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Posted: 10/2/2014 7:38:23 AM EDT
[#1]
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I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families.  Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Poppycock. Wages for govt employees are no longer lower then private sector jobs which have taken a hit over the past decade. And I don't think you have taken a look at the cutbacks in the beni's in the private sector recently either. I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families. It sounds like you need to get another job. Don't waste your life at a job that sucks, in the vain hope of a distant pension that may, or may not materialize. Are these high paying engineer jobs within your commutable area? Go out and get one. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 7:40:02 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Poppycock. Wages for govt employees are no longer lower then private sector jobs which have taken a hit over the past decade. And I don't think you have taken a look at the cutbacks in the beni's in the private sector recently either. I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families. Why aren't you in the private sector, then? Seems like a dumb decision to me. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 7:47:21 AM EDT
[#3]
Quoted: A bankruptcy judge handed CalPERS and organized labor a decision they’ve long feared Wednesday, declaring the city of Stockton has the right to reduce pension payments and even sever ties with the powerful pension fund. The verbal ruling from U.S. Bankruptcy Judge Christopher Klein was groundbreaking. It pierced CalPERS’ aura of invincibility and made clear, for the first time, that public employee pensions in California aren’t sacred. Two years after Stockton filed for bankruptcy protection, buried under more than $200 million in bond debt, a judge has declared that a municipality can walk away from its obligations to the California Public Employees’ Retirement System. Klein’s ruling was prompted by a legal protest from Franklin Templeton Investments, which is due to be repaid just $4 million on a $36 million loan it made to the city during better economic times. Franklin wants a better deal from Stockton even if it comes at the expense of the pensions. Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/2014/10/01/6752346/calpers-bankruptcy-stockton.html#storylink=cpy http://www.sacbee.com/2014/10/01/6752346/calpers-bankruptcy-stockton.html Yet Detroit's and Michigan's case went the different way. Lets see if this goes to SCOTUS.
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Posted: 10/2/2014 7:50:28 AM EDT
[#4]
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It sounds like you need to get another job. Don't waste your life at a job that sucks, in the vain hope of a distant pension that may, or may not materialize. Are these high paying engineer jobs within your commutable area? Go out and get one. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Poppycock. Wages for govt employees are no longer lower then private sector jobs which have taken a hit over the past decade. And I don't think you have taken a look at the cutbacks in the beni's in the private sector recently either. I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families. It sounds like you need to get another job. Don't waste your life at a job that sucks, in the vain hope of a distant pension that may, or may not materialize. Are these high paying engineer jobs within your commutable area? Go out and get one. Maybe he actually wants to retire someday? Good luck doing that with your 401K, and BTW off to walmart to enjoy your golden years as a door greeter because the stock market just tanked. And now the big question, many gov workers stay there because of the pension, if you think gov sucks now just think how bad it will suck if those people leave and new employees are hired that do not have the pension incentive and cant find work elsewhere. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 7:55:50 AM EDT
[#5]
In a death match between words on paper agreed to by politicians and union leaders vs. math and his tag team partner the universe/reality,
who do you put your money on? I'm buying everyone who participates in this thread a new 2015 Camaro. There it is, in writing. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 7:57:01 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So if this spreads you guys are ok with public employees getting raises now to what their counterpart makes in the private sector since the main benefit of working there is gone? Outside of California and a few NE states most state/local gov employees make between 1/2 and 2/3s less than their private sector counterparts. I do not mean DMV clerks but the people that get the roads built, services provided and organizations function: engineers, planners, IT, accountants, auditors, lawyers, etc. Taken from the FDOC thread: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1668197_UPDATED_WITH_NEW_STORY___Friday_Night_Massacre___32_Fired___Florida_Prison_Problems.html&page=5 "Sounds like the SOP for most of Florida's state and county employees. Offer shit pay/benefits - get shit applicants. .Gov hires idiots thinking they're saving money. ($) Attempt to train idiots into decent employees. ($) Already good employees get trained to death and have more duties pushed on them. ($$) Idiots need non-stop supervision from their "supervisors" and good, skilled employees. ($$) Supervisors spin in their chairs while Rome burns. ($$$) Those worth a