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Posted: 10/16/2018 12:15:11 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 5/14/2019 12:14:46 AM EDT by AJ_Dual]
I was at shot show this year where I got my hands on a few to play with. Told myself it’s the best of the original mixed with the best of the x95. First gun on my list to buy. Every IWI rep there said they will be on the US market in March 2018. We are way past that with no info about them coming out. So what the fudge are they at?! I want one damnit.
Almost zero advertising as well. Hope they are not scrapping it.
Link Posted: 10/16/2018 12:18:02 AM EDT
IWI reps said that they had to postpone release due to accuracy not being up to par, so they are apparently trying to make it more accurate before they release it.
Link Posted: 10/16/2018 6:49:06 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By WriterClarke:
IWI reps said that they had to postpone release due to accuracy not being up to par, so they are apparently trying to make it more accurate before they release it.
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from their instagram
Link Posted: 10/16/2018 10:15:31 AM EDT
I'd rather they wait and fix the issue than release it before it's ready.
Link Posted: 10/16/2018 11:05:23 AM EDT
As above, the barrels are heading back to the home country for accuracy issues. It sucks, but I’m glad that they identified the issue before releasing a flawed product, and that they are making the accuracy of the rifle a priority.
Link Posted: 10/16/2018 12:30:49 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:
As above, the barrels are heading back to the home country for accuracy issues. It sucks, but I’m glad that they identified the issue before releasing a flawed product, and that they are making the accuracy of the rifle a priority.
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They need to free float the barrel. That’s the biggest issue with the x95 in accuracy I think. Mine is a 3moa gun max. Even with match ammo
Link Posted: 10/16/2018 6:02:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/16/2018 6:04:43 PM EDT by doty_soty]
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Originally Posted By 1911xdm:

They need to free float the barrel. That’s the biggest issue with the x95 in accuracy I think. Mine is a 3moa gun max. Even with match ammo
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It’s always seemed odd to me that the X95 is noted for this, and not the Tavor. One of the bigger differences between the two is in the handguard which does make me wonder if it has to do with inconsistent handguard contact/pressure. My Tavor shoots pretty consistent. With SMKs I’d even call it an ‘accurate’ rifle, which is saying something for a combat rifle and a bullpup.
Link Posted: 1/13/2019 10:26:54 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:
It’s always seemed odd to me that the X95 is noted for this, and not the Tavor. One of the bigger differences between the two is in the handguard which does make me wonder if it has to do with inconsistent handguard contact/pressure. My Tavor shoots pretty consistent. With SMKs I’d even call it an ‘accurate’ rifle, which is saying something for a combat rifle and a bullpup.
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:
Originally Posted By 1911xdm:

They need to free float the barrel. That’s the biggest issue with the x95 in accuracy I think. Mine is a 3moa gun max. Even with match ammo
It’s always seemed odd to me that the X95 is noted for this, and not the Tavor. One of the bigger differences between the two is in the handguard which does make me wonder if it has to do with inconsistent handguard contact/pressure. My Tavor shoots pretty consistent. With SMKs I’d even call it an ‘accurate’ rifle, which is saying something for a combat rifle and a bullpup.
I have heard of people taking the barrel ring out of the front handguard and that helps them. Never tried it yet though
Link Posted: 1/15/2019 10:29:31 AM EDT
It’s delayed because IWI doesn’t want to be like Desert Tech.
Link Posted: 1/15/2019 10:32:30 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By 1911xdm:

I have heard of people taking the barrel ring out of the front handguard and that helps them. Never tried it yet though
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I’ve thought of that, but if you take out the barrel ring, then the handguard is just supported by at the rear by one screw and the tab in the trigger guard, and it doesn’t seem to take much to deform that polymer handguard.
Link Posted: 1/15/2019 11:11:15 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By 1911xdm:

They need to free float the barrel. That’s the biggest issue with the x95 in accuracy I think. Mine is a 3moa gun max. Even with match ammo
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A lot of rifles would have accuracy issues if it was due to lack of free floating barrels...
Link Posted: 1/15/2019 1:01:37 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/15/2019 1:02:18 PM EDT by Kali_Refugee]
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Originally Posted By willi3d:
I’ve thought of that, but if you take out the barrel ring, then the handguard is just supported by at the rear by one screw and the tab in the trigger guard, and it doesn’t seem to take much to deform that polymer handguard.
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Originally Posted By willi3d:
Originally Posted By 1911xdm:

