Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: 5-4 +1 OTOH, what's to stop McCain from giving us more liberal justices, being the "maverick" that he is? His word. Republican members of congress. Republican voters. His voting record. Well, everything, I suppose. Come on, badfish. Do you really think McCain would nominate conservative justices - the most likely ones to toss out his legacy legislation? Or, at best, would he give us Kennedys?

Yes.  Absolutely.  Especially in his first term.  Bush nominated Harriet Miers and the party about went ape shit.

Even a Kennedy is a win.  Hell, I'm liking Kennedy quite a bit right now.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I'm voting for Chuck Baldwin. You and 5 other people. Six. And labeling him a truther is ludicrous, and shameful.

Ludicrous?  The man wants the 9/11 commission opened up so they can look at the troofers claims, AND thinks there may be some sort of truth to their claims.  He just hasn't crossed the line into trooferdom yet.

Quoted: Quoted: 5-4 Yeah, that. Fuck it.  McCain '08

+1

To put it bluntly, anyone who says there is no difference between McCain and Obama is a moron, plain and simple.  Sorry.  Obama is one of the most liberal douchebags they could have picked, McCain is far stronger than him on almost every topic.  Even if his Supreme Court justice picks won't ultra conversatives (and I like to think they'd be pretty decent, we scored pretty big on GWB's picks) they will be farrrrrr better then the crap we'll get from Obama.  

If we had even one more Breyer on the Supreme Court we'd be looking at a basically nullified 2nd Amendment right now.  Do you "I'm tired of voting for the lesser of the two evils" idiots realize that?  5 to freakin' 4.  Voting for the lesser of two evils for the last couple elections has given us a great victory, it could have been very different...

The reality is that it is not about the lesser of two evils, it is about picking the best of the two candidates running.  All your protest vote will get us is a President Obama and the press tripping all over themselves to sing his praise in the sweeping mandate he and the Democrats have from their easy victory...  You're not going to teach the Republicans a lesson, you're merely going to screw us all over...

Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama.
Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter.
By your own choice.

Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice.

So we should vote for a guy that brought us a law (McCain-Feingold) that gutted one of our Constitutional rights huh?  

I have but one test for the potential President:  Will they uphold the Constitution?  With McCain the answer is clearly no as he has demonstrated in the past.  

Why should I vote for that?

Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice.

You don't have a choice.  You only have the illusion of a choice.  You actually think anything will get any better under either one of these two clowns?  

Quoted: I don't do current political threads often, and I'm sure I will vote McCain to keep the Obeast from getting in, but I was jut wondering- is anyone who will actually be glad at their choices this year?  For that matter, were you ever glad to vote for the person you voted for?

I was genuinely glad to vote for President Bush (Jr), twice...

McCain, not so much, but he was allways my #2 choice after Fred...

Quoted: Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice. So we should vote for a guy that brought us a law (McCain-Feingold) that gutted one of our Constitutional rights huh?   I have but one test for the potential President:  Will they uphold the Constitution?  With McCain the answer is clearly no as he has demonstrated in the past.   Why should I vote for that?

You really have no idea what went on with Campaign Finance, do you???

The law, in ammended form, was passed and signed in order to (a) pass SOMETHNG, and (b) under the full knowledge that the Supreme Court would strike down the 'days before an election' amendment....

Which is EXACTLY what happened...

McCain Feingold, 2 Supreme Court cases later, boils down to 527 groups (MoveOn.org and the SwiftBoat Vets, for example) and 'I approved this Message'....

The violation of the 1st Ammendment has been removed...

Voted for Bush in 04.  Wished I could have voted for him in 00.

Don't care for McCain... am scared of Obama. The fact that anyone like Obama could get nominated or elected for any national office does not bode well for this countries future.

For 08 I see this.

A socialist.  

The status quo

And any other vote being either worthless or a defacto vote for the socialist.

So I chose to vote for the status quo

Quoted: Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice. You don't have a choice.  You only have the illusion of a choice.  You actually think anything will get any better under either one of these two clowns?

