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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:16:41 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm surprised we haven't seen one yet. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:19:43 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not the narrative we're looking for. We need a tragedy to convince Americans to target Muhammedans, not gun owners. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Um, it has happened already. Several times. Now, it wasn't bloodthirsty ROP members Killing Infidel Children for Allah, but we've had several large school shootings in the US over the past two decades. Substitute Adam Lanza with someone like Dzhokar Tsarnaev and there you have it. Not the narrative we're looking for. We need a tragedy to convince Americans to target Muhammedans, not gun owners. You honestly believe that there will be such an outcome? Boston, San Bernardino, others were all commuted by Muslims, yet the left continue to target American gun owners. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:20:56 AM EDT
[#3]
It's angering that we keep being attacked, but we are lucky they are so incompetent.
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:23:10 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Um, it has happened already. Several times. Now, it wasn't bloodthirsty ROP members Killing Infidel Children for Allah, but we've had several large school shootings in the US over the past two decades. Substitute Adam Lanza with someone like Dzhokar Tsarnaev and there you have it. Ummm....That's not the same thing. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:24:09 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Thy plan drone strikes on patriotic Rand Paul supporters while offering jobs to Saracens. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Fuck the NSA, what do they ever do? Thy plan drone strikes on patriotic Rand Paul supporters while offering jobs to Saracens. That's not what this discussion is about and you know it. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:26:47 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Exactly. The Nice terrorist was shot and killed. A group of school children with no means of defense would simply be prey for Isis. Attending class, or during an outing. At least a trained and armed individual *may* have a chance at making some difference and saving innocent lives in the balance. Whatever the scenario. Thus is why "soft" targets are chosen... Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Firearms may not make a difference if an attack like what happened in Nice occurs during an outdoor school trip. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:28:59 AM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A coordinated attack on a school here in the country? Yes very possible. An utter bloodbath and clusterfuck like Beslan? Not a chance. US law enforcement and military are far better trained and equipped for such an occurrence and it would never get to the point it did with Beslan. I'd also say our schools are probably more hardened on average as well. Based on what? My kid's schools aren't hardened at all. Ring a bell and they let you through the glass doors. They don't even check you. Come in when the kids are entering school and the doors are wide open. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:39:44 AM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I would rather die on my feet than live on my knees. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Firearms may not make a difference if an attack like what happened in Nice occurs during an outdoor school trip. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:42:42 AM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Based on what? My kid's schools aren't hardened at all. Ring a bell and they let you through the glass doors. They don't even check you. Come in when the kids are entering school and the doors are wide open. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: A coordinated attack on a school here in the country? Yes very possible. An utter bloodbath and clusterfuck like Beslan? Not a chance. US law enforcement and military are far better trained and equipped for such an occurrence and it would never get to the point it did with Beslan. I'd also say our schools are probably more hardened on average as well. Based on what? My kid's schools aren't hardened at all. Ring a bell and they let you through the glass doors. They don't even check you. Come in when the kids are entering school and the doors are wide open. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:57:01 AM EDT
[#10]
Why would they need to attack when they can do it bloodlessly through infiltration of government?
Watch Phil Haney's Press Club speech on youtube. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:00:02 AM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Based on what? My kid's schools aren't hardened at all. Ring a bell and they let you through the glass doors. They don't even check you. Come in when the kids are entering school and the doors are wide open. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
A coordinated attack on a school here in the country? Yes very possible. An utter bloodbath and clusterfuck like Beslan? Not a chance. US law enforcement and military are far better trained and equipped for such an occurrence and it would never get to the point it did with Beslan. I'd also say our schools are probably more hardened on average as well. Based on what? My kid's schools aren't hardened at all. Ring a bell and they let you through the glass doors. They don't even check you. Come in when the kids are entering school and the doors are wide open. Yep. Mine too. They put up some stupid bell that the front desk receptionist will buzz you in. It's not stopping anyone. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:06:20 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why would they need to attack when they can do it bloodlessly through infiltration of government? Watch Phil Haney's Press Club speech on youtube. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:09:52 AM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm shocked it hasn't happened yet. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:13:38 AM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Um, it has happened already. Several times. Now, it wasn't bloodthirsty ROP members Killing Infidel Children for Allah, but we've had several large school shootings in the US over the past two decades. Substitute Adam Lanza with someone like Dzhokar Tsarnaev and there you have it. A group of individuals taking control of an entire school and then killing everybody? When did that happen? 
