It's one unconfirmed article.  A little early to be cancelling membership.  

 

Put some pressure on them, they shouldn't be giving up anything and we should be getting a much wider sporting purposes clause.  ATF is the one who screwed up.  (And congress before them for writing the NFA.)

Fuck no

 

Only thing we should be trading is the NRA retard that thinks that is a good

Idea.


Should give him to McDonald's to make fries

I am not ready to cancel my membership just yet
I think we just need to pressure them and remind them that if they compromise again we are gone

Welcome to GD pal

 

I may or may not in fact cancel my membership, BUT I wanted the little peon reading my email to grasp the severity of my concern for this situation without having to spend a lot of time reading.

when a manufacturer makes them, they submit paperwork to ATF, no? So ATF knows they make them? Then they ship them to distributors and dealers, and the ATF knows about that too. Then people buy them, do 4473s etc...and the ATF knows about those. It seems that they have known all about this stuff every step of the way for years. One could call the entire process 'ATF approved'...and considering the agencies penchant for legislating...how can they argue that they haven't do it again in this case? I say we let them twist in the wind. No compromise, just more lawsuits.

not if they do it again but if they did this in fact. if its true fuck them.

It was ATF approved, they just didn't read the laws they're supposed to enforce.

 

How about the one that bans Vets with PTSD from owning guns?

THe NRA pushed that through and advertised it like it was the greatest thing since sliced bread.

Now we have VETS getting letters from the VA telling them that their gun rights have been revoked, all because they asked for some sleeping pills after a deployment.

NOT AT ALL.

Interesting.  Where can I find a copy of that?  Something to talk to my Congressman about...

This whole fucking thread is an NRA basher's fantasy

Well yeah. It's the nra.

Not at the expense of ammo importation, and not at the expense of current court cases in process.

NRA should be scared to death of what Nolo is doing because If he wins and guts federal gun control across the board, suddenly there is no boogeyman for the NRA to raise money against.

An NRA without gun control is like Jessie Jackson's Rainbow Coalition in an America without racism.... Just another group of loudmouthed brokedick Assholes.

It would help if you had the slightest idea of what you were talking about instead of regurgitating ridiculous gun store mythology.  For starters, there is no law that bans vets diagnosed with PTSD by the VA from owning guns.

No wonder my google-fu was weak... Can't find what doesn't exists!

So the letters going out from the VA to vets aren't real?

Hold on.


" />

Boom, headshot.  Like someone posted earlier some on here take the ball and just start fucking running, they don't have a damn clue where they are going but holy shit are they ever going. We really are our own worst enemy

Good God that's derpy.  First, gun control isn't going to magically vanish with a big win.  And a big win will definitely provoke a backlash from the gun banners. This idea that the NRA needs gun control is ridiculous.

Second, about 2/3 of the NRA's income and expenses is derived from member dues and goes towards member communications, ranges, scholarships, etc.  IF there was some magic case that simultaneously gutted all gun control and prevented future efforts in Congress by which the NRA was forced back to being the sporting organization it was from 1873-1976,  they'd do just fine.  The organizations that would really be SOL are the one-person, gimme-money groups.

I present the NRA's mission statement:
To protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.
To promote public safety, law and order, and the national defense.
To train members of law enforcement agencies, the armed forces, the militia, and people of good repute in marksmanship and in the safe handling and efficient use of small arms.
To foster and promote the shooting sports.
To promote hunter safety.

Protecting the constitution is only part of what they do.

I assume you wrote it in crayon on a circle of paper?

If yu tards would wait a minute for me to upload something........damn


So, after VA Tech and sandy hook, the NRA helped push though new legislation banning mentally ill people from owning guns. SOUnds great right?

Well, unfortunately, if the VA determines that you are incompetent, meaning you have sever PTSD ro any other "mental illness", you get the letter stating that you are no longer allowed to own guns.

How the fuck have you not heard of this? It's been happening for a couple years now.

All it takes is some anti-gun Docotr at the VA to arbitralily decide that you are "mentally ill" and you can no longer own guns.