It's sad that anybody is unable to see the difference, and apparently freely admits to it on an open forum.

I dont' feel too bad about voting for McCain.  He seems to be very honest.  I trust him, even though i don't agree with him on everything.

Besides, not voting for the lesser of the two evils is a vote for the greater evil.

As it stands, I'm voting McCain.  But if he chooses an absolutely horrible VP, like Romney, I may have to reconsider.  

I never vote for the lesser of two evils. Lesser evil is still evil. I vote Libertarian.

"Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." John Quincy Adams

Quoted: I never vote for the lesser of two evils. Lesser evil is still evil. I vote Libertarian. "Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." John Quincy Adams

Why is the vote not lost or wasted ?  Honest question.  

Quoted: Quoted: I never vote for the lesser of two evils. Lesser evil is still evil. I vote Libertarian. "Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." John Quincy Adams Why is the vote not lost or wasted ?  Honest question.

By the same token, if you vote for the Republican candidate in California, is your vote wasted?

You seem to think that a ballot cast for someone who has little chance of election is a worthless vote.  In reality, the votes cast for President by individuals are nothing but a public opinion poll.  Thats why no vote is wasted.  Because the vote is just a tool to gauge the public sentiment.

The actual election is held in the electoral college.  And theoretically, they could disregard the public opinion.

Quoted: Quoted: I never vote for the lesser of two evils. Lesser evil is still evil. I vote Libertarian. "Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost." John Quincy Adams Why is the vote not lost or wasted ?  Honest question.

Than you shall receive an honest answer.

Because a vote is your voice and to vote any way other than what you stand for is to speak the words of someone else. Essentially giving your vote away, aka losing or wasting your vote.

Quoted: Quoted: i will not be voting for the lesser evil. i don't vote for evil. i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc100/theanticommunist/Album%201/Album%2014/Album%2020/1-1.jpg

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Its a shame that libertarians can't get nominated for President by a major party.  The two closest ones were Ron Paul and Fred Thompson, and we all know how that went. www.library.cornell.edu/olinuris/ref/goldwater1964.jpg upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/92/1964_Electoral_Map.png/800px-1964_Electoral_Map.png

Well at least my state went to Goldwater.... of course I wasn't born yet at the time, but I would have voted for him

I won't be voting for Mccain, if that's what you're asking.

Quoted: I won't be voting for Mccain, if that's what you're asking.

Well that will make you awfully useful come November, won't it?

Wow, glad to see lots of members here their justifing their votes to remove our rights.

How ironic.

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice. So we should vote for a guy that brought us a law (McCain-Feingold) that gutted one of our Constitutional rights huh?   I have but one test for the potential President:  Will they uphold the Constitution?  With McCain the answer is clearly no as he has demonstrated in the past.   Why should I vote for that? You really have no idea what went on with Campaign Finance, do you??? The law, in ammended form, was passed and signed in order to (a) pass SOMETHNG, and (b) under the full knowledge that the Supreme Court would strike down the 'days before an election' amendment.... Which is EXACTLY what happened... McCain Feingold, 2 Supreme Court cases later, boils down to 527 groups (MoveOn.org and the SwiftBoat Vets, for example) and 'I approved this Message'.... The violation of the 1st Ammendment has been removed...

But it was OK to try to pass the 1st Amendment violation in the Bill in the first place?  That was the intent and that is what counts in my book.

These lawmakers are sworn to uphold the Constitution and are trying to push stuff through that would hurt the Country and our freedoms. McCain has PROVEN himself to have no respect for the Constitution.

I simply can't vote for someone like that in good conscious...

 I'm voting against Obama. McCain is still a bitter pill to swallow with all his scumbag shenanigans over the years. I know that BOTH candidates will bring about more problems for our country. Like Death and Taxes, Obama or McCain will cause more problems inevitably. Most likely - less damage with McCain. McCain doesn't understand the real problems within our federal government - and wouldn't be tough enough to make the sacrifices required to get our country back in check. You know - follow the Constitution as a guide - something which has been arrogantly ignored by both major political partys for years.