damn take all the training, skill, and experience, and move on to greener pastures. ($$$$) Stupid people then do stupid things wasting more money. ($$$$$) .Gov agencies gets sued and whatever "savings" they had are now lost ($$$$$$$$$$) .Gov officials and elected representatives act confused on why there's a money problem, even though they already lined their pockets with kickbacks from contracts and bonuses from being soooo effective. ($$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$) "The People" bitch that the government doesn't work, and want budgets slashed even further. (Priceless) Wash - rinse - repeat. I work in a school district with 10-15% turnover in a year. The Sheriff's Office isn't much better. Look like the DOC finally had a massive zip it popped" |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 7:59:57 AM EDT
[#7]
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Then why work in them? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Good. Government jobs shouldn't be cushy, well-paid positions. Then why work in them? Aww.....see. Now you are getting with the program. A reduction in the number of government employees is not a bad thing. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:01:00 AM EDT
[#8]
Here in FL most Chiefs and Sheriffs dont make that much! But I guess when you consider you can buy a nice house here (Northeast Florida) for 100-200K and a nice house in Cali is what 750K or some BS then maybe it is reasonable for Cali. California is such a weird fuckn place I dont think you can compare salaries there with anyplace else in the US since everything costs so much.
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Tell me where a guy with a GED can make 140K in the private sector? one of my friends who dropped out of HS made that last year at a Bay Area PD, These unrealist bloated salaries are whats bankrupting these cities. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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So if this spreads you guys are ok with public employees getting raises now to what their counterpart makes in the private sector since the main benefit of working there is gone? Outside of California and a few NE states most state/local gov employees make between 1/2 and 2/3s less than their private sector counterparts. I do not mean DMV clerks but the people that get the roads built, services provided and organizations function: engineers, planners, IT, accountants, auditors, lawyers, etc. Taken from the FDOC thread: http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_1_5/1668197_UPDATED_WITH_NEW_STORY___Friday_Night_Massacre___32_Fired___Florida_Prison_Problems.html&page=5 "Sounds like the SOP for most of Florida's state and county employees. Offer shit pay/benefits - get shit applicants. .Gov hires idiots thinking they're saving money. ($) Attempt to train idiots into decent employees. ($) Already good employees get trained to death and have more duties pushed on them. ($$) Idiots need non-stop supervision from their "supervisors" and good, skilled employees. ($$) Supervisors spin in their chairs while Rome burns. ($$$) Those worth a damn take all the training, skill, and experience, and move on to greener pastures. ($$$$) Stupid people then do stupid things wasting more money. ($$$$$) .Gov agencies gets sued and whatever "savings" they had are now lost ($$$$$$$$$$) .Gov officials and elected representatives act confused on why there's a money problem, even though they already lined their pockets with kickbacks from contracts and bonuses from being soooo effective. ($$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$) "The People" bitch that the government doesn't work, and want budgets slashed even further. (Priceless) Wash - rinse - repeat. I work in a school district with 10-15% turnover in a year. The Sheriff's Office isn't much better. Look like the DOC finally had a massive zip it popped" |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:01:20 AM EDT
[#9]
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Please tell us more about how you were forced at gunpoint to apply for a government job. You know, instead of applying to the private sector. Not all government jobs are low-skill or can be done by just anyone. Government pay is already less for comparable skilled positions. The only attraction is more job security/stability. Take that away, and the government won't have any way to attract decent employees. You don't want that for their skilled positions.....then again, I think your goal is to do just that..... |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:01:27 AM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sigh....The outrage stems from .gov unions. Don't want pension problems, don't allow .gov unions and don't allow pension funds to be put into general fund projects. If a state is using pension funds to repair roads and such (general fund) then they need to do what is necessary to make the pension fund whole. In right to work states most state .gov employees contribute greatly to their retirement fund. Nothing more than a 401K really with a few added protetions. A lot more to it than that. These defined-benefit pensions rely on specific investment return averages to keep up with the inflated promises by politicians to buy the gov't union votes. Even small dips in the market have an impact on them, the market crash a few years ago did massive damage to them. The ultra-low interest rates of today guarantee that safe investment returns are ultra-low as well - far below what would be required to keep pace with the promised benefits.
