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Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:11:33 AM EDT
Logic train, all aboard!

Follow the standards!

Well what standards?

The ones pomulgated by the pentagon!

Well, the pentagon is changing the standard.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:12:26 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2014 11:14:36 AM EDT by CrazyWhiteGuy]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Squatch:


1) Everybody in the military is currently following the standards they agreed to when they signed up. *

2) The DoD is going to authorize the Departments to relax the standards, if they choose.

3) The Departments are going to relax the standards.

4) Everybody in the military will follow the new standards.

(* Except, of course, discipline cases, who will always be problems regardless of the standards)

Really, this isn't that difficult.
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Originally Posted By Squatch:
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Squatch:
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:

Standards change all the time, and don't hurt shit.


FIFY


standards changing is fine.

Double standards is not.


1) Everybody in the military is currently following the standards they agreed to when they signed up. *

2) The DoD is going to authorize the Departments to relax the standards, if they choose.

3) The Departments are going to relax the standards.

4) Everybody in the military will follow the new standards.

(* Except, of course, discipline cases, who will always be problems regardless of the standards)

Really, this isn't that difficult.


1) agree
2) bet they are
3) bet some won't/will merely continue as they have
4) except of course those exempted due to snowflake status

How much time did you spend in the army? How much time in an environment surrounded by snowflakes?

It will be as difficult as possible, and will continue to hurt those held to a standard that others are not.

I am all for changing standards with the times, or whatever. Well reconvene in 12-24 months and see how it's working out mkay?
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:14:48 AM EDT
And here I've been thinking that they're called uniforms for a reason.



Now it seems it's wear what you want, we don't want to hurt your feelings or offend you in some way.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:16:01 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:18:10 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:


Doesn't sound like a generic ass dentist to me does it.

Bet he wears a fucking navy uniform properly, doesn't he.

Age requirements change all the time, and don't hurt shit.

You're comparing tomatoes to potatoes.

Call of bullshit stands.
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Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Spade:
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Spade:

Medical people and other special folks can get waivers. That's what I was told when I was trying to get a waiver for my eyes.

There's a waiver for anything. The Navy gave, IIRC, a 70 year old guy a waiver to join up because he's a specialist doctor. And the guy who was the head of some shock trauma thing in Baltimore was still in the military in his 70's (at one point covering a street with a shotgun when his convoy stopped) having first joined during Korea because, again, he was a very good doc.

As I was told, there's a waiver for everything and anything. You just have to be important enough to get one.


Bull shit. He's a fucking dentist. He could have gotten the same job working the same bases as a civilian. But they don't pay your school loans back for you. Typical liberal shit for snowflakes in the service, I don't want to follow the rules but I want everything everyone else gets too.

I see "the commitments every other SM made are below me"

While I'm expected to fuck some joes up who are rocking a peach fuzz mouth while a mother fucker in a turban is in the next formation over laughing. And he expects those joes not to hate him for his special treatment, And I'm supposed to lead soldiers surrounded by snowflakes who get the same or better pay as them.

Standards exist for a reason.

Double standards equal none.


Okay, tell me about how bad this guy is:
http://www.2ndmlg.marines.mil/News/NewsArticleDisplay/tabid/3874/Article/58270/navy-doctor-62-serves-on-first-deployment-to-iraq-in-honor-of-two-marine-sons.aspx
http://articles.latimes.com/2007/dec/01/local/me-doctor1

He didn't need his loans paid, he had a great private practice, and as we all know, orthopedic surgeons with decades of experience who want to serve in shitty places just fall out of the trees everyday.


Doesn't sound like a generic ass dentist to me does it.

Bet he wears a fucking navy uniform properly, doesn't he.

Age requirements change all the time, and don't hurt shit.

You're comparing tomatoes to potatoes.

Call of bullshit stands.


The age requirement didn't change. He got a waiver.

Like that guy with the beard got a waiver. In other words, Mr. 61 Year Old Surgeon was held to a different (double if you like) standard.

Because they're special and are difficult for the military to get. If you didn't want beard guy in then you could've become a dentist and taken his place.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:18:15 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By Spade:
What if your religion requires sleeve tatoos?
View Quote

Then your religion will meet at 0500 every Saturday at the Post CSM's house for police call and area beautification.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:21:23 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:21:42 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By bagofcrabs65:


Join the Army, follow the Army's rules.