I have heard of people taking the barrel ring out of the front handguard and that helps them. Never tried it yet though
I’ve thought of that, but if you take out the barrel ring, then the handguard is just supported by at the rear by one screw and the tab in the trigger guard, and it doesn’t seem to take much to deform that polymer handguard.
It’s also supported by the top rail with the little polymer sliding piece that locks into it. I took the barrel rings out of mine front and back. Unfortunately between full time school, clinicals, and work I have barely done any shooting past few years so I don’t really know the effect it’s had on accuracy. I didn’t even get to be the rifle hipster with a non ar at cola warrior east last year
Link Posted: 1/17/2019 10:05:22 AM EDT
Get the K&M M17S in .308
Link Posted: 1/18/2019 7:36:03 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/18/2019 7:36:14 PM EDT by amheck]
Hoping someone can ask IWI at SHOT this year about the 7. I've been holding off on an x95 cause I don't have anything in 308. But not sure how long I wanna wait. I wish they'd just be honest.
Link Posted: 1/18/2019 8:07:56 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By amheck:
Hoping someone can ask IWI at SHOT this year about the 7. I've been holding off on an x95 cause I don't have anything in 308. But not sure how long I wanna wait. I wish they'd just be honest.
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Do you think they are intentionally deceiving or lying to you?
Link Posted: 1/18/2019 8:23:28 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By amheck:
Hoping someone can ask IWI at SHOT this year about the 7. I've been holding off on an x95 cause I don't have anything in 308. But not sure how long I wanna wait. I wish they'd just be honest.
View Quote
They’ve been pretty honest this whole time. They had them ready to go, but they weren’t sub-MOA so they’re back getting ready. Last word was spring. It sucks, but they’ve been night and day different in regards to how they’ve handled their release compared to...other companies.
Link Posted: 1/19/2019 6:52:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:

They’ve been pretty honest this whole time. They had them ready to go, but they weren’t sub-MOA so they’re back getting ready. Last word was spring. It sucks, but they’ve been night and day different in regards to how they’ve handled their release compared to...other companies.
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Do they really intend them to be sub-MOA? That would be a massive surprise for a combat weapon derived mass market bullpup. I’ve heard that they want them to be combat accurate in the range of 1-2 MOA and they were running 3-4 MOA. Achieving reliable sub-MOA in a bullpup would seem to be a stretch for IWI.
Link Posted: 1/19/2019 7:23:04 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By willi3d:

Do they really intend them to be sub-MOA? That would be a massive surprise for a combat weapon derived mass market bullpup. I’ve heard that they want them to be combat accurate in the range of 1-2 MOA and they were running 3-4 MOA. Achieving reliable sub-MOA in a bullpup would seem to be a stretch for IWI.
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Sub moa is kind of dumb fhoneslty because 90 percent of shootings cant shoot near moa regularly anyway. Even testing mass produced rifles for sub moa would be a massive pain and expensive. 1 to 2 moa is a reasonable goal and still will out shoot most people.
Link Posted: 1/19/2019 8:09:58 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By willi3d:

Do they really intend them to be sub-MOA? That would be a massive surprise for a combat weapon derived mass market bullpup. I've heard that they want them to be combat accurate in the range of 1-2 MOA and they were running 3-4 MOA. Achieving reliable sub-MOA in a bullpup would seem to be a stretch for IWI.
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1-2 MOA would at least get Internet haters off their back. I feel like the MOA ratings of the X95 are an albatross they're trying to dump.
Link Posted: 1/19/2019 11:00:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By willi3d:
Do they really intend them to be sub-MOA? That would be a massive surprise for a combat weapon derived mass market bullpup. I’ve heard that they want them to be combat accurate in the range of 1-2 MOA and they were running 3-4 MOA. Achieving reliable sub-MOA in a bullpup would seem to be a stretch for IWI.
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Originally Posted By willi3d:
Originally Posted By doty_soty:

