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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:27:00 PM EDT
[#1]
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Yes, now that ~$3K and ~3 months hardly seems wasted at all. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I just had a mail server crash here at work. Since the school made me read all that Shakespeare, I started speaking in tongues and blurted out some Taming of the Shrew to management, as well as the server, and it has magically spun back online. For this reason, that class was not at all a waste of my time or money. Wait... Yes, yes it was. You were able to reference some of Shakespeare's work while making a joke. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile Yes, now that ~$3K and ~3 months hardly seems wasted at all. where the hell did you go to school that a single course cost you $3000? holy fuck, that will buy you almost an entire semester's tuition at most in-state public schools. not to mention if somebody takes their extraneous courses at a community college ( which is a VERY financially sound idea). i took junior college classes in the early 2000s and a 3-unit class cost me $100. being that you (I assume) are in IT, I think it is appropriate to use the acronym PEBKAC here... |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:28:22 PM EDT
[#2]
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I was very uninterested in most of the General Ed classes. They ped to apathy which led to poor grades and ultimately me leaving school. I plan on going back, now that I have a job that will support the cost, but it blew my advisors mind that I was getting straight As in all my Major related 3&400 classes, but was failing North Dakota History 101. so you couldn't motivate yourself to write up some bullshit responses and at least squeak by? the problem is you, not "the system." |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:29:10 PM EDT
[#3]
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Too many f***ing gen-ed classes in my opinion. The quality of the gen-ed courses in particular (very large, well respected university) was inferior in every way to what I had gone through in high school. I think gen-ed's are a way to make students pay more for their piece of paper (diploma) than they really need to. If you want to be well rounded, you can easily accomplish that on your own. -EDIT- Plenty of gen-eds are full of commie TA's and professors too, sociology in particular. why, then, did you not go to a more prestigious university? the problem is with you, not "the system." |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:31:44 PM EDT
[#4]
It all depends on whether you want an education, or training.
It sounds as if OP is training oriented, along the lines of "How come I gotta learn this shit?". |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:32:04 PM EDT
[#5]
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so you couldn't motivate yourself to write up some bullshit responses and at least squeak by? the problem is you, not "the system." Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I was very uninterested in most of the General Ed classes. They ped to apathy which led to poor grades and ultimately me leaving school. I plan on going back, now that I have a job that will support the cost, but it blew my advisors mind that I was getting straight As in all my Major related 3&400 classes, but was failing North Dakota History 101. so you couldn't motivate yourself to write up some bullshit responses and at least squeak by? the problem is you, not "the system." Yep, poor guy doesn't understand the value of being taught to write bullshit responses. Does not bode well for his career in .gov |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:32:22 PM EDT
[#6]
IMO, degrees should only require that you take classes that are genuinely relevant to that degree.
If you're going for physics, you'll need to take math classes. Why would a speech class be needed? Biology? You'll need chemistry. Some math, too. But again, why a speech class? It is specifically BECAUSE of the bullshit requirements for classes that do NOT relate to my chosen field, that I don't HAVE a higher degree. I refused to play that game. The reason the colleges do it is really very simple: MONEY. Tuition fees. It stands to reason that they can make more money by forcing you to add a history class, a speech class, a social studies class, a phys ed class, and an elective to your list. I'd have gone for an EE degree which would have required (a) electronics and (b) higher math classes. Those are the important ones. With those, you WILL (if you study) earn your EE degree and be worthy of the title of engineer. I'd have been happy to pursue it if that was ALL that had been required. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:38:03 PM EDT
[#7]
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It is specifically BECAUSE of the bullshit requirements for classes that do NOT relate to my chosen field, that I don't HAVE a higher degree. I refused to play that game. is this the higher education equivalent of "well i was TOTALLY GONNA join the army, but......" ??? guess what bucko, at the end of the day i have a degree and you don't. funny, that. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:40:43 PM EDT
[#8]
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the problem is with you, not "the system." We are all making some pretty sweeping generalizations about gen-ed classes, with little regard to what university each person attended. I'm sure the quality varies, but I don't understand how disliking my university gen-ed's somehow indicates I have a problem? Why did I not attend a more prestigious university? Oh, so I should switch schools and lose out on money because I didn't like my history and sociology classes? Why didn't I think of that before, seems brilliant! |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:42:32 PM EDT
[#9]
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We are all making some pretty sweeping generalizations about gen-ed classes, with little regard to what university each person attended. I'm sure the quality varies, but I don't understand how disliking my university gen-ed's somehow indicates I have a problem? Why did I not attend a more prestigious university? Oh, so I should switch schools and lose out on money because I didn't like my history and sociology classes? Why didn't I think of that before, seems brilliant! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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the problem is with you, not "the system." We are all making some pretty sweeping generalizations about gen-ed classes, with little regard to what university each person attended. I'm sure the quality varies, but I don't understand how disliking my university gen-ed's somehow indicates I have a problem? Why did I not attend a more prestigious university? Oh, so I should switch schools and lose out on money because I didn't like my history and sociology classes? Why didn't I think of that before, seems brilliant! if you weren't happy with the quality of your classes, and you wanted to do something about it, then yes, that is one of two options. the other option is to shut the fuck up and accept the consequences of the decisions YOU made. 
