fucking tow companies
Im sure there are some good ones  but the only  time i was towed
ok I missed a sign my fault ill take it ( $85 tow charge )
However after finally getting a ride to the yard
1 it was towed at about 11:30 by the time i get there it was 12:15  surprise its a new day so a day of storage at  $25
2 they put ti at the very very very back of a huge junkyard  about 1/2 mile back
3 No vehicles allowed in the lot  just you and you have to walk ( they were giggling hard)
4 it is pitch ass black as i walk to try and find my truck
5 it is behind and in a corner behind a huge pile of shit so i have to search for it
6 it is in the bigest damn  mudhole you ever see
7 i have to use 4wd to get out of there
8 I get to the office and they pissed as "I tore up" there big ass mud hole and i should have called them  so they could tow me out for  $25
9 then said they were going to call the cops and saw i tore up the place
At this point my buddy handed them his bussiness card (Hes a lawyer ) and said  they are more than welcome to contact his office with the matter

I then left at a negotiated down $100

I should have fell down out there and sued um  fuckers


My one and only experience

I bet instead of the tow truck driver getting arrested for murder, they will charge the victim's friends with muder for being accomplices to a crime in which someone was killed.

There is way too little information to make an educated estimate based on a real knowledge of Florida law and the circumstances.

In other words the BS is pretty deep on some of these posts.

In many states (for the reading impaired I repeat MANY which is defined as NOT ALL), a lien is established as soon as the car gets hooked up.  You owe the tow charge even if the car hasn't moved.  Maybe a knowledgeable Floridian can elucidate for us.

I would also expect that the driver and passengers weren't as quiet and polite as Nuns in their discussions with the tow driver.  We have little to no information as to what was happening at the lot.  Somehow I doubt the tow driver was standing there like a valet and opened the door for the guys who tipped him handsomely.

Did the circumstances add up to a situation where there was sufficient fear and/or legal to use deadly force?  we don't know.  I kind of doubt it, but there may have been.

I expect in TX this would have been a good shoot.  Going on to their property at night and stealing a car from the lot?  I think at least some of the Texans here would call it a good shoot (especially depending on the lien status of the car)

Shot the guy over a civil dispute.

Quoted: Quoted: Wait!  there got to be more to the story... There might be....but for some reason I get the feeling this guy got pissed off because some drunk got into his own car with the intention of driving off.....tow truck driver got pissed about getting stiffed for tow fees and put himself in front of the car and created the situation.  I bet he tries to use the defense that he thought he was going to get run over.

Yep, thats called creating your own exengency(sp) and it doesnt work when the cops do it either. You cant steal your own car so this is was a weak "theft of services" at best, but really a civil dispute.

Quoted: Quoted: ...., was not arrested at the scene....

In most states if you arrest the suspect you only have 48-76 hours to file formal charges. Since the victim isnt getting anymore dead, and the suspect is known, they may just be getting all their ducks in a row first.

Or worse, the tow company might have some local LE connections...

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Wait!  there got to be more to the story... There might be....but for some reason I get the feeling this guy got pissed off because some drunk got into his own car with the intention of driving off.....tow truck driver got pissed about getting stiffed for tow fees and put himself in front of the car and created the situation.  I bet he tries to use the defense that he thought he was going to get run over.   Yep, thats called creating your own exengency(sp) and it doesnt work when the cops do it either. You cant steal your own car so this is was a weak "theft of services" at best, but really a civil dispute.

I could be wrong but i beleive in Ca. if you have a disputed bill with a mechanic he cannot hold your vehicle if you refuse to pay. Not to say you won't pay sooner or later for his services.





Roy

In Indiana, If we tow your car for illegal parking or impounded by a police agency, the vehicle is under our posession(sp). We have had people arrested for trying to steal their own car.

Quoted: In Indiana, If we tow your car for illegal parking or impounded by a police agency, the vehicle is under our posession(sp). We have had people arrested for trying to steal their own car.