The biggest issue for me is SCOTUS picks. Either candidate can do whatever damage they want in four years. But SCOTUS picks stay......McCain will *probably* nominate conservatives or lukewarm justices. We all know what kind of marxist scumbags an Obama presidency would put on the bench.

I may vote for McCain but only because of the danger facing SCOTUS and future court rulings. The next four years will be a train wreck regardless imho. I'm more concerned with decisions that effect us 10 years down the road. I wouldn't put it pass McCain to sign into law socialized healthcare. He's compromised on so much - why not this?

Quoted: Quoted: i will not be voting for the lesser evil. i don't vote for evil. i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc100/theanticommunist/Album%201/Album%2014/Album%2020/1-1.jpg

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice. You don't have a choice.  You only have the illusion of a choice.  You actually think anything will get any better under either one of these two clowns?   It's sad that anybody is unable to see the difference, and apparently freely admits to it on an open forum.

Lets see...

Both are for open borders
Both are for Global warming nonsense legislation
Both will continue deficit spending
Neither will reform or eliminate welfare
Both will either support or offer no contest to the radical homosexual lobby
Neither will move us away from the UN
Neither will do a thing about obvious problems with the Fed
And on and on

Go read some of Carrol Quigley's (one of Bill Clinton's mentors) stuff on the two party system in this country.  You'll realize that the parties often argue over details, but rarely dramatically change policies.  This is one of the reasons we are in the mess that we are in today.

It's interesting that Zbigniew Brzezinski, who was Carter's national security advisor, went on to be one of John McCain's foreign policy advisor for his 2000 campaign.  He is now one of Barack Obama's foreign policy advisors!  Hmmmm....

About the only credible argument that can be made for McCain is his picks for the supreme court, and that is questionable at best.  If you recall, we have gotten some of our worst justices from republican presidents...

What are some of you guys going to do if McCain picks a rabid anti-gunner like Bloomberg for VP?  McCain is old - you could end up with our worst possible enemy as President!  

On January 20, 2009 we will inaugurate a new president and it will be either Obama or McCain.
There is no third person who has even a remote chance of taking the oath of office on that day.

Look carefully at those 2 men and ask yourself who will do the least damage on the major issues.
Gun control
Defending the US from foreign enemies
Welfare and the growth of social programs
Taxes and spending
Personal rights vs collective rights

At the end of his four/eight year term who will have done the least damage?

On election day you can protest vote for mick mouse, stay home and curse the choices and system that gave us that choice or just ignore the whole mess but come January 20 either Obama or McCain will be president
There is a huge difference between a rabid socialist who has people like the unrepentant terrorist Bill Ayers and 'reverend' Wright as his political and moral mentors and a RINO like McCain. Yes McCain has a crappy policy on illegals and is not a fiscal conservative but he is not a socialist, served his Country and would not sell us out to our enemies abroad. Can we say the same for Obama?

We have no good choices this time but unless you prefer suicide over a good beating don't waste you vote in protest come November.

You all know that Obama was on the Board of the Joyce Foundation for about 10 years, right?  

To those voting for the lesser of two evils and consider a vote for anyone other than the 2 possible winners to be a waste...

I understand your view and your point. Even if deep down you know neither will change things for the better, you fear that the other will do worse. You fear that your rights will fade faster with the other candidate. You fear your country will die faster with the other candidate. You feel the other candidate will put more restrictions on you and the country than the other. You fear that the other candidate will do worse for the economy, taxes, foreign policy, etc, etc.

All of your fears are valid. One of them will be worse for our country and ourselves, more than the other. Both will be bad, but which one not as much? And in what areas, because the one that is less evil could be more evil in certain areas?

Though, the two parties are becoming more and more similar and the damage each will do becomes greater and more similar. Maybe voting for the lesser of two evils isn't that different after all.

It's not a pretty position, but I understand why you want to vote for the lesser of two evils.

But I ask you these questions...