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:44:38 PM EDT
[#10]
I'd say the problem is that colleges are offering majors that should actually be better served by trade schools. And that we as a society WANT people to go to college for everything.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:45:20 PM EDT
[#11]
Considering most are subsidised and taking government grants, plus federally backed student loans it is a waste of money.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 2:46:28 PM EDT
[#12]
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I'd say the problem is that colleges are offering majors that should actually be better served by trade schools. And that we as a society WANT people to go to college for everything. agree 100% on both counts. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:00:12 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It all depends on whether you want an education, or training. It sounds as if OP is training oriented, along the lines of "How come I gotta learn this shit?". |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:01:40 PM EDT
[#14]
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EDIT: Please read my post before responding. I am NOT saying that a Bachelor's degree should not include general education courses at all. ETA2: after re-reading the post, I see that the first paragraph didn't say quite what I intended it to; I meant to ask whether you felt that any, not all, of these courses were unnecessary. Unfortunately, after a couple of edits, that meaning wasn't clear. I'm not going to change it, but please read it with this in mind. For those who are either in college or have earned a Bachelor's, how do you feel about taking a large number of general education courses, or courses that are only tangentially related to the major? Do you feel that the courses in composition, history, social science, humanities, etc. were worthwhile, or would have preferred to either graduate with fewer hours, or take more courses in the major area of study? On the one hand, some of my favorite courses were outside my major (Astronomy and Cosmology, Anthropology, Logic), and I overcame writer's block and became a better writer after two semesters of composition (what do you mean, it doesn't show?  ). And I understand the viewpoint that a college graduate should be expected to have an education that's at least somewhat well-rounded - and that a BS degree should include a broad education in the sciences, and a BA degree should include a broad education in the arts.
OTOH, I'm having to take three courses with "Cultural" in the title, and I can't help wondering how that time and money might be better spent. And my major requires twelve hours of "Secondary Focus" courses, which are in areas that are only marginally related to the major. Combined, these courses comprise 17.5% of the hours required for graduation. I can't help thinking that there are far more useful courses that I could take instead - or that the 120 hour minimum for a Bachelor's degree could be reduced. Yes. Not sure what I will ever do with Contemporary Moral Issues Intro to news writing and others. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:07:48 PM EDT
[#15]
Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:16:19 PM EDT
[#16]
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Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. have you been to college? i don't think you quite understand how it works 
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:17:53 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
is this the higher education equivalent of "well i was TOTALLY GONNA join the army, but......" ??? guess what bucko, at the end of the day i have a degree and you don't. funny, that. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It is specifically BECAUSE of the bullshit requirements for classes that do NOT relate to my chosen field, that I don't HAVE a higher degree. I refused to play that game. is this the higher education equivalent of "well i was TOTALLY GONNA join the army, but......" ??? guess what bucko, at the end of the day i have a degree and you don't. funny, that. I know, and in spite of the fact that I don't think I make enough money, everyone keeps telling me I'm a one%er. 
