Edit: S12/V12 has some compatibility issues.
-Lynx Bolt Carriers do not fit. Ergo VEPR/Saiga BCG may not fit as well. Seems proprietery.
-Aftermarket Gas Pucks will cause the BCG to have a gap.
-Aftermarket Gas Regulators do not thread in to the gas block. The thread pitch has changed
-Front Sling Swivel is an odd size.
-On my Shotgun, The rear tang is out of spec and the following stocks have bad fit or do not fit:
Magpul (Poor Fit)
TDI Arms (No Fit)
DLG (Fits ok, but has flex. So weird)
Jmac Adapter (Does not fit at all!)
Canis Adapter (Fits but has side to side wobble no matter how snug it is)
Bonesteel/CNC Warrior (Stock cants upwards)
-The factory stock fits decent enough, and with a washer it's perfect.

What works so far:
-Triggers swap in np, mod the hammer for bolt hold open, and needs a mod for the bolt carrier.
-Muzzle Devices as normal.
-Saiga Magazines and even JTS fit fine.
-Magpul Accessories do fit the handguard but need longer set screws.
Original thread was archived, found here.

So I was concerned because I wanted to order another Lynx. I heard SDS Imports was discontinuing some shotguns. I could no longer find spare parts in stock. I stumbled upon this.

More or less a Gen 2 Lynx is being released. MSRP Remains the Same

Saiga Magazine Version:
Attached File

https://www.sdsimports.com/sdsimports-s12-shotgun-p/s12.htm
VEPR Magazine Version:
Attached File

Oof the transparency of the images looks messed up.
https://www.sdsimports.com/sdsimports-vp12-shotgun-p/vp12.htm
Features:
-Optic Rail based on the 3 Gun Version
-Right hand charging handle with oversized knob on right side (saiga version), left hand charging handle on vepr version.
-Forged Bolt, Trunion, and Bolt Carrier. The Gen 1 only had a forged Bolt/Trunion with a cast bolt carrier. On the plus side you might be able to get a spare bolt for using the Gen 1 Lynx if they ever sell them seperately.
-Uses Saiga Forends, AK Grips/Stocks, and either Saiga or VEPR mags depending on model.
-Uses Saiga Muzzle Devices
-US Palm style grip
-Enhanced Safety Lever
-M-lok handguard (Looks Polymer but I still think it's a nice deal for the money)


It's a shame the VEPR version doesn't take VEPR handguards though. Seems like there are quite a few worthwhile upgrades over the gen 1 models. When I get mine I will report back. Looks like a good rival compared to the KUSA version.
-Better Accessories out the box (The M-lok handguard looks nicer than the CAA Saiga 12 handguard, and it has M-lok imo)
-Half the price
-Parkerizing instead of Black Oxide. (I heard some KUSA 12 gauges also had rust/finish issues)
-Both use forged components.

You can either buy a Chinese Shotgun, or a US Made Shotgun with subpar finish that gets Turkish/Chinese furniture thrown on it for twice the price imo.

@ATLANTIC-FIREARMS

Are you going to have these anytime soon?

The only compatibility issues I see right now are dust covers/extended top rails. Also if you switch safeties make sure you use one made for Saigas. Otherwise a stamped AK safety will add another scratch and make contact with a rivet.  

I'm going to pick one of these up. I have some Vepr mags sitting around as well and I prefer the way they lock into the gun vs the Saiga mags. There is a significant difference between the Vepr & Saiga loading techniques. The Vepr mags insert like an AR. The Saiga locks in like an AK.

These are definitely cheap enough that I would regret not buying one if they become unavailable. I remember when Saiga was in this price range and I should have bought more than the I did. We are definitely in the golden age of Chinese and Turkish shotguns. They are cheap and have interesting models.

so bolt/carriers not interchangeable with saiga parts?  they so dang cheap, i plna ot get a couple... good drone patrol?

Actually I believe they are interchangeable with each other. However it is really hard to source saiga bolts and carriers right now.

LAC made a lightweight version. But Russian sanctions have caused these to stay out of stock. Also the bolt carriers price is about the same as one of these shotguns itself.