1. What is the goal of your vote? By choosing the lesser of two evils, are you trying to eradicate evil? No, because you're still voting for evil. Are you trying to save your rights? Yes, but only by choosing the one that will take fewer away this round. The next round more will be taken away, and more the round after that.

You're settling for the slower degradation of our rights and our country. Which makes sense, because we're all mortal. If in 80 years the country is the Soviet Union, Communist China, Tyrannical North Korea and Nazi Germany all rolled into one, it will not personally effect you one iota, because you'll be dead.

That's an extreme scenario that I'm not claiming will happen, but each step in that direction is still a step in that direction.

Shouldn't the goal of your vote be to voice your principles? To show what you stand for and show that you will accept nothing less. So that you may affect future candidates and future voters. So that you may one day actually create a country that is truly FREE and RIGHT and PROSPEROUS. It's not going to happen today, and maybe not even tomorrow, but which way are you walking? Are you taking a step forward or a step back?

2. What are you saying with your vote? You are saying you approve of the candidate and his stance. You are saying that you want what he wants and that you won't put up a fuss when he does it.

You are also approving of future candidates and voters doing the same. The current politician won with those stances. The current politician took away rights, taxed us, and made changes for the worse of the country. The current politician gets re-elected again and again.

The next candidate sees that and takes the same stance. It doesn't matter if I take away their rights, they'll vote for me just like they voted for the last 1000 politicians. But that's not necessarily why he took those stances. He also took those stances, because he believes in them. He grew up seeing politicians have them and voters vote for them. He's learned that they are right.

And the same goes for the future voters. They learn that these are the options, that these are what is normal and right. There's no reason to think or demand what is right, because this is the way it is. We vote for the lesser of two evils, that's the way it has always been. They grow up in a world like this and don't know any other life, they don't remember having the rights of yesteryear.

How are you going to change the country if you don't change who you're approving of? How are you going to upgrade the country if you continue to vote for the gradual downgrade? How are you going to change the country if you never said what you wanted and voiced your vote?

So in essence by voting for the lesser of two evils you ensure that you and all of your descendants will always vote for the lesser of two evils. The problem is that the evil they do builds up and eventually the amount of evil isn't so little anymore.

3. Do you think it will stop? In America, we have more freedom than anyone else (?). We'll never become like those other countries. We'll never be a Socialist nation. Eventually, there will be a point that the evil people and politicians will be satisfied with the amount of regulation and will just stop.

Or.......NOT. The stripping of our freedom has been stacking up for decades. We're in a position now that the voters of the lesser evil 70 years ago would not have wanted nor voted for. And your vote today will put the voters of 70 years in the future into the same position.

Remember, rights aren't taken away in one fell swoop. They're taken away in "sensible" portions. You can get a people to agree to a little chiseling of their rights, or in the least not start a revolution by doing so. After that, a little more can be whittled away, and a little more after that. Soon enough, there is not enough right left to be useful. Not enough right left to even fight to get it back.

Such as the freedom of speech and freedom to bear arms. Whittle away at those enough and not only have the rights been taken away, but the actual ability to take them back is taken away. How will you take back your freedom of speech if you can't speak to let people know it is gone? How will you get enough people behind you to be a strong enough force? How will you take back your right to bear arms if you have no arms to fight with?

Vote to infringe some of your rights today, and maybe you'll get an opportunity to vote the rest away tomorrow.

4. How did you get the rights you have today? This is not a question of how are these rights yours, but how is it that you are enjoying them. Why are you blessed, but the North Koreans are but subjects of a mad man?

Because of PRINCIPLE and standing by it without falter.  

The North Koreans are owned by their government, not because they don't want freedom, but because they won't fight for it. They have the principle of freedom, but they put what is easier before it, such as life and acceptance. I'm not saying they could win their freedom, because it would be hard pressed without such things as freedom of speech, assembly, and firearms. But they certainly will never get it until they begin to try, or someone else does it for them.

So are you going to stand by your principles and fight for your freedom, or are you going to wait until someone else does it for you? Or maybe just hope you can hold enough to be comfortable with until you die?

