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Link Posted: 12/8/2013 3:45:04 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By glocke12:
OP, I hope you have a suppressor, and if you don't you should just practice saying "WHUT? " now.

Unless I were living in Somalia, an AR anything would be my last choice for HD.
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Why is that?

Shorter and more maneuverable than a shotgun.

Greater ammo capacity than a shotgun or pistol.

Much more capable round than the typical automatic handgun.

Faster follow ups than a shotgun or handgun.

Less chance of overpenitration than buckshot or a handgun.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 3:51:28 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By WillAndrews:


Why is that?

Shorter and more maneuverable than a shotgun.

Greater ammo capacity than a shotgun or pistol.

Much more capable round than the typical automatic handgun.

Faster follow ups than a shotgun or handgun.

Less chance of overpenitration than buckshot or a handgun.
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Originally Posted By WillAndrews:
Originally Posted By glocke12:
OP, I hope you have a suppressor, and if you don't you should just practice saying "WHUT? " now.

Unless I were living in Somalia, an AR anything would be my last choice for HD.


Why is that?

Shorter and more maneuverable than a shotgun.

Greater ammo capacity than a shotgun or pistol.

Much more capable round than the typical automatic handgun.

Faster follow ups than a shotgun or handgun.

Less chance of overpenitration than buckshot or a handgun.


You sir, can just GTFO of here with your common sense view of the issue.

Link Posted: 12/8/2013 3:52:05 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By gman82001:
I don't get the pistol hate but if you get a stamp and throw a stock its the best thing since sliced bread.



I just built this this weekend and the brace is more solid and less wobbly than a standard gi stock once I get the rounds through it to prove its reliable you better believe this is gonna be my goto hd gun. Plus we camp in bordering states occasionally and I can take it along with out the headache of the stamp issue win win in my book



http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj528/gman82001/IMAG1000.jpg
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Originally Posted By gman82001:



Originally Posted By HingleMcCringleberry:


Originally Posted By Danner130:

AR pistol is just a bad ideal all the way around.  About the only thing they are good for, is holding your short barrel until the NFA stamp arrives.


 






I don't get the pistol hate but if you get a stamp and throw a stock its the best thing since sliced bread.



I just built this this weekend and the brace is more solid and less wobbly than a standard gi stock once I get the rounds through it to prove its reliable you better believe this is gonna be my goto hd gun. Plus we camp in bordering states occasionally and I can take it along with out the headache of the stamp issue win win in my book



http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj528/gman82001/IMAG1000.jpg




 
I will have that in 300. Needs a light too.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 3:55:05 PM EDT
OP, for HD, you need to go the 300 blackout 200 (or more) grain bullet load route to save your hearing.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 3:57:54 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 3:59:03 PM EDT by Couch-Commando]


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Originally Posted By glocke12:
I can't hear you over the "EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE­EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
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Originally Posted By glocke12:





Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:


"WHAT?!?"






I can't hear you over the "EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE­EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
It aint a joke. the EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE­EEEEEEEEEE is louder than most soft spoken people and interferes with my comprehension of English spoken with poor diction or thick accents.



ETA: And that is just from hunting and playing trumpet. I can't imagine how bad it must be for infantry, artillery men or tankers.





 
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 3:58:22 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By bcw107:


AUGs are expensive and the Tavor is a piece of shit.
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Originally Posted By bcw107:
Originally Posted By Ras_Thavas:
Why not a bullpup?  AUG or Tavor, all the goodness of a full size bbl, small overall length.


AUGs are expensive and the Tavor is a piece of shit.


And expensive
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:00:43 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:00:45 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By andrasik:

Dunno, but that'd be an interesting comparison to run.

I don't have one of the braces, nor do I know anyone with one, so I can't run it.  A good test, though.

Problem is, you're almost all the way to the stamp cost at that point.  Granted, the wait is killer.
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Originally Posted By andrasik:
Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
I'm listening.
Does the sig brace compare to a legit stock'd SBR?

Dunno, but that'd be an interesting comparison to run.

I don't have one of the braces, nor do I know anyone with one, so I can't run it.  A good test, though.