Honestly, I think the amount of courses not specifically related to computer science was just about right. Being able to converse with coworkers and potential employers about a variety of subjects makes you a more interesting person and gives you different outlooks on solving problems than those that go to technical schools. I can tell the minute I pick up a high level design or some other documentation whether the writer paid attention in English. As to IT degrees, most of those guys should just go to trade schools. Only the very best can design infrastructure and actually solve problems using their knowledge. The rest just know how to plug in cables and reset passwords and follow the security policy. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:19:00 PM EDT
[#18]
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Yep, poor guy doesn't understand the value of being taught to write bullshit responses. Does not bode well for his career in .gov Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I was very uninterested in most of the General Ed classes. They ped to apathy which led to poor grades and ultimately me leaving school. I plan on going back, now that I have a job that will support the cost, but it blew my advisors mind that I was getting straight As in all my Major related 3&400 classes, but was failing North Dakota History 101. so you couldn't motivate yourself to write up some bullshit responses and at least squeak by? the problem is you, not "the system." Yep, poor guy doesn't understand the value of being taught to write bullshit responses. Does not bode well for his career in .gov Theres only so much bullshit you can do in a day. For someone who works full time and doesn't live on their computer its not always easy to even do homework. In the digital age, especially in the 100 level classes professors will email the class at 10pm. And give a homeworks assignment that's due in class the next day. Its more than just paying attention. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:21:28 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. Part of the reason you go to college is to develop a social network. For some colleges the primary interest in going is to meet well connected up-and-comings (Harvard, Yale, Princeton). Ultimate Frisbee is there just so you can meet the Frisbee bunnies.
Seriously.. its there so you can blow off steam while getting credits for it. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:24:37 PM EDT
[#20]
I did my undergrad in history with a minor in political science. I really appreciated the other social science and humanities classes that I took (ANTH, CAMS, SOCI, PHIL, PSYCH, ECON, GEOG) and feel that even the content isn't directly applicable that I apply some of the associated thinking skills. I am much more critical of some of the tangentially related professional courses that I took in grad school- though those courses can have some benefit....
Another interesting thing is that I always seemed to make unintended connections between content themes in various classes- even when it was unintentional. It really helped to enhance the learning experience. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:26:53 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. There is an underlying idea in western education, which is derived from the Greek (part. Athenian) tradition that a well rounded education includes both mental and physical development, which are intertwined. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:35:12 PM EDT
[#22]
I only had to take 9 electives to get my bachelors in chemical engineering, the rest of the program (the other ~100 credits) were rigidly laid out and the only choices I had were which section I was in (and I think 2 graduate-level classes I got to pick from a list of ~20).
3 of them had to be in the same field (I did pol sci, American Pol System, Liberalism vs Conservatism and Political Terrorism), with two being 300+ level, one had to be an English class (specifically, Contemporary American Literature for Engineers, I only read one of the three books, it was a round-table discussion class with a single research paper, I read the Sparknotes on the two books I didn't read and intentionally argued tangents such as the legality of marijuana and its illicit use in Kerouac's On The Road ) and a different one had to be a 600+ level math class. While not related to my major, they were interesting to delve into. Political Terrorism was probably my most favorite, within the first two weeks of class three Muslims tried to argue about Palestinian suffering and how Israel was a terrorist nation, only for there to be an IDF veteran in the class who pointed out the three of them were Jordanian and why didn't their country let them in.  The Jordanians dropped out before the next class. I was taking that class right as W was delivering his ultimatums to Iraq and thus that was our assigned topic, so my research paper was about the fate of Scott Speicher and how we owed it to him to do everything necessary and possible to bring him home.
ETA: Some of my wife's friends were in the ultimate frisbee club at our alma mater. I should've been in that club.  And the sailing club, a classmate was invited to spend the summer in the Med on some chick's parents' yacht that he met in the sailing club. Don't be a hermit. Find two clubs your freshman year and at least one new club every year thereafter.
