Good Lord, you guys should scroll up and read what you wrote.  You sound like a bunch of inmature, selfish asshats that are more concern with dumping your load then the responsiblity of not only chosing an appropriate dispository but the consequences that go along with it.

First I think a woman who tricks a man into marriage or pregnancy should be sent to prison for fraud.  Its a horrible thing to do to any man, non the less the child.

Second I think people should be much much more selective with whom they have sex with.  It is after all the action that creates life.  

The idea that a man's only responsiblity is 1/2 the cost of an abortion is an embarrassment to the human race and more so to the men out there that are actually responsible mature members of our society.

Quoted: Good Lord, you guys should scroll up and read what you wrote.  You sound like a bunch of inmature, selfish asshats that are more concern with dumping your load then the responsiblity of not only chosing an appropriate dispository but the consequences that go along with it. First I think a woman who tricks a man into marriage or pregnancy should be sent to prison for fraud.  Its a horrible thing to do to any man, non the less the child. Second I think people should be much much more selective with whom they have sex with.  It is after all the action that creates life.   The idea that a man's only responsiblity is 1/2 the cost of an abortion is an embarrassment to the human race and more so to the men out there that are actually responsible mature members of our society.

Hi Patty.

I know a lot of this seems immature, but read between the lines and you'll see that there are some serious principles being discussed:

1.  Why should women be the only ones with the "right to choose" when it comes to unwanted pregnancies?

2.  Why are laws so skewed against men in regards to parental rights?

What's good for the goose should also be good for the gander, if you understand what I'm saying.

Having said that, I personally believe in personal responsibility on both sides.  If two people fool around and pregnancy is the result, both people should share legal responsibility for the child.  If women are going to insist on the right to abort, the "fathers" should be able to share equal legal powers in that choice.  If men are denied equal powers in that choice, it is only sensible for "fathers" to opt out of parental/financial responsibility for any children they don't want.


In situations where the baby isn't his, he should have to give written consent before the man is held financially accountable for the child.  Etc., etc.

In summary, men are tired of the inequality of the system, and you might find a major groundswell of backlash in the not too distant future.

Quoted: Oh for God's sake... Keep your dick in your pants, then you wont have the problem...

Far to difficult a concept for 80 - 90% of the public it seems.

Men have the right to dispute paternity, but once it's established, tough shit, pay up.

There's a reason it takes 2 to create a child.

Ban abortion. Problem solved. Takes two to cause pregnancy. Both should have to pay for the kid and take care of it. If abortion is banned it will take care of all of the BS topics like this.

Quoted: Quoted: Good Lord, you guys should scroll up and read what you wrote.  You sound like a bunch of inmature, selfish asshats that are more concern with dumping your load then the responsiblity of not only chosing an appropriate dispository but the consequences that go along with it. First I think a woman who tricks a man into marriage or pregnancy should be sent to prison for fraud.  Its a horrible thing to do to any man, non the less the child. Second I think people should be much much more selective with whom they have sex with.  It is after all the action that creates life.   The idea that a man's only responsiblity is 1/2 the cost of an abortion is an embarrassment to the human race and more so to the men out there that are actually responsible mature members of our society. Hi Patty. I know a lot of this seems immature, but read between the lines and you'll see that there are some serious principles being discussed: 1.  Why should women be the only ones with the "right to choose" when it comes to unwanted pregnancies? 2.  Why are laws so skewed against men in regards to parental rights? What's good for the goose should also be good for the gander, if you understand what I'm saying. Having said that, I personally believe in personal responsibility on both sides.  If two people fool around and pregnancy is the result, both people should share legal responsibility for the child.  If women are going to insist on the right to abort, the "fathers" should be able to share equal legal powers in that choice.  If men are denied equal powers in that choice, it is only sensible for "fathers" to opt out of parental/financial responsibility for any children they don't want. In situations where the baby isn't his, he should have to give written consent before the man is held financially accountable for the child.  Etc., etc. In summary, men are tired of the inequality of the system, and you might find a major groundswell of backlash in the not too distant future.

I am 100% opposed to abortion for any reason shy of saving the mother's life.  I don't think there's a perfect answer to this problem because it is impossible to legislate morality.  

I'm sick of women having all the rights.

A good friend of mine found out he had an 8 year old son, when he was 26. The girl lived 200 miles away and he hooked up with her one night when she was in town.

For 8 years this girl kept it a secret and then all the sudden she wants to get paid back for the last 8 years of child support and the hospital expenses from when he was born.

I think he should have the right to sue her from keeping him from his child.

Quoted: If a woman dupes a man into believing that she is using contraception but is actually not, she should be completely responsible for the result.

+1

A buddies wife did that to him...  Oops...  I conviently forgot to take my pills for the last couple of weeks and I'm now pregnant.  He was about to serve her ass with the walking papers.  It just postponed the enivetable for about a year.  

I'm gonnna have to go with the man on this one. Men have been getting the short end of the stick on this for years. If a woman can be irresponsible and have choices (which include murder) the man should have some choices too-

Quoted: I am 100% opposed to abortion for any reason shy of saving the mother's life.  I don't think there's a perfect answer to this problem because it is impossible to legislate morality.