Problem is, you're almost all the way to the stamp cost at that point.  Granted, the wait is killer.


I'm not a fan of the increased level of intimacy with the "man" either when compared with the Sig thingy
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:02:37 PM EDT
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:03:26 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By bcw107:


AUGs are expensive and the Tavor is a piece of shit.
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Originally Posted By bcw107:
Originally Posted By Ras_Thavas:
Why not a bullpup?  AUG or Tavor, all the goodness of a full size bbl, small overall length.


AUGs are expensive and the Tavor is a piece of shit.


What makes the Tavor a piece of shit?
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:04:44 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Paul:


I own 5 AR-15 pistols.

What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?
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Originally Posted By Paul:
Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
Anyone saying no own a pistol?


I own 5 AR-15 pistols.

What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?


Good enough in my foyer
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:08:42 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Couch-Commando:
It aint a joke. the EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE­EEEEEEEEEE is louder than most soft spoken people and interferes with my comprehension of English spoken with poor diction or thick accents.

ETA: And that is just from hunting and playing trumpet. I can't imagine how bad it must be for infantry, artillery men or tankers.
 
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Originally Posted By Couch-Commando:
Originally Posted By glocke12:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
"WHAT?!?"


I can't hear you over the "EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE­EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE"
It aint a joke. the EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE­EEEEEEEEEE is louder than most soft spoken people and interferes with my comprehension of English spoken with poor diction or thick accents.

ETA: And that is just from hunting and playing trumpet. I can't imagine how bad it must be for infantry, artillery men or tankers.
 


I have mine from playing in rock bands…one of the reasons I stopped was because I didn't want to further damage my hearing.

As far as shooting ARs indoors, this past summer I was at an outdoor range where the firing line was enclosed on three sides…I went to shoot my 6920 without realizing I did not have my hearing protection in.  I thought my rifle blew up and it was just like in the movies where there is an explosion and they show people moving slowly because they are in shock and can't hear.  Cant imagine shooting an AR pistol in a house without a suppressor.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:09:30 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By Paul:
I own 5 AR-15 pistols.



What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?

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Originally Posted By Paul:



Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:

Anyone saying no own a pistol?




I own 5 AR-15 pistols.



What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?





 
Hey, question..




Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?




I don't have any AR pistols yet.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:10:30 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:

  I will have that in 300. Needs a light too.
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
Originally Posted By gman82001:
Originally Posted By HingleMcCringleberry:
Originally Posted By Danner130:
AR pistol is just a bad ideal all the way around.  About the only thing they are good for, is holding your short barrel until the NFA stamp arrives.

 



I don't get the pistol hate but if you get a stamp and throw a stock its the best thing since sliced bread.

I just built this this weekend and the brace is more solid and less wobbly than a standard gi stock once I get the rounds through it to prove its reliable you better believe this is gonna be my goto hd gun. Plus we camp in bordering states occasionally and I can take it along with out the headache of the stamp issue win win in my book

http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj528/gman82001/IMAG1000.jpg

  I will have that in 300. Needs a light too.

You need something with out a safety.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:10:45 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:

  Hey, question..

Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?

I don't have any AR pistols yet.
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
Originally Posted By Paul:
Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
Anyone saying no own a pistol?


I own 5 AR-15 pistols.

What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?

  Hey, question..

Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?

I don't have any AR pistols yet.


No, just buy a stripped lower and do as you wish with it.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:11:18 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:

  Hey, question..

Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?

I don't have any AR pistols yet.
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
Originally Posted By Paul:
Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
Anyone saying no own a pistol?


I own 5 AR-15 pistols.

What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?

  Hey, question..

Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?

I don't have any AR pistols yet.


No. It just has to be bought as a virgin lower or pistol.

If it's ever been a rifle, it can't become a pistol.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:11:27 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By King_Mud:
No, just buy a stripped lower and do as you wish with it.
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Originally Posted By King_Mud:



Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:


Originally Posted By Paul:


Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:

Anyone saying no own a pistol?




I own 5 AR-15 pistols.



What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?



  Hey, question..



Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?



I don't have any AR pistols yet.





