Warning

 

Close

Confirm Action

Are you sure you wish to do this?

Confirm Cancel
Member Login

Site Notices
12/11/2018 1:58:31 AM
Posted: 11/30/2018 4:27:57 PM EST
I'm sure this has been beat to death. I'm prob gonna order one or the other this weekend in WP from TNVC. Since the RNVG has been out for awhile I'd figure I'd see what the general consensus was on these two. All of my lights run off of CR123 batteries like the Sentinels. I like the extra 15 or so hours of run time the Sentinels offer. Are the Sentinels $750 more because of the ANVIS mount? I will not be using the ANVIS mount nor do I need it. Is there anything I'm missing? I'll be using a Wilcox G24 mount for whichever one I decide on. Pros and Cons from guys that have these units would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!
Link Posted: 11/30/2018 9:06:24 PM EST
[Last Edit: 11/30/2018 9:07:41 PM EST by MrPlayer]
Originally Posted By enasty7:
I'm sure this has been beat to death. I'm prob gonna order one or the other this weekend in WP from TNVC. Since the RNVG has been out for awhile I'd figure I'd see what the general consensus was on these two. All of my lights run off of CR123 batteries like the Sentinels. I like the extra 15 or so hours of run time the Sentinels offer. Are the Sentinels $750 more because of the ANVIS mount? I will not be using the ANVIS mount nor do I need it. Is there anything I'm missing? I'll be using a Wilcox G24 mount for whichever one I decide on. Pros and Cons from guys that have these units would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!
View Quote
Other then battery commonality/life I don’t think there is a reason to spend the extra $750 on Sents, especially if you don’t plan to use anything but the dovetail.

TNVC is a site sponsor as well.
Link Posted: 12/1/2018 1:28:24 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/1/2018 1:29:28 AM EST by MunnyShot]
If you're concerned with having extended run time go with Sentinels with the ball mount and run the remote battery pack since the weight can be used as a counter weight to balance out the CG of your helmet. If you plan to run different rigs on your helmet such as a 14, 14 with a Breach, opposed to your binos the RNVG with a counter weight is your best option. I know more than a few people that run Sentinels built by TNVC and I have yet to hear a complaint. I'm sure no matter which way you go you can't go wrong buying from them.
Link Posted: 12/1/2018 2:16:44 AM EST
I went with a set of WP RNVGs, and I love them. Very happy with my purchase.
Link Posted: 12/1/2018 8:14:47 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ljh824:
I went with a set of WP RNVGs, and I love them. Very happy with my purchase.
View Quote View All Quotes
View All Quotes
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By ljh824:
I went with a set of WP RNVGs, and I love them. Very happy with my purchase.
What kind of real world run time are you getting for your RNVG's? Are they as robust as the Sentinels?

Originally Posted By MrPlayer:

Other then battery commonality/life I don’t think there is a reason to spend the extra $750 on Sents, especially if you don’t plan to use anything but the dovetail.

TNVC is a site sponsor as well.
I'm def going through TNVC, they have been nothing short of amazing when answering my questions.

Originally Posted By MunnyShot:
If you're concerned with having extended run time go with Sentinels with the ball mount and run the remote battery pack since the weight can be used as a counter weight to balance out the CG of your helmet. If you plan to run different rigs on your helmet such as a 14, 14 with a Breach, opposed to your binos the RNVG with a counter weight is your best option. I know more than a few people that run Sentinels built by TNVC and I have yet to hear a complaint. I'm sure no matter which way you go you can't go wrong buying from them.
Originally Posted By ljh824:
I went with a set of WP RNVGs, and I love them. Very happy with my purchase.
I do like that I can run an external battery that doubles as a counter weight.

@TNVC @TNVC_Augee are the Sentinels more durable than the RNVG's?