We have our freedoms today, because the men of 1776 stood by their principles. They did not accept a smaller amount of evil.

When we vote today for the lesser of two evils, we choose the slower degradation of our rights. We choose to have fewer rights taken away so that WE, WE who live today, can enjoy them a little longer. We're mortal and can't enjoy them forever anyway. The people of the future will have to do their own fighting, and we'll make it more difficult for them.

The men who fought for the rights you enjoy today did NOT think like that. I know they didn't, because if they did they would not have died for them. We vote so we may enjoy our rights a little longer, they DIED fighting for rights they would never get to enjoy for even one second.

We're voting and not fighting, but the principle remains the same. Some day we may need to fight and by voting for evil, we nearly ensure that day will come. We're also ensuring that that day will be much harder. It would already be harder today then it would be 10 years ago. Patriot Act, enemies of the state, detainment without trial, etc.

All thanks to voting for the lesser of two evils. Choosing safety today over liberty tomorrow.


So why not vote for the lesser of two evils?

Because it's still evil.

Because a little evil plus a little evil, plus a little evil, plus a little evil equals a hell of a lot more than a little evil.

Because eventually we won't have enough rights to fight to keep the rest and get the others back.

Because it's not RIGHT and it's not our PRINCIPLES.

Because your rights are not something that YOU have because you are special. They are rights because EVERYONE owns their self and is free from outside force. And as such when you vote to take away your rights, you vote to take away others' rights. And taking away others' rights is not something you have the right to do. Not the people of today and not the people of tomorrow. Your vote may not violate others' rights, but the outcome surely does.

Because the only time to take a stand is NOW.

Because voting for evil today ensures evil will be on the docket again tomorrow.

Because when a vote should take us a step forward, why vote for a step back? Push forward even if they push you back, because if you approve them to push you back in small steps then they will never stop.

(I'm going to take a break on the list, but feel free to add to it. Maybe I'll ETA your suggestions in.)


So when you vote for the lesser of two evils, know what you are doing. You don't have to stop voting for the two major parties, but you better make sure they change. And change starts with you. You can't change 20 million people's minds in one day, but you can make sure you always speak YOUR mind and stand by your principles.

If everyone stood by their principles and accepted nothing less, then change would be inevitable.

So for the last questions....

Are you going to stand by your principles today, or are you going to wait until enough people agree to stand by their principles? And if no one stands by their principles today, then how will there ever be enough?  

Change starts with you. Waiting for others to do something you won't even do is fruitless.

"A people that values its privileges above its principles soon loses both." Dwight D. Eisenhower

Amen adfinder23.

I will be voting for Ron Paul this year because I don't feel Republicans or Democrats are ever going unravel the clusterf*ck that is our .gov. I know RP won't win but I hope the #s after the election show that RPs platform of smaller government and more personal responsibility is a viable "brand".

Quoted: Quoted: 5-4 Yeah, that. Fuck it.  McCain '08

There is no other viable option .

Loose a little ,or loose BIG .

Quoted: I will not vote for McCain. ETA: McCain is as much an enemy of freedom as Obama is.  He just hides it better. IMO there is no difference. I will vote third party, before I cast my ballot for either of the same.

With all due respect, I would have to disagree with that statement. I will not be voting for Juan either, after he kissed the hispanic Klans ass , but, there is a difference between the two.

Juan would make a slightly better POTUS than obama, but I disagree with him so much I can not vote for him.

Quoted: Quoted: To those voting for the lesser of two evils <snip> All those words to make no viable point.   One question--have you ever voted for ANYONE who was EXACTLY what you wanted IN EVERY WAY?  Unless it was YOU running, the answer is an obvious "of course not."  One ALWAYS votes for "the lesser of two evils."  Always.   You can spin this any way you want in an effort to help Obama ("divide and conquer the stupid gun owners"), but the truth remains . . .

It is true that there will never be anyone that is EXACTLY who you want. But since I vote Libertarian, I'd say they are 98% of what I want.

However, you can guarantee that there will never be anyone even close to what you want unless you stand by your principles. If everyone did stand by their principles, then there would be more than 2 viable parties, and you would be a hell of a lot closer to voting the way you want.