No, just buy a stripped lower and do as you wish with it.




 
Not here, I'm afraid.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:12:06 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:

  Hey, question..

Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?

I don't have any AR pistols yet.
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
Originally Posted By Paul:
Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
Anyone saying no own a pistol?


I own 5 AR-15 pistols.

What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?

  Hey, question..

Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?

I don't have any AR pistols yet.


In free states, no.

The deal is, the lower cannot have ever been in a rifle configuration, or transferred as a "long gun". Has to be transferred on the forms as a "receiver" ("hand gun" would work too).

Pistol markings help avoid idiocy, but aren't required.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:12:15 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:

  I will have that in 300. Needs a light too.
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
Originally Posted By gman82001:
Originally Posted By HingleMcCringleberry:
Originally Posted By Danner130:
AR pistol is just a bad ideal all the way around.  About the only thing they are good for, is holding your short barrel until the NFA stamp arrives.

 



I don't get the pistol hate but if you get a stamp and throw a stock its the best thing since sliced bread.

I just built this this weekend and the brace is more solid and less wobbly than a standard gi stock once I get the rounds through it to prove its reliable you better believe this is gonna be my goto hd gun. Plus we camp in bordering states occasionally and I can take it along with out the headache of the stamp issue win win in my book

http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj528/gman82001/IMAG1000.jpg

  I will have that in 300. Needs a light too.


Light will be after payday
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:12:31 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By itsARanchrifle:





You need something with out a safety.
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Originally Posted By itsARanchrifle:



Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:


Originally Posted By gman82001:


Originally Posted By HingleMcCringleberry:


Originally Posted By Danner130:

AR pistol is just a bad ideal all the way around.  About the only thing they are good for, is holding your short barrel until the NFA stamp arrives.


 






I don't get the pistol hate but if you get a stamp and throw a stock its the best thing since sliced bread.



I just built this this weekend and the brace is more solid and less wobbly than a standard gi stock once I get the rounds through it to prove its reliable you better believe this is gonna be my goto hd gun. Plus we camp in bordering states occasionally and I can take it along with out the headache of the stamp issue win win in my book



http://i1266.photobucket.com/albums/jj528/gman82001/IMAG1000.jpg


  I will have that in 300. Needs a light too.



You need something with out a safety.




 








Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:14:11 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:


In free states, no.

The deal is, the lower cannot have ever been in a rifle configuration, or transferred as a "long gun". Has to be transferred on the forms as a "receiver" ("hand gun" would work too).

Pistol markings help avoid idiocy, but aren't required.
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Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
Originally Posted By Paul:
Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
Anyone saying no own a pistol?


I own 5 AR-15 pistols.

What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?

  Hey, question..

Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?

I don't have any AR pistols yet.


In free states, no.

The deal is, the lower cannot have ever been in a rifle configuration, or transferred as a "long gun". Has to be transferred on the forms as a "receiver" ("hand gun" would work too).

Pistol markings help avoid idiocy, but aren't required.


4473 must be marked other or receiver, just not "rifle".
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:14:34 PM EDT
So I've got a couple stripped lowers put up, but I'm guessing I registered those as rifles, since I didn't specify "pistol" when I got them.



No go then? Have to buy a new lower?
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:15:25 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:


What makes the Tavor a piece of shit?
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Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Originally Posted By bcw107:
Originally Posted By Ras_Thavas:
Why not a bullpup?  AUG or Tavor, all the goodness of a full size bbl, small overall length.


AUGs are expensive and the Tavor is a piece of shit.


What makes the Tavor a piece of shit?


It's really one of those guns you need to shoot in order to appreciate just how crappy it is. But the short list? Crappy plastic controls, odd, unwieldy, and the trigger is just fucking horrid. And then there are the mechanical problems I experienced like failure to extract, then another and another and another.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:16:40 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:


4473 must be marked other or receiver, just not "rifle".
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Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
Originally Posted By Paul:
Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
Anyone saying no own a pistol?


I own 5 AR-15 pistols.

What kind of velocities are you getting from a 7.5 to 10.5" barrel?

  Hey, question..