Previously SDS imports was selling the bolt carriers for only 60 bucks. So I'm assuming once these are out they will be selling spare parts as well

Also iirc Saiga and VEPR bolts will work with eachother?

I'm betting it's possible to retrofit your generation one lynx with a generation 2 bolt carrier

I know you can modify Saiga mags to work in a Vepr, so clearance isn't the issue.  I bet both bolts & carriers are very similar if not identical.  As soon as my commissions on some of my sales start hitting, I'm definitely going to pick one up.

I am liking the gen2 handgaurd and the fact the BCG is forged. Been on the fence about a current gen1 Lynx 3gun model but now I'm hoping I can wait for a gen2.

Is the magwell on the vp12 steel or plastic?

Where are the VP12s made?

Turkey or China?

They look sharp.







So
Vp12= left side charging and vepr mags

SP12= right side charging and sagia pattern mags



New to the idea of a AK shotgun.

Which mag system is more sought after?

Reliability?
Ruggedness?
Cost?
Availability?

Both are probably made in China and that type 56 factory. Looks like the VP just uses vpr magazines but isn't really a vpr.

I'd stick with the saga but personally if you are already invested in magazines for one platform, go with that one.

If this is your first shotgun like this The saiga magazines are really cheap

I was going to buy a Lynx12, the previous version of the S12 which both took Saiga mags. But I saw they are releasing the VP12. I like the Vepr pattern mag well as the mags insert straight in like an AR. It also helps that I have a some orphan Vepr mags sitting around.

The Saiga mags rock into place like an AK. The problem with the shotgun mags is the shell is pointing up and it isn't as easy to load /lock it compared to an AK rifle cartridge mag. It helps to lock the bolt open, and then load it. But it is a manual bolt hold on the Saiga. I never cared for that with my Saiga. I have an SDS Civet12 pump gun that uses Saiga mags and it suffers from the same issue, but it is easier to manipulate because it is a pump gun, but you do lose a round as its tough to lock in a mag on a closed bolt.

The Vepr has a tab on the mag to lock open the bolt after the last round. But on the Atlantic video, the factory mag locked open and the Vepr/Molot mag didn't.  So I like the Vepr pattern mag better, but there are significantly less options and they cost more. I have 3x of the CSpec metal mags, which cost nearly half of a VP12, so that's the direction I am headed.

Regarding reloading mags. Doing it on a closed bolt is a pain I agree. Its a bit easier if you download the mag by one.


I was realistically going to get about 2-3x css spec 8 round mags for serious use.

And stock up on cheap range mags, and try to get a promag 12 round drum to work.

8 rounds seem perfect imo. 10 look too long and could be cumbersome. The 8 rounders are about as long as a 30 round 7.62 mag.

The Promag 10/12 rounds are pretty short/slim. I hear they are surprisingly decent. Id nor ally avoid their crap. But they are servicable.

I put a deposit on the S12 for now.

I think I might put a Bonesteel Galil Folder and call it good.

Ive been sitting on a single stage trigger, better gas puck so far.

Oh one downside is that the Lynx use 2 stage factory triggers. Imo thats dumb for a shotgun.

Wonder how secure that rail is on top.

I’m wanting to do a night shotgun setup and this seems like a good Candidate for that.

Ir illuminator on the handguard. Sightmark wraith mini 4K on the rail.

Imo should be fine for a shotgun.

Its hinged/riveted near the front.
The recoil spring holds it shut tight on the back.

When I had a 3 gun lynx it was solid.

IMO do not drop the shotgun with the dust cover open and it should be fine. I did notice the entire dust cover and picatinny rail was steel.

Well Atlantic arms got some of my money.

Got a S12 on the way.

Will share pics when I get it.

i wonder if that was ammo, fitment, or chinese "craftsmanship"

For someone who was literally still a baby when Saiga-12s and Veprs were all the rage, what's the easier magazine to get? Was thinking of picking one of these up to scratch the AK shotgun itch but I'm not too keen on being stuck with no magazines. Do the "Turkish Delights" use similar enough magazines to work in these?

