User Panel
User Panel
User Panel
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 11:35:46 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You don't want to find out it doesn't work for you when someone is trying to kill you. but, hey, ubu Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
BAC is a lot harder to do when you're actually under stress. Being actually shot at tends to be much more stressful than you can replicate on a range. It's also worth noting that some people have a lot harder times making BAC work, for whatever reason. You might be one of the people that it works perfectly for in all situations, who knows? but, hey, ubu 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 11:42:32 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Wrong. Meprolight does. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Far as I know, no one else makes optics with tritium in them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 11:44:57 AM EDT
[#3]
Personally I think the fixed Elcans are probably superior to acogs in several ways.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 11:45:42 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Get a March 3-24x42 FFP and an offset a PA MRD. Aint much bigger than the old 2.5-8x36 that Leupold made. You can find them for about the same price. Good scope. the Best ACOGs are the 3x24 and 3.5x35. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 11:55:56 AM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted:Once you get an Elcan it will be your preferred optic. No one ever moves variables when shit starts happening or even flips magnifiers. What you are on is what you get. FFP 1-Xs are meh, SFP 1-Xs are worthless. General purpose light weight TA33 works great for me. For folks who don't BAC well TA11/31 w/RMR are probably the general purpose best option. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 11:57:50 AM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've used Elcans extensively I hate them. No one ever moves variables when shit starts happening or even flips magnifiers. What you are on is what you get. FFP 1-Xs are meh, SFP 1-Xs are worthless. General purpose light weight give me TA33 all day. TA11/31 w/RMR are also acceptable. I remember you shooting with the 1-6 Leupold at CWE. Did you dump it? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 11:57:54 AM EDT
[#7]
I like 1x red dots to 100 yds. Also cheaper.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 11:59:33 AM EDT
[#8]
They are very solid. That said i am not a fan of them in some light conditions where with amber you can lose the recticle in some light settings.
I hardly use mine anymore |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:01:36 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I remember you shooting with the 1-6 Leupold at CWE. Did you dump it? Geissele hyper extended made me like it a little more. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:07:07 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have never shot the swarvo, but I hear it is awesome. I am not sure the durability. Razor is a tank. I didn't like the mounting height on the elcan and didn't like the overall reticle. subtension to 1000M? Seems a bit, well, optimistic. Anyway, you have some legitimate 1-8 options as well as many 1-6 for the same cost. Elcan design is a decade old. Technology has moved on. I would take a piggy dot ACOG over the Elcan. Just my opinion. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:08:51 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No love for sb short dot? Not made of money. I'm sure it is a good scope. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:11:02 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I still have it, I like it for static hunting with my thermal clip on it's, nice for maximizing the poor thermal FOV but would never combat with it except in like a DM capacity. Geissele hyper extended made me like it a little more. I have a high super precision 30mm coming in and figuring out which 1-6 to try. Obviously it was made for the razor, but for a few hundred more I can get a swarvo. Or get one of the el cheapos and see if I like the concept. They are heavy fuckers. My old eyes find themselves needing more and more glass all the time. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:13:03 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not made of money. I'm sure it is a good scope. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
No love for sb short dot? I'm sure it is a good scope. They will get a custom glass shop to build them a spec by customer device and it works. US Optics used do all kinds of crazy scopes. Member seeng a 100x+ USO on the first single shot 50 I had ever seen in the flesh. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:15:48 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've used Elcans extensively I hate them. No one ever moves variables when shit starts happening or even flips magnifiers. What you are on is what you get. FFP 1-Xs are meh, SFP 1-Xs are worthless. General purpose light weight TA33 works great for me. For folks who don't BAC well TA11/31 w/RMR are probably the general purpose best option. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:35:12 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've been curious about this setup but most people seem to trash talk it. Any personal experience using it/advice? If you are shooting something farther out with the ACOG and some thing close runs by just lift head slightly and red dot, no dongles to flop around or twirl to change powers. The only downside is cheek-weld. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:38:55 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
General purpose light weight TA33 works great for me. For folks who don't BAC well TA11/31 w/RMR are probably the general purpose best option. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:40:19 PM EDT
[#17]
My least favorite of these is the ELCAN DR 1-4X
Bought it to go with my SCAR, which then got a TA31ECOS later. It's the best runner up for 4X32 ACOGs of all the other optics I've tried, including a Short Dot, I always come back to my beloved 4x32 ACOGs
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:43:46 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How are they superior to a high end 1-8 or 6? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:46:52 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I've been curious about this setup but most people seem to trash talk it. Any personal experience using it/advice? 3 gun dominates a lot of our thoughts about optics. And it is great training. But it is not a simulation of combat. I find sporting clays a closer approximation of combat. Just remove the presentation throws. Walk up and you will have moving targets coming from an unknown location. Some will be coming towards you, some will be going away, some will be crossers. and you have to instantly prioritize which one is the biggest threat, engage, transition, engage again and do all of that in 2-3 seconds. Of course it doesn't replicate the aspect of people trying to kill you. But the speed isn't buzzer. The speed is the fact that those targets disappear in seconds. It is hit or miss, time does not matter. Not the time to be fucking around with levers or BAC. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:52:59 PM EDT
[#20]
I had an Elcan 1-4 for a while, and if it only had better eye relief, and a mount plate that didn't limit you to ARMS mounts, I would still have it. As is I'm not a huge fan of them.
