Democratic Senator responded about gun confiscation in N.O. (unbelievable response!) - Page 2

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Democratic Senator responded about gun confiscation in N.O. (unbelievable response!) (Page 2 of 2)

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:09:08 AM EDT

[#1]

Quoted:
The very statement is false. The Second Amendment does not GRANT the right, it states that the PRE-EXISTING right shall not be infringed.

The right is God-given, as no earthly agency conferred it upon us.

CJ

thanks for saving me some typing.

TXL

BIG +1

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:11:27 AM EDT

[#2]

And dusty_c, don't give up, just understand that you are wrong.

TXL

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:19:13 AM EDT

[#3]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Senator Pryor probably means well, but he shows a lack of basic understanding of Constitutional tenets. If anyone plans on writing him, cite United States v. Cruikshank, 92 U.S. 542 (1876)...

"The right to bear arms is not granted by the Constitution; neither is it in any manner dependent upon that instrument for its existence. The second amendment means no more than that it shall not be infringed by Congress, and has no other effect than to restrict the powers of the national government."

www.guncite.com/court/fed/sc/92us542.html

Couldn't have said it better byself!

I've seen a lot of references to this being an important "distinction," but I think the word we've been looking for, and talking around is 'enumeration.'

The Bill of Rights enumerates certain rights, thus defining them, and in no-uncertain terms, spelling those rights out to Government. The Bill of Rights is like the proverbial line in the sand: "Whatever the government we create does in the future, it absolutely will not be allowed by the people to violate these rights we here write."

I'll cede the point that in the legal arena, the 2nd amendment is the best defense of a right that "predates" the government, but it only works that way legally because the judges who are responsible for interpreting laws understand the distinction between "priveleges granted" and rights enumerated.

The Constitution is both a restriction on governmental powers and a grant of governmental powers. The "restriction" part is there to override previous common law conceptions of inherent governmental powers. In either case, it is focused on what the government can and can't do -- kinda like a contract. "We give you these powers and you do these things for us."

All powers not granted to the government are ultimately retained by the People. This principle is frequently confused -- even by lawmakers.

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:20:37 AM EDT

[#4]

Smoke in Mirrors....

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:21:13 AM EDT

[#5]

Quoted:
The very statement is false. The Second Amendment does not GRANT the right, it states that the PRE-EXISTING right shall not be infringed.

The right is God-given, as no earthly agency conferred it upon us.

CJ

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:22:04 AM EDT

[#6]

Quoted:
Quoted:
I complained when they took the firearms up in New Orleans to my Democratic Senator.

got this in the mail today:

I understand your concern with some recent news reports about gun confiscation that has taken place in the wake of Hurricane Katrina. Citizens of the United States must be afforded all of their rights, and I hold the right to bear arms, granted to us under the Second Amendment, as vital to our existence as a nation. In an effort to protect these rights, I assure you that I will research this matter fully, and as a member of the Senate Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Commitee, I will have the opportunity to question officials regarding the response to the disaster. I will keep your concerns in mind during this process.

only quoted part, but how's that for pro-2nd?

eta: senator is Mark Pryor of Arkansas.
Pryor is an Arkansas democrat. Bill wasn't. Pryor knows how us Arkies feel.

This is one damn funny post for that's exactly how TN felt about Al Gore!

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:23:42 AM EDT

[#7]

Quoted:
Awesome!

My senator (Hutchison - R) gave me back a b.s. letter about "thank you for your concern about Hurricane Katrina. Lots of people are in need of assistance and its so tragic, blah blah blah." not one word about gun confiscation or the violation of rights. what a crock of shit.

Yep, these slimes are really "representing" you aren't they.

Fuck them.

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:27:52 AM EDT

[#8]

Quoted:
Quoted:
The very statement is false. The Second Amendment does not GRANT the right, it states that the PRE-EXISTING right shall not be infringed.

The right is God-given, as no earthly agency conferred it upon us.

CJ

Easy on the petty semantics.

They're not petty. Govt. does not grant us rights, only God does. All govt. can do is restrict them or take them away.

Posted: 1/5/2006 11:30:42 AM EDT

[#9]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The very statement is false. The Second Amendment does not GRANT the right, it states that the PRE-EXISTING right shall not be infringed.

The right is God-given, as no earthly agency conferred it upon us.

CJ

Easy on the petty semantics.

It's not petty semantics, it is a fundamental part of the Constitution. For you to not understand that is part of the problem.

G
If the second amendmant doesn't grant us the RKBA, what does? Legally it does. Period, end of story. If you want to say it's a god given right fine. But The 2nd amendment is exactly what grants us this right. For you not to understand that is a problem.

the second amendment is the written record of the right that god endowed us with, and that our government was instituted to secure for us. some people say "you are being petty, what was said was good enough". i say,"how can anything but the pure truth be good enough?". it is words and phrases repeated numerous times that form someones thoughts... therefore give no quarter to half truths or any kind of shading whatsoever of the pure, easily understood truth. one little step in the wrong direction may seem like no big deal, but it is still a step in the wrong direction. and those steps add up.

Posted: 1/7/2006 9:41:06 AM EDT

[#10]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
The very statement is false. The Second Amendment does not GRANT the right, it states that the PRE-EXISTING right shall not be infringed.

The right is God-given, as no earthly agency conferred it upon us.

