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Posted: 10/28/2019 11:00:42 AM EDT
We talked about this awhile back, but that was mostly when they first started shipping. Then, we were discussing 2.3 MOA average groups. I’ve been seeing some reports of 3+ MOA as the very best groups some people are getting with premium ammo. I know this isn’t a precision rifle, I have actual precision rifles for that, but that’s a bit offputting to me.

So I thought I’d raise the question: If you’ve taken the time to shoot your 7 for groups, what results are you getting?
Link Posted: 10/28/2019 1:56:18 PM EDT
Right around 2moa on mine. One thing to keep in mind is also the skill of the shooter. A bad shot saying "My _____ gets 5moa!" may be more reflective of the shooter or conditions than the firearm.
Link Posted: 10/28/2019 4:26:37 PM EDT
Lots of posts on the net of folks getting 1.5moa too with match ammo.  Hard to tell what the actual average is yet, but I wouldn't expect it to be any better than around 1.5moa with tuned load.s
Link Posted: 10/29/2019 4:20:46 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 10/29/2019 4:23:36 PM EDT by thehun06]
I posted mine a while back...I think a lot of it comes down to shooter...not saying I am super awesome ninjacool...but here are my results.

Malaysian L2A2 2.2 MOA

Aguila was 1.9 MOA

Federal XM80 1.5 MOA

Using a bi-pod, no rear bag....US Optics SR6S with JNG reticle....100 yards...

Here is the link.
Link Posted: 10/29/2019 4:38:04 PM EDT
I'm loving my Tavor 7, no it's not a precision rig, but it's compact and reliable. Want a lot of firepower at close ranges, yeah this is it then.
Link Posted: 11/1/2019 7:32:27 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/1/2019 7:32:46 AM EDT by doty_soty]
This was what I was hoping to hear. I’m wondering if the reviewer was a part of the problem. It’s just disconcerting to hear that the very best group fired all day with match ammo was 3 MOA. Yikes.
Link Posted: 11/1/2019 11:33:15 AM EDT
Link Posted: 11/2/2019 3:47:25 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By doty_soty:
This was what I was hoping to hear. I’m wondering if the reviewer was a part of the problem. It’s just disconcerting to hear that the very best group fired all day with match ammo was 3 MOA. Yikes.
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Not every reviewer is a rifleman nor good at shooting...

When my Tavor 7 showed 1.5 MOA on a 5-shot group with XM80...that is all I needed to know how good it is...
Link Posted: 11/2/2019 3:48:05 PM EDT
@Manticore_Arms got an ETA on the T7 buttpads yet?
Link Posted: 11/2/2019 5:04:01 PM EDT
Link Posted: 11/2/2019 10:16:32 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/2/2019 10:17:33 PM EDT by _Dragoon_]
My x95 is better at hitting a 8" steel plate at 300 yards than my T7. Both using non-match ammo
Link Posted: 11/3/2019 5:35:44 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By _Dragoon_:
My x95 is better at hitting a 8" steel plate at 300 yards than my T7. Both using non-match ammo
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How are you as a shooter when it comes to something like .308?
Link Posted: 11/3/2019 9:46:05 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/3/2019 9:49:06 AM EDT by _Dragoon_]
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Originally Posted By ShadowAngel:



How are you as a shooter when it comes to something like .308?
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Not new to 308 if that's what you're asking. Considering my T7 has a 1-8x and my x95 has 3x, and shot both on the same day, I'm going to say my x95 is slightly more accurate. My x95 would hit the plate 7/10 times, T7 was 6/10.
Link Posted: 11/4/2019 9:29:48 PM EDT
GunsAmerica reporting 3-6" groups at 100 yards for 5 shot groups, 1-3.5" 3-shot groups. See video at 14:16

https://youtu.be/as28XHwd8IE?t=856
Link Posted: 11/4/2019 10:13:02 PM EDT
MAC is also reporting poor accuracy. Guess it depends upon how many rounds in your group. 3 shots vs 5 shots vs 10. Anyways iwi held back release to fix the accuracy and they stated they could not fix it.
Link Posted: 11/4/2019 11:05:39 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By _Dragoon_:
GunsAmerica reporting 3-6" groups at 100 yards for 5 shot groups, 1-3.5" 3-shot groups. See video at 14:16