What is the point in have rules if we are just going to make exceptions for everything and everyone?

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Originally Posted By bagofcrabs65:
Originally Posted By Him:
We had a mess sergeant tell a Jewish kid to "take that fuckin' hat off when you are in my mess hall."

The Sgt. got an ass chewing from the Company Commander, and the kid kept his "hat" on.

This was in the late 1950s.


Join the Army, follow the Army's rules.

What is the point in have rules if we are just going to make exceptions for everything and everyone?


Didn't the US establish religious freedom before establishing a standing army?

Or maybe do like Israel does, and give the religious a draft and service deferral?

Sort of surprised to see this right now, isn't the military trying to trim ranks, not encourage people to stay?
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:26:09 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:

1) agree
2) bet they are
3) bet some won't/will merely continue as they have
4) except of course those exempted due to snowflake status

How much time did you spend in the army? How much time in an environment surrounded by snowflakes?

It will be as difficult as possible, and will continue to hurt those held to a standard that others are not.

I am all for changing standards with the times, or whatever. Well reconvene in 12-24 months and see how it's working out mkay?
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17 years and counting.

The same wailing and gnashing of teeth occurred a couple years ago with the revocation of DADT.  The military responded to that "EOT military AWKI" in the most non-spectacular fashion ever.  Namely, it continued the day after DADT exactly the same day prior, professionally and with an astounding lack of drama.

Despite the rending of clothes in this thread, the military will be just fine *even if* the Departments relax their standards.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:26:32 AM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Spade:


The age requirement didn't change. He got a waiver.

Like that guy with the beard got a waiver. In other words, Mr. 61 Year Old Surgeon was held to a different (double if you like) standard.

Because they're special and are difficult for the military to get. If you didn't want beard guy in then you could've become a dentist and taken his place.
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Originally Posted By Spade:
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Spade:
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Spade:

Medical people and other special folks can get waivers. That's what I was told when I was trying to get a waiver for my eyes.

There's a waiver for anything. The Navy gave, IIRC, a 70 year old guy a waiver to join up because he's a specialist doctor. And the guy who was the head of some shock trauma thing in Baltimore was still in the military in his 70's (at one point covering a street with a shotgun when his convoy stopped) having first joined during Korea because, again, he was a very good doc.

As I was told, there's a waiver for everything and anything. You just have to be important enough to get one.


Bull shit. He's a fucking dentist. He could have gotten the same job working the same bases as a civilian. But they don't pay your school loans back for you. Typical liberal shit for snowflakes in the service, I don't want to follow the rules but I want everything everyone else gets too.

I see "the commitments every other SM made are below me"

While I'm expected to fuck some joes up who are rocking a peach fuzz mouth while a mother fucker in a turban is in the next formation over laughing. And he expects those joes not to hate him for his special treatment, And I'm supposed to lead soldiers surrounded by snowflakes who get the same or better pay as them.

Standards exist for a reason.

Double standards equal none.


Okay, tell me about how bad this guy is:
http://www.2ndmlg.marines.mil/News/NewsArticleDisplay/tabid/3874/Article/58270/navy-doctor-62-serves-on-first-deployment-to-iraq-in-honor-of-two-marine-sons.aspx
http://articles.latimes.com/2007/dec/01/local/me-doctor1

He didn't need his loans paid, he had a great private practice, and as we all know, orthopedic surgeons with decades of experience who want to serve in shitty places just fall out of the trees everyday.


Doesn't sound like a generic ass dentist to me does it.

Bet he wears a fucking navy uniform properly, doesn't he.

Age requirements change all the time, and don't hurt shit.

You're comparing tomatoes to potatoes.

Call of bullshit stands.


The age requirement didn't change. He got a waiver.

Like that guy with the beard got a waiver. In other words, Mr. 61 Year Old Surgeon was held to a different (double if you like) standard.

Because they're special and are difficult for the military to get. If you didn't want beard guy in then you could've become a dentist and taken his place.


Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:31:38 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2014 11:32:43 AM EDT by CrazyWhiteGuy]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By Squatch:


17 years and counting.

The same wailing and gnashing of teeth occurred a couple years ago with the revocation of DADT.  The military responded to that "EOT military AWKI" in the most non-spectacular fashion ever.  Namely, it continued the day after DADT exactly the same day prior, professionally and with an astounding lack of drama.