It's happening, and it's all because of the NRA.

linky

 
So are you saying that before Va. Tech the mentally incompetent could own legally own firearms? Or is it Sandy hook? Those happened quite a bit of time apart from each other.


Your link states nothing about the NRA being involved in any form with what you posted.


Your ignorance is lolzworthy.

No, the letters are real.  The idea that the NRA pushed through a law that banned vets with PTSD from having guns is bullshit.

The 1968 Gun Control Act (which the NRA opposed) provides that a prohibited person is (among others) one who has been: "has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed to any mental institution".  In the late 1980s, the gun control groups started a crusade to go after previously prohibited people who had their rights restored and later committed further crimes.  They were successful and Congress suspended funding for ATF to review or approve petitions to have their firearms rights restored.  When the Brady Bill went through, it had a provision for a background check conducted by local law enforcement and a mandatory seven day waiting period.  In order to kill those provisions, the National Instant Check System was created.  Because Congress would no longer fund restoration of rights through ATF, a prohibited person finding was now essentially a lifetime ban regardless of how much circumstances changed (with a few exceptions).

After the Virginia Tech shootings, it was discovered that the shooter had been adjudicated mentally defective and found a danger to himself or others under Virginia law.  However, he was able to purchase a firearm through an FFL because the judicial record was never sent to NICS.  This led to the NICS Improvement Act of 2007.  This Act provided money for states and federal agencies to update their records.  It also provided that any state who accepted the funding, and all federal agencies, had to set up a process by which such determinations could be appealed (this was moved to the states to prevent Congress from defunding it like previous provisions).  States were not required to do this; but those that did not did not get the extra grant money.

The VA has taken the position that someone who is not capable of managing their own financial affairs (someone who has a financial trustee assigned due to a PTSD diagnosis) is effectively mentally disabled.  Under the law, this counts as "adjudicated mentally defective" in some jurisdictions.  This is not due to anything the NRA sponsored. This is the way the law was since 1968.  It hits on a big problem with the current law which is that there is a circuit court split on what "adjudicated mentally defective" means.  Depending on what Court of Appeals circuit you fall under, you could lose your Second Amendment rights with less due process than other Circuits.  The Supreme Court has not yet resolved this yet.  As a result, the VA is sending these names to NICS.  

About the worst you can say of the NRA is that they A) created a process where veterans can challenge that determination even after they have already been sent to NICS and B) may have provided funds that the VA used to send the records (although with this Administration, it likely would have happened anyway).

Great post BR.

It would, but the better thing would be to allow ATF to destroy themselves.  The entire "sporting purposes" concept is unsupportable by the Constitution.

How so?

Feel free to be specific.

So some nut writes a blog bashing the NRA on unsubstantiated claims and everyone believes him?  I know how much you guys hate facts but you have stooped to a new low with this on.

This is the same "nut" who wrote about Fast and Furious.

We could try incrementalism instead of having it used against us for once.



Just a thought.



 

The probability that those who blame NRA for '86 have joined ANY of the NFA-centric legal groups is almost zero. That is why all of them have failed. They can't even explain the law for us. If they could, most would shut up. The few remaining "all or nothing" types never gave a dollar to the aforementioned, now failed groups. They probably can't even name them.

These are the people who show up to an NRA sponsored meet and greet at the State Capitol in BDU pants and a boony cap.

Idiots.

So what do I need to buy now before it is banned?

Is this some kind of conspiracy to make us all go broke?

Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile

Easy.



Parts of the 1968 GCA that prohibited mail-order ammo sales and required dealer tracking of ammo.  Those and other onerous provisions were overturned in the much-maligned-but-far-more-important-than-people-believe 1986 FOPA.



The 1994 AW Ban -- which as most here forget, would have been permanent if the NRA hadn't gotten sympathetic Senators to insert sunset language into the bill.  That, and their opposition to a renewal in 2004 effectively repealed the law.



The ban on carry in National Parks in 2009, which had been repealed by rule by the Bush Administration, only to be overturned by Obama.



 

How well would it work out for you if you did whatever the hell you wanted to do and tried using the old "I didn't read the MCO" excuse? Should work the same for ATF as an organization.

Lol, I wouldn't have my rank.