I kept on thinking about this and have to ask:

How is someone "stealing" their own property?  It may be semantics but, to me, its the same confusion as using the phrase 'guns kill people'.



edit: clarififification

To be honest, I have no clue why it is, the way it is. But I can tell you that I have seen it at least 30 to 40 times. Almost all these episodes the car owner did get physical with drivers/dispatchers. Once, the car owner drove through our sliding gate with a brand new Mercedes. He went to jail and had to pay for the tow and the fence. Just remember this everybody, THE POLICE USUALLY WILL TAKE THE SIDE OF THE TOW TRUCK OPERATOR. And be nice, I do not do "tow-offs" anymore. I haul epuipment (still the same company). Most tow truck operators hate doing these runs, however this is the nature of the buisiness.

UPDATE IN ORGINAL POST.


Good call on the S.O. part.  Seems like this is nothing more than an execution.

ID10T

If the holes aren't in the front of the car, my guess is that tow truck diver's ass is grass.

Anyhow, what's with all the tow truck driver hatin'?  I've had them help me out of a jam several times.  Once, in the middle of nowhere on a Sunday afternoon, my buddy's car crapped out.  A tow driver found a place that was open where we could buy the part we needed, and then put it in for free.  Any group of people has nice guys and assholes in it.

Quoted: You can't put a lein on a car unless you have the title and it is sent in to have the state place the lein in your name.  So this guy does not have a lein on the car. The guy shot may have been tresspassing and may have been trying to run over the tow truck driver then for it would be self defense.  How would you like to go to jail for self defense.  or he could have just been pissed and wasted the guy, I guess we will see in court.

Ever hear of a mechanics lein? You don't need anything to file that type of lein. You may be thinking of the type of lein that a financial institution may have until a loan is satisfied. That isn't th only type of lein.

The guy may well have started the paperwork for a mechanics' lein. Still doesn't give him the right to kill a guy for retrieving his car.

If the car owner was trying to run down the tow truck driver....how is it that the fatal shot went through the passenger side window? Seems to me if he got out of the way enough to shoot through the side window, then the danger had passed.

Quoted: Quoted: The guy shot may have been tresspassing and may have been trying to run over the tow truck driver then for it would be self defense. Why do people keep saying that? Am I the only one who read the article? Montanez, 44, pulled a .40-caliber pistol and fired into the car from the passenger side, striking Rich in the chest, Callaway said. He died later at a hospital.

Nope, I read that also.  Police Officer or Joe Citizen, firing through the passenger window means he was not in front of the car, therefore was not in imminent danger of death or serious bodily injury.  Bad shoot; go to jail, go directly to jail.  Do not pass Go.

Thats pretty fucked up.

Passenger side....

FatCobra caught it also.

Kind of hard to claim self defense if you fire into the PASSENGER SIDE of the car and hit the guy in the side of the chest.  

AFARR

Yea, I had to deal with a tow company here in FL.  Boy, that was an experience that I hope I will never have to repeat.  

I was moving into my house.  It's on kind of a busy street, and I had a 26' ryder truck with a double wheel car trailer (the kind that you drive the whole car onto) attached to the back.  Well, there's not enough space in front of the house to park the truck with the trailer, so I find the nearest parking lot (it's a parking lot of a k-mart that was closed, and was huge, so I figure..I put lock on trailer ball connection, leave car on trailer, and when I'm done unloading the truck, I'll go unload the car, and re-attach the trailer and return the truck and trailer together.  Well, some asswhipe felt that a ryder trailer with a car on it poses some threat to a parking lot of a closed store, because maybe tommorow, someone won't be able to park their car in that HUGE lot.  They tow the trailer (and cut my effing lock).  So, I go try to pick it up.  I pay them, cash, something like $150 to get my trailer back.  I should have just left it and told the ryder people what happened and gave them the truck back, sans trailer.  I ask them where it is, they say, just around that corner.  Well, during august here in FL, it rains a LOT.  Well, I go look, and they put it behind a HUGE mud puddle.  I sure as hell am not going to go explore the puddle before backing a 26' ryder truck around a corner, and then hooking it up while the truck sinks into a pit of sandy mud (common to FL).  I go back and tell them that they are going to pull my trailer out.  They laugh at me, and tell me they wont.  I resond to the bitchy ass woman that is sitting behind the desk, that they can't possiably expect me to back a big ass truck, which I can't see behind for shit, around a corner in a tightly packed with cars, tow lot, through a huge ass lake of a puddle, and get stuck.  I then "highly suggest" that she get someone to pull it out.  She says "you don't suggest anything to me."  At that point, I told her to get the owner of the establishment.  She says "he's out getting his hair done."  I told her to get him on the line, she told me to leave the property, I was no longer welcome.  Well...at that point I'm hugely pissed off.  I leave, because no sense in making myself cupable in the eyes of the law, which I was about to get on the phone.  They can't NOT bring me my trailer, which I have a reciept for, and kick me off the property....that's theft.  They told me to let my wife back the truck (LOL....she won't drive my F-150 because it's too big.....and she wasn't on the lease agreement for the Ryder, only me).  After the owner heard that, and the fact that I was just about to get the S.O. on the phone, he brought me my trailer.