I really want a VCOG. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 12:58:57 PM EDT
[#21]
I love ACOGS. I'll get one someday. The BAC isn't an issue for my eyes. I shoot with the front cover on my aimpoint most of the time anyway. Usually by accident
. The acogs I've used have been phenomenal.
I've tried variables and I think they're ok. I really like how with RDS I can shoot with my head a little higher and I just need to put the dot on the target. The gun can be shot in weird positions and I just need to put the dot on the target. I'll just stick with my $300 aimpoint pro for now. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 1:06:09 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Meprolight has Tritium illuminated prism sights? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Far as I know, no one else makes optics with tritium in them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 1:12:25 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not made of money. I'm sure it is a good scope. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 1:16:09 PM EDT
[#24]
The elcan spectre has better glass.
That being said, I hate cowitness height. ACOG all the way. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 1:43:47 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have a high super precision 30mm coming in and figuring out which 1-6 to try. Obviously it was made for the razor, but for a few hundred more I can get a swarvo. Or get one of the el cheapos and see if I like the concept. Quote HistoryQuoted:
I have a high super precision 30mm coming in and figuring out which 1-6 to try. Obviously it was made for the razor, but for a few hundred more I can get a swarvo. Or get one of the el cheapos and see if I like the concept. My old eyes find themselves needing more and more glass all the time. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 1:45:55 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was reading an article comparing different ACOGs and it said that the TA-33 is listed as having 1.9" of eye relief, but it is actually closer to 4". Does this match anyone else's experience? I'm trying to figure out which ACOG has the longest eye relief. Link to article. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 1:48:35 PM EDT
[#27]
Considering the first ACOG, the TA01, was introduced in 1987 and folks are still recommending 30 years later, that's quite a record.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 1:53:42 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Reread your statement. I stand by my answer. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Far as I know, no one else makes optics with tritium in them. but the ACOG prisms is what I originally answered about with the OP. I think ACOGs and Tritium illuminated optics in general are expensive because of the fact only one company makes prism sights. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 1:57:06 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You are right. but the ACOG prisms is what I originally answered about with the OP. I think ACOGs and Tritium illuminated optics in general are expensive because of the fact only one company makes prism sights. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Far as I know, no one else makes optics with tritium in them. but the ACOG prisms is what I originally answered about with the OP. I think ACOGs and Tritium illuminated optics in general are expensive because of the fact only one company makes prism sights. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:00:36 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You mean tritium illuminated prism sights? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Far as I know, no one else makes optics with tritium in them. but the ACOG prisms is what I originally answered about with the OP. I think ACOGs and Tritium illuminated optics in general are expensive because of the fact only one company makes prism sights. Back in the day it was common in scopes. Pretty sure the Europe used tritium for 60 years. There are surplus scopes with dead elements from all over Europe. but I mean new on the Us market, they are scarce. Trijicon Is the only one I know of that uses tritium in their prisms and the Vcog. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:03:06 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
With 1-6/8x quality variables in the same price range, no they are not. I have 2 but paid used prices for them. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:04:33 PM EDT
[#32]
Its no Elcan
But ACOGs are nice in my book |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:06:15 PM EDT
[#33]
I have grown extremely fond of the 1-4/1-6/1-8 optics.
The only fixed magnification optics I have are Aimpoints (ML3/C3) and Vortex red dots. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:07:17 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted:
I can come up with the funds to get either a nice dot, ACOG, or 1-4X. Never had an ACOG, and it seems sort of neat. Most people really love them OP, so take my comments for what it's worth. I had a TA33 for a while. It was a nice optic, but the reality did not match the hype. Red dot fit my needs better, so I sold my ACOG to someone who could appreciate it, and went with an Aimpoint H-1. I don't regret my choice. My expectation is that any serious use of an AR will be at very short range. I prefer the fast acquisition of the dot sight to the accuracy of a magnifying optic. I also like that I don't have to get the rifle into the proper position for eye relief with a red dot, which can be useful if in odd shooting positions. It might be that I would like something other than the TA33 a lot better. Like I said, it was good but it did not match the hype. I will say I got a 20 inch AR with no sights on it right now, and an ACOG might work better for that rifle, given what it is. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:08:05 PM EDT
[#35]
I have a TA31 and really like it. But at ~$1200 NIB I won't be buying any more of them, new anyway.