They’ve been pretty honest this whole time. They had them ready to go, but they weren’t sub-MOA so they’re back getting ready. Last word was spring. It sucks, but they’ve been night and day different in regards to how they’ve handled their release compared to...other companies.
Do they really intend them to be sub-MOA? That would be a massive surprise for a combat weapon derived mass market bullpup. I’ve heard that they want them to be combat accurate in the range of 1-2 MOA and they were running 3-4 MOA. Achieving reliable sub-MOA in a bullpup would seem to be a stretch for IWI.
Dunno what they’ll end up with, but they said something to that effect when they were delayed. Don’t recall the exact wording but it was something near ‘MOA capable’ or thereabouts. I agree that’s a lofty goal. I don’t think it’s necessary for what the rifle is for, but it’s good marketing if it can. I’d be perfectly content with <2 MOA. How much flak has the X95 caught for its flier issues?

I disagree that it’s a stretch for IWI. They make rifles to spec. Those specs have usually called for rack grade accuracy. I don’t fault them for meeting that spec and not exceeding it, especially if it inflated other specs like cost or weight. They’re certainly capable of greater accuracy, and have the capabilities to make very nice barrels if necessary. Their DAN rifles come to mind.
Link Posted: 1/20/2019 12:09:53 AM EDT
If anyone is going to see them at SHOT, do me a favor and ask if they 20in barrel Tavor 7 is still going to be a thing or not.
Link Posted: 1/20/2019 8:09:35 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By CliveAlive:
Get the K&M M17S in .308
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I agree with this. I've had several bullpups and the k&m was the best. Amazing trigger, lighter, simple robust design, uses many easy to obtain parts. Customer service is basically dealing with the guy directly and he is very responsive.

Over the years I've just soured on bullpups altogether. Mostly due to cost vs benefit than bullpup designs themselves. I've come to the realization they just dont offer much over tried and trued designs and they cost WAY more. But if I had to go back to one it would be k&m for sure.
Link Posted: 1/20/2019 11:16:14 PM EDT
Link Posted: 1/21/2019 7:24:23 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Do you think they are intentionally deceiving or lying to you?
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Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Originally Posted By amheck:
Hoping someone can ask IWI at SHOT this year about the 7. I've been holding off on an x95 cause I don't have anything in 308. But not sure how long I wanna wait. I wish they'd just be honest.
Do you think they are intentionally deceiving or lying to you?
perhaps "honest" was a bit harsh but they've been radio silence from what I've seen. I know they went back because of the accuracy issues but its been silence since then. I've asking several times on various social media platforms and have heard nothing, not even an estimate.
Link Posted: 1/21/2019 9:33:41 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/21/2019 9:34:15 PM EDT by doty_soty]
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Originally Posted By amheck:
perhaps "honest" was a bit harsh but they've been radio silence from what I've seen. I know they went back because of the accuracy issues but its been silence since then. I've asking several times on various social media platforms and have heard nothing, not even an estimate.
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Originally Posted By amheck:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Originally Posted By amheck:
Hoping someone can ask IWI at SHOT this year about the 7. I've been holding off on an x95 cause I don't have anything in 308. But not sure how long I wanna wait. I wish they'd just be honest.
Do you think they are intentionally deceiving or lying to you?
perhaps "honest" was a bit harsh but they've been radio silence from what I've seen. I know they went back because of the accuracy issues but its been silence since then. I've asking several times on various social media platforms and have heard nothing, not even an estimate.
Last update was a Spring release, don’t know what there is to say past what they said then save for if they have the barrel issue resolved. SHOT is upon us and I’m sure they’ll have this asked and new info put forth.