Despite the rending of clothes in this thread, the military will be just fine *even if* the Departments relax their standards.
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Originally Posted By Squatch:
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:

1) agree
2) bet they are
3) bet some won't/will merely continue as they have
4) except of course those exempted due to snowflake status

How much time did you spend in the army? How much time in an environment surrounded by snowflakes?

It will be as difficult as possible, and will continue to hurt those held to a standard that others are not.

I am all for changing standards with the times, or whatever. Well reconvene in 12-24 months and see how it's working out mkay?


17 years and counting.

The same wailing and gnashing of teeth occurred a couple years ago with the revocation of DADT.  The military responded to that "EOT military AWKI" in the most non-spectacular fashion ever.  Namely, it continued the day after DADT exactly the same day prior, professionally and with an astounding lack of drama.

Despite the rending of clothes in this thread, the military will be just fine *even if* the Departments relax their standards.


09L guard unit?

No one in the actual service gave a shit about DADT being repealed, dumb law, dumb implementation and dumb selective use. Religious wieners and homophobes made a big deal out of it, some in some out.

Fucking PC waivers are a nightmare for low level leadership. A dentist (or a nurse) is not special, or in such critical shortage that he is worth the army losing the confidence of soldiers who joined under, and held to standards.

If the army says "beards" then great.

But they won't.

And the snow flakes will continue to pile up.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:38:29 AM EDT
Military policies will go the way of the NYPD where almost anything goes.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:53:34 AM EDT

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Originally Posted By Skg_Mre_Lght:



Why in the fuck would we need a larger pool of candidates when we are shrinking the aize of our ranks?





 
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to insure the pool contains the best possible people for the job.

Link Posted: 1/22/2014 11:55:51 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:05:36 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2014 12:06:22 PM EDT by joemama74]
I went though this.

You get issued a uniform.

Get a group ass chewing everyday because someone didn't do something and committed a safety violation because of how they wore their uniform.

Ok, it's a uniform, everyone the same, I fucking understand.

This goes on for years. You have to wear this, no exceptions. You have to wear it this way, no exceptions.

OK.

Then all of sudden, "special uniforms" start showing up that aren't available in the supply chain where we are required to obtain our uniforms.

We get told these new uniforms don't violate any safety protocols, even though they obviously do.

Just one more thing that made it easy to get the fuck out of there.

If it's a uniform, it's a uniform. If it's whatever the fuck we want, then I want whatever the fuck I want.


Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:11:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By mousehunter:
to insure the pool contains the best possible people for the job.
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Originally Posted By mousehunter:
Originally Posted By Skg_Mre_Lght:

Why in the fuck would we need a larger pool of candidates when we are shrinking the aize of our ranks?

 
to insure the pool contains the best possible people for the job.

With 300 million plus people the pool is pretty large already
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:12:32 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By The-Bald-Monk:
SMA Chandler's head will explode...

http://media.al.com/huntsville-times/photo/2012/01/-3ec328cf14e25857.JPG


Monk

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No. He will be 100% behind it because his masters tell him to be.

Still with rage on you for tats and rolled up sleeves in the field, though.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:19:35 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:


Bull shit. He's a fucking dentist. He could have gotten the same job working the same bases as a civilian. But they don't pay your school loans back for you. Typical liberal shit for snowflakes in the service, I don't want to follow the rules but I want everything everyone else gets too.

I see "the commitments every other SM made are below me"

While I'm expected to fuck some joes up who are rocking a peach fuzz mouth while a mother fucker in a turban is in the next formation over laughing. And he expects those joes not to hate him for his special treatment, And I'm supposed to lead soldiers surrounded by snowflakes who get the same or better pay as them.

Standards exist for a reason.

Double standards equal none.
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Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Spade:

Medical people and other special folks can get waivers. That's what I was told when I was trying to get a waiver for my eyes.

There's a waiver for anything. The Navy gave, IIRC, a 70 year old guy a waiver to join up because he's a specialist doctor. And the guy who was the head of some shock trauma thing in Baltimore was still in the military in his 70's (at one point covering a street with a shotgun when his convoy stopped) having first joined during Korea because, again, he was a very good doc.

As I was told, there's a waiver for everything and anything. You just have to be important enough to get one.


Bull shit. He's a fucking dentist. He could have gotten the same job working the same bases as a civilian. But they don't pay your school loans back for you. Typical liberal shit for snowflakes in the service, I don't want to follow the rules but I want everything everyone else gets too.