So no, it hasn't happened to that scale yet (thankfully) 
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:13:43 AM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Why? Shock and awe to demonstrate their power and reach as their Caliphite is decimated. Isis is Al Queda on steroids regarding global terrorism. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Why would they need to attack when they can do it bloodlessly through infiltration of government? Watch Phil Haney's Press Club speech on youtube. It's easier to fight a soft war through subverting our hard-as-marshmallows .gov than get people pissed off 9/11 style. They're playing the long game, any they're going to win unless people wake up and realize what's really going on right under their noses. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:41:44 AM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm surprised we haven't seen one yet. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:45:54 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Agreed. It will happen. And kids will die by the buttload, because politicians won't let SWAT go immediately in and kill the terrorists, giving them time to rape, mutilate, booby-trap, and get fortified in the structure with explosives and kill a fucking shitload of kids...just like Beslan. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Just a matter of time.  Agreed. It will happen. And kids will die by the buttload, because politicians won't let SWAT go immediately in and kill the terrorists, giving them time to rape, mutilate, booby-trap, and get fortified in the structure with explosives and kill a fucking shitload of kids...just like Beslan. Over the last couple of years LEO and EMS have updated their active shooter plans. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 12:40:02 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Agreed. It will happen. And kids will die by the buttload, because politicians won't let SWAT go immediately in and kill the terrorists, giving them time to rape, mutilate, booby-trap, and get fortified in the structure with explosives and kill a fucking shitload of kids...just like Beslan. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Just a matter of time. Agreed. It will happen. And kids will die by the buttload, because politicians won't let SWAT go immediately in and kill the terrorists, giving them time to rape, mutilate, booby-trap, and get fortified in the structure with explosives and kill a fucking shitload of kids...just like Beslan. If you send SWAT in immediately, you only get more SWAT killed. The only effective way to deal with the threat is to stop it while in it's planning phases, something the NSA and others to very well. Except they can't brag about their successes, because that would allow the bad guys to figure out how they got fucked up before. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 12:53:22 PM EDT
[#19]
Not a question of IF but WHEN.
The real question is, how will our government and society respond? The Media and various groups and government institutions will push for gun control to take advantage of the situation. Groups of private citizens will probably take the law into there own hands and start to target Mosques. Our government will pays lots of lip service, but do nothing effective. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:03:28 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not the narrative we're looking for. We need a tragedy to convince Americans to target Muhammedans, not gun owners. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Um, it has happened already. Several times. Now, it wasn't bloodthirsty ROP members Killing Infidel Children for Allah, but we've had several large school shootings in the US over the past two decades. Substitute Adam Lanza with someone like Dzhokar Tsarnaev and there you have it. Not the narrative we're looking for. We need a tragedy to convince Americans to target Muhammedans, not gun owners. Imagine how Americans would persecute those peace loving Muslims if they did something like fly aircraft into skyscrapers. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:06:27 PM EDT
[#21]
It's possible but not likely, we're just too good and Johnny Jihad won't find a receptive pond to swim in here. But it's like they say, the scumbags only have to get lucky once, we have to be lucky all the time.
By the way, the guy who wrote Days of Wrath, Wm Forstchen, is the guy who wrote the One Second After series, an excellent writer, not the usual clumsy crap that dominates the post apocalypse genre. Man, next week is the 12th anniversary of Beslan.
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:13:54 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's possible but not likely, we're just too good and Johnny Jihad won't find a receptive pond to swim in here. But it's like they say, the scumbags only have to get lucky once, we have to be lucky all the time. By the way, the guy who wrote Days of Wrath, Wm Forstchen, is the guy who wrote the One Second After series, an excellent writer, not the usual clumsy crap that dominates the post apocalypse genre. Man, next week is the 12th anniversary of Beslan. The level of organization required for 9/11 could also pull off a very sophisticated school attack. The only real difference is that the school attack would require firearms and explosives, but the human element would be similar, and that's the difficult part. The importation of Muslims by the current administration doesn't help, either. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:19:04 PM EDT
[#23]
I don't see that happening.