ETA: whatever happened to the shotgun?
Link Posted: 1/21/2019 10:47:22 PM EDT
IWI were not at Range Day, will go by their booth at the show tomorrow.
Link Posted: 1/22/2019 12:32:59 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By amheck:
perhaps "honest" was a bit harsh but they've been radio silence from what I've seen. I know they went back because of the accuracy issues but its been silence since then. I've asking several times on various social media platforms and have heard nothing, not even an estimate.
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Originally Posted By amheck:
Originally Posted By kfeltenberger:
Originally Posted By amheck:
Hoping someone can ask IWI at SHOT this year about the 7. I've been holding off on an x95 cause I don't have anything in 308. But not sure how long I wanna wait. I wish they'd just be honest.
Do you think they are intentionally deceiving or lying to you?
perhaps "honest" was a bit harsh but they've been radio silence from what I've seen. I know they went back because of the accuracy issues but its been silence since then. I've asking several times on various social media platforms and have heard nothing, not even an estimate.
Maybe they're personifying DT's new policy of not saying anything until it is ready? Given the issues that are going on over there right now, they may have more pressing matters than something their own military doesn't have any interest in purchasing.
Link Posted: 1/22/2019 1:35:03 AM EDT
Link Posted: 1/22/2019 6:10:16 PM EDT
IWI didn't commit to a release date indicated when it was ready they would let us know.
Link Posted: 1/22/2019 6:52:14 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Aussie_E:
IWI didn't commit to a release date indicated when it was ready they would let us know.
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That’s probably for the best. It still sucks.
Link Posted: 1/30/2019 8:04:11 PM EDT
IWI's interview about the Tavor 7 at SHOT:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ffU5_4o3Aw

TLDR: Gun was shooting 4MOA, redesigned the operating mechanism to attempt to increase accuracy to 1 MOA, no release date, price point $2100.
Link Posted: 3/2/2019 12:18:54 PM EDT
Update on Tavor 7:


All Outdoor Article posted March 1st 2019

Update 2.28.19

We took 3 rifles out for endurance testing.

Accuracy was checked at the start. 3 groups per rifle average around where we wanted it shooting off a lead sled , 168gr Gold Medal Match, Nightforce, Vortex, and Leupold scopes where used.

The goal was 20K through each gun under a controlled specification. At the end of a firing iteration the rifle was cooled and the firing sequence would begin again.

The Good:
Accuracy was were we wanted it. Much more consistent from where we started.

The rifles ran with no issues. I witness this first hand and my shoulder can speak to it. Over 3 days in cold and wet conditions I had ZERO failures.

The Not so good
A part was wearing abnormally which at that point we stopped to address the issue. Can’t speak to it but at this point we stopped testing. This is protocol per how testing is defined. The team from Isreal was here for the testing and will make corrections. Then we will go at it again.

Closing:
Here in the states I’d say I’ve got more rounds through a T7 than anyone. It’s a battle through and through. They just keep chewing up and spiting out 308. The accuracy has improved from the start. I have full faith that the engineering teams will get us right the best we can. To everyone that’s going to ask…… How does this impact my timeline? Uncertain. What is certain is we are committed to providing the best possible product we can.
Link Posted: 3/2/2019 12:44:25 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By BombCrater:
Update on Tavor 7:


All Outdoor Article posted March 1st 2019

Update 2.28.19

We took 3 rifles out for endurance testing.

Accuracy was checked at the start. 3 groups per rifle average around where we wanted it shooting off a lead sled , 168gr Gold Medal Match, Nightforce, Vortex, and Leupold scopes where used.

The goal was 20K through each gun under a controlled specification. At the end of a firing iteration the rifle was cooled and the firing sequence would begin again.

The Good:
Accuracy was were we wanted it. Much more consistent from where we started.

The rifles ran with no issues. I witness this first hand and my shoulder can speak to it. Over 3 days in cold and wet conditions I had ZERO failures.

The Not so good
A part was wearing abnormally which at that point we stopped to address the issue. Can’t speak to it but at this point we stopped testing. This is protocol per how testing is defined. The team from Isreal was here for the testing and will make corrections. Then we will go at it again.

Closing:
Here in the states I’d say I’ve got more rounds through a T7 than anyone. It’s a battle through and through. They just keep chewing up and spiting out 308. The accuracy has improved from the start. I have full faith that the engineering teams will get us right the best we can. To everyone that’s going to ask…… How does this impact my timeline? Uncertain. What is certain is we are committed to providing the best possible product we can.
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I would think that, depending on which part is wearing in what way, this is a good update. Hopefully it’s something minor that can be addressed quickly, and not something that needs major redesign or impacts other systems.
Link Posted: 3/2/2019 8:40:17 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By BombCrater:
Update on Tavor 7:


All Outdoor Article posted March 1st 2019

Update 2.28.19

We took 3 rifles out for endurance testing.