Does the lower have to be marked "pistol"? Any difference in the paperwork process?

I don't have any AR pistols yet.


In free states, no.

The deal is, the lower cannot have ever been in a rifle configuration, or transferred as a "long gun". Has to be transferred on the forms as a "receiver" ("hand gun" would work too).

Pistol markings help avoid idiocy, but aren't required.


4473 must be marked other or receiver, just not "rifle".


Ummmm... It must be checked as "Receiver" or, alternatively, "Hand Gun".

It CANNOT have "Long Gun" checked, ever, under any circumstances, period.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:17:13 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
So I've got a couple stripped lowers put up, but I'm guessing I registered those as rifles, since I didn't specify "pistol" when I got them.

No go then? Have to buy a new lower?
View Quote


Receivers aren't rifles or pistols, they are firearms and transfer as "other" on a 4473.

Even if it wasn't done that way (ATF just recently clarified this for FFLs), it's no problem.  If they've never been rifles (ie built up as a rifle AND completed -- with an upper put on that is Title I), you can build it as a pistol.

Even better, anything that starts a pistol can go to a rifle and back to a pistol again now legally.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:19:45 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Moose:


I recently got a Keltec PLR-16 and toyed with the HD idea.
Then I shot it at an indoor range.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3790/10747446135_4ec95da071_z.jpg

I'll stick with my double barrel shotgun for now.
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Originally Posted By Moose:
Originally Posted By BUCC_Guy:
Nothing makes my loins pulse like the thought of lighting off unsuppressed 5.56 rounds out of a short barrel... indoors.


I recently got a Keltec PLR-16 and toyed with the HD idea.
Then I shot it at an indoor range.
http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3790/10747446135_4ec95da071_z.jpg

I'll stick with my double barrel shotgun for now.

Loud mo fo.  Sho nuff.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:20:28 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 4:24:53 PM EDT by andrasik]
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Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Ummmm... It must be checked as "Receiver" or, alternatively, "Hand Gun".

It CANNOT have "Long Gun" checked, ever, under any circumstances, period.
View Quote

Incorrect.



ETA:
http://www.atf.gov/files/press/releases/2009/07/070709-openletter-ffl-gca.pdf
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:21:17 PM EDT
Kiss yer hearing goodbye
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:22:03 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By bcw107:


It's really one of those guns you need to shoot in order to appreciate just how crappy it is. But the short list? Crappy plastic controls, odd, unwieldy, and the trigger is just fucking horrid. And then there are the mechanical problems I experienced like failure to extract, then another and another and another.
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Originally Posted By bcw107:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Originally Posted By bcw107:
Originally Posted By Ras_Thavas:
Why not a bullpup?  AUG or Tavor, all the goodness of a full size bbl, small overall length.


AUGs are expensive and the Tavor is a piece of shit.


What makes the Tavor a piece of shit?


It's really one of those guns you need to shoot in order to appreciate just how crappy it is. But the short list? Crappy plastic controls, odd, unwieldy, and the trigger is just fucking horrid. And then there are the mechanical problems I experienced like failure to extract, then another and another and another.


I've shot one, and I liked it actually.

Controls could be better. That has applied every bullpup. So are the terms "odd" and "unwieldy".

Trigger sucks... Welcome to the world of bullpups. I'm interested in seeing what Geissele can do with it. Geissele hasn't mentioned making triggers for any other bullpup that I have heard of.

At least it takes correct magazines.

As for failures... That I am more concerned about. Do you mind if I ask what type of ammo was involved?
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:25:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 4:27:56 PM EDT by TexasRifleman1985]
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Originally Posted By andrasik:

Incorrect.

http://i.imgur.com/rbQeVLu.png
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Originally Posted By andrasik:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Ummmm... It must be checked as "Receiver" or, alternatively, "Hand Gun".

It CANNOT have "Long Gun" checked, ever, under any circumstances, period.

Incorrect.

http://i.imgur.com/rbQeVLu.png


Nope. He asked what receivers a handgun can be built from. An AR lower that has been a handgun (and thus checked as "Hand Gun" on the 4473) and only a handgun can be a hand gun. Also, a virgin lower correctly checked as "Receiver" can be a handgun. A lower that has at any point been a rifle configuration or, more importantly due to the fact it is in writing, transferred as a "Long Gun" cannot ever be a handgun.