I've had Russian Saiga and Vepr shotguns with mag fitment issues. In fact CS Spec mags and MD Arms drums both come with oversized mag catches that you fit to the gun for this reason.

I've had the Vodka special on a few Russian guns. One Saiga-12 had a dust cover pop off when shooting every 10-30 rounds, so the gas system needed to be moved back 1/4" and pinned in place.  I imagine the Chinese guns can have the same fate, although I have had excellent luck with Chinese guns (SKSs, Uzi, 1911, AK, etc.).

And yes, the shotguns are finicky with ammo. You have to find the sweet spot and these guns require a break in period. So it could be any combination of things.

@SDSImports
Will you be making/importing 8-round VEPR 12 style magazines?
Will the 5 & 8 round magazines work in VERP 12?
Any idea on magazine cost and availability?

Should be getting my S12 today. Will update with pics

Shotgun arrived today. Very impressed.

I have only handled a few Ak12 pattern guns and all of them have been heavily customized. SBS or FA at the local NFA shoot.

These example that I have looks to be one of the nicest one to date.

Below is a picture of the gas block. Notice the multi hole gas vent.
Attached File


Gas plug is more of a gas divot. I have never seen the gas plugs in the few explamples that I have fired. This maybe the norm for all I know but I do like it. Appears to be very easily cleaned.
Attached File


Gun as shipped with 5rd mag. 5 rd mag has no major play once locked in place. And front hand guard is very strong/ridged feeling no play or slop. Appears to be connected via a single screw to the gas block on teh bottom.
Attached File


Internals look standard AK (could be wrong) I would thing any aftermarket AK trigger should drop in easily. The manual bolt hold back is a nice feature.
Attached File


Rail on dust cover is secured by 3 screws all locklited in place. Would be nice to see spot welds as well but no big deal. (note that is not rust but some sort of grease and camera made it look like that)
Attached File

Bolt and carrier look nice and robust.

Attached File

Attached File


The recoil spring is does collapse in itself. Appears to have a inner spring and outer spring that you can see here. It does have a hard plastic buffer and ships with a second.
Attached File

Attached File

Attached File

I did purchase a 2 pack of the SDS 10rd mags from Atlantic Arms. They came individually wrapped but in the same box as the gun.

These mags feel ok, they do have plastic locking surfaces on the front and metal on the rear at the mag latch. These mags do have CONSIDERABLE slop both side to side and back and forth when in the gun. I placed the mag in the gun and manually cycled by hand to feel if the feed lips touched the bolt and carrier and noticed no interface.

Attached File



Overall very impressed with the gun especially at $359.00. I was planning on buying a Kalashnikov USA K12 but this is 1/2 the price. Dont really consider this for me as a home defense gun but more of a pest eliminator/ fun gun.

Plan on attaching some IR lights and maybe a IR compatible laser or dot sight for use with NV.

Short video of first shots.

Thanks for adding to this.

I was surprised the rail was screwed in, the Gen 1 3-gun rail was riveted.

Not sure what stock I want to throw on this yet.
Carolina Shooter Supply has some nice upgrades.

Are the triggers in these single or double stage? I remember the Lynx Gen 1 was a 2 stage for some reason.

Seemed to be single stage but will have to check again. Just a typical AK trigger.

I did experience what I thought was a dead trigger twice but ended up being me not allowing it to reset all the way.

I also noticed this gun seems to have a pronounced 6 o clock hold. Which I actually like.

Thanks! Still might swap the trigger.


If anyone with a gen 1 wants a black aces quad rail let me know. I wont be needing it. They sell pretty cheap so just consider me paying it forward

Small update on mine S12.

Really liking it so far. Like it so much I may buy a V12 as well.

Hey sds my IG handle is NFA_junky.

Affordable yet reliable VEPR mags would be great.

Would also like to see some 8 round us made polymer magazine tbh.


The 10 rounders are nice but kinda long

I just ordered a VP-12 from my local dealer.  His price was as good as any I saw online.  I use them from transfers, so I always try them first when ordering something.