Thanks again for all the responses guys!
Link Posted: 12/1/2018 8:42:25 AM EST
RNVGs are supposed to have the ability to hook up to a battery pack. Soonish

It will take a trip back to manufacturer and a $100ish fee.
Link Posted: 12/1/2018 2:07:32 PM EST
I have some DTNVGs inbound. Later this year when my wife stops being mad at me I am going to pick up some RNVGs. Because I like options, and I like doing stuff with buddies rather than alone. Few of my friends can afford this crap and the ones that can have no interest...

Anyways. I run comp M5s and a MAWL and a D2, and a pvs 14, etc... I have come to accept the fact that I need to keep AAs and CR123s around. It’s not a big deal really. Think about the reality of not being able to find either of those batteries when you need them... Also, think about the reality of how long you will use your nods at a time... 16 hours of battery life is plenty. Keep some lithium AAs around if you think you need a shtf stockpile. Use the alkalines to hunt with or have fun with, takes 2 seconds to change, and should last you at least 2 to 3 nights.

I’ve been told the RNVGs are stronger than the Sents. They are an aluminum housing vs delrin. Think of how much abuse your AR lower can take... Personally I still think the Sents are incredibly strong. But... the RNVGs are lighter, that’s nice. I hope the battery pack upgrade will be a plug in port rather than an anvis mount, it will be much lighter that way.

Anyways. The Sents are awesome. But I think the RNVG is just as good for less money.
Link Posted: 12/1/2018 3:04:13 PM EST
You would be happy with either. I got my Sentinel housing direct from Adams Industries and paid less than the RNVG housing. So if prices were the same I would go with Sentinels. All my batteries are cr123 as well, so it's super easy to have extras in my Mohawk counterweight. If Sentinels were $750 more then go with the RNVG & save the money.

I would recommend taking a good look at the DTNVG. That is next on my list lol.
Link Posted: 12/1/2018 10:36:44 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By enasty7:

What kind of real world run time are you getting for your RNVG's? Are they as robust as the Sentinels?

I'm def going through TNVC, they have been nothing short of amazing when answering my questions.

I do like that I can run an external battery that doubles as a counter weight.

@TNVC @TNVC_Augee are the Sentinels more durable than the RNVG's?

Thanks again for all the responses guys!
View Quote
Still playing with them. Have about two hours of run time so far. I don't have a pair of Sentinels to compare them to, but the RNVGs are rock solid. I won't voluntarily drop them, but if I did, they would hold up.
Link Posted: 12/1/2018 10:42:33 PM EST
Right now I’m runnng a older set of BNVD’s with mil-spec pinnacles and a newer set of DTNVG WP’s. I like everything self contained and streamline therefore the RNVG’s appeal to me more than the Sentnels.
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 8:16:05 AM EST
[Last Edit: 12/2/2018 8:17:41 AM EST by great308]
RNVG is lighter, stronger, and cheaper for a built set. No reason to go with the sentinels if you don’t plan to use the ball mount.

Only issue I’ve had with mine was I came down off a roof top and when I landed the butt of my rifle hit one of the tubes ungodly hard and shut it off. Probably from one of the spring loaded contacts that runs on the contact board had a blunt enough hit to momentary interrupt power. The rnvg gets power from the housing battery via a contact board on the housing that the tubes ride on. Quick switch off then back on with the power knob restored the tube. I have not heard of anything thing else like I’ve expierenced and it was a pretty hard hit which I’d really like to not do ever again. This is not really a issue or flaw as far as I’m concenred as I doubt they were made to be used as a hammer but no damage what so ever.

I’ve been running lithium AA’s and have maybe 10 hours of cumulative and still no low battery warning but not sure with lithium I might get one since they tend to sharply drop vs alkaline. I suspect I will get a low battery warning or they just quit sometime soon. It’s an easy change and not a big deal. I will be sending mine out to get retro fitted for external battery use when the option comes available.
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 9:18:20 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By EZToForget:
I have some DTNVGs inbound. Later this year when my wife stops being mad at me I am going to pick up some RNVGs. Because I like options, and I like doing stuff with buddies rather than alone. Few of my friends can afford this crap and the ones that can have no interest...