Kharn |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:41:45 PM EDT
[#23]
Let me simply quote DK-Prof's oft-posted phrase in response to the OP.
lol 
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:42:41 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yep, poor guy doesn't understand the value of being taught to write bullshit responses. Does not bode well for his career in .gov Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I was very uninterested in most of the General Ed classes. They ped to apathy which led to poor grades and ultimately me leaving school. I plan on going back, now that I have a job that will support the cost, but it blew my advisors mind that I was getting straight As in all my Major related 3&400 classes, but was failing North Dakota History 101. so you couldn't motivate yourself to write up some bullshit responses and at least squeak by? the problem is you, not "the system." Yep, poor guy doesn't understand the value of being taught to write bullshit responses. Does not bode well for his career in .gov Getting an "education" isn't exclusive to learning new knowledge or skills. "Higher education" is a highly bureaucratic institution used to reward certain social choices and (if you ever leave) prepare you for a career in corporate and/or government servitude. HRM departments are pretty much and extension of this institution used to check compliance. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:43:46 PM EDT
[#25]
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"General Education" requirements are just a way to force funding in to programs that otherwise would not be self-sustaining. bingo. gotta pay for that dumb liberal shit not just the stuff you actually need to know! |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:44:54 PM EDT
[#26]
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have you been to college? i don't think you quite understand how it works Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. have you been to college? i don't think you quite understand how it works Are you serious? working on bachelors number 2 now. Yes they require you to take a 1/4 hour pe course and yes those are on the listed of available courses you can take. My question is why, due to the high expense of college, are these classes required? |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:45:47 PM EDT
[#27]
Yes, it's bull shit so non-desirable departments, like art, can steal money from people trying to get a real degree. To get an accounting degree, I didn't get to take an accounting class until my sophomore year, even then, it was just one each semester.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:48:09 PM EDT
[#28]
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Part of the reason you go to college is to develop a social network. For some colleges the primary interest in going is to meet well connected up-and-comings (Harvard, Yale, Princeton). Ultimate Frisbee is there just so you can meet the Frisbee bunnies.
Seriously.. its there so you can blow off steam while getting credits for it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. Part of the reason you go to college is to develop a social network. For some colleges the primary interest in going is to meet well connected up-and-comings (Harvard, Yale, Princeton). Ultimate Frisbee is there just so you can meet the Frisbee bunnies.
Seriously.. its there so you can blow off steam while getting credits for it. If I wanted to pay money to make friends I would have joined a Frat
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:48:25 PM EDT
[#29]
AS - IT
BS - IT BS - Psychology MS - undecided on major, starting in 2014 I currently have completed around 190 credits for my current three degrees and I can honestly say all classes were enjoyable. Some will say were they actually needed though, well yes they were because they were required by the colleges to complete the major and receive the paper. As someone already pointed out, college isn't trade school
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:50:59 PM EDT
[#30]
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Are you serious? working on bachelors number 2 now. Yes they require you to take a 1/4 hour pe course and yes those are on the listed of available courses you can take. My question is why, due to the high expense of college, are these classes required? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. have you been to college? i don't think you quite understand how it works Are you serious? working on bachelors number 2 now. Yes they require you to take a 1/4 hour pe course and yes those are on the listed of available courses you can take. My question is why, due to the high expense of college, are these classes required? can you please show me where in your course catalog it tells you that nobody is allowed to graduate until the take Golf 101? no. you're making a mountain out of a mole hill. yes, you may be required to take a physical education class. HOLY SHIT. find SOMETHING that you like. most colleges have such a wide range of PE classes that they even have offerings for fatbody fucktards that don't want to play real sports. I distinctly remember seeing things like billiards, "walking for fitness", karate.... if you can't find SOMETHING that appeals to you, then I really don't know what to tell you. you are not required to literally take GOLF in order to graduate; you just wanted to throw a temper tantrum on the forum to impress all of your friends. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:56:29 PM EDT
[#31]
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It's fucking stupid. People are taking out a ridiculous amount of loans for these 4 year degrees, but 1.5 - 2 years of it is useless. The history of rock and roll class I took really helped me become a doctor. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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A college degree isn't a technical certification. It includes the implication that the recipient is somewhat well rounded. It's fucking stupid. People are taking out a ridiculous amount of loans for these 4 year degrees, but 1.5 - 2 years of it is useless. The history of rock and roll class I took really helped me become a doctor. That's by their own choice, no one is forcing them to. I earned my first degree at night while working 40+ hours a day in a non climate controlled factory and also while raising a family. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 3:59:28 PM EDT
[#32]
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If I wanted to pay money to make friends I would have joined a Frat Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. Part of the reason you go to college is to develop a social network. For some colleges the primary interest in going is to meet well connected up-and-comings (Harvard, Yale, Princeton). Ultimate Frisbee is there just so you can meet the Frisbee bunnies.