I'll test out how my CS Spec Vepr mags fit and function.  The bolt hold open is one of the nicer features, so I hope it functions as intended.  

Do these take standard AK furniture?

While there are less Vepr pattern guns around, there are also less magazine options as well.  Basically there are factory, CS Spec, and SGM for mags.  There is one company that makes a 25rd drum, which looks way too big.

I'd love to see a 7-8rd mag and a 12-15rd drum for it.  Please keep the bolt hold up on any mag, I realize it is harder on a drum as most drums delete that option.  I don't know if a quad stack mag (like the Mossberg 590M mags) is an option.  I believe the designer originally was going to do a Saiga 12ga. version before licensing it to Mossberg.  I bought a MD-20 drum for my hold Saiga, and it worked well.  I think a little smaller would be nice, but I'd consider a 20rd drum.  The 25rd drum is just too big.  Hopefully you can modify the drum you currently offer to fit the Vepr/VP-12.

Stamped Stock and Pistol Grip (The nut and screw need to be replaced)
Saiga 12 Sporter Forends

Have always thought the mossberg mags would be cool on a AK12.

Finally got around to buying it. I had a few things come up (I cracked a curved computer monitor and the cost of another made me delay this. I'm hoping I'll have it next week.

So Far I have the following laying around:
-CSS US Single Stage Saiga Trigger
-CSS Gas Puck
-CSS Gas Regulator with 6 Positions (IIRC)
-Magpul Pistol Grip
-Tapco Thread Protector (These are like $5 and US Made at CDNN)

Mags:
2x 8 Rd CS Spec Magazines
-3x JTS M12AK 5 Round Magazines (I heard these will work, I'm not thrilled with the Lynx Factory 5 rounders, the 10's are gtg)



I think a Bonesteel Galil stock would give this a really mean look IMO. I have a TDI Adapter and a Magpul CTR stock laying around though. I might use that in case the CNC warrior stock takes awhile.


Side Note for something cheap:
The NC Star VISM Stock adapter fixed tubes are good to go. They are actually made my DLG in Turkey and KUSA uses them on their shotguns.

I am skeptical about the folding adapter though since it's all polymer. They look ugly as hell though
Click To View Spoiler
Compared to the KUSA, the SDS has way better Aesthetics and for half the price they hit it out of the park. Honestly the KUSA is mostly foreign furniture/mags. DLG/CAA.

Knowing that you can get the same accessories if needed at a fraction of the price.

s12 pro mag drum testing.
Fired the drum 3 full times today with the low  pressure loads. Had a single jam on each drum about 1/2 way thru firing.
Increase gas setting to 2 and still had jam. Ran out of shells for more testing at range.

I've had the VP12 for about 2 weeks.  and I have been trying to get this thing to shoot skeet because I can.  Made 2 outing in skeet with it.

Few observations..

The handguard screw that hold the handguard tend to shoot loose.  Keep an eye on it.  you can tell when the handguard starts sliding about 1/8 of an inch.  I've put some blue loctite on the screw and  We'll see if it holds.

The left charging handle that screws into the bolt carrier also likes to shoot itself loose.  I've put some blue loctite on it so we'll see if it stays.

I have been using reload trap/skeet loads.  Gas regulator is set on 3.  I am shooting low brass  #7.5 #8 going about 1275 FPS.  The bolt open on the last round has been sporatic.  sometimes it works sometimes it closes.  I have contacted SDS to see if they have any insight and so far they asked that I break in the shotty and try a different mag.  I have a feeling it's cycling the round but not enough oomph to hold the bolt back on last round.   I will be ordering a weaker recoil spring from CSS to see if it will help.

I added a mod choke and a muzzle brake from CSS to give it slightly longer barrel for skeet shooting but I seem to be breaking the clays so I assume its working.  I also have a 8 inch extension barrel that I bought a long time ago and that I can screw on.  I need to do a side by side comparision to see which is more effective at breaking clays, mod choke with MB or 8 inch barrel extension.