To stand by your principles means that parties' principles will be formed based on the people's principles, rather than the other away around.

I'm lucky, since I already have a party to vote for and still stand to my principles.

Yes, that is exactly what I'm doing. I'm using my vote for one person in order to make a totally different party win. Or, if I wanted to do that I could just vote for Obama in the first place. It'd be easier.

Why don't you just tell me how to vote in every election? Because I'm apparently not allowed to vote for who I want, because it might upset someone else's vote. I now know that my vote should be based on other people's principles, not my own. Someone else wants McCain to win, and I want a 3rd party, which will make Obama win, so I should vote McCain. You should probably also start calling the Obama supporters and let them know that their vote is going to make Obama win.

Or we could just outlaw all 3rd parties, outlaw write-in ballot, and force everyone to vote, because then I would be forced to vote for the lesser of two evils.

I say it is you that can spin this anyway you want, but the truth remains that to say my vote is a vote for Obama is a cop out. If Obama wins it's because not enough people wanted McCain.

If Obama wins, maybe we'll be more inspired to bring about change. Maybe the Republicans will start leaning more to the other party that apparently stole their votes. If I as a Libertarian steal their votes, than I am the one they want to appease. Wouldn't hurt if the Republicans started respecting freedom like they used to, would it?

And that is how you bring about change.

Let me ask you this question...

Let's say there was a glass ball that predicted the future. Anytime this glass ball was asked a question about the future, it was 100% accurate. 100% ACCURATE. It was never wrong. Whether it was an event that was unavoidable like an earthquake, or something that could be changed simply by knowing the future, it was always right. So if the crystal ball said Republicans would win they would win. By knowing they were going to win, more Democrats could show up on election day and change the future, right? NOOOOO!!! Because the crystal ball is 100% ACCURATE and predicts the actual future, not what could have been. Let's also say you believe and know this crystal ball to be accurate, so don't just say, "I don't believe in crystal balls."

Now to the question. If this crystal ball said that Obama was going to win the presidency in a landslide...who would you vote for on election day?

Would you accept defeat and vote for Obama? Or vote McCain to voice your opinion?

I know that I would still vote based on my principle.

Obama's election will be devestating due to all the Executive and Judicial appointees, some for life; even worse will be people neglecting their House and Senate races in favor of concentrating on the POTUS election.

Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice.

QFT


Just in case their eyes were full of shit..Like their heads!!!