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:02:19 AM EDT
[#11]
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This. Taken to its logical conclusion--be prepared to have the dumbest fuckers that have ever walked this earth working at every booth at the DMV, for the rest of your life. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Taken to its logical conclusion--be prepared to have the dumbest fuckers that have ever walked this earth working at every booth at the DMV, for the rest of your life. How would that be any different that what we have now at the DMV? |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:02:56 AM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryThat's a really great article. People should read it. ESPECIALLY, those employed by Federal, State, and Local Governments. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:06:24 AM EDT
[#13]
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Then the federal government will start seizing 401K's and Roths/IRA's. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Military pensions are next. Then the federal government will start seizing 401K's and Roths/IRA's. I came to post this, will GD wring it's hands when the GOV takes private investments accounts. Because you know the rich got them off the backs of the people. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:06:30 AM EDT
[#14]
DMV clerks are not the problem, if they were not there they would probably be flipping burgers. It is the people that get the roads built, services provided and make organizations function: engineers, planners, IT, accountants, auditors, lawyers, etc. Most of these are NOT union and having good ones vs bad ones can make a big difference in how well an agency functions. Instead of a race to the bottom for salary and benefits these are the people you want to be hiring the best of because they will be the ones spending the money you pay in taxes and making sure you get the services you need and paid for.
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How would that be any different that what we have now at the DMV? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Taken to its logical conclusion--be prepared to have the dumbest fuckers that have ever walked this earth working at every booth at the DMV, for the rest of your life. How would that be any different that what we have now at the DMV? |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:11:16 AM EDT
[#15]
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Yep, The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Good. Yep, The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. That's just stupid. I guess everyone in the military should just get a private money market fund. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:12:23 AM EDT
[#16]
The only issue I have with this is sets an extremely bad precedent. Now
that they know pensions can be severed and they aren't legally bound to fulfill their obligation to retirees , every shithead politician (that means all of them) in State/Local government will intentionally underfund pension plans and funnel the money to social welfare programs. Then, when they go bankrupt, they can wash their hands of the whole thing. Think about it. Lets screw over those who worked for a living, and instead spend the money (i.e. buy votes) on the welfare leeched and every other bullshit social welfare program. As much as I hate Unions, this does not bode well for the future... |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:13:30 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Poppycock. Wages for govt employees are no longer lower then private sector jobs which have taken a hit over the past decade. And I don't think you have taken a look at the cutbacks in the beni's in the private sector recently either. I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:14:31 AM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Simple solution. Get another job. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Poppycock. Wages for govt employees are no longer lower then private sector jobs which have taken a hit over the past decade. And I don't think you have taken a look at the cutbacks in the beni's in the private sector recently either. I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families. Again I have to ask: Many gov workers stay there because of the pension, if you think gov sucks now just think how bad it will suck if those people leave and new employees are hired that do not have the pension incentive and cant find work elsewhere. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:16:18 AM EDT
[#19]
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Maybe he actually wants to retire someday? Good luck doing that with your 401K, and BTW off to walmart to enjoy your golden years as a door greeter because the stock market just tanked. And now the big question, many gov workers stay there because of the pension, if you think gov sucks now just think how bad it will suck if those people leave and new employees are hired that do not have the pension incentive and cant find work elsewhere. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Poppycock. Wages for govt employees are no longer lower then private sector jobs which have taken a hit over the past decade. And I don't think you have taken a look at the cutbacks in the beni's in the private sector recently either. I am an engineer for the state, and get paid about half of what I would in the private sector. And as far as state agencies go, my agency has the lowest paid engineers of all other state agencies. My benefits suck; my insurance is so lousy, that I have to go outside to get better coverage. My pension is not impressive. My company offers no other retirement funding; no IRAs, no price matching, nothing. If I knew that I was going to have my pension pulled (which I might add, is taken out of my paycheck monthly) I would quit yesterday. But yeah, screw all .gov employees and their families. It sounds like you need to get another job. Don't waste your life at a job that sucks, in the vain hope of a distant pension that may, or may not materialize. Are these high paying engineer jobs within your commutable area? Go out and get one. Maybe he actually wants to retire someday? Good luck doing that with your 401K, and BTW off to walmart to enjoy your golden years as a door greeter because the stock market just tanked. And now the big question, many gov workers stay there because of the pension, if you think gov sucks now just think how bad it will suck if those people leave and new employees are hired that do not have the pension incentive and cant find work elsewhere. My traditional pension Did go away, replaced by a 401k. And guess what? We are all still here, working as hard as ever. The taxpayers were never supposed to make each one of you into a Millionaire. I'm not sure how that whole expectation came about, but it's not realistic. The money just isn't there. Never was. It was a Lie, the whole time. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:16:34 AM EDT
[#20]
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Tell me where a guy with a GED can make 140K in the private sector? one of my friends who dropped out of HS made that last year at a Bay Area PD, These unrealist bloated salaries are whats bankrupting these cities. Who the hell did he blow to get a Bay Area PD gig at that pay grade with just a GED?! I've got more education than that plus some prior experience, and I was having to bust ass for an entry-level position in that vicinity for at best, half that pay including value of benefits. Didn't get it, heard the guy who got the gig had far better quals than me. Last 3-4 years, competition for the well-paid slots at those agencies has been pretty steep. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:17:45 AM EDT
[#21]
While i agree Government should never have been involved in pensions.......the die is cast.
This will not end well for everyone....(including those not working for the state) Pensions are the cancer that was keeping the patient from immediately dieing. If you cut out the cancer there will be not be enough organs left to sustain the patient. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:19:04 AM EDT
[#22]
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Including military? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Good. Yep, The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Including military? Whats good for the goose and all that...... |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:19:06 AM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The only issue I have with this is sets an extremely bad precedent. Now that they know pensions can be severed and they aren't legally bound to fulfill their obligation to retirees , every shithead politician (that means all of them) in State/Local government will intentionally underfund pension plans and funnel the money to social welfare programs. Then, when they go bankrupt, they can wash their hands of the whole thing. Think about it. Lets screw over those who worked for a living, and instead spend the money (i.e. buy votes) on the welfare leeched and every other bullshit social welfare program. As much as I hate Unions, this does not bode well for the future... Ding ! Ding! Ding! This guy gets it. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:19:33 AM EDT
[#24]
 surprised ? |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:22:00 AM EDT
[#25]
Has anyone in this thread spent any real time in Stockton?
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:22:40 AM EDT
[#26]
Interesting times.
So what do we tell people who have worked 40-50 years and are 68 years old and then the pension they were expecting is pulled out from underneath them? Do we say go to hell? Do we put them on on welfare and medicade? Do we shoot them? Just a fair question. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:23:05 AM EDT
[#27]
I'm on PERS and collecting my retirement from them. That said, I don't expect PERS to be around in a few years. PERS investors have been caught accepting bribes to influence their decisions. One questionable investment was the purchase of two New York buildings from the Carlysle Group. This is after the housing crash and while QE has artificially kept housing afloat.
Anyway, I've taken precautions to safeguard myself in the event of PERS bankruptcy and the bankruptcy of the city that is supposed to take over after PERS goes buh-bye.. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:25:30 AM EDT
[#28]
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Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. This, I am an engineer, and have been offered double my salary by a private firm. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:25:54 AM EDT
[#29]
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Good. FPNI |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:30:02 AM EDT
[#30]
I just want to know how many politicians borrowed money from those plans and wrote IOU's. Lord only knows how many of those rat bastards had their hands in the cookie jar to fund their pet projects.