https://youtu.be/as28XHwd8IE?t=856
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This was the one that made me originally start the thread. I hope theirs was an outlier, or poor marksmanship on the part of the shooter or something. Users here and elsewhere seem to have better results than that with regular ball ammo. I don’t plan on shooting it from the bench or at F-Class or anything, but 6 MOA? Damn.
Link Posted: 11/5/2019 5:07:06 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 11/5/2019 5:27:20 AM EDT by ShadowAngel]
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Originally Posted By ronin556:
Anyways iwi held back release to fix the accuracy and they stated they could not fix it.
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They stated they could not consistently get less than 2moa without affecting reliability. They did not say "We can't fix the accuracy."

IWI doesn't really make precision guns, that's just not their thing. They make guns that go bang every time no matter what, and have combat acceptable accuracy.
Link Posted: 11/5/2019 5:26:47 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By _Dragoon_:
GunsAmerica reporting 3-6" groups at 100 yards for 5 shot groups, 1-3.5" 3-shot groups. See video at 14:16

https://youtu.be/as28XHwd8IE?t=856
View Quote
He says he thinks it's capable of hitting 1.5 moa with a good shooter and good ammo. He was also shooting for groups at 100yards with a red dot, so.... that's a little iffy in itself. The dot alone is bigger than 2moa at 100yards.
Link Posted: 11/5/2019 8:30:39 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By ShadowAngel:

He says he thinks it's capable of hitting 1.5 moa with a good shooter and good ammo. He was also shooting for groups at 100yards with a red dot, so.... that's a little iffy in itself. The dot alone is bigger than 2moa at 100yards.
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He was using a 4.5x-14x scope, not a red dot.
Link Posted: 11/5/2019 4:20:12 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By _Dragoon_:
He was using a 4.5x-14x scope, not a red dot.
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Ah, missed that. He was shooting with a red dot through 99% of the video.
Link Posted: 1/21/2020 12:00:36 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/21/2020 12:02:07 AM EDT by Sniper3142]
Well since the Tavor 7 has a 1-12 twist for its barrel, it won't shoot projectiles heavier then 150gr very well.

That would also explain the better groups with XM80 ammo over match stuff (which is almost always in the 155 to 175 grain range).

Personally I think going with a 1-12 twist is a shame and a real missed opportunity.
Link Posted: 1/21/2020 11:24:18 PM EDT
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Originally Posted By Sniper3142:
Well since the Tavor 7 has a 1-12 twist for its barrel, it won't shoot projectiles heavier then 150gr very well.

That would also explain the better groups with XM80 ammo over match stuff (which is almost always in the 155 to 175 grain range).

Personally I think going with a 1-12 twist is a shame and a real missed opportunity.
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Pretty sure they looked at the SCAR when they made that choice.
Link Posted: 1/22/2020 12:25:40 AM EDT
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Originally Posted By ShadowAngel:
Pretty sure they looked at the SCAR when they made that choice.
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Originally Posted By ShadowAngel:
Originally Posted By Sniper3142:
Well since the Tavor 7 has a 1-12 twist for its barrel, it won't shoot projectiles heavier then 150gr very well.

That would also explain the better groups with XM80 ammo over match stuff (which is almost always in the 155 to 175 grain range).

Personally I think going with a 1-12 twist is a shame and a real missed opportunity.
Pretty sure they looked at the SCAR when they made that choice.
I understand that.  From the standpoint of a "battle ready" rifle, it makes a little sense.  From an accuracy standpoint, it makes almost none.

There are LOTS of 7.62x51 semi auto rifles that are proven "battle ready" rifles that use barrels with a 1-10 twist, which is MUCH better from an accuracy point of view.  IMHO, I think IWI made a mistake on this aspect.
Link Posted: 1/22/2020 9:07:09 AM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2020 9:11:22 AM EDT by thehun06]
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Originally Posted By ShadowAngel:

Pretty sure they looked at the SCAR when they made that choice.
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Negative...they looked at what ammo most NATO .gov agency would use in 7.62x51...NATO XM80 ball...1:12 is perfect for that and in my experience with the Tavor 7...that is true.