The plastic stock hits my face sometimes so I will likely switch that out to a Zhukov foldable stock in the near future.  It should be more comfortable.

When you hit the skeet range with this shotgun, be ready to answer some questions.  Barrel length minimum at skeet range is 18.5 but ours is 19 so we good there.   Be advised per rule, you can only have 2 rounds in your gun per station.  So you will want 2 mags so you can do mag changes and put 2 rounds per mag.  You will get a lot of looks from the O/U crowd.  But if you are breaking the clays, they don't say anything.  They will approach you with courisity and ask a lot of questions.  I always offer them to shoot it if I have any extra rounds on me.  After shooting it they always have a smile and tells me the action is quick enough for follow up shot in skeet.  I think a few of them are shopping for VP12 after I told them the price.  I essentially tell them the entire shotgun costs less than 2 of their fancy titanium chokes on their O/U.

I'm definitely an advocate of loctiting all the things

I have to ask, what are the major differences between these and the older Lynx-12 that was offered. Because I was eyeing the Lynx-12 HF3G before and then these came out.

What is the rear trunnion on these? I am assuming the standard fixed, but wanted to make sure before finding out it is something oddball.

Also, can these take any of the upgrades that came out for the Saigas, like the gas plugs? Never dived to deep into the Saigas and Saiga clones as I always wanted a Vepr 12 instead. Well look how that turned out.

I have a gen one. Haven't found anything for Saigas that won't work on it yet. The Gen 2 is supposed to be compatible with Saiga parts, too.

I haven't replaced the stock on mine, but I know many have. From what I understand, it's not anything that requires modification.

Side rail is Russian style, not Romanian style, so avoid Romanian scope mounts.

I finally just picked this up. I'm impressed.

The old lynx top rail had some play, and this thing is solid.

The thread protector came off without a wrench. I feel fortunate.

Rivets look okay.

Pistol grip screw is now the correct thread pitch however the nut is a bit different than standard and you can still replace it out.

The gas regulator thread seem a bit finer (my CSS 6 position would get stuck half way.) For the love of God guys why did you change this from the lynx? The regular Lynx worked just fine with aftermarket gas selectors. So dumb

I was unable to get the TDI stock adapter to work I'm assuming a vltor may have the same issue just FYI.

I believe bone steel and magpul will fit just fine though

Attached File
Seriously wtf thread pitch is this?


S12 top
SAIGA 12 bottom

Well that is extremely disappointing. Because now there is not a way to tune the gas with different parts if you need something for your setup.

Iirc I think both are M22 but Saiga is course, and the sds is fine threads?

The M-Lok handguard is crazy thicc.

-My SDS/CSS Specs mags have some front to back/side to side wobble. I did try some JTS Mags and those are almost perfect/no wobble at all.
-I needed replacement screws for some accessories.  The screws need to be atleast 5/8" or 3/4" Long. There is still plenty of clearance from the barrel however. Just fyi. Still usable/manageable.
-I have a DLG Fixed Stock Adapter otw, these are imported by NC Star sadly but KUSA has been using these adapters. I figure for $25 it will hold me over until I get my Bonesteel. Made in Turkey at least.
-Carolina Shooters Trigger seems ok. Reset was kinda sticky until I oiled it and started dry firing a bunch. Some of the finish made it a tad gritty on the reset. It's good now.
-I think I'll be throwing a Primary Arms Advanced Micro On This.

@swampfoxoutdoors

How tight is your magwell with 10 rounders and such? Haven't fired mine yet tbh.

Also actually having a loaded magazine will reduce the wobble.

Was surprised my CSS Specs mags didnt need any filing. One has worse side to side wobble than the other. I hate playing the game of tolerances tbh. If JTS mags feed good I might stock up on those since they are dirt cheap/fit tight.  The JTS 5 rounders seem to be quality mags and can be found for $15 each.

BTW I noticed my SDS 5 rounder has plastic feed lips this time. Im fine with that since the originals tended to pop off.

Yes they wobble but are reliable. Think I show the wobble in one of the videos.

Yes they wobble but are reliable. Think I show the wobble in one of the videos.