Seriously.. its there so you can blow off steam while getting credits for it. If I wanted to pay money to make friends I would have joined a Frat I hear ya 
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:00:06 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
IMO, degrees should only require that you take classes that are genuinely relevant to that degree. If you're going for physics, you'll need to take math classes. Why would a speech class be needed? Biology? You'll need chemistry. Some math, too. But again, why a speech class? It is specifically BECAUSE of the bullshit requirements for classes that do NOT relate to my chosen field, that I don't HAVE a higher degree. I refused to play that game. The reason the colleges do it is really very simple: MONEY. Tuition fees. It stands to reason that they can make more money by forcing you to add a history class, a speech class, a social studies class, a phys ed class, and an elective to your list. I'd have gone for an EE degree which would have required (a) electronics and (b) higher math classes. Those are the important ones. With those, you WILL (if you study) earn your EE degree and be worthy of the title of engineer. I'd have been happy to pursue it if that was ALL that had been required. I disagree because without actual social classes could you imagine how introverted and socially awkward STEM guys like myself would be . Hell I earned earned another degree in human behavior just to figure out how to act around normal dumb people
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:00:37 PM EDT
[#34]
So let me get this straight. The same GD, which HATES subsidized education; HATES the current movement by some former college students that cannot find a good paying job after graduation and want to have their student loans forgiven; and that blames the later by saying they shouldn't have majored in such useless degrees like Art history or musical theory which do not allow people to land jobs, wants me to think it is OK to be forced take such useless classes, making it take longer to graduate, and ultimately cost more in the long run, just as long as it is in moderation? Just so I can "network" and "make new friends". I made plenty of friends in my normal classes, playing college football, attending parties, attending organized skeet/trap shoots (there was a club on campus that was NOT a required class, not a class at all, just a club), and taking my new friends to the range to shoot.
Ok...I got it
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:02:39 PM EDT
[#35]
No. They require too many stupid courses not related to the major.
There is a difference between a classical liberal education and a joke of a curriculum pretending to be a classical liberal education. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:03:41 PM EDT
[#36]
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can you please show me where in your course catalog it tells you that nobody is allowed to graduate until the take Golf 101? no. you're making a mountain out of a mole hill. yes, you may be required to take a physical education class. HOLY SHIT. find SOMETHING that you like. most colleges have such a wide range of PE classes that they even have offerings for fatbody fucktards that don't want to play real sports. I distinctly remember seeing things like billiards, "walking for fitness", karate.... if you can't find SOMETHING that appeals to you, then I really don't know what to tell you. you are not required to literally take GOLF in order to graduate; you just wanted to throw a temper tantrum on the forum to impress all of your friends. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. have you been to college? i don't think you quite understand how it works Are you serious? working on bachelors number 2 now. Yes they require you to take a 1/4 hour pe course and yes those are on the listed of available courses you can take. My question is why, due to the high expense of college, are these classes required? can you please show me where in your course catalog it tells you that nobody is allowed to graduate until the take Golf 101? no. you're making a mountain out of a mole hill. yes, you may be required to take a physical education class. HOLY SHIT. find SOMETHING that you like. most colleges have such a wide range of PE classes that they even have offerings for fatbody fucktards that don't want to play real sports. I distinctly remember seeing things like billiards, "walking for fitness", karate.... if you can't find SOMETHING that appeals to you, then I really don't know what to tell you. you are not required to literally take GOLF in order to graduate; you just wanted to throw a temper tantrum on the forum to impress all of your friends. You are the one escalating this into some kind of huge argument by putting words into people's mouths and attempting to get a rise out of me. Good day to you sir. "ignored" |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:07:24 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
So let me get this straight. The same GD, which HATES subsidized education; HATES the current movement by some former college students that cannot find a good paying job after graduation and want to have their student loans forgiven; and that blames the later by saying they shouldn't have majored in such useless degrees like Art history or musical theory which do not allow people to land jobs, wants me to think it is OK to be forced take such useless classes, making it take longer to graduate, and ultimately cost more in the long run, just as long as it is in moderation? Just so I can "network" and "make new friends". I made plenty of friends in my normal classes, playing college football, attending parties, attending organized skeet/trap shoots (there was a club on campus that was NOT a required class, not a class at all, just a club), and taking my new friends to the range to shoot. Ok...I got it Well... Yeah?