Another Sandy Hook, maybe. Which would suck (for the lives sake, and political standpoints). But I really don't see Beslan happening here. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:22:39 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The level of organization required for 9/11 could also pull off a very sophisticated school attack. The only real difference is that the school attack would require firearms and explosives, but the human element would be similar, and that's the difficult part. The importation of Muslims by the current administration doesn't help, either. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
It's possible but not likely, we're just too good and Johnny Jihad won't find a receptive pond to swim in here. But it's like they say, the scumbags only have to get lucky once, we have to be lucky all the time. By the way, the guy who wrote Days of Wrath, Wm Forstchen, is the guy who wrote the One Second After series, an excellent writer, not the usual clumsy crap that dominates the post apocalypse genre. Man, next week is the 12th anniversary of Beslan. The level of organization required for 9/11 could also pull off a very sophisticated school attack. The only real difference is that the school attack would require firearms and explosives, but the human element would be similar, and that's the difficult part. The importation of Muslims by the current administration doesn't help, either. Absolutely on both counts. The difference with 9/11 is we know they're out there and they really want a shot at us (they don't care what the repercussions for the muzz world would be). We work incredibly closely with intel and law enforcement agencies all over the world. Our muzz population knows they're under the gun and how badly another large scale, organized attack would be for them, both image wise and physical/real world wise. The muzz community has provided tips that have stopped many attacks from happening and helped set up stings and investigations. Our intel and law enforcement agencies have evolved tremendously. Unfortunately, so have theirs. We just have to be faster and better. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 1:29:38 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm surprised we haven't seen one yet. This |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:12:03 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm surprised we haven't seen one yet. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:19:03 PM EDT
[#27]
They don't have enough competent fighters. Beslan was done by combat hardened Chechens, sourced locally.
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Posted: 8/26/2016 2:42:49 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm surprized that it hasn't happened yet. But, I think an event like that would unify the US and we'd deport all goat fuckers. Fixed? |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:05:21 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Just a matter of time. FPNI, that it hasn't happened yet is amazing. Some of the softest of the soft targets are schools plus the emotional toll that that it would take I'm shocked it hasn't happened. J- |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:18:08 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Based on what? My kid's schools aren't hardened at all. Ring a bell and they let you through the glass doors. They don't even check you. Come in when the kids are entering school and the doors are wide open. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
A coordinated attack on a school here in the country? Yes very possible. An utter bloodbath and clusterfuck like Beslan? Not a chance. US law enforcement and military are far better trained and equipped for such an occurrence and it would never get to the point it did with Beslan. I'd also say our schools are probably more hardened on average as well. Based on what? My kid's schools aren't hardened at all. Ring a bell and they let you through the glass doors. They don't even check you. Come in when the kids are entering school and the doors are wide open. Yep 
And there is usually one police officer at schools with 1500-2500 kids. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:21:11 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Um, it has happened already. Several times. Now, it wasn't bloodthirsty ROP members Killing Infidel Children for Allah, but we've had several large school shootings in the US over the past two decades. Substitute Adam Lanza with someone like Dzhokar Tsarnaev and there you have it. This is why you want to be sending your child to a ghetto school with metal detectors, alarmed doors, professional security, and a firewall to block access. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:21:33 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I'm surprised we haven't seen one yet. I think the possibility is very low. Shooting up a club in France will piss the frenchies off something fierce, but wiping an elementary school out will make Americans get on ships and torch every living soul in any country that ever has a Muslim fart in it. These housewives that read Time and watch CNN will suddenly not give two shits about rules of engagement or collateral damage and shit will get done. You want to see shock and awe, have a group of terrorists shoot up a school and have it come out where they trained under the permissive gaze of the country's government,.... |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:24:29 PM EDT
[#33]
Why wouldn't it happen here? I suspect I'll see it in my lifetime.