Why not?  Morality has been legislated since the birth of our nation.  Steeling, murder, false witness(purgery), etc. are all essentially moral issues.

The problem is the fact that our legislators have lost the backbone to take any real stance on what is right and what is wrong.

WHEN will they come out with a pill for men???  

Every time I've laid the bone, I've used protection, but still, I think 'what if?' and it makes me nervous.  I'd hate to get shafted if I slept with some woman and got a call months later saying I'm a daddy, pay up.  

Quoted: [Why not?  Morality has been legislated since the birth of our nation.  Steeling, murder, false witness(purgery), etc. are all essentially moral issues. The problem is the fact that our legislators have lost the backbone to take any real stance on what is right and what is wrong.

Because everyone has a different take , outside of murder, etc, on what constitutes moral behavior. There are plenty of people whjo in the name of morality would expect everyone to observe blue laws, for instance.

Quoted: Keep it in your pants until you're married and then its not an issue.  What's so difficult about that concept?

Because almost no one does that, and its really unrealistic to expect that it will EVER be widely practiced.

Quoted: I don't see what difference that makes. It takes two people to conceive a child. If she was a willing participant and doesn't want the child the father should have the right to raise his child if he wants it.

The difference is that HE isn't the one being forced to carry the child.

Tag.

as of someone whom has paid over 197 grand in child support       i have no contact with the child or mother     hell don't even have a clue where they live   and the court won't tell me a thing   i can't wait till i can sue that bitch back for my 197 grand they stole from me         its about dam time for something like this to happen

Quoted: Quoted: 1) Penis gets hard. 2) You put your penis inside her. 3) You ejaculate. -------------------------------Your rights stop here. 4) She gets pregnant. 5) She has baby. 6) You pay child support. I'm not paying for someone else's 'fun'. I understand that in many places, if baby thinks you're Dad, the state says you're Dad, whether you're the biological father or not. Still think there's nothing wrong with the picture?

Then following is not directed at you specifically:

If a man has sex with a woman and she gets pregnant with his child then he is 100% responsible for taking care of that child.  If she goes on him then he probably should have gotten to know her a little better before committing his penis to her vagina.  

I'm not saying that everyone should date for 3 years, get engaged for 1 1/2 years and then be married for a year before having a child.  But people are very cavalier about having sex and then when the woman gets <gasp> pregnant after screwing her, and the man doesn't want to take responsibility for the child, I call bullshit.  You fucked her, you deal with it.    

DNA testing should change things to some extent, but not completely.

If a man is living with a woman, she gets pregnant and he ASSumes it is his, then I have a problem with him ordering a DNA test down the road (years later) as an excuse of absolving him of any financial responsibility for the kid.  

If he doesn't feel the kid is his soon after it's born, get a DNA test at that time.  If you live long enough with the kid for him to think you're his father then I see that as a form of a 'contract' that you have made with the mom/kid.

As far as a woman 'tricking' a man into getting her pregnant, give me a break.  We're all adults here and we all know how mammalian reproduction works.  The penis has to ejaculate in or around the hot sweaty lubricated vagina.  Sperm is not magically 'beamed' into the vagina.  I don't care if she took the rubber out of the garbage and inseminated herself with it, it is your responsibility to account for every one of your little spermies.  

If she says she is on the pill . . . well, as Reagan used to say:  "Trust, but verify."

Quoted: WHEN will they come out with a pill for men???

Are they even working on one?

Funny, she has all the say over an abortion, but when you want to get a vasectomy, both husband and wife have to sign OK. WTF?

Quoted: Quoted: WHEN will they come out with a pill for men???   Are they even working on one?

I believe they are... I think I recall one is in FDA approval phase now (which can take a couple years).


A buddy related a smart thing one of his buddies did.   Put a few shots on ice at a fertility clinic, and then get snipped.  If he and a woman ever decide to have a child, she gets one of his frozen pops.  

I agree with the man. I also think the child support system needs to be redone. Something like the woman should have to show receipts for necessities she bought for the child for the month, then the man and woman split that in half. I do not think they should do it on a "more you make, more they take" system like they currently do. Say you have to pay 700 a month in child support, then if you can't pay all of your bills, you work an extra job to make up the difference, then she can take you back to court and make you pay more because you now make more.

Quoted: Ban abortion. Problem solved. Takes two to cause pregnancy. Both should have to pay for the kid and take care of it. If abortion is banned it will take care of all of the BS topics like this.

Banning abortion will work about as well as, oh, banning drugs.  Or banning alcohol............

Yeah, tell me how that ban on marijuana, heroin, and meth is working.

Quoted: I believe they are... I think I recall one is in FDA approval phase now (which can take a couple years).

If you have any information on it... link..articles..w/e.

I'd be very interested in reading it.