Just 'cause you take courses in things you don't need now doesn't mean that you are getting a concentration in them.. they are what.. 3 hours a piece? (grammar is fun!) You should have a huge list of things that you can choose from... you don't necessarily have to take upside down, underwater, basket-weaving if you don't want. Why don't you minor in pussy? find some course with lots of good looking girls and nail as many of them as you can.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:08:17 PM EDT
[#38]
Yup. Wasted 4 years of which could have been done in 2.
The whores n booze were fun tho.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:10:22 PM EDT
[#39]
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You are the one escalating this into some kind of huge argument by putting words into people's mouths and attempting to get a rise out of me. Good day to you sir. "ignored" Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Everyone in here arguing for a "well-rounded" education answer me this. What exactly dose a class in "golf" or "ultimate Frisbee" have to do with making you more well-rounded? Maybe for a major in some type of sports medicine or physical education...but a chemistry major? This is just the most extreme example I can think of, there are others. have you been to college? i don't think you quite understand how it works Are you serious? working on bachelors number 2 now. Yes they require you to take a 1/4 hour pe course and yes those are on the listed of available courses you can take. My question is why, due to the high expense of college, are these classes required? can you please show me where in your course catalog it tells you that nobody is allowed to graduate until the take Golf 101? no. you're making a mountain out of a mole hill. yes, you may be required to take a physical education class. HOLY SHIT. find SOMETHING that you like. most colleges have such a wide range of PE classes that they even have offerings for fatbody fucktards that don't want to play real sports. I distinctly remember seeing things like billiards, "walking for fitness", karate.... if you can't find SOMETHING that appeals to you, then I really don't know what to tell you. you are not required to literally take GOLF in order to graduate; you just wanted to throw a temper tantrum on the forum to impress all of your friends. You are the one escalating this into some kind of huge argument by putting words into people's mouths and attempting to get a rise out of me. Good day to you sir. "ignored" 
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:10:47 PM EDT
[#40]
No. A college degree is about getting a well rounded education.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:14:10 PM EDT
[#41]
Yes.
Then again, I don't look to college for my rounded education. Colleges do a poor job at this and there's no reason why I can't learn more and learn better without a fuckwit with an agenda grading me. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:15:04 PM EDT
[#42]
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You are supposed to come out of college with a "well-rounded" education. Yes, but many of the departments and their courses, at a college or university, hardly qualify as education, many are just about entertainment or nonsense and bullshit that people just made up. Fantasy is not education. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:16:52 PM EDT
[#43]
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Well... Yeah?
Just 'cause you take courses in things you don't need now doesn't mean that you are getting a concentration in them.. they are what.. 3 hours a piece? (grammar is fun!) You should have a huge list of things that you can choose from... you don't necessarily have to take upside down, underwater, basket-weaving if you don't want. Why don't you minor in pussy? find some course with lots of good looking girls and nail as many of them as you can. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So let me get this straight. The same GD, which HATES subsidized education; HATES the current movement by some former college students that cannot find a good paying job after graduation and want to have their student loans forgiven; and that blames the later by saying they shouldn't have majored in such useless degrees like Art history or musical theory which do not allow people to land jobs, wants me to think it is OK to be forced take such useless classes, making it take longer to graduate, and ultimately cost more in the long run, just as long as it is in moderation? Just so I can "network" and "make new friends". I made plenty of friends in my normal classes, playing college football, attending parties, attending organized skeet/trap shoots (there was a club on campus that was NOT a required class, not a class at all, just a club), and taking my new friends to the range to shoot. Ok...I got it Well... Yeah?