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:26:02 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think the possibility is very low. Shooting up a club in France will piss the frenchies off something fierce, but wiping an elementary school out will make Americans get on ships and torch every living soul in any country that ever has a Muslim fart in it. These housewives that read Time and watch CNN will suddenly not give two shits about rules of engagement or collateral damage and shit will get done. You want to see shock and awe, have a group of terrorists shoot up a school and have it come out where they trained under the permissive gaze of the country's government,.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I'm surprised we haven't seen one yet. I think the possibility is very low. Shooting up a club in France will piss the frenchies off something fierce, but wiping an elementary school out will make Americans get on ships and torch every living soul in any country that ever has a Muslim fart in it. These housewives that read Time and watch CNN will suddenly not give two shits about rules of engagement or collateral damage and shit will get done. You want to see shock and awe, have a group of terrorists shoot up a school and have it come out where they trained under the permissive gaze of the country's government,.... We're too far gone for that. If it happened tomorrow we'd have Obama lecturing us on the benefits of Islam and half the country would be cheering him on. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:28:52 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I think the possibility is very low. Shooting up a club in France will piss the frenchies off something fierce, but wiping an elementary school out will make Americans get on ships and torch every living soul in any country that ever has a Muslim fart in it. These housewives that read Time and watch CNN will suddenly not give two shits about rules of engagement or collateral damage and shit will get done. You want to see shock and awe, have a group of terrorists shoot up a school and have it come out where they trained under the permissive gaze of the country's government,.... Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
I'm surprised we haven't seen one yet. I think the possibility is very low. Shooting up a club in France will piss the frenchies off something fierce, but wiping an elementary school out will make Americans get on ships and torch every living soul in any country that ever has a Muslim fart in it. These housewives that read Time and watch CNN will suddenly not give two shits about rules of engagement or collateral damage and shit will get done. You want to see shock and awe, have a group of terrorists shoot up a school and have it come out where they trained under the permissive gaze of the country's government,.... I really don't see anything like that happening. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:33:44 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A coordinated attack on a school here in the country? Yes very possible. An utter bloodbath and clusterfuck like Beslan? Not a chance. US law enforcement and military are far better trained and equipped for such an occurrence and it would never get to the point it did with Beslan. I'd also say our schools are probably more hardened on average as well. Russian building construction has much thicker walls and doors to make it through the winter. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:39:26 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Already a book about it, and if you have kids, it will freak you out. https://www.amazon.com/Wrath-Dies-Irae-William-Forstchen/dp/1625781547/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1472177226&sr=8-1&keywords=day+of+wrath |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:42:41 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Want to know how I know that you have not a clue about active shooter doctrine? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Just a matter of time. Agreed. It will happen. And kids will die by the buttload, because politicians won't let SWAT go immediately in and kill the terrorists, giving them time to rape, mutilate, booby-trap, and get fortified in the structure with explosives and kill a fucking shitload of kids...just like Beslan. Want to know how I know that you have not a clue about active shooter doctrine? Yep. Establishing a perimeter and waiting for swat died as a conceptional solution to active shooter response during casualty collection at Columbine. We are much further than that. Much more aggressive. Admittedly I do not believe a 2 officer hasty team or a T cell comprised of 5 mixed experience day shift patrollmen is going to be effective against a coordinated, dug in Beslan style attack. The training is light years ahead of where it was in the 90s and constantly evolving. But it is designed to mitigate a conventional lone gunman or small uncoordinated group by overwhelming them with force and cutting down on the time they have to inflict casualties. The emphasis.....to the point of ludicrously ignoring officer safety...is to engage the shooter ASAP. A two man team rushing to clear a 30 to 50 THOUSAND sq ft structure is lunacy....but they will do it. Having even one of the first responding officers possesing significant team entry/ element training would be a statistical anomaly. R R training workshops are meant to give them some hard fundamentals and a taste of stress innoculation/ RBT. They had better all be sporting St Jude if they use this doctrine in a Beslan attack. But there will be such limited info and radio saturation for the first arriving units it is unlikely that the threat would be that well defined. There are supposedly groups of JTTF response units conducting training across the US for these types of events. They are supposedly VERY EFFECTIVE against highly trained OPFOR. Supposedly To be prepped for that (LE) would require such an astronomical budget in both training and maintenance of roving specialty units that it is beyond consideration. Hell, think of the costs for a multi department 3 day rotating Rapid Response workshop being taught over Spring break in the local High School. We are doing this now and they cry about the expense. Forget the equipment and consumables.....think hours dedicated to training. OT to cover the essential shifts, etc. It adds up quick. Rocco |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:43:27 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yes. Please elaborate, sir. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Just a matter of time. Agreed. It will happen. And kids will die by the buttload, because politicians won't let SWAT go immediately in and kill the terrorists, giving them time to rape, mutilate, booby-trap, and get fortified in the structure with explosives and kill a fucking shitload of kids...just like Beslan. Want to know how I know that you have not a clue about active shooter doctrine? See above. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:46:29 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm surprised we haven't seen one yet. Yeah, it's horrifying to think about. But that doesn't mean there are folks out there that wouldn't LOVE to pull one off in America |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:54:35 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The scale of Beslan was impressive. There were several dozen attackers, small arms, explosives, and 1,100 hostages. It's hard for an attacker to maintain operational security for an attack that large in the US. On the other hand, a team of 5-10 people can probably be done, and that can do quite a bit of damage against a crowded soft target. Deaths in the hundreds is plausible. The recent attacks at Nice demonstrated how easily 2-3 terrorists with rented trucks could put the death toll into the hundreds. Target the average elementary school playground during recess with three trucks and you'd top 100 casualties easy. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:57:22 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Russian building construction has much thicker walls and doors to make it through the winter. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
A coordinated attack on a school here in the country? Yes very possible. An utter bloodbath and clusterfuck like Beslan? Not a chance. US law enforcement and military are far better trained and equipped for such an occurrence and it would never get to the point it did with Beslan. I'd also say our schools are probably more hardened on average as well. Russian building construction has much thicker walls and doors to make it through the winter. No shit... that was my first thought as well. When was the last time you were in a suburban elementary/intermediate/high school? Hardened is the absolute LAST word that comes to mind. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:57:36 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
A coordinated attack on a school here in the country? Yes very possible. An utter bloodbath and clusterfuck like Beslan? Not a chance. US law enforcement and military are far better trained and equipped for such an occurrence and it would never get to the point it did with Beslan. I'd also say our schools are probably more hardened on average as well. Schools hardened? Most schools have a chain link fence and thats about it. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:57:44 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ummm....That's not the same thing. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Um, it has happened already. Several times. Now, it wasn't bloodthirsty ROP members Killing Infidel Children for Allah, but we've had several large school shootings in the US over the past two decades. Substitute Adam Lanza with someone like Dzhokar Tsarnaev and there you have it. Ummm....That's not the same thing. The OP was wondering why terrorists hadn't attacked US schools. They have; the terrorists just haven't been of the Islamic variety and the death toll hasn't been as high. If your argument is that it's not terrorism because it wasn't committed by Muslims then you're leaving yourself wide open for an attack by someone else. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:58:20 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yep. Establishing a perimeter and waiting for swat died as a conceptional solution to active shooter response during casualty collection at Columbine. We are much further than that. Much more aggressive. Admittedly I do not believe a 2 officer hasty team or a T cell comprised of 5 mixed experience day shift patrollmen is going to be effective against a coordinated, dug in Beslan style attack. The training is light years ahead of where it was in the 90s and constantly evolving. There are supposedly groups of JTTF response units conducting training across the US for these types of events. They are supposedly VERY EFFECTIVE against highly trained OPFOR. Supposedly To be prepped for that (LE) would require such an astronomical budget in both training and maintenance of roving specialty units that it is beyond consideration. Hell, think of the costs for a multi department 3 day rotating Rapid Response workshop being taught over Spring break in the local High School. Forget the equipment and consumables.....think hours dedicated to training. OT to cover the essential shifts, etc. It adds up quick. Rocco Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Just a matter of time. Agreed. It will happen. And