Horrible decision. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:32:56 AM EDT
[#31]
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I just want to know how many politicians borrowed money from those plans and wrote IOU's. Lord only knows how many of those rat bastards had their hands in the cookie jar to fund their pet projects. Horrible decision. Have you ever seen those politicians government provided pensions along with their health care deal? |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:33:32 AM EDT
[#32]
It's funny how many people think govt employees are all knocking down 6 figures and are triple protected by unions at every level
Gr |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:35:30 AM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I came to post this, will GD wring it's hands when the GOV takes private investments accounts. Because you know the rich got them off the backs of the people. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Military pensions are next. Then the federal government will start seizing 401K's and Roths/IRA's. I came to post this, will GD wring it's hands when the GOV takes private investments accounts. Because you know the rich got them off the backs of the people. So you don't understand the difference between a private retirement account and a taxpayer funded public pension????
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:37:37 AM EDT
[#34]
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It's funny how many people think govt employees are all knocking down 6 figures and are triple protected by unions at every level Gr Not really funny. It's GD and everyone here is a rocket scientist with $1,000,000 in savings and have 500,000 rounds of .22LR put back. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:37:40 AM EDT
[#35]
Open.georgia.gov
Tells you how much every state employee including teachers make in georgia Gr |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:37:51 AM EDT
[#36]
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Good. Government jobs shouldn't be cushy, well-paid positions. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Good. Government jobs shouldn't be cushy, well-paid positions. Then, however will the government attract the best and brightest!
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:39:50 AM EDT
[#37]
Public Employee Unions = Democrat Party.
Take union dues => Fund Democrat Candidates campaigns to get elected. => Democrat politicians then create laws shield public employee unions from oversight/regulation/discipline. ==> Ultimate Result? Crime ridden, bankrupt cities. Look at any city in the USA with a strong public employee union and you will see a high crime rate, failing schools, bankrupt budgets with Democrat leadership. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:40:48 AM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Then, however will the government attract the best and brightest! Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Good. Government jobs shouldn't be cushy, well-paid positions. Then, however will the government attract the best and brightest! If the current state of the gov't is the result of paying for the best and brightest I think maybe a change is in order.
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:40:59 AM EDT
[#39]
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I don't agree with this. A contract is a contract. Although unfortunate, contracts get broken during bankruptcy. Typically, there is an order in who gets paid. This is why people were furious over the GM bailout. They didn't follow the bankruptcy law order. This type of thing has been happening for years in the private sector. The appropriate response should have come earlier banding together to demand the city/employer remain solvent. It's too late for that now. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:44:39 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Interesting times. So what do we tell people who have worked 40-50 years and are 68 years old and then the pension they were expecting is pulled out from underneath them? Do we say go to hell? Do we put them on on welfare and medicade? Do we shoot them? Just a fair question. It won't get pulled out entirely, but it will get cut (well if they want to stay solvent). Same as some private sector pensions.
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:44:46 AM EDT
[#41]
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Military pensions are next. They are being considered for future recruits. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:51:49 AM EDT
[#42]
Meh, Illinois has close to 100B in unfunded pension liabilities. That's how my state rolls.......
Illinois, spending like there's no tomorrow. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:56:44 AM EDT
[#43]
This writing has been on the wall along time.