CJ

Easy on the petty semantics.

They're not petty. Govt. does not grant us rights, only God does. All govt. can do is restrict them or take them away.

Agreed!
If we get into the mindset that our government is in charge, then we are lost. Lets not have the inmates run the asylum!

We are in charge. We delegate our power and authority to our government to act in our interests.

Posted: 1/7/2006 9:48:53 AM EDT

[#11]

He is rated by the NRA with a D and according to awbansunset.com he voted to extend the ban. In 2002 his gun platform said he was opposed to any new gun restrictions according to isues2000.org.

Posted: 1/7/2006 9:55:28 AM EDT

[#12]

Quoted:
Quoted:
When a NE democrap says that I'll be pleased. It is still nice to hear. But is he just telling you what you want to hear?
Pryor has a pretty good rep in Arkansas.

Pryor is full of shit, he supported the renewal.

Posted: 1/7/2006 9:57:32 AM EDT

[#13]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Awesome!

My senator (Hutchison - R) gave me back a b.s. letter about "thank you for your concern about Hurricane Katrina. Lots of people are in need of assistance and its so tragic, blah blah blah." not one word about gun confiscation or the violation of rights. what a crock of shit.

I got the exact same letter from mine. He just blew right around my concern about gun confiscation.

Asshole.

NONE of AR's reps are worth a dime.

Posted: 1/29/2006 9:46:28 PM EDT

[#14]

this great democrat senator you speak of........

January 27, 2006
Press Release

Statement by Senator Mark Pryor On Judge Alito’s Confirmation to the Supreme Court

When I ran for the Senate, I said there would be times when I agreed with the President and times when I would not, but that I would always vote in the best interest of Arkansas. There is no doubt in my mind that Judge Alito is a credentialed jurist for this position, and carries with him the proper judicial temperament to sit on our Nation’s highest court. However, intellect alone is not sufficient to fill this lifetime appointment. I believe a Supreme Court Justice must also exhibit a consistent ability to be fair and impartial. While trying to give deference to the President, I cannot ignore that Judge Alito’s record demonstrates his tendency to legislate from the bench. In my mind, this unmet criterion disqualifies Judge Alito from receiving my vote. Finally, while I personally cannot support Judge Alito’s confirmation on the Supreme Court, there is not a smoking gun in his past that would warrant “extraordinary circumstances” and subsequently a filibuster against his nomination. I have faith in the thirteen other members who forged the “Gang of 14.” In exchange for preserving the minority party’s right to filibuster a judge, we all agreed a higher threshold must be met before this action is taken. Our agreement also called on President Bush to seek meaningful consultation with the Senate before nominating a judge. I believe the Administration worked with the Senate, as a co-equal branch of government, to find a consensus nominee in Chief Justice John Roberts. I was proud to vote for Chief Justice Roberts, and I believe he will conduct himself as a man of the court, not as a man of politics. In addition to Justice Roberts, I have also supported 116 judges nominated by President Bush. But I simply do not have this same degree of confidence in Judge Alito. ###

Posted: 1/29/2006 10:40:25 PM EDT

[#15]

Mark Pryor also voted to EXTEND the AWB in the Senate. He and Blanche Lambert-Lincoln are NOT gun friendly at all.

His daddy supported the ban back in 1994: I still have a copy of Pryor's response back in 1994. In it, he promised that "this legislation will prevent assault weapons and handguns from being available to children..."

Funny, I emailed him right after Columbine to ask him about that statement, but he never replied (he was out of the Senate by that time...). I did however see fit to include that quote to Mark Pryor, as a reference to the "sins of the father". He also did not choose to respond.

Molon Labe!

Posted: 1/29/2006 10:44:44 PM EDT

[#16]

My right to own a firearm is granted by God? Well thats certainly an.....interesting.....way to look at it.

Posted: 1/29/2006 11:38:57 PM EDT

[#17]

Quoted:
My right to own a firearm is granted by God? Well thats certainly an.....interesting.....way to look at it.

You went to public school, didn't you?

Posted: 1/29/2006 11:53:05 PM EDT

[#18]

Quoted:
Quoted:
Anyone who thinks that our Constitution grants us rights has no place in government.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights

The Constitution is a legally binding document. The Declaration Of Independence is an editorial.

Posted: 1/30/2006 5:04:55 AM EDT

[#19]

Quoted:
Quoted:
My right to own a firearm is granted by God? Well thats certainly an.....interesting.....way to look at it.

You went to public school, didn't you?

Hard to be an atheist 2nd Amendment activist isn't it.

Posted: 1/31/2006 10:51:24 AM EDT

[#20]

Quoted:
My right to own a firearm is granted by God? Well thats certainly an.....interesting.....way to look at it.

OK... how did we come to have our unalienable rights? One must answer this foundational question before a meaningful discussion can take place.

Discussing rights that are "granted" by government is useless. Anything a government gives can be taken away or witheld - which completely invalidates the concept of unalienable rights.

The founders of this country answered this question by the concept of a Creator (or God); therefor only our Creator could take away our rights.

Governments often infringe upon the rights of people. Their argument is that whatever is being restricted is not a right. Freedom of speech and freedom to worship (or not) are quite often restricted. These rights still exist, its just that they are being repressed.

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Democratic Senator responded about gun confiscation in N.O. (unbelievable response!) (Page 2 of 2)

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