I see "the commitments every other SM made are below me"

While I'm expected to fuck some joes up who are rocking a peach fuzz mouth while a mother fucker in a turban is in the next formation over laughing. And he expects those joes not to hate him for his special treatment, And I'm supposed to lead soldiers surrounded by snowflakes who get the same or better pay as them.

Standards exist for a reason.

Double standards equal none.

Tell us how you really feel.

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:25:03 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By Birddog1911:



My mistake; slick sleeve in AF is no-rank.
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And all this time I thought 'slick sleeve' in the Air Force meant having a scratch handicap.



 
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:29:27 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:

Because double standards equal none.

Whatever, I'm out - your army now Mr Taxpayer.
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Me too.  Why should everybody follow the same rules?  Let some Native American kid wear an eagle feather war bonnet for promotion ceremonies, same difference.

I think this is done to purposefully destroy any cohesion; the oppressors cannot help but be themselves when faced with multiculturism.  Obviously they are against this becasue of pick-your-ism; racism, sexism, anti Islamism, etcl.

Forces the need for komissars to be imposed from the outside, who get to dig in and keep order, comrades.  If it sounds like crazy talk to you, follow the money.  

How large is the pentagon revenue stream?  Largely an insulated bureaucracy that while under civilian control, largely administers itself.  If you're a pol in office and give them a ration of shit, they'll just wait you out. Would be nice to the levers in place to have "political" control over that.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:44:28 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By SS109:



Sort of surprised to see this right now, isn't the military trying to trim ranks, not to encourage the right people to stay?
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More specificer.



 
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:47:56 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By AKengineer:
-
Sikhs have been all about fucking up Islamist shit for centuries. Their religion even requires them to concealed carry to protect the innocent, they just have not moved the mandate up to firearms yet.
 
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Originally Posted By AKengineer:
-
Sikhs have been all about fucking up Islamist shit for centuries. Their religion even requires them to concealed carry to protect the innocent, they just have not moved the mandate up to firearms yet.
 



http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/mar/28/sikh-man-cites-religion-lawsuit-against-gun-contro/

A Sikh man is suing the state of California over its gun laws, arguing they violate his First Amendment rights to practice his religion by barring him from carrying the kind of weapons he says he needs for self-defense.

Gursant Singh Khalsa, a practicing Sikh for 35 years, charges in the lawsuit filed this month that California’s laws banning military-style, semiautomatic weapons and high-capacity magazines violate mainstream Sikh doctinre requiring Sikhs “be at all time fully prepared to defend themselves and others against injustice.”

“We’re required to wear what’s called a kirpan” or dagger, he said Thursday. “I feel, as far as my religion goes, it dictates that we should have all weapons of all kinds to defend ourselves. By not being able to carry an assault rifle or weapon that has a high-capacity magazine, I don’t feel that I can defend myself or my family.”
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:49:57 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Sirveaux:
Originally Posted By AKengineer:
-
Sikhs have been all about fucking up Islamist shit for centuries. Their religion even requires them to concealed carry to protect the innocent, they just have not moved the mandate up to firearms yet.
 



http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/mar/28/sikh-man-cites-religion-lawsuit-against-gun-contro/

A Sikh man is suing the state of California over its gun laws, arguing they violate his First Amendment rights to practice his religion by barring him from carrying the kind of weapons he says he needs for self-defense.

Gursant Singh Khalsa, a practicing Sikh for 35 years, charges in the lawsuit filed this month that California’s laws banning military-style, semiautomatic weapons and high-capacity magazines violate mainstream Sikh doctinre requiring Sikhs “be at all time fully prepared to defend themselves and others against injustice.”

“We’re required to wear what’s called a kirpan” or dagger, he said Thursday. “I feel, as far as my religion goes, it dictates that we should have all weapons of all kinds to defend ourselves. By not being able to carry an assault rifle or weapon that has a high-capacity magazine, I don’t feel that I can defend myself or my family.”



Getcha some Gursant Singh Khalsa.  Good on you.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:55:04 PM EDT
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There was a thread on this guy a couple weeks ago.

Some members here know him.


Is it a net benefit to relax regulations with the specific intent to bring in Sikhs?

Or is it a net loss and simply leftist social engineering and that's it - like women in combat arms/infantry units?