If you are young, don't kid yourself that you are going to be able to take the "safe" government job and be able to bank on that retirement or the promised benefits (health insurance, etc). You will have to save for your own retirement too. If you are old and are already in the system? Well, I feel bad for you. I have family members who are in this boat now. What they were banking on and what they are actually going to get is allot different. Its the reality of working for 30 years and being retired for 30 years is just not financially sustainable. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 8:57:36 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Poppycock. Wages for govt employees are no longer lower then private sector jobs which have taken a hit over the past decade. And I don't think you have taken a look at the cutbacks in the beni's in the private sector recently either. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Poppycock. Wages for govt employees are no longer lower then private sector jobs which have taken a hit over the past decade. And I don't think you have taken a look at the cutbacks in the beni's in the private sector recently either. Yeah. Alright. Okay.  The only reason to take a state/fed job is for the retirement. My private sector colleagues make (on average) - make $30,000 a year more than I do (*almost* double my salary- $48,500). The only difference being I don't have to live in the city and I started with a lot more vacation time. Those two things were more important than pay to me. I have no union representative. I am not part of a union. When push comes to shove at my workplace I am not factored in and considered "replaceable". I get no tenure and if I get fired, that's it. If shit hits the fan, it is my ass on the line. 12% of my paycheck every week gets sucked into the pension system. But please, tell me how my job works. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 9:00:13 AM EDT
[#45]
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Aww.....see. Now you are getting with the program. A reduction in the number of government employees is not a bad thing. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Good. Government jobs shouldn't be cushy, well-paid positions. Then why work in them? Aww.....see. Now you are getting with the program. A reduction in the number of government employees is not a bad thing. It depends what the public wants done. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 9:05:11 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Half of the point to some of these zombies working for the government isn't just the retirement package...... it is because they basically can't get fired. You pretty much need to be a headstanding, hand grenade throwing, kid diddler to even get a demotion at some of these places. Teachers pretty much have to sleep with minors and that is about the only firing offense. And how many LEO get fired for misconduct? a tiny percent. And on and on and on....... |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 9:07:44 AM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
This writing has been on the wall along time. If you are young, don't kid yourself that you are going to be able to take the "safe" government job and be able to bank on that retirement or the promised benefits (health insurance, etc). You will have to save for your own retirement too. If you are old and are already in the system? Well, I feel bad for you. I have family members who are in this boat now. What they were banking on and what they are actually going to get is allot different. Its the reality of working for 30 years and being retired for 30 years is just not financially sustainable. Like it was for almost everybody that ever lived before the notion of 'retirement' came about in the last century. |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 9:07:59 AM EDT
[#48]
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Yeap. Defined contribution only. Except the contract is written between politicians and union leaders who hold a huge sway in CA elections, with no independent evaluation or fiscal reality being forced on them. That's how we get stuck with things like pension spiking and letting people retire after 20 years so they can start a second career while double-dipping. Kharn Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Good. Yep, The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Including military? Yeap. Defined contribution only. Quoted:
I don't agree with this. A contract is a contract. Except the contract is written between politicians and union leaders who hold a huge sway in CA elections, with no independent evaluation or fiscal reality being forced on them. That's how we get stuck with things like pension spiking and letting people retire after 20 years so they can start a second career while double-dipping. Kharn This contract also put money back in the hands of politicians in the form of votes and political advertising |
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Posted: 10/2/2014 9:11:19 AM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If the current state of the gov't is the result of paying for the best and brightest I think maybe a change is in order. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
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The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. Then there would be no reason to work at any level of government. The whole point of government work is the sweet retirement package. Otherwise, you spend your career doing a job with below average pay and benefits compared to the private sector (for most employees). At that point, anyone working for the government would be an IDIOT to waste their life in the public sector. Good. Government jobs shouldn't be cushy, well-paid positions. Then, however will the government attract the best and brightest!
If the current state of the gov't is the result of paying for the best and brightest I think maybe a change is in order. The current state of the government has little to do with people who work for the government, and more to do with who has been elected (and the shit choices that voters are provided). Let's not forget that most of the federal budget that isn't the DOD is welfare expenses, which are only going to rise. Government employees, at least on the Fed level, are minuscule in comparison to this expense. But go ahead and rag on people who are working. That ought to get more people employed and off the dole..... 
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Posted: 10/2/2014 9:11:20 AM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
That's just stupid. I guess everyone in the military should just get a private money market fund. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Good. Yep, The government - all of it, including federal, state, and local - should not be providing pensions to anyone. That's just stupid. I guess everyone in the military should just get a private money market fund. They'd be better off than if the left it in the hands of the government. BTW, during the sequester guess whose money was spent to fund the government? Federal pensions (including the military) |
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