We remember yours too, Bradders.  We remember yours.
View Quote


Reminds me of the Battle of King's Mountain, in Western South Carolina.  The British commander, Patrick Ferguson, is the only one buried there.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:47:36 PM EDT
[#28]
Well done, brother Bradders.
Link Posted: 8/31/2015 11:54:09 PM EDT
[#29]
On a somewhat lighter note, I love that your bike is dirty!
Link Posted: 9/1/2015 6:46:57 AM EDT
[#30]
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Quoted:


Thanks for that, fascinating stuff
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Pvt Bennet was assigned to a colored unit, as near as I can tell. Looks like his unit was made up mostly of colored men from the same I area I am from.

Shortly after the US got involved in WWI the government had to stop accepting black volunteers, because all of the quota for colored soldiers had been filled.

There were colored combat arms units in WWI, but most colored soldiers were assigned to labor battalions and other menial roles.


Thanks for that, fascinating stuff


I was reading up on some WW1 stuff for family history for Ma Danby, she was able to get a headstone picture for her grandmothers first husband.  He was an SPC.  Which was a rank between about 1920 and during WW2 and then apparently re-instated again after that.  Didn't know that earlier version existed,

But in my research, primarily to ranks in WW1 that might be SPC, SRG, SFC, the picture of the headstone wasn't all that clear, so looking to see what might fit the three apparent letters.

I found several references to us black troops being assigned to the French Army and they were used as combat troops.  

http://www.worldwar1.com/dbc/detached.htm
Link Posted: 9/1/2015 10:03:34 AM EDT
[#31]
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