Asshats...........honestly.......give me an effing break.  Next time I ever get anything towed, I'm bringing a LEO friend of mine to smooth things over.

Quoted: Yea, I had to deal with a tow company here in FL.  Boy, that was an experience that I hope I will never have to repeat.   I was moving into my house.  It's on kind of a busy street, and I had a 26' ryder truck with a double wheel car trailer (the kind that you drive the whole car onto) attached to the back.   .  .  .   . Asshats...........honestly.......give me an effing break.  Next time I ever get anything towed, I'm bringing a LEO friend of mine to smooth things over.

BTDT.  

Donald Montanez, you will soon know what it's like to feel helpless.

Quoted: Too bad the idiot is adding to the anti's stats with that idiot move.

You know there was probably someone who was going to report the guys previous episodes where he acted out of line and have the CCW issuing agency look at him but then everyone told that person to STFU and mind their own business so he did.  After all if this guy was really unstable the system would have taken care of him before he actually hurt someone right?    

If there is one thing I learned on this site today it is that everyone should be allowed carry even if they exhibit behaviors which question their mental stability.  Also, anyone who dares questions everyone carrying immediately becomes an asshole who is trying to deny everyone their 2nd amendment rights without due process.

Quoted: Quoted: FL's 10-20-Life law is as follows.  Use a gun in the commiting of a crime, automatic 10 years.  Fire the gun get 20 automatically.  If someone dies as a result of you pulling the trigger, automatic life.  No questions asked. This POS tow truck driver needs life.  Regardless if he was going to get stiffed for the tow (legal to or not) it is NOT his property to defend with lethal force.  If the owner of the car started a fight and brandished a weapon, that is a different story. That's a terrible law.  However, this case may be the exception.  I could live with life for the tow truck driver in this case.

What do you mean? I think it sounds like a good law. For this law to have any effect on your life, you have to be first commiting a crime and second do it with a firearm. This law wouldn't bother me in the least, as I don't commit crimes.

Quoted: In Indiana, If we tow your car for illegal parking or impounded by a police agency, the vehicle is under our posession(sp). We have had people arrested for trying to steal their own car.

Yes, arrested, not shot!

What I don't get is why don't cooler heads prevail? Why make a mountian out of a mole hill? You have all the info on the car, or at least you should as you just towed it. So if some asshole wants to steal it back let him. Call the cops and have him arrested. It's 5:30am, hell the owner is still probably drunk, so it just adds to the charges against him.  

Quoted: You can't put a lein on a car unless you have the title and it is sent in to have the state place the lein in your name.  So this guy does not have a lein on the car. The guy shot may have been tresspassing and may have been trying to run over the tow truck driver then for it would be self defense.  How would you like to go to jail for self defense.  or he could have just been pissed and wasted the guy, I guess we will see in court.

That may be the law where you are, but in many states, once a tow truck has hooked up on a legal tow they have a lien.

