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With millions having carry permits or unlicensed carry civilians on the scene with a gun should be expected.

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If he was really shot standing there with his hands in the air, I don't see where it matters whether he was the good guy, bad guy or some random guy walking by. It's still a bad shoot and someone needs to do a lot of jail time.

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The cop who did the shooting is probably being recruited by the FBI's Hostage Rescue Team as we speak!

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If he was really shot standing there with his hands in the air, I don't see where it matters whether he was the good guy, bad guy or some random guy walking by. It's still a bad shoot and someone needs to do a lot of jail time.

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wow.  maybe the cops were mad that this citizen did their job for them.

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It always easy to blame the amateurs when the "pros" shit the bed.

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Gonna get paid.

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Shooting cop should be charged just as if roles were reversed and the citizen accidentally shot the cop.

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No, this is not Ferguson, Missouri.  It’s Independence, and it’s not a young black man, it’s a white husband and father.

Mike Becker, 31, saved his wife, his daughter at about 30 strangers at a Dollar General from an armed robber on Tuesday.

Becker’s wife called him to inform him that a man with a gun was threatening the patrons.

Mr. Becker arrived on the scene to discover the armed man beating on the glass doors while the people inside were huddled near the back.  He then drew his gun and rushed to put himself between the man and the people inside.

“The only thing in my mind was my baby and wife,” he said. “There was no way the gunman was getting in that store.”

The Kansas City Star reports what happened next.

http://www.dcclothesline.com/2018/02/08/missouri-father-saves-wife-daughter-30-strangers-from-armed-robber-cops-show-up-shoot-him-with-hands-in-the-air/

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The only thing I have heard along those lines is some admins don't want cops getting any training outside the department or some official POST certified training.

The thought process was they don't want you using some technique you learned in some class that has not been vetted by official LE channels because then if you use it and get sued it's difficult to prove it is LE certified.

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Colin Noir's bullshit gets proven wrong yet again.

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lucky he is still alive

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Did the cop ND while covering the guy?

If he was compliant, dropped the gun and had his hands up the justifiable reasons to shoot him kind of diminish.

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It boils down to this:

Police are, for the most part, poorly trained.

They are held to dogshit standards (sometimes enforced by court orders because actual standards are "discriminatory") that would be considered deplorable for just about any other profession. In most states it takes more training time to become a fucking barber than it does to be someone who is issued a lethal weapon and arrest powers.

Baltimore just had 1/3 of its latest recruit class fail the final exams to become a police officer...but fuck it, we'll put them on the street anyway:

https://www.themaven.net/bluelivesmatter/news/1-3-baltimore-recruits-fail-final-academy-tests-so-they-get-rid-of-it-J81uinRV6kO2zEkquwm9aw

It is virtually guaranteed that the vast majority of those who failed those exams are women and/or racial minorities.

But fuck it, put them on the street anyway.

So here you have these poorly trained, poorly prepared individuals shoved into literally lethal situations. Situations full of ambiguity and bad information where they don't know who the good guys and bad guys are. Their training has been mostly dogshit. They know this. Because the second you are confronted with actual danger you can't fucking Stuart Smalley your way into handling it. You cannot bullshit yourself, not when shit gets real.

So these poorly trained people who do not have the skills to prevail in a real fight find themselves facing a real fight or the possibility of a real fight and they are not confident their dogshit skills will see them through.

This sets off a chain reaction of fucktardery.

See, a prepared, well-trained individual stays in the rational part of his/her mind. When shit is going sideways and they have a plan for this, they stay on that plan and they stay in the part of their brain that is capable of rationally thinking through a problem. This is why we spend shitloads of money weeding out the unsuitable and repeatedly exposing pilots to every possible fucked up scenario imaginable...so that when shit happens they stick to the part of their brain that is capable of recognizing, understanding, and appropriately reacting to new information.

We train combat medics by strapping down a pig, cutting its femoral artery and then making them actually stop the bleed. Why? Because the first time they experience arterial blood spray and a squirming squealing patient shouldn't be when a person's actual life is on the line.

For the most part, WE DO NOT DO THIS WITH POLICE OFFICERS.

We do not require them to demonstrate a high level of skill with a firearm before putting them on the street. We do not require them to demonstrate a high level of skill in combatives before putting them on the street. What scenario based training they do receive is often either far too soft with "red man" suits they hit weakly and get instant compliance from, or it's no-win scenarios that they end up shot with sims no matter what they do.

So these poorly trained, poorly prepared people are staring down the barrel of a situation that they do not believe they can handle...and that shifts them out of that rational part of the brain into the lizard brain. That angry walnut-sized area of your brain at the base of it that is responsible for one thing: KEEP. YOU. ALIVE.

If there is a gun in your hand when that part of your brain is all that is running, you will pull the trigger. A lot. And on the slightest provocation.

Most citizens are there when they use a gun in self defense...but this doesn't pose too much of a problem because they are in that state because they are the victim of a criminal assault. There's no question about it. Dude stuck a gun in their face. It makes for a simple decision tree.

Police officers are often in a very different circumstance. They have to go deal with potentially violent criminals without being the direct victim of hostility. And they have to routinely sort out the violent criminal actors from honest citizens who mean them no harm. When a situation starts to overwhelm them (which can be instantaneous) their panic program starts up and that thing on their hip isn't plan A or plan B or plan C, it's THE. PLAN. PERIOD.

...and so they shoot people. Sometimes people who need to be shot. Sometimes people who didn't need to be shot.

And that's just the deliberate shootings. That doesn't even count the accidental shootings that result from dogshit gun handling that isn't corrected. I know of examples of police officers who fired a weapon accidentally, narrowly missing causing a fatal wound to another police officer, who received no discipline whatsoever for gross negligence in handling a lethal weapon because the admin types were worried about a discrimination lawsuit.

You cannot have that kind of bullshit taking priority and still have competent professionals handling guns and potentially dangerous situations.

The only reason it isn't 100 times worse is because most bad guys are fucking pussies. If even another 25% of criminals hardens the fuck up tomorrow society will be a fucking bloodbath.  

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If it was me and I wasn't hurt too bad, pay me $200-500k and we will call it even.

No lawyer etc just drop the money in my account, and have the Officer apologize.

Then after I am paid me and the Officer will go have a drink and laugh the entire thing off.

One thing I always worried about is stopping a robbery and get shot by mistake thinking I was the guy with a gun.

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Shooting cop should be charged just as if roles were reversed and the citizen accidentally shot the cop.

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Shot him in the hip?

Calling it now, ND.

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The cop missed the COM shot by more than a foot, and shot an unarmed man who had his hands up.  That's some mighty fine police work in the "Show Me" state.  

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Really?

Pat Tillman ring a bell?

Gazillions of dollars spent on BFT and iFF systems?

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Shooting cop should be charged just as if roles were reversed and the citizen accidentally shot the cop.

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40xb will be along to tell you that this was a good shoot shortly.   The fact that the citizen was armed at any point clearly shows that he was a threat.  The totality of the circumstances were that he could have been reaching for an invisible gun above his head.  A reasonable officer should smoke any citizen that was armed at any point.

No changes in policy needed here.

Cop went home safe - all good

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