I tend to fall on the side of uniformity exists for a reason and if it ain't broke, don't fix it... but Marine Raiders were sporting beards and wearing whatever did the job.  If allowing a religious exception for Sikhs is going to be a net gain... well... there's something worth discussing here.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:55:07 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2014 12:56:01 PM EDT by Desert_AIP]
I am a Pagan

Link Posted: 1/22/2014 12:57:10 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By primuspilum:



Getcha some Gursant Singh Khalsa.  Good on you.
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Originally Posted By primuspilum:
Originally Posted By Sirveaux:
Originally Posted By AKengineer:
-
Sikhs have been all about fucking up Islamist shit for centuries. Their religion even requires them to concealed carry to protect the innocent, they just have not moved the mandate up to firearms yet.
 



http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/mar/28/sikh-man-cites-religion-lawsuit-against-gun-contro/

A Sikh man is suing the state of California over its gun laws, arguing they violate his First Amendment rights to practice his religion by barring him from carrying the kind of weapons he says he needs for self-defense.

Gursant Singh Khalsa, a practicing Sikh for 35 years, charges in the lawsuit filed this month that California’s laws banning military-style, semiautomatic weapons and high-capacity magazines violate mainstream Sikh doctinre requiring Sikhs “be at all time fully prepared to defend themselves and others against injustice.”

“We’re required to wear what’s called a kirpan” or dagger, he said Thursday. “I feel, as far as my religion goes, it dictates that we should have all weapons of all kinds to defend ourselves. By not being able to carry an assault rifle or weapon that has a high-capacity magazine, I don’t feel that I can defend myself or my family.”



Getcha some Gursant Singh Khalsa.  Good on you.


First white Sikh I've seen!

Link Posted: 1/22/2014 1:06:35 PM EDT
muslim outreach
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 1:09:47 PM EDT
Are they gonna let Wiccans go sky clad?
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 1:13:34 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By yagermeister:
muslim outreach
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I was going to post something about max effective range but decided not to.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 1:27:09 PM EDT
Indians already use peyote.

I'm a certified Rastafarian!
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 1:54:10 PM EDT
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By edb66:
Are they gonna let Wiccans go sky clad?
View Quote

Only if they're non whites, and bring something extraordinary to the service it can't get anywhere else. Like HVAC skills.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 1:59:16 PM EDT
Uniformity is important and yes the details like the grooming standard do matter.  

This is total bullshit. Especially considering the fact that the military is downsizing. The US Army is going from 550,000 to 450,000 soldiers. Where is this need to relax anything when you can be even more selective in who enlists or receives a commission?  

I don't get the whole women in combat, gays, and now this crap when it's not being done to increase the number of eligible recruits to draw on to fight a war.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 2:03:37 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By SilentType:
Uniformity is important and yes the details like the grooming standard do matter.  

This is total bullshit. Especially considering the fact that the military is downsizing. The US Army is going from 550,000 to 450,000 soldiers. Where is this need to relax anything when you can be even more selective in who enlists or receives a commission?  

I don't get the whole women in combat, gays, and now this crap when it's not being done to increase the number of eligible recruits to draw on to fight a war.
View Quote



The left hates the military.

The only way to destroy it is from within, and that requires a cultural change.

Once complete. it will be acceptable to demonize former military members and vets as throwbacks and treat them as poorly as they were in the 70s.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 2:08:10 PM EDT
In 1976, the U.S. Army authorised Turbans, and Beards, for Sikhs. It was in Army Times, or whatever the
Magazine was called. The guys in my platoon thought it was cool. But we didn't have a Sikh in our whole Brigade.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 2:12:13 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2014 2:12:38 PM EDT by USMCTanker]
I believe there was a court case that decided that DoD could restrict non-standard items of wear such as turbans (specifically).  I remember hearing it on the radio in my parents car one morning during that period of time.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 2:36:07 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Andrew:
In 1976, the U.S. Army authorised Turbans, and Beards, for Sikhs. It was in Army Times, or whatever the
Magazine was called. The guys in my platoon thought it was cool. But we didn't have a Sikh in our whole Brigade.
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That would be national inquirer: us army edition
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 2:56:27 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:


That would be national inquirer: us army edition
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Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Andrew:
In 1976, the U.S. Army authorised Turbans, and Beards, for Sikhs. It was in Army Times, or whatever the
Magazine was called. The guys in my platoon thought it was cool. But we didn't have a Sikh in our whole Brigade.