Just 'cause you take courses in things you don't need now doesn't mean that you are getting a concentration in them.. they are what.. 3 hours a piece? (grammar is fun!) You should have a huge list of things that you can choose from... you don't necessarily have to take upside down, underwater, basket-weaving if you don't want. Why don't you minor in pussy? find some course with lots of good looking girls and nail as many of them as you can. Just trying to cut out the fat man. Everyone's always complaining about the high cost of education. Why not cut some of the fluff? With a combination of cutting some of the fat and getting rid of the subsidies and remedial classes for people that have no business in college in the first place we might actually get somewhere. Colleges would lose some of the people who have no business being there (money wise and education wise) and might actually have to lower tuition to stay competitive. lol. that sounds like one of my old roomates. Maybe the first time I was in, but this time its all business. I'm too old and too married now. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:25:16 PM EDT
[#44]
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Just trying to cut out the fat man. Everyone's always complaining about the high cost of education. Why not cut some of the fluff? With a combination of cutting some of the fat and getting rid of the subsidies and remedial classes for people that have no business in college in the first place we might actually get somewhere. Colleges would lose some of the people who have no business being there (money wise and education wise) and might actually have to lower tuition to stay competitive. lol. that sounds like one of my old roomates. Maybe the first time I was in, but this time its all business. I'm too old and too married now. Those aren't bad ideas, frankly. I was just joking with you.  I'm all for cutting out the dross. In my opinion a small % of the dead weight exists in the secondary system is because the feds (and some states) give kick-backs for a certain number of "disadvantaged" folks. Anyway, it's a tough time to be an educator or researcher in a university environment.. a lot of federal money has dried up and many of the institutions are barely making it. I know that many research funding levels have been cut back to pre-1998 amounts and this is making things extremely difficult for any sort of grant funding.. although that's a federal thing. For that reason I think a lot of universities are trying really hard to find new avenues with which to draw in students and keep them. I really don't know where the various systems will end up in 20 years.. they are usually top heavy just like the federal government.
EDIT: Also, I think you're seeing things from the eyes of a guy that has been there and done that. You have to remember that the system is geared to kids out of high school or the military that haven't had these courses before. I think that the academic boards that come up with this stuff want to make sure that everyone is well rooted in the basics and also.. there are guidelines that they must meet in order to stay accredited. I think that's a national guideline. Not everyone is like you, with a primary degree going back in.. although I don't disagree with you.. I think they should cater more to other possibilities. If I were going back in today I wouldn't want to take extra courses either. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:29:52 PM EDT
[#45]
Lot's of people in tis thread who need to throw away tech certificate of whatever and go to college because THEY CAN'T FUCKING READ.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:38:25 PM EDT
[#46]
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College has evolved into a form a Trade Schools. If there was a place I could get a Finance degree that would be accepted by major employers that didn't involve psychology, or literature credits, I would take it and skip those classes. I can see the well rounded part, but I also see it more as revenue generation for most Colleges. Without a doubt. Some places are splitting 3hr classes into two 2hr, it goes over the same stuff but makes them more money. Or I would assume that's why they would do something like that. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:42:15 PM EDT
[#47]
I thought so at the time but looking back I am much more well-rounded after having taken them. Graduate school is not w/o them, just to a much lesser extent.
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Posted: 10/27/2013 4:55:27 PM EDT
[#48]
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<snip> EDIT: Also, I think you're seeing things from the eyes of a guy that has been there and done that. You have to remember that the system is geared to kids out of high school or the military that haven't had these courses before. I think that the academic boards that come up with this stuff want to make sure that everyone is well rooted in the basics and also.. there are guidelines that they must meet in order to stay accredited. I think that's a national guideline. Not everyone is like you, with a primary degree going back in.. although I don't disagree with you.. I think they should cater more to other possibilities. If I were going back in today I wouldn't want to take extra courses either. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: <snip> <snip> EDIT: Also, I think you're seeing things from the eyes of a guy that has been there and done that. You have to remember that the system is geared to kids out of high school or the military that haven't had these courses before. I think that the academic boards that come up with this stuff want to make sure that everyone is well rooted in the basics and also.. there are guidelines that they must meet in order to stay accredited. I think that's a national guideline. Not everyone is like you, with a primary degree going back in.. although I don't disagree with you.. I think they should cater more to other possibilities. If I were going back in today I wouldn't want to take extra courses either. I can see that. I did enjoy some of the classes that weren't relevant when I was going through the first time. They were easy As and Bs. Looking back now, some of it just seems like it was a huge money/time waste. I did try and take things that wouldn't just be a throwaway class (for instance I took a Brazilian jujitsu class for PE instead of the easier offered ones like golf or jogging). I do understand that they have to meet minimum standards. Reminds me of several classes I had in the past that gave a writing project due the end of the semester that seemed kind of out of place in the rest of the class format. In those cases several professors said "Sorry about this writing project, it is a government requirement for this course to meet a writing objective". Had to take a computer course the second time around too, which back then wasn't required. Good class, if you've never used Microsoft word before. To someone who had to write several reports weekly for their employment, it was a huge waste of time and money. They should have some kind of waiver test, that if you are competent with computers and pass the test, you won't have to take it. But then the university couldn't charge you for another 3 credit hour class. Had a conversation with someone in education a while ago who said college is there to teach you critical thinking skills. You learn how to do the job on the job. I can see that with my first degree, but not this one, we are learning the actual trade. Which others have stated would be better suited at a trade school. Too bad there is no trade school which can certify you, just colleges/universities. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 5:06:54 PM EDT
[#49]
short answer: i would like to have had 6-9 more hours in my area.