Btw...here is my thoughts on the OP

After much personal debate and thought here is a not so typical post in GD by myself! I thought I would share what I have been feeling about the current state of affairs of our loved but possibly soon to be lost country!! I think something we are missing is a very sad but true fact..OUR America is in the most dire and fragile condition it has ever been in its great and very honorable life! I hope you guys dont take this the wrong way or take that I have lost the love for our great nation but I want to get some feelings off my mind and truly share some of my thoughts with my brothers of freedom ,of which I know may feel somewhat the same once they read this entire post! First, I want to say I love this nation and believe it is THE GREATEST NATION ON EARTH!! However,Our current society has drastically fallen as the leader of freedom and justice..The United States,the most honorable nation on the planet, has lead the world in a spiral decline in some recent years..Certainly further away from where we once were, yet we remain the pinnacle of justice on the worlds stage..The nations of the world needs the United States to be a strong and righteous nation in its time of distress as she was in times past! Some of "WE The People" no longer stand for what we once were or what we as a Nation aspired to once be as Americans,The Just and righteous, The protectors of freedom and hero's of the weak and oppressed! We have allowed our rights to be withered away by injustice of the tyrannical and elite! America and her troops have been stripped of its luster and honorable vision and are effectively tarnished to the rest of the world while we fall to non supportive legislators bent on the demise our own kind by essentially cutting the supply chain into! We are no longer viewed as the liberators of injustice or the standard of truth as we once were.. regardless of how brave and true our military warriors are in their duty to protect the United States and the Constitution we all cherish and some have lived and died on foreign soil for the cause of freedoms of other people who know them not!! Some would facilitate their demise for their own liberal,elite and self serving agenda..Placing the finest of Americans, Our Marines,Soldiers,Sailors and Airmen who volunteered for harms way to risk life and limb..year after year,In a wicked and increasingly hostile arena thousands of miles away from home.While some blather hate speech against these young men and women and their more than honorable service to protect freedom in a country far away and for a people who are not their own but some have become to know and trust!! This threat of our image of honor is from within..As we have traitors fighting for the helm of our beloved country and it may be a real possibility a shallow shell could become leader of the free world for having only one attribute to his record..his ability to or the effective use of a lie to deceive and to draw thousands of minions,multi-national and multi-millions of dollars! No other time in history have we had such wickedness rampantly abound with a desensitizing effect!..We see atrocities spoken and acted out against our own daily with no one to stand and call it what it is...Wickedness or evil! It's on the news for a week and then its back to American Idol...NO shock or outrage only a small loss of emotion! In America there is high level corruption of our some of our so called leaders which is reported daily,abduction and murder is as common as the weather report,our children are taught by public schools to kill babies in abortion clinics in stead of abstinence or morality by parents, Child rapist get a free ride without effective punishment..yet we have to celebrate the overwhelming glory of the approval of what should be our God given and inherent rights to defend our lives with an inch by inch and take what we can get mentality...Well,at least we can hope our right to protect life and liberty will be taken seriously by self serving elitist as with DC mayor! When will we begin to stand for what is rightfully ours? Has It has become so very commonplace to really effect us when they dont take " We the People" as the true Americans!...Not some dual citizenship soft shell politician who's record is only as long as his shoe or some fat 4 generation behind the scene socialist who has manipulated our rights for his own agenda! In years past sure we had bad people but in the present time, I personally believe some men have become corrupt who operate in BROKENNESS and who are effectively... Unrepairable! Reprobate in a sense!! There is a distinct separation of "Mankind" at present with trough in effect! EVIL on one side and GOOD on the other with very little in between..and I believe the balance leans to corruption in our day! With some who remain silent and not exercise the 1st Amendment rights to speak up against what should be correct and right! I said all that to say this...In a few months we will have to pick a leader for this nation! One candidate is a war hero with a record of service that is 5 and 1/2 years long and 30 years wide! NOT PERFECT in some of his policies! OR! You have an empty shell with an elitist agenda and a racist and questionable rise to deception of the masses!!! The main issue is that one of them WILL be the next president of the United States!! And one of them will appoint 2 or maybe 3 justices to the USSC...We recently gained some our rights back by a hair thin margin of 5-4! If we do not place the right man in the office of leader of the free world..our rights will become a party to the history of what this nation become and has lost in years past! It is of grave importance we do everything possible to elect a leader who will appoint conservative justices to the U.S. Supreme Court... It is our duty to see this through!! Thank you for your time!

I will not vote for a democrat under any circumstances. And I'd be very hard-pressed to vote for a republican. Both parties suck.

If you're only voting  "against the other party" you're really not voting for anything. The reason we don't have a viable 3rd party is because people vote against instead of for something they feel is right. These other options need votes to become viable. It seems very fundamental to me.

Barr 08.

-JC

Quoted: Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice. QFT Just in case their eyes were full of shit..Like their heads!!!

How astute.
You're one of the "sheeple" if you are willing to take an unpopular position, be attacked for it, be called names, be accused of everything from spoiling the election to near-treason, called-out, mocked, ridiculed and derided.

However if you make the easy choice and vote party line to thunderous applause then you are a free-thinker and a grand patriot.

Bravo.

ETA - And the second bit is a charming mix of Karl Marx and Jerry Falwell. I particularly liked this:

We have allowed our rights to be withered away by injustice of the tyrannical and elite!

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice. QFT Just in case their eyes were full of shit..Like their heads!!! How astute. You're one of the "sheeple" if you are willing to take an unpopular position, be attacked for it, be called names, be accused of everything from spoiling the election to near-treason, called-out, mocked, ridiculed and derided. However if you make the easy choice and vote party line to thunderous applause then you are a free-thinker and a grand patriot. Bravo.