You are aware that receivers are not one-time use items, right? And a handgun does not have to be built on a virgin receiver. It does, however, have to be a receiver that has not been a long gun, and especially not in writing ("Long Gun" checked on form).
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:25:06 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 4:25:49 PM EDT by DuraToTheMax]
nvm still not sure.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:26:11 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:


Nope. He asked what receivers a handgun can be built from. An AR lower that has been a handgun (and thus checked as "Hand Gun" on the 4473) and only a handgun can be a hand gun. Also, a virgin lower correctly checked as "Receiver" can be a handgun. A lower that has at any point been a rifle configuration or, more importantly due to the fact it is in writing, transferred as a "Long Gun" cannot ever be a handgun.
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Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Originally Posted By andrasik:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Ummmm... It must be checked as "Receiver" or, alternatively, "Hand Gun".

It CANNOT have "Long Gun" checked, ever, under any circumstances, period.

Incorrect.

http://i.imgur.com/rbQeVLu.png


Nope. He asked what receivers a handgun can be built from. An AR lower that has been a handgun (and thus checked as "Hand Gun" on the 4473) and only a handgun can be a hand gun. Also, a virgin lower correctly checked as "Receiver" can be a handgun. A lower that has at any point been a rifle configuration or, more importantly due to the fact it is in writing, transferred as a "Long Gun" cannot ever be a handgun.


Wrong again.

I just edited my post with the ATF's open letter to FFLs.  What it was transferred as doesn't matter.  Receivers are not pistols, rifles, or shotguns.  They don't meet the legal definitions as such.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:27:30 PM EDT
I think an AR pistol is good to go for home defense if that is what you want it for.  Any gun you fire with out ear protection is going to hurt you.  You shouldn't be shooting it without hearing protection unless someone is in your house doing your harm.  In that case you are going to deal with a bit of hearing loss.  

That argument just seems silly to me.

I have a sig brace on a pistol.  I think my times would be just as good as if I swapped to an SBR which Iowa does not allow.  

Depending on what your state laws are for CCW you can often carry it in your vehicle as well.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:28:43 PM EDT
Why do you guys want more than a fordy five for HD
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:30:19 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By andrasik:


Wrong again.

I just edited my post with the ATF's open letter to FFLs.  What it was transferred as doesn't matter.  Receivers are not pistols, rifles, or shotguns.  They don't meet the legal definitions as such.
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Originally Posted By andrasik:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Originally Posted By andrasik:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
Ummmm... It must be checked as "Receiver" or, alternatively, "Hand Gun".

It CANNOT have "Long Gun" checked, ever, under any circumstances, period.

Incorrect.

http://i.imgur.com/rbQeVLu.png


Nope. He asked what receivers a handgun can be built from. An AR lower that has been a handgun (and thus checked as "Hand Gun" on the 4473) and only a handgun can be a hand gun. Also, a virgin lower correctly checked as "Receiver" can be a handgun. A lower that has at any point been a rifle configuration or, more importantly due to the fact it is in writing, transferred as a "Long Gun" cannot ever be a handgun.


Wrong again.

I just edited my post with the ATF's open letter to FFLs.  What it was transferred as doesn't matter.  Receivers are not pistols, rifles, or shotguns.  They don't meet the legal definitions as such.


You are aware that receivers are not one-time use items, right? And a handgun does not have to be built on a virgin receiver. It does, however, have to be a receiver that has not been a long gun, and especially not in writing ("Long Gun" checked on form).