 

No.

Find me the words "Sporting purposes" in Art. 2 .

Hint.

If it's not there, fuck off.

Broadening the definition, means accepting something, other than the actual limitation of Govt. Regulation that is already stipulated clearly.

The old dead white guys chose their words wisely.
They were no fools, and figured on gutless dipshits and cowards, that would fold over weasel dick Lawyers, plying verbage.

The word "Arms" was chosen without a modifier.

Not "Smooth bore fowling Arms", Not "Rifled bore Squirrel rifles", not " Cannon", and not "Swords".

"ARMS"

It's all encompassing, and not because they lacked a fucking dictionary.

It's all encompassing because they planned on spineless fucksticks, like we have in the North east and Mexifornia.







.

No, it's a guy purportedly quoting a story from that guy, not that writing about rumors that proved true means jack or squat.

Good point.  NRA-ILA's future might be in question, but I'd suggest the antis would never stop trying to find a way to re-impose gun control, and future Congresses refuse to be bound by the decision of past Congresses, so ILA would still have a place.

 
And?  I'm sure CNN breaks a news story every once in awhile too.  I guess they must always be right.  



The NRA has no reason to compromise and sell out right now.  The NRA isn't going to do anything simply so the ATF can save face either.  The article says "This reporter could get no one from NRA national leadership to go on or off the record to confirm this deal".  Wow, no one involved will comment but this guy knows all the details.  Now if the NRA does come out claiming what he claims, then I'll listen.  Until then he is just another nut trying to make himself relevant by bashing the NRA during their annual convention.

They have no legitimate authority to regulate, based upon sporting purposes, period, and never have.

Recognizing they do, legitimizes their unconstitutional authority.

FUCK NO!!!!!!

The 2A has NOTHING to do with "Sporting purposes". NONE!!!!!!!!!!

Would you let a Jr. High Hall monitor, give you a speeding ticket on the freeway?
If so, would you actually pay the fine?

I'm hoping no.
You don't list the Northeast or Mexifornia as location...so I assume you were born with a spine.

It's not by accident.

The leftist think tanks focus on fracturing the oppositions base.

Trotsky, Alinsky, ring a bell?

The leftist media is more than willing to spin a false narrative in support of their side.

Who is better funded and supported. Soros, Bloomberg, and the left, or the NRA?

It's bullshit.

The NRA has been fighting the "Sporting purpose" clause for decades.

That depends on whether the Jr high hall monitor is demanding payment while he points his machinegun at me and 16 other armed jr high hall monitors back him up.

 

Weren't sawed off shotguns made illegal because the had no military purpose?  This is my recollection.  Inasmuch, if they ban guns that have no "sporting" purpose, and there is precedence for banning guns that have no military purpose, then no gun will be legal.

boom

I'm tired of the NRA's bullshit

I'm tired of ignorant peoples bullshit.

Tag to see where this goes.

The gun hobby has never had so many choices.

After the sunset of 2006, we have $400 - 500 AR15's
American AKS's
Drums of all types for 10/22's Glocks, shotguns. you name it
And Norinco .223 was 10 cents back in 1985. If you minus inflation to 2015, the price of Federal is about even

Yes the 89 import ban cut some choices, but we have far more today. Want an AR10 ? You can 80% one, or factory one for less than an AR15 cost in 85. Heck 2005.

And any home built AR today works. Not so with the hodgepodge in the 80's.
Billet ambi lowers, I wish we had them but they would have been $700.

Slidefire availability would have cut class 3 sales by a mile !

Todays suppressor's WORK and lots of companies to chose from.

CCW. Not a chance, Switchblades were not even around anymore. Now they have come back.
Microtech's make the Tijuana junk look really sad.

I had machineguns. When I sold them, Frank's Guns gave me a fair price.

I don't really think the semi's are boring. Look at the Siaga.
Just a different choice.

Now we have trick triggers that are really fast. 3G from Bill G.

MANY more gun owners, Women carry now.
AND they vote, they don't want to lose that security.

We lost machineguns.
True.
But we have better choices we didn't have in 86.

There is no "4473" or CCW mentioned either