Quoted: Probably would be legal in Texas

Nope, not here either.  I wonder at the average BAC of all the participants. (including the Tow truck guy)

Quoted: Yea, I had to deal with a tow company here in FL.  Boy, that was an experience that I hope I will never have to repeat.   I was moving into my house.  It's on kind of a busy street, and I had a 26' ryder truck with a double wheel car trailer (the kind that you drive the whole car onto) attached to the back.  Well, there's not enough space in front of the house to park the truck with the trailer, so I find the nearest parking lot (it's a parking lot of a k-mart that was closed, and was huge, so I figure..I put lock on trailer ball connection, leave car on trailer, and when I'm done unloading the truck, I'll go unload the car, and re-attach the trailer and return the truck and trailer together.  Well, some asswhipe felt that a ryder trailer with a car on it poses some threat to a parking lot of a closed store, because maybe tommorow, someone won't be able to park their car in that HUGE lot.  They tow the trailer (and cut my effing lock).  So, I go try to pick it up.  I pay them, cash, something like $150 to get my trailer back.  I should have just left it and told the ryder people what happened and gave them the truck back, sans trailer.  I ask them where it is, they say, just around that corner.  Well, during august here in FL, it rains a LOT.  Well, I go look, and they put it behind a HUGE mud puddle.  I sure as hell am not going to go explore the puddle before backing a 26' ryder truck around a corner, and then hooking it up while the truck sinks into a pit of sandy mud (common to FL).  I go back and tell them that they are going to pull my trailer out.  They laugh at me, and tell me they wont.  I resond to the bitchy ass woman that is sitting behind the desk, that they can't possiably expect me to back a big ass truck, which I can't see behind for shit, around a corner in a tightly packed with cars, tow lot, through a huge ass lake of a puddle, and get stuck.  I then "highly suggest" that she get someone to pull it out.  She says "you don't suggest anything to me."  At that point, I told her to get the owner of the establishment.  She says "he's out getting his hair done."  I told her to get him on the line, she told me to leave the property, I was no longer welcome.  Well...at that point I'm hugely pissed off.  I leave, because no sense in making myself cupable in the eyes of the law, which I was about to get on the phone.  They can't NOT bring me my trailer, which I have a reciept for, and kick me off the property....that's theft.  They told me to let my wife back the truck (LOL....she won't drive my F-150 because it's too big.....and she wasn't on the lease agreement for the Ryder, only me).  After the owner heard that, and the fact that I was just about to get the S.O. on the phone, he brought me my trailer. Asshats...........honestly.......give me an effing break.  Next time I ever get anything towed, I'm bringing a LEO friend of mine to smooth things over.

Hmmm, sounds llike "Kings Wrecker".  What a bunch of Asshats

Quoted: Quoted: You can't put a lein on a car unless you have the title and it is sent in to have the state place the lein in your name.  So this guy does not have a lein on the car. The guy shot may have been tresspassing and may have been trying to run over the tow truck driver then for it would be self defense.  How would you like to go to jail for self defense.  or he could have just been pissed and wasted the guy, I guess we will see in court. That may be the law where you are, but in many states, once a tow truck has hooked up on a legal tow they have a lien.

Correct. In the state of Florida, if one wheel is hooked upsecured to the truck, the tow company has a lien on the vehicle.  About once a week, we issue bolo's for stolen vehicles where the driver is the owner. The roam towing agencies here are pure hell, but what really sucks is that no matter what, they win. I don't know why the lawmakers pander to these assholes, but they do.

Here is a little more detail in a more recent article. I'm neutral on this one, he may have a legitimate defense, too many factors involved and not enough info.