Accuracy was checked at the start. 3 groups per rifle average around where we wanted it shooting off a lead sled , 168gr Gold Medal Match, Nightforce, Vortex, and Leupold scopes where used.

The goal was 20K through each gun under a controlled specification. At the end of a firing iteration the rifle was cooled and the firing sequence would begin again.

The Good:
Accuracy was were we wanted it. Much more consistent from where we started.

The rifles ran with no issues. I witness this first hand and my shoulder can speak to it. Over 3 days in cold and wet conditions I had ZERO failures.

The Not so good
A part was wearing abnormally which at that point we stopped to address the issue. Can’t speak to it but at this point we stopped testing. This is protocol per how testing is defined. The team from Isreal was here for the testing and will make corrections. Then we will go at it again.

Closing:
Here in the states I’d say I’ve got more rounds through a T7 than anyone. It’s a battle through and through. They just keep chewing up and spiting out 308. The accuracy has improved from the start. I have full faith that the engineering teams will get us right the best we can. To everyone that’s going to ask…… How does this impact my timeline? Uncertain. What is certain is we are committed to providing the best possible product we can.
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Perhaps someone from DT should observe IWI’s process to see how to properly debug a gun BEFORE selling it to the public.
Link Posted: 3/7/2019 11:22:47 PM EDT
Too bad they didn't mention what the accuracy was on these test guns.
Link Posted: 3/8/2019 12:01:33 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By _Dragoon_:
Too bad they didn't mention what the accuracy was on these test guns.
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They didn’t directly state it I guess, but they’ve been very upfront and transparent about everything else so I don’t see harm in giving benefit of the doubt and combining previous statements. They claimed prior they wanted MOA as their goal. They claimed here their groups averaged around where they wanted it. I’m going to extrapolate that to mean their rifles were shooting +/- MOA depending on ammo or group.

I hope this assumption is right. This thing is going to be awesome if it can be as reliable as an IWI but with MOA accuracy. I’m happy to see they’ve learned from the 95 and know to value precision to make it big on the US market. Whether we want to admit it or not, the vast majority of its market is primarily casual 100yd bench shooters, and if they don’t want a rifle that makes them look good WHILE looking cool, they don’t want it. ‘Combat accuracy’ is fine for a duty rifle, but is a derogatory term for many here in the current market, I’m afraid. They know that now.
Link Posted: 5/8/2019 9:33:17 PM EDT
Just watched a video from Military Arms Channel and James from TFB TV where they were shooting a Tavor 7, wonder if it's an old model or an updated pre production model.
Link Posted: 5/10/2019 7:11:05 AM EDT
So its now almost mid May 2019, ideas on release date or just a unicorn?
Link Posted: 5/10/2019 10:42:37 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By awmp:
So its now almost mid May 2019, ideas on release date or just a unicorn?
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When they get it right. They're probably tired of all the forum bitching about the x95's 3-4moa accuracy and are making sure it doesn't happen again.
Link Posted: 5/10/2019 11:13:40 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By ShadowAngel:
When they get it right. They're probably tired of all the forum bitching about the x95's 3-4moa accuracy and are making sure it doesn't happen again.
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Originally Posted By ShadowAngel:
Originally Posted By awmp:
So its now almost mid May 2019, ideas on release date or just a unicorn?
When they get it right. They're probably tired of all the forum bitching about the x95's 3-4moa accuracy and are making sure it doesn't happen again.
While the silence sucks for those who are really excited, I think it’s a better approach than feeding a hype train and stating 2 weeks indefinitely which seems to be the industry standard.
Link Posted: 5/10/2019 11:48:03 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Kali_Refugee:

While the silence sucks for those who are really excited, I think it’s a better approach than feeding a hype train and stating 2 weeks indefinitely which seems to be the industry standard.
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coughMDRcough
Link Posted: 5/11/2019 3:23:25 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By MAC21500:
Just watched a video from Military Arms Channel and James from TFB TV where they were shooting a Tavor 7, wonder if it's an old model or an updated pre production model.
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This video?
Link Posted: 5/13/2019 12:04:11 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By SpyHawk:

This video?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZoL_g4wXl4
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Yes, that one.
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