Anyways. I run comp M5s and a MAWL and a D2, and a pvs 14, etc... I have come to accept the fact that I need to keep AAs and CR123s around. It’s not a big deal really. Think about the reality of not being able to find either of those batteries when you need them... Also, think about the reality of how long you will use your nods at a time... 16 hours of battery life is plenty. Keep some lithium AAs around if you think you need a shtf stockpile. Use the alkalines to hunt with or have fun with, takes 2 seconds to change, and should last you at least 2 to 3 nights.

I’ve been told the RNVGs are stronger than the Sents. They are an aluminum housing vs delrin. Think of how much abuse your AR lower can take... Personally I still think the Sents are incredibly strong. But... the RNVGs are lighter, that’s nice. I hope the battery pack upgrade will be a plug in port rather than an anvis mount, it will be much lighter that way.

Anyways. The Sents are awesome. But I think the RNVG is just as good for less money.
View Quote
Really good info, thanks. Reading about the battery pack upgrade for the RNVG's is intriguing, especially if it's a plug in port. Having it be an ANVIS mount kinda defeats the purpose of me getting Sentinels over RNVG's. Guess if I get the RNVG's I'll just have to stock up on AA's, not really a big deal.
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 12:10:22 PM EST
I really like my sentinels. They are seeing a lot more use than my MOD3's these days, even though the tubes in them are slightly worse (filmless vs pinnacles). I think most of the options these days are all pretty comparable and for me, it always comes down to price / personal preference. I just ordered another set of Sentinels, but went through AI directly (like sbye), and skipped the Anvis ball mount option and they were much more economical. My understanding is that AB Night Vision is doing the machine work on most of the popular options that aren't a DTNVG, MUM, or 14, so the quality is all pretty much about equal. I don't really see prices coming down much until other shops are getting into the housing business.

The RNVG just confuses me because it sort of addresses a need that wasn't really there, since AB Night Vision was already building the Sentinels for AI.

I'm not really sure why they cut into an existing customer's market share with a similar product line. Hopefully it ends up lowering prices for all of us. I'll say it again - but I wish AB NV would have instead invested that time on a MOD3 bridge that functions like a PVS-15. ;-)
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 4:04:29 PM EST
I ended up ordering RNVG's with L3 Filminess WP tubes from TNVC. Went with the RNVG's to save a little money over the Sentinels. Now the wait begins!
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 4:16:02 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By enasty7:
I ended up ordering RNVG's with L3 Filminess WP tubes from TNVC. Went with the RNVG's to save a little money over the Sentinels. Now the wait begins!
View Quote
Attachment Attached File
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 8:38:38 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By enasty7:

Really good info, thanks. Reading about the battery pack upgrade for the RNVG's is intriguing, especially if it's a plug in port. Having it be an ANVIS mount kinda defeats the purpose of me getting Sentinels over RNVG's. Guess if I get the RNVG's I'll just have to stock up on AA's, not really a big deal.
View Quote
Exactly.

I think if the battery pack option is a plug in port, these will take a pretty big share of the sentinel sales. But... I could be wrong.

Anyways. Regarding your order. I think you will be quite happy.

RNVGs are on my short list.
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 9:47:38 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By enasty7:
I ended up ordering RNVG's with L3 Filminess WP tubes from TNVC. Went with the RNVG's to save a little money over the Sentinels. Now the wait begins!
View Quote
Wanna loan me some money
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 9:48:26 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By VIP3R:

Wanna loan me some money
View Quote
A little tight right now, can I get you next time?
Link Posted: 12/2/2018 10:53:34 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By chosos:
I really like my sentinels. They are seeing a lot more use than my MOD3's these days, even though the tubes in them are slightly worse (filmless vs pinnacles). I think most of the options these days are all pretty comparable and for me, it always comes down to price / personal preference. I just ordered another set of Sentinels, but went through AI directly (like sbye), and skipped the Anvis ball mount option and they were much more economical. My understanding is that AB Night Vision is doing the machine work on most of the popular options that aren't a DTNVG, MUM, or 14, so the quality is all pretty much about equal. I don't really see prices coming down much until other shops are getting into the housing business.