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:15:40 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
How is a red dot superior to an acog with bindon aiming concept? I'm still faster with a red dot though. YMMV. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:17:59 PM EDT
[#37]
I used ACOGs in Iraq and Afghanistan, and i like them. Solid optics.
The only issue I really had was reticle washout - The chevron fading out when aiming from a dark area (indoors or shade) at something illuminated by sunlight. I'd prefer a battery powered 4x like an LED ACOG, ACSS microdot with a magnifier, or a Browe. Carrying around a spare AA or 123 is not a huge burden, IMO. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:18:40 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I was reading an article comparing different ACOGs and it said that the TA-33 is listed as having 1.9" of eye relief, but it is actually closer to 4". Does this match anyone else's experience? I'm trying to figure out which ACOG has the longest eye relief. Link to article. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:18:45 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
For me, it's faster. Some people do BAC well and some don't. I do it only so-so with an ACOG. Interestingly enough I have little problem doing it with conventional tube style optics. I'm still faster with a red dot though. YMMV. If BAC was equivalent to red dot, why does essentially no CQB unit use ACOGs? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:22:32 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If BAC was equivalent to red dot, why does essentially no CQB unit use ACOGs? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:25:22 PM EDT
[#41]
I had an ACOG TA01NSN for my Colt M4 rifle and it was adequate. I sold it and bought an Elcan Specter DR 1-4X and it is much better. I like having the 1X and 4X like two scopes in one as well as the choice to switch between an illuminated red dot or plain cross hairs. Plus, it has iron sights on top of the scope itself. The Elcan will cost a little more than the ACOG, but is worth it. Some people will whine and whimper about the weight,
 but, it is like having two or three scopes in one unit. A little bit of weight never hurt anybody. Unless you're a little girl. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:27:25 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I am uneducated about what door kickers use, but I can see why they might prefer something other than an ACOG. Not knocking the ACOG, it's a fine optic. My purposes were always better served with an RDS. the industry is awash in optics but ACOG is on the short list of what should be considered acceptable for combat. But it has limitations and technology has moved on. When batteries were horribly inefficient, tritium made a lot of sense. Now with modern battery life, the tritium is holding it back along with the use of the fiber optic tube. There are many people on here who have LOTS more experience in combat than I do. Some of them are posting. A range optic and a combat optic are two very different things. Sometimes there is a Venn overlap. But just because something works on the range, doesn't mean it works in the real world. On a slightly related note... I frankly don't get the Elcan love. Never liked that thing. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:33:12 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If BAC was equivalent to red dot, why does essentially no CQB unit use ACOGs? 
But to be fair I do prefer RDS for urban areas
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:34:43 PM EDT
[#44]
40mm on a CQB team.
Bold strategy, cotton. Fake Ass Seal Team. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:39:45 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
40mm on a CQB team. Bold strategy, cotton. Fake Ass Seal Team. We used both rockets and 203s. Fallujah 04 
More ACOGS in Fallujah 04 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:44:36 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
40mm on a CQB team. Bold strategy, cotton. Fake Ass Seal Team. |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:50:45 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
40mm on a CQB team. Bold strategy, cotton. Fake Ass Seal Team. And that first gen sopmod flashlight! that belongs in a collection, not in combat! |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:51:55 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The thing with MOUT is that one minute you're kicking in doors, then you're up on the roof fighting with insurgents across a court yard. We used both rockets and 203s. Fallujah 04 https://www.americangrit.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/10/marinesfallujah.jpg If that is a hostage rescue, then throwing a frag makes you a seal. that said, why does everyone else seem to just be watching/taking pictures? |
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:53:49 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Everyone should have 203's. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
40mm on a CQB team. Bold strategy, cotton. Fake Ass Seal Team. 
|
|
|
|
Posted: 8/28/2017 2:57:27 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
If that is a hostage rescue, then throwing a frag makes you a seal. that said, why does everyone else seem to just be watching/taking pictures? Did you guys move in and then throw the frag? Seems kinda backwards to me. |
|
|
Win a FREE Membership!
Sign up for the ARFCOM weekly newsletter and be entered to win a free ARFCOM membership. One new winner* is announced every week!
You will receive an email every Friday morning featuring the latest chatter from the hottest topics, breaking news surrounding legislation, as well as exclusive deals only available to ARFCOM email subscribers.
AR15.COM is the world's largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types.
From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm.
Subscribe to our monthly Newsletter to receive firearm news, product discounts from your favorite Industry Partners, and more.
Copyright © 1996-2024 AR15.COM LLC. All Rights Reserved.
Any use of this content without express written consent is prohibited.
AR15.Com reserves the right to overwrite or replace any affiliate, commercial, or monetizable links, posted by users, with our own.