Quoted: As far as a woman 'tricking' a man into getting her pregnant, give me a break.  We're all adults here and we all know how mammalian reproduction works.  The penis has to ejaculate in or around the hot sweaty lubricated vagina.  Sperm is not magically 'beamed' into the vagina.  I don't care if she took the rubber out of the garbage and inseminated herself with it, it is your responsibility to account for every one of your little spermies.   If she says she is on the pill . . . well, as Reagan used to say:  "Trust, but verify."

Yes we know, but she's gaming the system.  Properly used birth control is well over 99% effective.  If she sabotages it by not taking her pills or punching holes in her diaphragm, you're now entering into the act with the wrong numbers, taking a chance you would never take if you had full disclosure.  And that is bullshit.  It's like playing russian roulette with a fully loaded gun instead of only one round.

Verify how?  It's not like you can test for it.  

Quoted: Quoted: Then there is the question of abortion. Should a man have a say? A woman is preganant with your child and doesn't want it. You do and are willing to accept full custody of the child. Should she be allowed to kill it? If not, should she be forced to pay support? A woman can give birth and demand support if you don't want the child. Why can't you? I don't buy the "it's her body" arguement in this case. It's her body but it's your child as well. Opinions? Yep, that is bullshit. If he wants it and she doesn't, he should get to keep the kid, AND collect child support from her. It also shouldn't be legal for women to have abortions without the man involved's consent.

Quoted: 1) Penis gets hard. 2) You put your penis inside her. 3) You ejaculate. -------------------------------Your rights stop here. 4) She gets pregnant. 5) She has baby. 6) You pay child support. I'm not paying for someone else's 'fun'.

Thats what abortions and adoption are for.

This case should have came up long ago.

well well well. speaking from experience (I have a beautiful, smart, fun loving 14.5 yr. old daughter born out of wedlock) I can tell you this: While I dont necessarily condone or agree with the thought of paying for someone else's "oops", the heart of this lawsuit is not JUST the money.

I can see where the 25 year old idiot is coming from, cause I was there myself. My daughter was born when I was just turned 22, and fresh off of active duty. Sure I was pissed about it; it spoiled my plans to move to Aspen and go be a ski bum, BUT, I knew as soon as I found out the GF was preggo that I had a commitment to honor to the child, wanted or not. Ever since, I have done all i can and have tried my best, and so far, the little bugger has turned out wonderfully. She's a good person, does well in school (3.5+GPA) and has a good heart and head in her, and thenkfully was born with all 10 fingers and toes, despite what the man shot into me prepping for Gulf I.

I can say though, with out question, that fathers are definitely on the loosing side of the battle from day one. Fathers rights are more or les non-existant, EXCEPT where it comes to child support. As an example, you HAVE to account for every penny you make and spend, while the monther does not. Child support is based (in alot of states) on your POTENTIAL earnings, not what you actually make; While you can be a bum  and not pay your child support, the mother can also not let you visit with your child. Sure, you could take her to court, but guess what? YOU are responsible for ALL court fees, whille the mother can file all kinds of cases for child support at NO COST.  Oh yeah, and JUST TRY as a fatehr to get an accounting of your support case. Good luck with that.

The REAL reason teh lawyers are willing to take this on is to bring to light fathers rights, which are lagging far behind in all aspects. Period.

P.S. I happen to have an excellent relationship with my daughter, especially given the circumstances and distances between us. AND, she's gonna be a hottie to boot. But dont try to get me to post pics.

Equal Protection under the law would dictate that the father have the same rights as the mother, which doesn't happen in todays system.  The father has no rights.  

Things need to change to make it equitable under the law.

Quoted: Equal Protection under the law would dictate that the father have the same rights as the mother, which doesn't happen in todays system.  The father has no rights.   Things need to change to make it equitable under the law.

And that, I believe is the crux of this case. As it is, the ONLY thing you can hope for is a peaceful, amicable relationship with momma. It makes things WAY easier.

Quoted: Funny, she has all the say over an abortion, but when you want to get a vasectomy, both husband and wife have to sign OK. WTF?

+1.  I was flabberghasted when I went to get snipped and I was informed that my wife had to sign off on it.  I was thinking "Who's balls are they?"  Legally, I guess they were community property.

Quoted: Quoted: Funny, she has all the say over an abortion, but when you want to get a vasectomy, both husband and wife have to sign OK. WTF? +1.  I was flabberghasted when I went to get snipped and I was informed that my wife had to sign off on it.  I was thinking "Who's balls are they?"  Legally, I guess they were community property.

I think this depends on the state.  I didn't have any say [legally] in my husband's decision to have a vasectomy.  

It's his kid too...

My normal position on the abortion topic is a strictly legal one -> I am disturbed by the existance of an 'invented' right to privacy, vis-a-vis RvW, that some judge pulled out of his ass...

Situation gets a tad hairy - does dad 'want the kid', or does he want to make the ex go thru pregnancy?

In the end, though, if one parent wants the kid, kid should be born, regardless of the status of abortion law...

IMHO it's no different than him suing to make her get an abortion - he can't, so all things should be equal here... Don't like it, there are plenty of ways NOT to get pregnant...

Makes me wonder why people have pre-sex agreements to sign when having a casual roll in the hay...