So, nope, again. You can build an AR pistol on a receiver provided every 4473 and bound book it has been in is checked/written "hand gun" or "receiver", but never "long gun". Technically, it must also never have been in the physical configuration of a long gun, but obviously this is more difficult to prove.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:31:03 PM EDT
My 7" pistol is definitely my HD go-to weapon. It's got a flaming pig on it, which cuts down the muzzle blast on the shooter's end. It literally acts like a flashbang for everyone else around, especially indoors. I never really understood people who hate on AR pistols for HD. Obviously a full SBR may be more effective, but not everybody wants to invite "the man" into their life just to have one. With a pistol I still have an AFG, a light, a one-point sling for retention, and a 20-30 rd mag. And now you can add the sig brace to be Operator As F#ck!
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:31:37 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
You are aware that receivers are not one-time use items, right? And a handgun does not have to be built on a virgin receiver. It does, however, have to be a receiver that has not been a long gun, and especially not in writing ("Long Gun" checked on form).

So, nope, again. You can build an AR pistol on a receiver provided every 4473 and bound book it has been in is checked/written "hand gun" or "receiver", but never "long gun". Technically, it must also never have been in the physical configuration of a long gun, but obviously this is more difficult to prove.
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You have been proven wrong yet continue to argue.  That's sad.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:32:25 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 4:38:28 PM EDT by Beach]
Whats wrong with the AR PISTOL HATERS? What could possibly be wrong and all but AR goodness from RIFLE CALIBER,  concealable (although not as easy as a pistol and def not in the summer time), car carry-able (in states that forbid loaded rifles in a car) CCW legal AR15 PISTOL...a pistol that can give you head shots to 200 and body shots to 400+ from a concealable package? WHY PAY FOR AN SBR stamp and have to jump thru all those hoops? The AR pistol can be fired floated on the move like a carbine, snugged u tight with the buffer tube in tight to the shoulder (minimal recoil) for rifle like accuracy...what in the world could you find wrong with a system like this? 30 rounds of RIFLE AMMO in a small package...If you are shitting on the idea...YOU HAVE NOT HELD NOR FIRED ONE...PERIOD...To hell with SBR's...I've got a few 14.7 AR's with pinned suppressor mounts to be legal...and a 9" AR Pistol with a RRA pistol buffer tube...building a 300BLK in 10" soon...buy a SSS Brake Shield or a KX3 and turn that extremely loud muzzle blast to your favor...basically every time you pull the trigger your projecting a flash bang like sound wave at your target...completely resetting their OODA loop every time you pull the trigger... more AR Pistol awesomeness...you don't train without ear pro do you?

Properly set up and run the AR Pistol is a formidable weapon...


Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:32:52 PM EDT
PTRPDWPistol FTW. Hearing and vision are way overrated.

Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:35:16 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 4:59:51 PM EDT by TexasRifleman1985]
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Originally Posted By andrasik:

You have been proven wrong yet continue to argue.  That's sad.
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Originally Posted By andrasik:
Originally Posted By TexasRifleman1985:
You are aware that receivers are not one-time use items, right? And a handgun does not have to be built on a virgin receiver. It does, however, have to be a receiver that has not been a long gun, and especially not in writing ("Long Gun" checked on form).

So, nope, again. You can build an AR pistol on a receiver provided every 4473 and bound book it has been in is checked/written "hand gun" or "receiver", but never "long gun". Technically, it must also never have been in the physical configuration of a long gun, but obviously this is more difficult to prove.

You have been proven wrong yet continue to argue.  That's sad.




I said that a receiver must not have been marked Long Gun on a 4473 at any point, but being marked Hand Gun or Receiver in its transfer history does not prohibit a handgun being built on the receiver. That is factually correct.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:46:10 PM EDT
So it sounds like I need to dig out my paperwork and check how they were marked at transfer, just to be sure.



It's been so long since I bought them I don't remember what we did.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:50:11 PM EDT
I built an AR pistol in 5.7x28 with a 12" AR57 upper. Light, handy, easy to shoot with almost no recoil. I set it up with a single-point sling, MAGPUL AFG, and an Aimpoint Micro and a Streamlight.

For now it is nothing more than a novelty as I have better guns for HD but with the right ammunition (I have some SS195) and that 50 round mag I have no doubt it could ruin a bad guy's whole day.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 4:52:27 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
So it sounds like I need to dig out my paperwork and check how they were marked at transfer, just to be sure.

It's been so long since I bought them I don't remember what we did.
View Quote

You don't actually.  Unless there's some CA state law.