The RNVG just confuses me because it sort of addresses a need that wasn't really there, since AB Night Vision was already building the Sentinels for AI.

I'm not really sure why they cut into an existing customer's market share with a similar product line. Hopefully it ends up lowering prices for all of us. I'll say it again - but I wish AB NV would have instead invested that time on a MOD3 bridge that functions like a PVS-15. ;-)
View Quote
Link Posted: 12/3/2018 1:25:02 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By sbye:

View Quote
I second this PVS-15 style bridge.
Link Posted: 12/3/2018 2:47:57 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By enasty7:

A little tight right now, can I get you next time?
View Quote
sure
Link Posted: 12/4/2018 11:24:19 AM EST
Link Posted: 12/4/2018 10:11:51 PM EST
Link Posted: 12/5/2018 10:29:18 AM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TNVC_Augee:
There are still folks that prefer the ball-detent ANVS format mount to the BNVS dovetail for more than just the external battery pack capability.

However, the majority of civilian Sentinel users tend to use them with the BNVS interface, thus negating both the external battery pack, and all of the ANVS compatibility built into the Sentinel.

I use the Sentinels with the ball-detent, so consequently, I end up running the Sentinels off AAs as well.

~Augee
View Quote
I know you are a big fan of the ball detent mount. I was expecting you to respond. Other than the battery pack what are the other reasons to like the ANVS mount? I genuinely don’t know and I think that’s what a lot of people need to hear when deciding between these two systems.

The biggest disadvantages in my mind to the ball detent mounting are weight and being able to switch between systems without having to break a helmet down. That’s why I think the plug in battery pack would be awesome for the rnvg. It stays light weight, and I can switch between other binos or monos via the dovetail easily. That could be quite useful when out with friends, trading things around a such.

My buddy doesn’t have any NV, just a digital scope. So I have a nightcap set up for him and a helmet for myself. I can pass a 14 back and forth between the 2 of us that way. When I get my binos I can trade back and forth if we feel like it, on a whim. It’s all about sharing and having fun for me, so the dovetail makes it easy.

For others that don’t want or need to share, this is a moot point.
Link Posted: 12/5/2018 1:30:24 PM EST
Link Posted: 12/5/2018 7:03:42 PM EST
Discussion ForumsJump to Quoted PostQuote History
Originally Posted By TNVC_Augee:

The ANVS ball-detent format mount allows the goggles to stow a lot closer and lower to the helmet, though they obviously also place them further forward, changing the CG somewhat. This means that while stowed, you have a little bit more room in vehicles or other tight spaces, as the goggles are more or less on the same plane as the crown of your helmet.

The dovetail mount will always stow a little bit taller, though some mounts are more or less extreme than others, e.g., the old Norotos TATM versus the Wilcox L4 G24--the lower stowing mounts will, of course, obviously stow a little bit further forward so they will have similar impacts on CG.

Granted, dovetail mounts using articulating goggles (DTNVG or PVS-31 style) can get lower than fixed, shelf-style goggles like the Sentinel or RNVG if you fold them down around the helmet (FWIW, the "top of the line" goggles like the FGS or GPNVG are not capable of this either, though that is moot for most users), but that segues into my next point:

Personally, I prefer the very simple deployment of ball-detent mounts insofar as they're always "ready," you just need to flip them up and down, and even an electrical dummy like me can understand how that's possible: rotate up, remove power, rotate down, restore power. Goggles are on, goggles are off. No knobs or switches to worry about, no mechanical or logic/software-based auto-shutoff functions to worry about, no worries about "did I leave batteries in the device?" or "did I accidentally leave the device on?"