that said, a university is not a trade school. if someone wants a trade education, go do that. but there's too much emphasis on "useful", and not enough emphasis on being an educated citizen. over-specialization causes problems--if your only tool is a hammer, every problem starts looking like a nail. people need to take history courses. they need to take political science courses. they need to take psychology, sociology, and anthropology courses. and (of course) they need to take logic and philosophy courses. what they don't need is the presumption that they know enough about the world to decide what they don't need. if a student thinks that they know more about education than their educators do, then go educate yourself. i was finally confronted with contemporary student culture this semester. one of my lab students (geology) was having a hard time with a question, so i was talking her through the process so that she could understand it and work it out for herself. her response (and this is verbatim): "i don't need to understand this. just tell me what i need to know for the test." this is not a shot at the OP--you're just asking the question. but i'm here to tell you that yes, you need almost all of that stuff. it can be exasperating, i know. i despised the one college algebra course required for my BA. now i'm having to teach myself calculus and diffEQ, which is slightly less fun than getting sodomized with a saguaro. three years ago, i would have said that i didn't need higher math, because it wouldn't be useful for me. but now... on any given day, glance over the threads on page 1 of GD. at least half of the threads consist of things that people should have taken college courses for, but didn't. -people make claims about evolution, but have never studied science. -people make claims about science, but have never studied the history or philosophy of the discipline. -people make claims about group behavior, but have never taken a sociology course. -people make claims about individual behavior, but have never taken a psychology course. -people make claims about economics, but have never taken anything beyond macro. -people make claims about marx and smith, but have never read marx or smith. -people make claims about regional history, without having taken anything beyond world civ. -people make claims about logic, but have never studied it. -people make claims about religion, but have never studied theology or cultural anthropology. and my personal favorite, people make claims about "critical thinking", but don't even know what it is. these are all things that people need to know in order to be informed members of the american polity, but people don't learn them. it's easy to take the 'good will hunting' line that you can educate yourself for free off the web and public library, but it isn't the same thing. you're in control of self-guided learning, so there is no discipline to it--you're never challenged in the same way as you are in an exam or essay for a grade. maybe one person in a million can learn successfully in a self-taught environment. this is obviously a wandering post, which diverges from the spirit of the OP. i guess my point is that yes, it would be nice to have a focused degree plan with less 'extraneous' stuff. but when it comes right down to it, very little core curriculum is 'extraneous' to life as a citizen of the US. it may not be necessary for job qualification, but it's pretty important for life. |
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Posted: 10/27/2013 5:14:07 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The reason the colleges do it is really very simple: MONEY. Tuition fees. It stands to reason that they can make more money by forcing you to add a history class, a speech class, a social studies class, a phys ed class, and an elective to your list. this is just silly. they have to pay that faculty, as well--history profs don't work for free. google 'liberal arts' and the university model of education. learn the difference between a university and a college. if you want specialization, go to a college. a university is specifically geared towards a broad-based education, just like it has been since medieval times. a college is narrowly focused on specific fields. sounds like you should have gone to a college.
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