Tow Truck Driver Freed On Bail In Homicide Published: Feb 7, 2006 TAMPA - A tow truck operator charged with second-degree murder in the shooting of a man trying to drive off in an impounded car was freed on $100,000 bail Monday. Bail for Donald Montanez, 44, was set Monday. The attorney for Donald Montanez, 44, said his client fired in self-defense when Glen "Chuck" Rich, 30, tried to ram Montanez with the car. Members of Rich's family, at the courthouse Monday, said they were disappointed that bail had been set for Montanez. "I think the family has been upset for a while, and certainly this isn't going to help," said Linda Streeter, Rich's aunt. The family has hired a private lawyer, Bruce Batts, of Orlando, to assist them while the state prosecutes Montanez. "I don't think it's ever justified to kill someone over a car," Batts said. During Monday's hearing, Montanez's attorney, Roger Rigau, told the judge Montanez had a legal right to defend himself and his employees. On Jan. 7, Montanez's company was impounding cars illegally parked outside the Sugar Shack bottle club. The cars were towed to a nearby lot. In the early morning hours of Jan. 8, Rigau said, 10 to 15 men were creating problems with tow company employees, angrily saying they would take their cars despite the impounds. When Montanez arrived, he saw Rich and Rich's two brothers. Rigau said Montanez has said he pulled out his .40-caliber Sig Sauer handgun. Nevertheless, Rigau said, the men walked past him and got in the car. Rich put it into reverse, knocking off a tire lock, then drove forward toward Montanez, Rigau said. When the gun fired, Rich was struck under his right arm. He died at St. Joseph's Hospital. After an investigation by the state attorney's office, Montanez was arrested Friday.

http://news.tbo.com/news/metro/MGBXOZOODJE.html

Quoted: Here is a little more detail in a more recent article. I'm neutral on this one, he may have a legitimate defense, too many factors involved and not enough info. Tow Truck Driver Freed On Bail In Homicide Published: Feb 7, 2006 TAMPA - A tow truck operator charged with second-degree murder in the shooting of a man trying to drive off in an impounded car was freed on $100,000 bail Monday. Bail for Donald Montanez, 44, was set Monday. The attorney for Donald Montanez, 44, said his client fired in self-defense when Glen "Chuck" Rich, 30, tried to ram Montanez with the car. Members of Rich's family, at the courthouse Monday, said they were disappointed that bail had been set for Montanez. "I think the family has been upset for a while, and certainly this isn't going to help," said Linda Streeter, Rich's aunt. The family has hired a private lawyer, Bruce Batts, of Orlando, to assist them while the state prosecutes Montanez. "I don't think it's ever justified to kill someone over a car," Batts said. During Monday's hearing, Montanez's attorney, Roger Rigau, told the judge Montanez had a legal right to defend himself and his employees. On Jan. 7, Montanez's company was impounding cars illegally parked outside the Sugar Shack bottle club. The cars were towed to a nearby lot. In the early morning hours of Jan. 8, Rigau said, 10 to 15 men were creating problems with tow company employees, angrily saying they would take their cars despite the impounds. When Montanez arrived, he saw Rich and Rich's two brothers. Rigau said Montanez has said he pulled out his .40-caliber Sig Sauer handgun. Nevertheless, Rigau said, the men walked past him and got in the car. Rich put it into reverse, knocking off a tire lock, then drove forward toward Montanez, Rigau said. When the gun fired, Rich was struck under his right arm. He died at St. Joseph's Hospital. After an investigation by the state attorney's office, Montanez was arrested Friday. http://news.tbo.com/news/metro/MGBXOZOODJE.html

I'm not seeing self-defense here, but then again, I wasn't there. Striking under the guy's arm and producing a fatal wound to the chest would require either shooting the side of the car (no self-defense) or the passenger was sitting sideways in the seat and he shot through the windshield (potential self-defense). From what I understand, he shot into the side of the car, or after it passed him, therefore there was no true threat.

Given the info we have, he's screwed, but there could always be something we haven't heard about.

Quoted: I'm not seeing self-defense here, but then again, I wasn't there. Striking under the guy's arm and producing a fatal wound to the chest would require either shooting the side of the car (no self-defense) or the passenger was sitting sideways in the seat and he shot through the windshield (potential self-defense). From what I understand, he shot into the side of the car, or after it passed him, therefore there was no true threat. Given the info we have, he's screwed, but there could always be something we haven't heard about.

From the original articles:

Rich drove to a nearby convenience store, where he called his wife before passing out. He was taken to St. Joseph's Hospital, where he died from the gunshot wound.

If he got shot in the arm or armpit, even from the front, how long would it take someone to bleed out from the Axillary artery ? It does come directly from the heart and pumps a substantial volume of blood.

ETA: I just remembered the part about a shattered passenger side window in the original article, sounds like the guy doesn't have much of a self-defense case considering that.