Should they have went with 1/10...probably, maybe... to please the civilian uber commando sniper ninjas...but I shot 1.5MOA with Federal XM80 and 2.2 with L2A2...not sure you can ask for better out of a battle rifle...let alone a bullpup in .308...heck both of my LMT MWS and POF AR10 return the exact same performance with those ammos...and they have 1:10 5R rifling...at 1.5 MOA with XM80...I don't even bother spending extra money to get better groups...no need.

If one wants absolute accuracy...you just have to play around with 140-155gr match bullets with 1:12...I bet the Hornady ELD series would do great...which that bullet has been proven to go out to 1000 out of a 13.5" LMT MWS...

Heck, an HK G28, a purpose built DMR, doesn't even have a 1 MOA guarantee...I believe its guarantee is 1.5 MOA...using NATO standard ammo.
Link Posted: 1/22/2020 3:50:00 PM EDT
[Last Edit: 1/22/2020 3:51:39 PM EDT by doty_soty]
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By thehun06:
Negative...they looked at what ammo most NATO .gov agency would use in 7.62x51...NATO XM80 ball...1:12 is perfect for that and in my experience with the Tavor 7...that is true.

Should they have went with 1/10...probably, maybe... to please the civilian uber commando sniper ninjas...but I shot 1.5MOA with Federal XM80 and 2.2 with L2A2...not sure you can ask for better out of a battle rifle...let alone a bullpup in .308...heck both of my LMT MWS and POF AR10 return the exact same performance with those ammos...and they have 1:10 5R rifling...at 1.5 MOA with XM80...I don't even bother spending extra money to get better groups...no need.

If one wants absolute accuracy...you just have to play around with 140-155gr match bullets with 1:12...I bet the Hornady ELD series would do great...which that bullet has been proven to go out to 1000 out of a 13.5" LMT MWS...

Heck, an HK G28, a purpose built DMR, doesn't even have a 1 MOA guarantee...I believe its guarantee is 1.5 MOA...using NATO standard ammo.
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Originally Posted By thehun06:
Originally Posted By ShadowAngel:

Pretty sure they looked at the SCAR when they made that choice.
Negative...they looked at what ammo most NATO .gov agency would use in 7.62x51...NATO XM80 ball...1:12 is perfect for that and in my experience with the Tavor 7...that is true.

Should they have went with 1/10...probably, maybe... to please the civilian uber commando sniper ninjas...but I shot 1.5MOA with Federal XM80 and 2.2 with L2A2...not sure you can ask for better out of a battle rifle...let alone a bullpup in .308...heck both of my LMT MWS and POF AR10 return the exact same performance with those ammos...and they have 1:10 5R rifling...at 1.5 MOA with XM80...I don't even bother spending extra money to get better groups...no need.

If one wants absolute accuracy...you just have to play around with 140-155gr match bullets with 1:12...I bet the Hornady ELD series would do great...which that bullet has been proven to go out to 1000 out of a 13.5" LMT MWS...

Heck, an HK G28, a purpose built DMR, doesn't even have a 1 MOA guarantee...I believe its guarantee is 1.5 MOA...using NATO standard ammo.
I tend to agree, I’ve never found the 1:12 thing to matter much. I don’t consider it nearly as big a deal as the 1:9/1:7 thing with .223. I’ve had multiple 1:12’s and both shot 175’s and 178’s just fine. Hell my FN SPRA1 used to shoot well under MOA with it. Having said that I’m sure every barrel is different, and I could see some 1:12’s not liking it. For whatever reason it seems like some barrels just don’t stabilize the same at the same twist rate.
Link Posted: 1/23/2020 12:08:30 AM EDT
When you get into match accuracy or want match accuracy...regardless of twist rate...you have to find the one that your barrel loves the most...why I find twist rate arguments dumb...

On of the most accurate barrels I ever owned was a RRA 1:9 twist setup...it would shoot 50gr VMAX match load at .6MOA...
Link Posted: 2/15/2020 4:59:25 PM EDT
Has anyone tried 130-135 grain bullets in the T7?
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