That would be national inquirer: us army edition


No, that was official policy. I'm on a kindle and don't know how to copy and paste. Look it up.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 3:00:23 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Desert_AIP:



The left hates the military.

The only way to destroy it is from within, and that requires a cultural change.

Once complete. it will be acceptable to demonize former military members and vets as throwbacks and treat them as poorly as they were in the 70s.
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Originally Posted By Desert_AIP:
Originally Posted By SilentType:
Uniformity is important and yes the details like the grooming standard do matter.  

This is total bullshit. Especially considering the fact that the military is downsizing. The US Army is going from 550,000 to 450,000 soldiers. Where is this need to relax anything when you can be even more selective in who enlists or receives a commission?  

I don't get the whole women in combat, gays, and now this crap when it's not being done to increase the number of eligible recruits to draw on to fight a war.



The left hates the military.

The only way to destroy it is from within, and that requires a cultural change.

Once complete. it will be acceptable to demonize former military members and vets as throwbacks and treat them as poorly as they were in the 70s.


We are now "discovering" that all EM's in the Army are rapists.  Just like all incoming male college freshmen.

Hmmm.  I wonder if there's a repeat of a successful institutional erosion template at work here?
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 3:09:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Andrew:


No, that was official policy. I'm on a kindle and don't know how to copy and paste. Look it up.
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Originally Posted By Andrew:
Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Andrew:
In 1976, the U.S. Army authorised Turbans, and Beards, for Sikhs. It was in Army Times, or whatever the
Magazine was called. The guys in my platoon thought it was cool. But we didn't have a Sikh in our whole Brigade.


That would be national inquirer: us army edition


No, that was official policy. I'm on a kindle and don't know how to copy and paste. Look it up.


I don't need to. There have been two alracts in my time in the service pertaining to religious shit, including beards, yarmulkas and turbans. The Army has granted like 4 or 5 seiks waivers to service, usually citing something like language skills despite the fact that they don't sign up as a translator or end up in SF and end up doing medical bullishit, as the aforementioned dentist and nurses.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 3:41:40 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2014 3:47:38 PM EDT by bagofcrabs65]
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Originally Posted By SS109:

Didn't the US establish religious freedom before establishing a standing army?

Or maybe do like Israel does, and give the religious a draft and service deferral?

Sort of surprised to see this right now, isn't the military trying to trim ranks, not encourage people to stay?
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Originally Posted By SS109:
Originally Posted By bagofcrabs65:
Originally Posted By Him:
We had a mess sergeant tell a Jewish kid to "take that fuckin' hat off when you are in my mess hall."

The Sgt. got an ass chewing from the Company Commander, and the kid kept his "hat" on.

This was in the late 1950s.


Join the Army, follow the Army's rules.

What is the point in have rules if we are just going to make exceptions for everything and everyone?


Didn't the US establish religious freedom before establishing a standing army?

Or maybe do like Israel does, and give the religious a draft and service deferral?

Sort of surprised to see this right now, isn't the military trying to trim ranks, not encourage people to stay?


Signing the dotted line gives up part of your "freedom of religion".  The army isn't going to stop you from practicing your religion, but we aren't going to give you special exceptions to the rules/regulations because of it.

Well, we weren't....now we will.

Again, someone explain to me how this makes our military stronger?  Is it about making our military stronger?  Or is it about making the Military more PC?
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 3:45:36 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Him:
We had a mess sergeant tell a Jewish kid to "take that fuckin' hat off when you are in my mess hall."

The Sgt. got an ass chewing from the Company Commander, and the kid kept his "hat" on.

This was in the late 1950s.
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Good for your company commander. We never seem to have enough Jewish people in the peace time ranks. Every Jewish officer I served under or with seemed pretty good, regardless of whether they were SF, IN, JAG, of Medical Corps.  Why does it seem to me that it takes a draft to get them proportionally represented in the ranks?
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 3:46:56 PM EDT
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Is that an 807th Medical Brigade patch in the background?
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 3:51:11 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:


Of course he's a fucking slick sleeve.
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Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Fourays2:


what could possibly go wrong?


Of course he's a fucking slick sleeve.


Got news for you.  You can make captain so fast nowadays that there are captains who a) joined after we pulled out of Iraq, and b) have not had a chance to serve in our dwindling force in Afghanistan.  In the 90s, I knew colonels who joined ROTC in 1968, fully expecting to go to Vietnam, only to be told in 1972, that -despite their scholarship status- they were a) not going to Nam, and b) were not going on active duty.