Again:


TR1985 is wrong.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 5:01:04 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ObsoleteMan:
PTRPDWPistol FTW. Hearing and vision are way overrated.

http://www.slickguns.com/sites/default/files/PTR915300Pr762.jpg
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Having owned one of those for a while the AR pistol is tame.
But the damn thing always resulted in a stupid, shit eating grin.

Why not an AR pistol for HD?
I will agree with a few posts here, short, hi cap, rifle performance, decent accuracy.
In a HD situation anything is loud.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 5:01:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 5:11:54 PM EDT by jlficken]
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Originally Posted By HingleMcCringleberry:

 
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Originally Posted By HingleMcCringleberry:
Originally Posted By Danner130:
AR pistol is just a bad ideal all the way around.  About the only thing they are good for, is holding your short barrel until the NFA stamp arrives.

 



I agree 100% with him if you are over 5' 8" or so.  I did the pistol route while waiting for my stamp to come and being 6' 6" tall with long arms it is a major PITA to shoot a AR pistol.  I actually just submitted 2 more Form 1's tonight so that I will never have to deal with an AR pistol again.

ETA: I do still have a pistol lower and will use it when traveling if I need to but it is no comparison to the same gun in SBR form except maybe with the Sig brace but I don't have one.  For the same $$ though I can almost get the Form 1 done.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 5:01:55 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 5:06:53 PM EDT by TexasRifleman1985]
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Originally Posted By andrasik:

You don't actually.  Unless there's some CA state law.

Again:
http://i.imgur.com/rbQeVLu.png

TR1985 is wrong.
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Originally Posted By andrasik:
Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:
So it sounds like I need to dig out my paperwork and check how they were marked at transfer, just to be sure.

It's been so long since I bought them I don't remember what we did.

You don't actually.  Unless there's some CA state law.

Again:
http://i.imgur.com/rbQeVLu.png

TR1985 is wrong.


So, what would a dealer transferring a stripped lower have checked on this 4473:



I'll wait for your answer. Or apology, but I won't hold my breath.

There are shitloads of lowers out there that were transferred checked as either "Long Gun" or "Hand Gun", because there was no other option at the time. For people who own such lowers it is important to know which it was transferred as before building a pistol out of said lower.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 5:02:50 PM EDT

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Originally Posted By andrasik:





You don't actually.  Unless there's some CA state law.



Again:

http://i.imgur.com/rbQeVLu.png



TR1985 is wrong.
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Originally Posted By andrasik:



Originally Posted By DuraToTheMax:

So it sounds like I need to dig out my paperwork and check how they were marked at transfer, just to be sure.



It's been so long since I bought them I don't remember what we did.



You don't actually.  Unless there's some CA state law.



Again:

http://i.imgur.com/rbQeVLu.png



TR1985 is wrong.




 
Alrighty then, thanks for the help.




Now to pick out an upper and delve into the whole 300 blk thing, which I promised myself I wasn't going to do.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 5:02:56 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By c7aea15:


The stamp will take close to a year to get, and with the brace you're not on an NFA list….
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Originally Posted By c7aea15:
Originally Posted By Stoney0102:

If I could afford that, I would just get my stamp.


The stamp will take close to a year to get, and with the brace you're not on an NFA list….


My 2 took 95 days from date of submission on eForms to approval including the .gov shutdown.  If you have a Trust it is the best way right now to get a Form 1.
Link Posted: 12/8/2013 5:03:47 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Danner130:
AR pistol is just a bad ideal all the way around.  About the only thing they are good for, is holding your short barrel until the NFA stamp arrives.
View Quote

Link Posted: 12/8/2013 5:04:01 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 12/8/2013 5:04:38 PM EDT by Hahns10mm]
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Originally Posted By ToledoXJ:
Does the sig brace compare to a legit stock'd SBR?
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Yes, absolutely.



My new baby.



To me, I'd rather have pistol than SBR. No wait. No paperwork to leave state. Same advantages carry-wise as a regular handgun. Not to mention, not all states (like mine) allow SBRs.
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