Meanwhile, a lot of folks that use PVS-31s often don't stow their goggles at all most of the time, they just rotate the pods up around the mount so they can see under them. This is pretty nifty and it works well... to a point. The other thing about shelf-style goggles for me, is that the IPD is always set--I know every time I flip the goggles down, they not only turn themselves on, but they're set to exactly where and how I want them, no fiddle-faddle. Devices like the DTNVG, etc. usually don't have IPD stops, and even the PVS-31s which do have them, at least I personally find myself bumping them essentially every time I rotate the pods, and sometimes just from touching the device in general. Granted, these are not usually huge adjustments that cause minor misalignment, but annoying to me nonetheless.

The other thing about the PVS-31s specifically, is that they take forever to shut off (you need to hold the button for a second or two, you can just tap it and turn it off or rotate a knob. Mercifully this does not apply to turning them on), nor do the pods shut off when you rotate them up, not to mention that the auto-shutoff is angle based, and because they take so long to shut off manually, it's not even like the PVS-14 where you can disable the auto-shutoff and simply use them that way. They also turn back on automatically, rather than needing to have the knob re-cycled, which means that if you flipped them up, then forgot to shut them back down, they may end up turning themselves back on when you put them away, meaning you need to double check that they're "actually" off before you put them away, lest you subject yourself to battery drain, or worse even, image burn, depending on how/where you put them away. Only takes one time to forget to trash an expensive pair of goggles which are a pain in the ass to service, even if you got them "legitimately," to say nothing of if you bought them on the gray market. The DTNVG is better in this respect at least, IMHO, in having a mechanical knob, and also built in logic that will at very least turn the pods off when you rotate them far enough up if you choose to rotate the pods away, rather than stowing the device.

But, I'm off topic.

Another thing that I appreciate about ball detent mounts is that they have a built-in breakaway function--I know that that's not what most people concern themselves about, but personally I appreciate it, prevents or reduces the chances of damage to... well, just about every component, the mount, the device, your neck, etc. Again--if you spend a decent amount of time in and around vehicles especially, it's something worth considering.

Of course, the ball-detent is not without its downsides, it is a little bit more sensitive, less stable in many cases, especially with repurposed USGI aviation mounts (mounts like the Wilcox GSGM/DPAM are a huge upgrade, but of course come with a pretty huge cost premium as well compared even to something like the AB Night Vision or Adams mounts), however even this can be addressed some with the use of bungees, stiffer springs for the actual ball mount, etc. FWIW, the ball detent is also far far far less saltwater resistant than the dovetail, so if you're engaged in a lot of maritime work, probably a less ideal choice. Incidentally, Navy Surface Warfare Center-Crane, which has oversight over USSOCOM VAS programs have pretty much standardized on the dovetail.

Once again, I like and use both--and most devices are not ball-detent compatible anyways. For somewhat obvious reasons, I don't necessarily use a single set of NVGs exclusively, and different goggles can have advantages and disadvantages for different applications. In fact, when speaking to customers, I often recommend the dovetail, as it is generally simpler, cheaper, and locks in more stably, which for better or worse often translates to perceived quality, and absent user specific needs or preferences that are either already known or already identified, the dovetail tends to result in higher customer satisfaction--the reality being that most users, even many professional end-users are not spending that much time (e.g.,) rolling around in armored vehicles or helicopters, climbing through windows or navigating exceedingly narrow structures, nor are they necessarily experiencing the frequency of switching between white light and NV.

I'm certainly not saying one is wholly better than the other, only that for users that do prefer the ball-detent, while some may do it for the remote battery pack alone, there are nevertheless those who prefer it independently of the remote power function, and I would point out that most of the Wilcox ball-detent mounts either have the option or have a dual-power function that allows them to be run without the remote battery pack entirely.

~Augee
View Quote
Thanks for the reply. That is very informative. I'm sure it will help a lot of people come to a more informed decision regarding this topic!
Top Top