If that is an 807th Medical Brigade patch in the background, then it is a bunch of USAR medical reservists.  For all you know, the Sikh captain is a nurse/physician/pharmacist/etc who got directly commissioned.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 3:57:15 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By JTF-B:


Good for your company commander. We never seem to have enough Jewish people in the peace time ranks. Every Jewish officer I served under or with seemed pretty good, regardless of whether they were SF, IN, JAG, of Medical Corps.  Why does it seem to me that it takes a draft to get them proportionally represented in the ranks?
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Originally Posted By JTF-B:
Originally Posted By Him:
We had a mess sergeant tell a Jewish kid to "take that fuckin' hat off when you are in my mess hall."

The Sgt. got an ass chewing from the Company Commander, and the kid kept his "hat" on.

This was in the late 1950s.


Good for your company commander. We never seem to have enough Jewish people in the peace time ranks. Every Jewish officer I served under or with seemed pretty good, regardless of whether they were SF, IN, JAG, of Medical Corps.  Why does it seem to me that it takes a draft to get them proportionally represented in the ranks?

Jews are 2% of the population and 1% of the military. Why? Liberal politics and regional population clusters. Plus multi generational soldiers becoming the norm

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Link Posted: 1/22/2014 3:58:13 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Dino:
I have no problem with allowing Sikh's to wear their hair long, have a beard, and wear a turban/kirpan.   The regs against beards are bullshit anyway.

People wear gas  masks with beards before the regs changed and those who were in before 1986 were grandfathered.  We had a Chief with a full beard on my sub, he had zero problems with our air equipment.

If the uniformity of appearance is that important, then recruit them to special units as other countries have done.  
 

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In the 1970s, the Army recruited several hundred Sikhs and they had exception letters in their personnel jackets allowing them to wear their turbans, beards, and long hair.  Many gravitated towards Special Forces and Military Intelligence, and many became warrant officers. Had one of them as one of my instructors at the MI transition course at For Huachuca in '94.  Good soldiers.  They come from a warrior caste in India, must be armed with a ceremonial dagger at all times, and will fight Muslims to the death.

I'd like to deploy with a unit that includes Sikhs and Salvadorans. In Iraq, when the Salvadorans got ambushed, they always turned the tables on the insurgents.  One Salvadoran killed 13 insurgents ....with his bayonet.  when asked and medal ceremony why he killed them...with his bayonet....he said something that translated to "I didn't want to waste the bullets."
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 4:00:12 PM EDT
WTF , soory I'm and old guy , is this the military or a day school?
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 4:28:16 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Desert_AIP:



The left hates the military.

The only way to destroy it is from within, and that requires a cultural change.

Once complete. it will be acceptable to demonize former military members and vets as throwbacks and treat them as poorly as they were in the 70s.
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Originally Posted By Desert_AIP:
Originally Posted By SilentType:
Uniformity is important and yes the details like the grooming standard do matter.  

This is total bullshit. Especially considering the fact that the military is downsizing. The US Army is going from 550,000 to 450,000 soldiers. Where is this need to relax anything when you can be even more selective in who enlists or receives a commission?  

I don't get the whole women in combat, gays, and now this crap when it's not being done to increase the number of eligible recruits to draw on to fight a war.



The left hates the military.

The only way to destroy it is from within, and that requires a cultural change.

Once complete. it will be acceptable to demonize former military members and vets as throwbacks and treat them as poorly as they were in the 70s.



As an ole retired military fart, you, SIR, have my endorsement !!
Here lately, though, I don't think anyone gives a shit...............................  


Link Posted: 1/22/2014 5:06:10 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:


Of course he's a fucking slick sleeve.
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Originally Posted By CrazyWhiteGuy:
Originally Posted By Fourays2:


what could possibly go wrong?


Of course he's a fucking slick sleeve.


He was in training.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 5:10:29 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By USMCTanker:
We have an All Volunteer Force.  Don't like the grooming standards?  Then stay the fuck out-nobody's forcing you to serve.



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This.  So many special snowflakes nowadays.
Link Posted: 1/22/2014 5:15:25 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By USMCTanker:
We have an All Volunteer Force.  Don't like the grooming standards?  Then stay the fuck out-nobody's forcing you to serve.



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Well said, sir.
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