Full of Shit...Say it with me now!!.

If you have so little of an understanding in politics that you can not see that by taking your 3rd party stance is a Vote for Obama then God help us all!..


It dont take much intelligence to see a vote against McCain is a VOTE FOR OBAMA!!

like it or not that is the fact!...


ETA...I hope you like Govt cheese!

Quoted: If everyone stood by their principles and accepted nothing less, then change would be inevitable. So for the last questions.... Are you going to stand by your principles today, or are you going to wait until enough people agree to stand by their principles? And if no one stands by their principles today, then how will there ever be enough?   Change starts with you. Waiting for others to do something you won't even do is fruitless. "A people that values its privileges above its principles soon loses both." Dwight D. Eisenhower

Edited for brevity - but well said - thankyou sir. That's kinda what I was getting at.

-JC

Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Anyone who throws their vote for a guaranteed loser is a fucking retard. A vote for anyone other than MCain is a vote for Obama. Saying that you won't vote for the lesser of two evils is stupid. Wakeup, you are now one of the sheeple. Bleat all you want after you have voted away your freedom. No one will hear you, because you don't matter. By your own choice. QFT Just in case their eyes were full of shit..Like their heads!!! How astute. You're one of the "sheeple" if you are willing to take an unpopular position, be attacked for it, be called names, be accused of everything from spoiling the election to near-treason, called-out, mocked, ridiculed and derided. However if you make the easy choice and vote party line to thunderous applause then you are a free-thinker and a grand patriot. Bravo. ETA - And the second bit is a charming mix of Karl Marx and Jerry Falwell. I particularly liked this: We have allowed our rights to be withered away by injustice of the tyrannical and elite!

And yet you are the one effectively voting for a Marxist ...FOAD!

You have got to be fucking kidding me ...

I'll be voting against evil; gonna vote for McCain.

in during an epic innernet arguement But no. I will not vote this election



If your hungry, and your choices were crap, and stir fried crap, I guess i would go hungry. McCain and Obama suck ass. You mean to tell me out of the millions of people these two shitbirds, one of which will be the next POTUS? Screw em I'm cashing in my chips and leaving the table.

Quoted: I will not vote for a democrat under any circumstances. And I'd be very hard-pressed to vote for a republican. Both parties suck. If you're only voting  "against the other party" you're really not voting for anything. The reason we don't have a viable 3rd party is because people vote against instead of for something they feel is right. These other options need votes to become viable. It seems very fundamental to me. Barr 08. -JC

There may one day be a viable 3rd party in this country and a lot (not all) of the libertarian party line sounds great but this election has Zero chance of a third party win.
It will be Obama or McCain and third party votes will either help or hurt one of those two candidates.

If you can live with 4-8 years of Obama as president then go ahead and vote 3rd party otherwise hold your nose with the rest and vote for McCain.

There are choices and there are dreams masquerading as a choice, know when to follow your dreams and when to accept hard reality, it's never an easy task.

Quoted: in during an epic innernet arguement But no. I will not vote this election If your hungry, and your choices were crap, and stir fried crap, I guess i would go hungry. McCain and Obama suck ass. You mean to tell me out of the millions of people these two shitbirds, one of which will be the next POTUS? Screw em I'm cashing in my chips and leaving the table.

No you will eat the shit that others chose for you

Quoted: Quoted: in during an epic innernet arguement But no. I will not vote this election If your hungry, and your choices were crap, and stir fried crap, I guess i would go hungry. McCain and Obama suck ass. You mean to tell me out of the millions of people these two shitbirds, one of which will be the next POTUS? Screw em I'm cashing in my chips and leaving the table. No you will eat the shit that others chose for you

Yeah, thats the sad part. Last election the NV delegates voted against the States popular vote, so standing in line for three hours to vote was a waste of time, I no longer participate in the POTUS election. I only vote during State and local elections.