kids will die by the buttload, because politicians won't let SWAT go immediately in and kill the terrorists, giving them time to rape, mutilate, booby-trap, and get fortified in the structure with explosives and kill a fucking shitload of kids...just like Beslan. Want to know how I know that you have not a clue about active shooter doctrine? Yep. Establishing a perimeter and waiting for swat died as a conceptional solution to active shooter response during casualty collection at Columbine. We are much further than that. Much more aggressive. Admittedly I do not believe a 2 officer hasty team or a T cell comprised of 5 mixed experience day shift patrollmen is going to be effective against a coordinated, dug in Beslan style attack. The training is light years ahead of where it was in the 90s and constantly evolving. There are supposedly groups of JTTF response units conducting training across the US for these types of events. They are supposedly VERY EFFECTIVE against highly trained OPFOR. Supposedly To be prepped for that (LE) would require such an astronomical budget in both training and maintenance of roving specialty units that it is beyond consideration. Hell, think of the costs for a multi department 3 day rotating Rapid Response workshop being taught over Spring break in the local High School. Forget the equipment and consumables.....think hours dedicated to training. OT to cover the essential shifts, etc. It adds up quick. Rocco SWAT ain't HRT |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 10:58:50 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A group of individuals taking control of an entire school and then killing everybody? When did that happen? So no, it hasn't happened to that scale yet (thankfully) Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Um, it has happened already. Several times. Now, it wasn't bloodthirsty ROP members Killing Infidel Children for Allah, but we've had several large school shootings in the US over the past two decades. Substitute Adam Lanza with someone like Dzhokar Tsarnaev and there you have it. A group of individuals taking control of an entire school and then killing everybody? When did that happen? So no, it hasn't happened to that scale yet (thankfully) If you are talking about Beslan, then no, it hasn't happened yet. But if you are talking about terrorist attacks in our schools, then yes, there have been several. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 11:03:51 PM EDT
[#47]
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SWAT ain't HRT Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Just a matter of time. Agreed. It will happen. And kids will die by the buttload, because politicians won't let SWAT go immediately in and kill the terrorists, giving them time to rape, mutilate, booby-trap, and get fortified in the structure with explosives and kill a fucking shitload of kids...just like Beslan. Want to know how I know that you have not a clue about active shooter doctrine? Yep. Establishing a perimeter and waiting for swat died as a conceptional solution to active shooter response during casualty collection at Columbine. We are much further than that. Much more aggressive. Admittedly I do not believe a 2 officer hasty team or a T cell comprised of 5 mixed experience day shift patrollmen is going to be effective against a coordinated, dug in Beslan style attack. The training is light years ahead of where it was in the 90s and constantly evolving. There are supposedly groups of JTTF response units conducting training across the US for these types of events. They are supposedly VERY EFFECTIVE against highly trained OPFOR. Supposedly To be prepped for that (LE) would require such an astronomical budget in both training and maintenance of roving specialty units that it is beyond consideration. Hell, think of the costs for a multi department 3 day rotating Rapid Response workshop being taught over Spring break in the local High School. Forget the equipment and consumables.....think hours dedicated to training. OT to cover the essential shifts, etc. It adds up quick. Rocco SWAT ain't HRT Agreed, and neither would likely be the composition of the first responding units to an active shooter unless it happened in a major city where saturation would increase the odds. In the burbs? Not likely. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 11:06:07 PM EDT
[#48]
It's going to happen and Obama if he's still in power will apologise to the Muslims.
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Posted: 8/26/2016 11:21:33 PM EDT
[#49]
I've been saying this for years.
I think it would be difficult for them to coordinate unless they infiltrated across the border. It seems like the successful attacks have been the "lone 'wolf" types that don't make a lot of chatter or require a lot of support. Our response would be measured in minutes and hours, not days, so that is another key difference. That there would still be a staggering casualty count is practically a given. |
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Posted: 8/26/2016 11:25:21 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've been saying this for years. I think it would be difficult for them to coordinate unless they infiltrated across the border. It seems like the successful attacks have been the "lone 'wolf" types that don't make a lot of chatter or require a lot of support. Our response would be measured in minutes and hours, not days, so that is another key difference. That there would still be a staggering casualty count is practically a given. Too small and you can't take and hold territory. Too large and the NSA or others catches wind and you disappear quietly into the night because you never saw the men who came and brought hell with them. |
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